Harkless over Leonard

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I don't spend a ton of time on this forum these days, but there are people here who think we could trade for Paul George with a pu pu platter of expiring deals? Paul George is a top 15 player in the league on a long-term reasonable contract. He might be a top 10 asset in the league. We're not getting him for fucking Meyers Leonard and Moe Harkless.

If he's even being shopped - and I'd doubt that he would be - Indiana is getting a big return back that would include either elite young players (Russell, etc.) or high picks (Brooklyn's 1sts, etc.).
I think the one thing people seem to overlook the most, when thinking about for whom another team might, through some miracle of desperation, trade us a star player, is that there are other teams in the league, and that some of those other teams would surely offer more.

:cheers:
 
I don't spend a ton of time on this forum these days, but there are people here who think we could trade for Paul George with a pu pu platter of expiring deals? Paul George is a top 15 player in the league on a long-term reasonable contract. He might be a top 10 asset in the league. We're not getting him for fucking Meyers Leonard and Moe Harkless.

If he's even being shopped - and I'd doubt that he would be - Indiana is getting a big return back that would include either elite young players (Russell, etc.) or high picks (Brooklyn's 1sts, etc.).
Sometimes it's not just a team move..players request trades. Nobody thought Memphis would swap its superstar Pau Gasol to the Lakers for his then chubby, rookie brother Marc...making the Lakers a dynasty at the time. Nobody thought the Clippers would land Chris Paul..these things happen. Miami got a big 3 by Riley sweet talkin' them into joining forces. We have youth, assets and money...and a pretty good pitch guy in the front office. If we're going to discuss needle moving players, why discount the possibility of actually acquiring the best in the game? It's all guess work here anyway.
 
Paul George is 25 years old, Myles Turner looks like a stud, and Larry Bird has built himself a bunch of really good Pacers teams. You could argue that the Pacers are everything we consider ourselves to be - except they have more of a proven track record (their ECF teams), they have more assets (George is better than Lillard, Turner is more promising as a foundational piece than CJ), and an easier path (they play in the East).

Do you think this is a fair trade? http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=jlvsnwr

That's the Pacers fans' equivalent of the George trade posted above.
 
Paul George is 25 years old, Myles Turner looks like a stud, and Larry Bird has built himself a bunch of really good Pacers teams. You could argue that the Pacers are everything we consider ourselves to be - except they have more of a proven track record (their ECF teams), they have more assets (George is better than Lillard, Turner is more promising as a foundational piece than CJ), and an easier path (they play in the East).

Do you think this is a fair trade? http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=jlvsnwr

That's the Pacers fans' equivalent of the George trade posted above.
Turner looks like a stud based on a solid 8 game stretch? Right. How's he a more promising than CJ?
 
Turner looks like a stud based on a solid 8 game stretch? Right. How's he a more promising than CJ?
Well... he's more promising/important vs. CJ because Turner may be THE reason why PG doesn't leave Indy; the failed experiment putting PG @ pf is over & PG returns to his regular position/comfort level because of Turner; he's ALREADY got a good handle on pf (he's only going to get better on offense AND defense :wink:); Turner is a big reason why Indy's winning again/clicking. So does CJ mean enough to the Blazers (in any way) to where a decision made on him is THE cause for Dame to stay or leave? No. There u have it, that's the biggest reason why Turner is way more promising/important vs. CJ. However, even more obvious/superficial would b Turner's already a million Miles (pun intended :tongue2:) ahead of CJ on defense & always will b.
 
I don't spend a ton of time on this forum these days, but there are people here who think we could trade for Paul George with a pu pu platter of expiring deals? Paul George is a top 15 player in the league on a long-term reasonable contract. He might be a top 10 asset in the league. We're not getting him for fucking Meyers Leonard and Moe Harkless.

If he's even being shopped - and I'd doubt that he would be - Indiana is getting a big return back that would include either elite young players (Russell, etc.) or high picks (Brooklyn's 1sts, etc.).

"People" implies that there are more than one... one dude suggested that trade.

I have said since the beginning that it would take, at the very least, a combination of CJ/Plumlee and maybe even Vonleh.
 
Well... he's more promising/important vs. CJ because Turner may be THE reason why PG doesn't leave Indy; the failed experiment putting PG @ pf is over & PG returns to his regular position/comfort level because of Turner; he's ALREADY got a good handle on pf (he's only going to get better on offense AND defense :wink:); Turner is a big reason why Indy's winning again/clicking. So does CJ mean enough to the Blazers (in any way) to where a decision made on him is THE cause for Dame to stay or leave? No. There u have it, that's the biggest reason why Turner is way more promising/important vs. CJ. However, even more obvious/superficial would b Turner's already a million Miles (pun intended :tongue2:) ahead of CJ on defense & always will b.
May be the reason PG stays in Indy? PG is signed through 2019!! He can't leave...

He's the reason that Paul George can play SF?? It's a coaches decision. They have other bigs.

Miles ahead defensively? How so? Show me the stats that back that up

You're stretching.
 
May be the reason PG stays in Indy? PG is signed through 2019!! He can't leave...

He's the reason that Paul George can play SF?? It's a coaches decision. They have other bigs.

Miles ahead defensively? How so? Show me the stats that back that up

You're stretching.
YEAH... BECAUSE PG was pissed & wasn't liking pf; he IS signed for a long time for a good contract then/today, THAT's just ONE reason why he'd b so awesome to have; of course, there r a lot of reasons why Indy wouldn't trade him (I never implied he was a FA, THAT should've been a given to u & any1 else).


