Fuck this healthcare Reform...

[maxiep]

And here we go...

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704271804575405203894857436.html?mod=rss_opinion_main

Here is Ann Althouse's comment on it (like MikeDC, I read her blog as well) http://althouse.blogspot.com/2010/08/so-here-we-have-government-anointed.html

 

[maxiep]

Drug and medical care development is going to take a hit. What will happen to other countries who have been relying on us to do all of the research and development while they drifted by with their "free" healthcare?

This legislation is so ill-considered on so many levels. Not understanding that this legislation will change the behavior of for profit companies is one of them.

 

[maxiep]

You people are too stupid to understand what's good for you. It's time for a little "reeducation".

http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/sebelius-administration-has-lot-reeducation-do-obamacare

This is fucking Orwellian.

 

[bodyman5001]

You people are too stupid to understand what's good for you. It's time for a little "reeducation".

http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/sebelius-administration-has-lot-reeducation-do-obamacare

This is fucking Orwellian.

That video uses a tactic that I am curious about. I have seen this from the government before, they have 12 people read the same thing and then edit it together so you only hear a bit or two per person. Then they edit it together like this. This way you must be more likely to swallow the bullshit they are sending you because MULTIPLE PEOPLE TOLD ME SO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I just wonder who came up with that technique.

My favorite new analogy for this healthcare disaster is this. If they applied this idea to McDonalds, you could get a Big Mac for 20 cents with a free drink and it would be healthier for you and the employees of the McDonalds would all make 100 grand a year.

Just doesn't sound plausible to me.

Maybe if they showed a video of 23 people telling me that it was true, I would buy it.

 

[maxiep]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/09/20/AR2010092006665.html

Don't think this strategy by the Administration isn't intentional. Make the business of health care impossible to make a profit or even to break even and then the government "has" to intervene. Expect this strategy to reoccur bit by bit until the government "has" to provide health care for everyone, because the "evil" insurance companies just won't provide the health insurance we need.

One more question: If insurance companies can't afford to provide coverage for all of these services, when they're all gone, how will costs lower or even stay the same when the population essentially self-insures by having the government run the system? I know the answer; let's see if anyone else gets it.

 

[maxiep]

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/o...se-than-critics-thought-960772-103571664.html

An article with a few of the "highlights" of the bill. This bill will go down as one of the greatest scams ever perpetrated on the American people.

 

[blazerboy30]

Can somebody explain how this is GOOD for the country? Can somebody explain why we couldn't just provide $1000 / year catastrophic coverage to the 30 million uninsured ($30billion / year total cost), and still be much cheaper than this atrocious bill?

 

[bodyman5001]

I think I will stop paying for my insurance and decrease the amount they take out of my check for income taxes if that is still allowed and tell the govt to fuck right off if they want to keep my 300 dollar tax refund. They can stick it up their collective asses.

 

[jlprk]

I am not about to read this prolonged thread. Looking at this Page No. 14 (didn't read it), it appears conservatives are talking to themselves. I would guess the thread preaches to the choir and doesn't change anyone's mind. But I read this article today so I'll throw it in.

It says that most of the dislike of the bill comes from the left, not the right. 40% want the bill to create more government involvement in health care than it does, and only 20% want it to do less. And this was a phone poll, which means the millions who don't have a phone are unrepresented--those too poor to have one, and itinerants who move around to find work.

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/storie...ME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2010-09-25-15-04-14

The article and this thread have nothing to do with the following point, but--Similarly, Obama's decrease in general (not just health care) support has come from the Left. The Right already polled against him, no change there. But the Right pretends the reason is that he's too far left. Actually it's because he's too far right.

 

[BrianFromWA]

I think the problem is that this shouldn't be an "insurance" issue. The parts that I didn't like were that a pretty horribly written and conceived bill was pushed through only after bribing some senators to vote for it, either lying about or dismissing costs to taxpayers and misrepresenting what the bill would actually do. The fact that a bill that 65% of the country is against (for whatever reason) got pushed through doesn't strike a chord with anyone here?

