Hinrich telling friends ...

[PapaG]

Are you kidding? Did you miss the playoffs?

Blake had a better playoff series than Hinrich.

 

[Crimson the Cat]

Blake had a better playoff series than Hinrich.

You seriously think Blake outplayed Hinrich in this year's playoffs?

 

[andalusian]

I don't like this very much at all. I think KP should rather sit tight and wait for July 1st and go for Miller or Sessiosn. Both know how to run a team much better than Kirk.

Really? Sessions (which I like) was never in the playoffs. Capt. Kirk was the starting PG for a young Chicago team that won 49 games.

Andre Miller in 11 years has been to the playoffs 5 times, Kirk in 6 years has been to the playoffs 4 times.

Are you sure about going with Sessions and Miller being better running a team? History does not seem to support this statement...

 

[Sheldon Shape]

Miller is too old and with the Bucks trade Sessions is probably out of play.

That of course is why the trade won't happen. KP won't want to get rid of valuable players like Blake and Outlaw to get Capt. Kirk.

Too old for what? To date your daughter? Sure. To expect him to be here 5 or 6 years from now? Sure. But to make this team a contender for the next few seasons? I think he is a much better option than Kirk. Sessions still isn't out of the question. Getting Kirk will likely mean Tyrus Thomas will accompany him and other bits for essentially scraps like Blake and Outlaw. Kirk's value is NOT high. Is he an improvement over Blake? Sure, but not significantly enough IMO.

 

[Sheldon Shape]

Really? Sessions (which I like) was never in the playoffs. Capt. Kirk was the starting PG for a young Chicago team that won 49 games.

Andre Miller in 11 years has been to the playoffs 5 times, Kirk in 6 years has been to the playoffs 4 times.

Are you sure about going with Sessions and Miller being better running a team? History does not seem to support this statement...

Such inconsequential statistics you're showing. How about showing who's had more talent on their team? How about who's actually played More playoff games?

 

[Sheldon Shape]

Kirk isn't going to be running the team. Brandon is.

So let's work Brandon like a dog again because no other player can get us into our offensive scheme? That's weak. I'd like Brandon to play a little more off the ball personally.

 

[andalusian]

Such inconsequential statistics you're showing. How about showing who's had more talent on their team? How about who's actually played More playoff games?

What talent was on Chicago's team until they got Derrick Rose? A bunch of over-rated starter-level guys... they just played great, tough defense to get there... - and Capt. Kirk was part of that tough defense.

What scoring did these Chicago teams have? No post players, Ben Gordon which is streaky as hell and...?

We do not need someone to run this team - we already have Roy to do it. We need someone that can bring the ball up-court, distribute some, shoot the open 3 and play great defense - and if he can grow with the team as it enters it's prime - that's great. Hinrich answers all these attributes. Miller does not (bad 3 point shooter, is older ). Add the fact that Miller is rumored to be a locker-room pain - something Kirk most definitely is not - and quite frankly - Hinrich seems like a better fit.

 

[Wizard Mentor]

Kirk - Blake = (1 less Oden Foul)/20 min.

This is one important reason to like Kirk.

 

[Crimson the Cat]

Too old for what? To date your daughter? Sure. To expect him to be here 5 or 6 years from now? Sure. But to make this team a contender for the next few seasons? I think he is a much better option than Kirk. Sessions still isn't out of the question. Getting Kirk will likely mean Tyrus Thomas will accompany him and other bits for essentially scraps like Blake and Outlaw. Kirk's value is NOT high. Is he an improvement over Blake? Sure, but not significantly enough IMO.

1. Miller can't be signed until after the draft. You risk missing out on Kirk, or other point guards, if you're going to wait.

2. The cost to add Miller will be substantially more and for likely 5 seasons. The competition for his services will be fierce.

3. His production will deteriorate over the life of his contract.

Hinrich is cheaper. Fills a huge need for years to come. Improves the team. Fits in age-wise. This is definitely a winning move in my book.