Miles ahead defensively: http://insider.espn.go.com/mens-col...er-best-defensive-freshmen-college-basketball

http://www.nbadraft.net/players/myles-turner

http://www.nbadraft.net/players/cj-mccollum

^ these r of course from before the draft BUT notice the "potential" for both these guys is the same? Today, CJ's good but there's not much more he can improve upon; the things that he can work on/those extras will make a big difference, BUT the ceiling on actual change isn't as high vs. Turner currently. Think of it like a runner trying to shave seconds off his time; CJ is trying is @ the point where he's trying to now shave a few seconds off his time, Turner on the other hand, is a fast runner who's trying to shave a minute + seconds off his time.

http://espn.go.com/nba/player/_/id/3133628/myles-turner

from the last ^: "Turner has been a revelation since joining the starting lineup at power forward, and his emergence has allowed Paul George to transfer back to his more natural spot at small forward. In his six starts to date, the rookie is averaging 13.2 points, 7.2 rebounds, 2.3 blocks, and 1.2 assists across 31.2 minutes. He's been a huge upgrade over the likes of Lavoy Allen and C.J. Miles [Miles isn't a big BTW], who had been previously been splitting the starting role, so look for Turner to continue to occupy a prominent spot on coach Frank Vogel's top unit."

It's obvious you're talking out ur ass & u don't actually watch Indy games, "stretching..." my ass. Show me/us where CJ is better than Turner defensively (any stats show CJ currently @ best an average defender, Turner ALREADY is better vs. average); u realize the 2 play different positions?

Here, I'll sorta give u 1:

turner.jpg cj.jpg

^ @ best (stretching things), u could say that CJ is a better defender vs. Turner based on opponent's fg% while respective player is @ the rim (because they play different positions & the #'s for them r basically the same? Yeah, I said it was a stretch didn't I; I'm not going to buy that) HOWEVER... look @ how MANY more times Turner is around the basket (Turner around the rim while opponents r there 4X'S as much); put CJ @ the rim 4x's more AND then we'll c how much better CJ is vs. Turner.
 

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"People" implies that there are more than one... one dude suggested that trade.

I have said since the beginning that it would take, at the very least, a combination of CJ/Plumlee and maybe even Vonleh.

NB has been leading the charge to get PG in scarlet & black.
 
I took a bit of a ribbing for saying recently that we needed to play Harkless more (and then a lot more once he was benched) to find out what we had in him before the end of the season. It looks to be paying off now.
 
I took a bit of a ribbing for saying recently that we needed to play Harkless more (and then a lot more once he was benched) to find out what we had in him before the end of the season. It looks to be paying off now.
If we weren't in the Playoff hunt I'd still like to see the following starting line-up for a good stretch:

Dame / CJ or Henderson / Harkless / Davis / Meyers
 
Harkless tied for the team lead with 13 rebounds and comes in 2nd in scoring. Pretty impressive night.
 
I love aminu and harkless on the wings defensively.

The most versatile D we have had in a while. That look may not work against every team but we are deep and we can throw out a lot of different looks. Having Mo in there to guard players like Harden and maybe Durant.......I am not worried about our wing D as much.
 
I had high hopes for Leonard coming into this season, but Harkless has been a real revelation to me. When Meyers went down tonight against the Jazz, I was surprised at how relieved I was to know we had another, even younger, young stud in there to take his minutes. And that's the thing--we're so used to thinking of Leonard as the young developing kid, but Mo is a year younger.

With Aminu quite capable of playing the stretch 4, you get so much more activity and speed with that lineup of Lillard/McCollum/Harkless/Aminu/Plumlee. It probably means playing Crabbe more as well, which isn't great, but maybe it's time to see what Conaughton has got....

I don't know how long Leonard is going to be out--maybe he's coming back for the next game. But I think he just lost his starting job.

I was certainly wrong about Leonard losing his starting job to Harkless.
 
It was a good adjustment by the coach to put harkless in for Leonard. Blazers are better on defense with harkless in there then Leonard.
 
Preseason, I was hearing almost the same things about Harkless as we did about Wes when we first got him. Guy can ball, athletic, etc.

I was wondering if it was all hype this time. Seems not!
 
Harkless and Aminu together are a great defensive pairing especially against small ball lineups but Leonard will get the nod against Howard, Cousins, Drummond, Rolo etc....there are just more small ball lineups these days. It's smart coaching and matchup awareness game to game
 
Vonleh > Harkless > Leonard.

And I am fine with that as long as Harkless gets minutes. Vonleh is the future so it makes sense to get him comfortable with our studs.
 
Tired of Leonard....he's just not a natural basketball player. He should be like a pro beach volleyball player or something. I like what Hark brings to the table as a role player.
 
Harkless and Aminu together are a great defensive pairing especially against small ball lineups but Leonard will get the nod against Howard, Cousins, Drummond, Rolo etc....there are just more small ball lineups these days. It's smart coaching and matchup awareness game to game
I've been calling for that all season.
 
I remember sitting with Fonz at the preseason game against Utah... And saying to him "Damn, I really like Harkless."

Looking like it's finally working for Hark! Good for him!
 
I'm a Vonleh fan...this guy is becoming a defensive force..he can frustrate anybody and nobody can push him off his position..one of the strongest lower cores in the league..and he has the arms of a guy 7'6
 
I'm a Vonleh fan...this guy is becoming a defensive force..he can frustrate anybody and nobody can push him off his position..one of the strongest lower cores in the league..and he has the arms of a guy 7'6

I got a lot of shit for backing him when he was going through his lumps (And he will go through more)... but I saw it from him from day 1... he has something.
 
I got a lot of shit for backing him when he was going through his lumps (And he will go through more)... but I saw it from him from day 1... he has something.
I liked him from summer league on...he was a beast with Crabbe in summer league
 

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