Getting an MRI in, say, France costs almost 4x less than it does in the Seattle area. What does insurance of any type do about that? Vaccinations that we're giving (through places like International Red Cross, Doctors without borders, etc) to African children cost significantly less than the ones I take my 6month-old daughter in to get. That isn't an insurance issue. People not having the money to pay those costs is the issue. Those who grasp at quick-fix government-based "solutions" that sound good to Johnny-on-the-street aren't solving the problem (see, Social Security), and are actually impeding things that would actually help people get quality, affordable health care.

 

[MARIS61]

http://hotair.com/archives/2010/08/05/obamacare-the-sum-of-all-fears

A brutal summation of all the lies told about this bill.

LOL.

Here's the facts:

http://www.whitehouse.gov/healthreform/myths-and-facts#healthcare-menu

 

[MARIS61]

Since the public employee unions have been reaping obscene profits off the taxpayers with their promised returns on their pensions for a few decades now, how about you cut your government pension? After all, you know we can't afford all the public pensions and we overpromised what we could pay, you could cut your pension and lessen our tax burden in gratitude.

LOL.

Federal Retirement pensions are nothing special at all. That's the biggest lie there is. I'm sure you get a much better package where you work. I had better retirement plans at 4 of my private sector jobs, just not enough time at each to qualify.

 

[MARIS61]

You people are too stupid to understand what's good for you.

Smart enough to know better than to listen to someone who calls me stupid.

Seriously, how's that approach working for you?

 

[MARIS61]

This is fucking Orwellian.

You do realize Eric Arthur Blair (George Orwell) was a devout Democratic Socialist, and that he opposed totalitarianism, while supporting Democratic Socialism as the true path to personal freedom and social justice.

 

[MARIS61]

The article and this thread have nothing to do with the following point, but--Similarly, Obama's decrease in general (not just health care) support has come from the Left. The Right already polled against him, no change there. But the Right pretends the reason is that he's too far left. Actually it's because he's too far right.

That's my beef with him. He preached left and threw right.

 

[Denny Crane]

LOL.

Here's the spin:

http://www.whitehouse.gov/healthreform/myths-and-facts#healthcare-menu

Fixed it for you.

 

[OSUBlazerfan]

My Companies Health Care premiums will sharply rise for next year

Just wanted to pass that along

 

[maxiep]

Smart enough to know better than to listen to someone who calls me stupid.

Seriously, how's that approach working for you?

Actually, it's Secretary Sebelius and the rest of the Obama Administration calling us stupid. And I don't think it's working out well at all for them.

 

[maxiep]

Why price controls are a bad idea, not just generally, but in the health care market: http://american.com/archive/2010/october/confessions-of-a-price-controller

 

[Denny Crane]

A little factoid about universal health care.

The first Democratic Party president to propose it was... Harry Truman. When he decided not to run for re-election, his poll ratings were down at W's levels, if not worse.

The next Democrat to try and push it on everyone was Clinton. Hillarycare, remember? The result was an ass kicking in the mid terms. Republicans took control of the House for the first time in 40 years. A 54 seat swing. At least Hillarycare was mostly done in public (public meetings, etc.) and without trying any parliamentary tricks.

Obama, Pelosi, and Reid did push it on everyone, the bill written in secrecy, nobody actually read it, and passed using a parliamentary trick. Republicans need 39 seats to take over the House. In an ordinary mid-term election, the party in power loses some seats, but 39 is rare. And the drubbing about to come is likely to top the 54 seat swing of 1994. The senate is going to be a massive swing as well, even if Republicans don't gain control. A swing of 8 or 9 seats out of 33 possible is rather stunning, and also rare to have such a big change.

Third time's the charm, it seems. But what part of "the people don't want any part of it" don't the Democrats understand?

 

[OSUBlazerfan]

AARP raising prices on employees

 

[OSUBlazerfan]

Unconstitutional.... bwahahahahahhaha

 

[bluefrog]

My dad just got dropped by his health provider (the one through his employer before he retired). He worked for the company for 40 years and this is how they re-pay him.

He's 76 years old and has Parkinson's disease. He's got all kinds of other problems: bum shoulder, bad back, bum hip. He still gardens and keeps bees though and tries to be active. He's led a healthy life style but was dealt crappy DNA.