 

[blue32]

So let's work Brandon like a dog again because no other player can get us into our offensive scheme? That's weak. I'd like Brandon to play a little more off the ball personally.

But that's not what got Brandon Roy, to be Brandon Roy....

This is his team to run, everyone else is 2nd and 3rd options, unless hes smoke screening. Which is a good thing.

 

[Crimson the Cat]

So let's work Brandon like a dog again because no other player can get us into our offensive scheme? That's weak. I'd like Brandon to play a little more off the ball personally.

This will allow Brandon to ease up on defense at times, while not making him exert any more energy on the offensive end than he was last season. This saves Brandon. It doesn't dog him.

 

[hasoos]

Blake had a better playoff series than Hinrich.

Why don't you just post "I don't watch anybody but the Blazers".

 

[RickyRubio]

Blake had a better playoff series than Hinrich.

I hope you are joking. Otherwise, you are clueless.

 

[oldmangrouch]

Capt Quirk is a combo guard who is capable of playing above average defense. Miller is a real PG who can QB a team's offense, and play pretty decent defense himself.

Miller is older, you say? The guy is also an iron-man who has averaged an amazing 81.5 games a season! There is no real reason to believe he can't remain a good player for another 2-3 seasons, giving us a chance to compete while developing a younger prospect.

Is Hinrich better than nothing? Absolutely.....but I am a loooong way from convinced that he is our best option.

 

[RickyRubio]

So let's work Brandon like a dog again because no other player can get us into our offensive scheme? That's weak. I'd like Brandon to play a little more off the ball personally.

LoL well thank God you are not running the team.

 

[Erroneous Subterfuge]

I'd like it. He's a year younger, his salary goes down every year so it's not as bad as it first appears, his career PER is 14.8 compared to Blake's 12.1, and most importantly he's a substantial upgrade defensively. Last year he had to deal with a thumb injury and getting benched in favor of Rose. In his 4 starts last year he still averaged 16/5.8 with 2.8 steals a game. I think a new situation for him in which he'd probably get consistent starter minutes would be good for him and us, as much as I like Blake.

 

[Entity]

Portland was the most efficient offense in the NBA per possession. If Hinrich replaces Blake, Portland would still be the most efficient offense in the NBA. Sure, I'd still like to see some more offensive improvement, but I'm far more concerned with how inefficient this defense has been, and getting Hinrich improves that figure significantly. My prediction is:

POR off:
with Blake - 1st
with Hinrich - maybe 1st

POR def:
with Blake - 13th
with Hinrich - 5th-8th

That's powerhouse kind of stuff.

 

[Crimson the Cat]

Capt Quirk is a combo guard who is capable of playing above average defense. Miller is a real PG who can QB a team's offense, and play pretty decent defense himself.

Miller is older, you say? The guy is also an iron-man who has averaged an amazing 81.5 games a season! There is no real reason to believe he can't remain a good player for another 2-3 seasons, giving us a chance to compete while developing a younger prospect.

Is Hinrich better than nothing? Absolutely.....but I am a loooong way from convinced that he is our best option.

Don't you think the Blazers' brain trust understands this? I would hope they knew a general direction Miller was headed this Summer before making this move. If they move for Kirk, it's because he's the best fit available to us.

I'd be super pissed if went after Miller and he decides that he'd rather stay in Philly, head to ATL or MIA instead. Then who do we sign? Maybe no one.

 

[hasoos]

Don't you think the Blazers' brain trust understands this? I would hope they knew a general direction Miller was headed this Summer before making this move. If they move for Kirk, it's because he's the best fit available to us.

I'd be super pissed if went after Miller and he decides that he'd rather stay in Philly, head to ATL or MIA instead. Then who do we sign? Maybe no one.

Hmmm Miller. But the wrong Miller. Brad Miller would make a great 2nd string big to go with Pryz.

 

[PapaG]

You seriously think Blake outplayed Hinrich in this year's playoffs?

They didn't play each other, but statistically, Blake shot better overall, had a better PER, and had a much better A/TO ratio while playing 8 more minutes per game. Plus, Rondo average a triple-double against the Bulls and Ray Allen averaged 23 ppg for that series. I guess I missed the stellar perimeter defense played by Hinrich?

 

[LittleAlex]

LoL well thank God you are not running the team.

Because it would be really foolish to extend the guy's career?

If Brandon is continually asked to shoulder as much weight as he currently is, expect him to suffer the same injury problems as D Wade.

Brandon needs help, specifically another guy who can make plays and attack the rim.

 

[PapaG]

Why don't you just post "I don't watch anybody but the Blazers".

Why don't you offer some statistics. The Bulls backcourt lost the series by being unable to to contain Rondo and Ray Allen. Where are the facts that you are offering? I compared Blake/Hinrich and also how their opponents did in the first-round series. To me, Blake did a better job while playing more minutes.

 

[PapaG]

I hope you are joking. Otherwise, you are clueless.

Argue with the stats I posted. Otherwise, you are clueless.

 

[Ed O]

They didn't play each other, but statistically, Blake shot better overall, had a better PER, and had a much better A/TO ratio while playing 8 more minutes per game. Plus, Rondo average a triple-double against the Bulls and Ray Allen average 23 ppg for that series. I guess I missed the stellar perimeter defense played by Hinrich?

Blake's PER was 15.0. Hinrich's was 17.1

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/h/hinriki01.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/b/blakest01.html

Ed O.

 

[hasoos]

Why don't you offer some statistics. The Bulls backcourt lost the series by being unable to to contain Rondo and Ray Allen. Where are the facts that you are offering? I compared Blake/Hinrich and also how their opponents did in the first-round series. To me, Blake did a better job while playing more minutes.

Go look em up yourself. The Bulls back court didn't lose that series. The Celtics won that series with a better team. That series was way more intense in my book, way more physical, and during that series Hinrich displayed a toughness level that is not on this team now.

Is getting lit up by Rajon Rondo worse than getting lit up by Aaron Brooks, Kevin Lowry and Von Wafer? Rajon Rondo only averaged a triple double through out the playoffs for the most part. Amazingly enough after Houston got by Portland those guys didn't look so great did they?

How about those lovely missed free throws by Blake. Those were sure a good playoff performance. How about that wild 3 that he jacked up at the end of the game with a ton of time on the clock. That sure was the performance from a heady point guard.

 

[PapaG]

Blake's PER was 15.0. Hinrich's was 17.1

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/h/hinriki01.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/b/blakest01.html

Ed O.

OK, but Blake did much better defensively. I still say Blake had the better playoff as a true PG.

 

[PapaG]

Go look em up yourself. The Bulls back court didn't lose that series. The Celtics won that series with a better team. That series was way more intense in my book, way more physical, and during that series Hinrich displayed a toughness level that is not on this team now.

Is getting lit up by Rajon Rondo worse than getting lit up by Aaron Brooks, Kevin Lowry and Von Wafer? Rajon Rondo only averaged a triple double through out the playoffs for the most part. Amazingly enough after Houston got by Portland those guys didn't look so great did they?

How about those lovely missed free throws by Blake. Those were sure a good playoff performance. How about that wild 3 that he jacked up at the end of the game with a ton of time on the clock. That sure was the performance from a heady point guard.

Subjective, all of it. I offer stats, you offer feelings and excuse the piss-poor perimeter defense by the Bulls.

Good day. I have an opinion, and it can be argued statistically. Your hatred of Steve Blake is making you useless to debate on this issue. Rondo slowed down considerably versus Orlando. I guess the same works for saying the Bulls made him look better than he was, right?