He's scrambling to find coverage with private insurers because his doctor doesn't take Medicare. He said he's having trouble finding affordable coverage. My brother and sisters and I have told him find the best coverage and we'll help him pay for it but he's a stubborn old man ("doesn't want to be a burden") .

Fuck this health care system

 

[maxiep]

My dad just got dropped by his health provider (the one through his employer before he retired). He worked for the company for 40 years and this is how they re-pay him.

He's 76 years old and has Parkinson's disease. He's got all kinds of other problems: bum shoulder, bad back, bum hip. He still gardens and keeps bees though and tries to be active. He's led a healthy life style but was dealt crappy DNA.

He's scrambling to find coverage with private insurers because his doctor doesn't take Medicare. He said he's having trouble finding affordable coverage. My brother and sisters and I have told him find the best coverage and we'll help him pay for it but he's a stubborn old man ("doesn't want to be a burden") .

Fuck this health care system

Did he get dropped by his employer from their health care system or by his health insurer? It would seem suspicious to me that a health insurer would drop him out of the blue with no reason. Usually they just raise your premiums or lower your coverage.

I think everyone has a responsibility to plan and provide for their own health care. One quarter of your total health care expenditures come in the last six months of your life. Forewarned is forearmed. I don't want to be a burden to my family either, which is why I save money every month specifically for health care.

And if you hate the fact that the physician you want can't be had through Medicare, imagine what our care will be like when everyone is on quasi-Medicaid via Obamacare.

 

[maxiep]

Unconstitutional.... bwahahahahahhaha

This is all kabuki. It's going to end up in the Supreme Court and assuming no change in the makeup of that body, Anthony Kennedy will decide whether or not mandating health care coverage is constitutional.

 

[Minstrel]

This is all kabuki. It's going to end up in the Supreme Court and assuming no change in the makeup of that body, Anthony Kennedy will decide whether or not mandating health care coverage is constitutional.

It can be changed to the government buying the health insurance for everyone and levying a tax to pay for it. It comes to exactly the same thing, which is why the claims of unconstitutional seem pretty unfounded and the Supreme Court is unlikely to strike it down. It's simply a version of tax and spend, which is hardly considered unconstitutional. This version just cuts out the middle man of the IRS.

 

[maxiep]

It can be changed to the government buying the health insurance for everyone and levying a tax to pay for it. It comes to exactly the same thing, which is why the claims of unconstitutional seem pretty unfounded and the Supreme Court is unlikely to strike it down. It's simply a version of tax and spend, which is hardly considered unconstitutional. This version just cuts out the middle man of the IRS.

I'm sure if Kennedy rules to limit the Commerce clause, that will be the next bite of the apple. We'll see if the American people elect leaders in 2012 that will propose that kind of solution. The polling appears to show they won't.

 

[bluefrog]

Did he get dropped by his employer from their health care system or by his health insurer? It would seem suspicious to me that a health insurer would drop him out of the blue with no reason. Usually they just raise your premiums or lower your coverage.

I wish I knew the answer. He's being vague about it. He's pissed off more than I've seen in years so I think it's the employer. My folks have always been reluctant to share financial info with their children.

I think everyone has a responsibility to plan and provide for their own health care. One quarter of your total health care expenditures come in the last six months of your life. Forewarned is forearmed. I don't want to be a burden to my family either, which is why I save money every month specifically for health care.

I agree but you can't expect people to predict that health care costs will sky rocket in 30 years. I'm sure my dad wanted to save for unforeseen costs in the future but he was too busy raising 7 kids and paying the mortgage.

And if you hate the fact that the physician you want can't be had through Medicare, imagine what our care will be like when everyone is on quasi-Medicaid via Obamacare.

It's a shitty bill. Hopefully the republican controlled congress can pass some legislation that provides real reform

 

[Denny Crane]

Time to ditch this thing and go for a VA style government run health care option.

Bad news for barfo's chili since the govt. can't mandate everyone has to buy and eat it.

 

[maxiep]

http://www.theatlantic.com/business...the-sick-people-who-cant-get-insurance/69738/

An interesting question that the supporters of Obamacare can't seem to answer.