 

[Shapecity]

From ESPN Insider Draft Buzz Galore ...

POSTED: June 24 -- 3:41 p.m. ET

Henry Abbott: There have been rumblings and suggestions that if things get extremely complicated with Ricky Rubio's Spanish team, DKV Joventut, he might not be able to afford to play in the NBA. Depending on where he's drafted, it's conceivable that his NBA salary will approximate the buyout he owes his original team. In other words, he might play in the NBA without making a penny.

Rubio says that wouldn't bother him. "I have a dream," he said. "I want to play in the NBA."

The point guard, who presumably could make some money from sponsorships, could not have been clearer that it's not about the money. If his rookie contract nets him zero, he says, "I don't care."

In a video that will be on TrueHoop shortly, he also was asked to react to various NBA cities. His gut reaction to the word "Minnesota" was: "Too cold." Oklahoma City earned a "My best friend lives nearby." And when Rubio thinks of Sacramento, the first thing that comes to mind is: "Nice weather."



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


POSTED: June 24 -- 1:59 p.m. ET




Andy Katz: Minnesota and Memphis haven't talked about a trade for the No. 2 pick yet, according to a source with direct knowledge of the situation.

Memphis owner Michael Heisley and GM Chris Wallace are scheduled to meet Wednesday night to discuss their options.

As for the Timberwolves, they want to climb to No. 2 to draft Ricky Rubio but are trying to figure out who could drop to them at No. 5 if they stay put.

If Memphis keeps the No. 2 pick and takes Hasheem Thabeet, Oklahoma City picks James Harden at No. 3 and Sacramento takes Stephen Curry or Jonny Flynn at No. 4 ... then Rubio will be there at No. 5.

The other Wolves scenario in which they would at least get Thabeet could occur if Memphis picks Tyreke Evans at No. 2, Oklahoma City picks Rubio at No. 3 and Sacramento picks Flynn or Curry at No. 4. In that instance, Thabeet would fall to No. 5.

As much as Minnesota wants Thabeet and Rubio, the source said it may be too difficult to pull it off.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


POSTED: June 24 -- 12:43 p.m. ET

Chris Broussard: Rajon Rondo is definitely on the market. I'm told he's very hard for Doc Rivers to coach, and that although Rondo gets along OK with his teammates, he's far from a great teammate. The fear in Boston is that if Rondo is this difficult to handle on a rookie-scale salary, he'll be a monster once he earns big money.

One GM told me, "They won a championship with this guy, and he's coming off a tremendous playoff performance ... and they're looking to trade him. That tells you how bad things are."



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


POSTED: June 24 -- 12:17 p.m. ET




Marc Stein: The Celtics scoffed with vigor Tuesday night when we presented them with a Rajon Rondo/Brian Scalabrine-for-Rudy Gay/Mike Conley scenario.

It certainly does make more sense that the Celts wouldn't surrender Rondo without getting the second overall pick back in the swap, but it's clearly getting harder and harder for them to convince folks that Rondo isn't in play.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


POSTED: June 24 -- 11:55 a.m. ET




Marc Stein: The Grizzlies aren't just entertaining the idea of parting with the No. 2 overall pick in Thursday's draft. They've also engaged in advanced discussions with the Knicks that should put former No. 2 overall pick Darko Milicic in New York by week's end ... unless Memphis winds up needing Milicic's expiring contract in another draft-related trade.

Sources say that the proposed swap would send Milicic to the Knicks for swingman Quentin Richardson and cash. Milicic is scheduled to earn $7.5 million next season in the final year of a three-year deal he received from the Griz in 2007; Richardson has a player option for next season at $8.7 million.

If the teams go through with the trade, Milicic would join his fourth team since Detroit infamously gambled on him in 2003 with the pick immediately after LeBron James ... and right before Carmelo Anthony, Chris Bosh and Dwyane Wade. But it's believed that Knicks coach Mike D'Antoni hasn't been able to kick his long-standing interest in seeing what he can get out of the perpetually, uh, casual 24-year-old. Despite his unquestioned standing as one of the biggest draft busts in league history, Milicic would have to be considered an intriguing one-year rental for the go-go-go Knicks given his length, mobility, passing skills and age.

Wouldn't he?

• Read Stein's entire trade-chatter column here



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POSTED: June 24 -- 11:11 a.m. ET



Harden
Andy Katz: Wednesday got off to a hurried start for Minnesota, which diverted the travel plans of Arizona State's James Harden.

NBA officials confirmed that Harden was supposed to be at Wednesday's media session in New York but had an unscheduled workout thrust onto his schedule late Tuesday night.

According to a source close to Harden, he flew to Minneapolis for an interview and a light shooting workout with the Timberwolves on Wednesday.

The source said Washington had told Harden he would have been the Wizards' pick at No. 5 before Tuesday's trade that shipped the fifth pick to Minnesota for Randy Foye and Mike Miller, with three Wizards -- Etan Thomas, Darius Songaila and Oleksiy Pecherov -- also heading to Minnesota.

The source said Harden would go to either Oklahoma City at No. 3 or Minnesota at No. 5 or 6, pending further moves by the Wolves.

Harden is expected to get to New York late Wednesday night.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------





POSTED: June 24 -- 1:18 a.m. ET

Chad Ford: The NBA trading frenzy that normally coincides with draft week got off to a hot start Tuesday with two huge trades. The Bucks traded Richard Jefferson to the Spurs for cap relief, and the Wolves agreed to trade Randy Foye and Mike Miller to the Wizards for the No. 5 pick and a bunch of players with undesirable contracts.

How do the deals affect the draft?

For the Bucks, probably little. This deal gave them some flexibility to re-sign one of their restricted free agents -- either Charlie Villanueva or Ramon Sessions. From what I can gather, the emphasis will be on Villanueva.

Why? The draft has something to do with it. The Bucks have several point guard prospects they like at No. 10. The only big guy they've looked at hard is DeJuan Blair, but that's too high for Blair to go.

I think they'll take Jonny Flynn, Jrue Holiday or Jeff Teague at No. 10 and go into the summer with a solid rebuilding base of talented young players including Andrew Bogut, Joe Alexander and Villanueva. It isn't a championship contender, but it's a start.

For the Spurs, not at all. They don't have a first-round pick anyway.

But the Wolves now are the power players in the draft, with picks 5, 6, 18, 28, 45 and 47. The question is, what will they do next?

Sources say they want two lottery picks, so a trade of 5 and 6 for the second or third pick is unlikely. But they might be willing to package 5 and 18. That might not be enough for Memphis (No. 2), but it could be for Oklahoma City (No. 3). The Thunder might be content to go to No. 5 and get either James Harden or Stephen Curry, and then, at No. 18, get another player they covet, Ohio State's B.J. Mullens.

See our latest mock draft for more on the Wolves' options.

The Wizards are out of the draft now, but what they did was pretty savvy. I thought it would be tough to get two veterans who could come and really contribute for them, but Miller and Foye really fill out their backcourt. If they can get one more big man, they will be serious contenders in the East.




• The Pistons also made a small deal Tuesday, moving Amir Johnson to the Bucks for Fabricio Oberto. Since Oberto's contract is only partially guaranteed next year, the Pistons can waive him and get about $1.7 million further under the salary cap this summer.

That could put them roughly $23 million under the cap going into free agency. Over the past few months, we've assumed Carlos Boozer is their primary target, but that might not be the case. A league source told me Tuesday that the Pistons' free-agent strategy likely would preclude a run at Boozer.

The Pistons want to add several players to the roster and want to keep salaries at or less than $10 million per year. With Boozer likely demanding a deal in the $15 million to $16 million a year range, his contract demands are out of their league. Add in concerns about Boozer's injury history, and I don't think the Pistons will make a play for him.

Instead, you can look for them to make a run at Ben Gordon, try to re-sign Antonio McDyess and find one or two other players they can sign for smaller salaries.

That stance in Detroit could put Boozer in a tough position. If he opts out of his contract with the Jazz, he's going to struggle to find any team far enough under the cap to offer him what he wants. And with the Jazz interested in keeping Paul Millsap, Boozer could be out of luck in Utah, too.



Rondo
• The Rajon Rondo trade talk is still alive despite Danny Ainge's attempts at spin control. In speaking to the media Tuesday, Ainge was pretty adamant that if the Celtics trade Rondo, it will be to make their team better and not because of any problems with Rondo.

I'm not sure I totally buy that. Rondo was the best player for the Celtics in the playoffs, a triple-double machine and the bridge between their present and their future. How would trading Rondo away make the Celtics better?

I'm more persuaded by what several league sources told me about Doc Rivers' relationship with Rondo. They say Rivers has told them Rondo is "impossible to coach" and "stubborn." The worry is that if the Celtics give him a big contract extension next year, he'll be even more unmanageable in the future. So the Celtics are trying to trade him now, while his trade value is high, to avoid a very difficult decision a year from now.

Given that, a couple of potential trade scenarios come to mind. These are not rumors, just hypotheticals.

What about San Antonio's Tony Parker, Roger Mason and Matt Bonner for Ray Allen and Rondo? The Celtics would get another young championship point guard and the Spurs would get a new backcourt capable of winning a title, as we've seen.

Or, what about Memphis' Mike Conley and the No. 2 pick for Rondo? Conley isn't Rondo, but he's young and improving, and the Celtics could get their man -- Tyreke Evans -- with the second pick.




• One day after a second workout with the Knicks, Jrue Holiday flew to Toronto for his second workout with the Raptors on Tuesday. Unlike in his first workout, against Jonny Flynn, he was by himself. Holiday wowed the Raptors in the first workout and getting him back for a second one in Toronto is a good sign.

The Raptors seem to have narrowed it down to DeMar DeRozan, Gerald Henderson and Holiday. We're sticking with DeRozan in our mock draft, but well-placed sources in Toronto say Holiday has a lot of fans in Toronto right now.

The Raptors had James Johnson in for a second workout as well. Johnson's stock has been all over the board, and he could be a target. The Raptors might have a need at small forward if they're unable to re-sign free agent Shawn Marion this summer.




• One rumor that won't go away has the Suns and Thunder talking about a draft-day swap that would give Oklahoma City the 14th pick and land the Suns the Thunder's 25th pick and, more importantly for the Suns, the return of their first-round pick in 2010. The Suns traded that pick to the Thunder several years ago as part of the Kurt Thomas trade. The trade is unprotected next year, and with the Suns flirting with rebuilding, they don't want to lose it.

Sources say the Thunder have an eye for Ohio State center B.J. Mullens and likely will take him if he's available at No. 14.

 

[Entity]

I didn't know Derrick Rose was benched in that series, since Hinrich apparently carried the starter's assignments. Blake is a shit defender. It's ridiculous to put him above Hinrich, who is most certainly not.

 

[andalusian]

Why don't you offer some statistics. The Bulls backcourt lost the series by being unable to to contain Rondo and Ray Allen. Where are the facts that you are offering? I compared Blake/Hinrich and also how their opponents did in the first-round series. To me, Blake did a better job while playing more minutes.

Blake's PER in the playoffs was lower than Hinrich - and Hinrich's defensive win-score in the playoffs was twice as high as Blake's - while playing against a much better guard rotation in Rondo/Ray Ray.

I like Aaron Brooks - but he is no Rondo... - and for the record, Hinrich played less minutes in the playoffs than Blake (not by much) - so two times the defensive win score in less minutes against better competition... yes, sounds like an upgrade to me...