Forum Game How do you build a contender around Dame in the next couple years?

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tykendo said:
My Money's on Dame. Some of Ya'll keep on doubting him. A healthy Dame, is a Lethal Dame. And he's 31, not 36. Quit trying to put him out to pasture.
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His age certainly plays into it, but the bigger issue is that he is not a position of need for the Blazers. His trade value is far more valuable than his value % over Simons. Simons and Smith Jr are a PG random that any team in the league would be happy with.
 
tykendo said:
My Money's on Dame. Some of Ya'll keep on doubting him. A healthy Dame, is a Lethal Dame. And he's 31, not 36. Quit trying to put him out to pasture.
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We are starting from nearly scratch. Look at our roster. How are we going to put a team around him in the next 2-3 years?

Either we go all-in and trade Simons and the draft picks for players that can help now, or we trade Dame. There's really no middle ground because we have zero assets.
 
Natebishop3 said:
We are starting from nearly scratch. Look at our roster. How are we going to put a team around him in the next 2-3 years?

Either we go all-in and trade Simons and the draft picks for players that can help now, or we trade Dame. There's really no middle ground because we have zero assets.
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My feelings exactly
 
lol...yeah, Blazers should just give up now before even trying because some fans can't see how it can be done

just about everybody agreed that the first step was to break up the Dame/CJ back court. For chrissakes CJ was traded almost 4 days ago and Portland isn't a contender yet? What the fuck is the holdup?

oy yeah, sure...the Blazers are going to get a great package of young players and picks for Dame. I mean, look at all the great assets they got for CJ-RoCo-Powell-Nance. There's the template!!! Yeah, it's obvious that teams will be lining up to mortgage their future to trade for a 31 year old 6'2 inch PG, out with a chronic injury, who is on a super-max contract.
 
tykendo said:
My Money's on Dame. Some of Ya'll keep on doubting him. A healthy Dame, is a Lethal Dame. And he's 31, not 36. Quit trying to put him out to pasture.
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He’ll be 32 next time he plays a game. In NBA years for a PG that has had to piggy back his team for years, that’s ancient.
 
wizenheimer said:
lol...yeah, Blazers should just give up now before even trying because some fans can't see how it can be done

just about everybody agreed that the first step was to break up the Dame/CJ back court. For chrissakes CJ was traded almost 4 days ago and Portland isn't a contender yet? What the fuck is the holdup?

oy yeah, sure...the Blazers are going to get a great package of young players and picks for Dame. I mean, look at all the great assets they got for CJ-RoCo-Powell-Nance. There's the template!!! Yeah, it's obvious that teams will be lining up to mortgage their future to trade for a 31 year old 6'2 inch PG, out with a chronic injury, who is on a super-max contract.
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I was in favor of breaking up the Dame/CJ backcourt when I thought we could trade him for a small forward. My plans were always to keep Norm/RoCo and move CJ for hopefully a really good small forward.

Dame
Norm
???
RoCo
Nurk

Or you move CJ and RoCo, get someone like Randle or Grant and start Nas. But instead the Blazers dumped CJ/Norm/RoCo and basically got zero back in the way of immediate help for Dame. We got Hart. That's it. And we definitely didn't need another guard. Cronin has done a piss poor job of getting immediate help, and he's banking on things that are historically not a good way to acquire talent in Portland.

Free agency? LOL

The draft? Sure.... if you have several years for the players to pan out, which we don't. How exactly are we going to acquire the kind of talent that we need to contend?

Dame
Ant
Nas
????
Nurk

I don't care who you plug into that four spot, that's not a contending team.
 
For a little more context:

Out:
46.8 ppg
11.9 rebounds
8 assists
2.3 blocks
3.5 steals

Where are we going to find that production? Ant can probably step in and replicate CJ (including his horrible defense), and RoCo's numbers were pretty pedestrian, but Norm's offensive output was pretty damn good. We gave up a solid starter for basically nothing after trading away GTJ (another solid starter)
 
Natebishop3 said:
For a little more context:

Out:
46.8 ppg
11.9 rebounds
8 assists
2.3 blocks
3.5 steals

Where are we going to find that production? Ant can probably step in and replicate CJ (including his horrible defense), and RoCo's numbers were pretty pedestrian, but Norm's offensive output was pretty damn good. We gave up a solid starter for basically nothing after trading away GTJ (another solid starter)
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I understand your pessimism, but you're acting like Portland lost something irreplaceable with these trades. They didn't. Olshey had driven the team down a narrow dead end lane. There was no room to turn around so the team bus had to be backed out of the dead end. Portland has not lost a thing of any real value with these trades. They were locked on a treadmill of crappy draft picks and 1st round exits. Where they are right now, is a better place than where they were a week ago.

but go ahead, convince me. With Philly now out of the running now, give me a couple of examples of realistic teams that would trade for dame and give up the kinds of assets you guy keep assuring everybody that Portland would get. And keep in mind that the trades they just made are the back drop for the kind of assets they'd get for Dame
 
wizenheimer said:
I understand your pessimism, but you're acting like Portland lost something irreplaceable with these trades. They didn't. Olshey had driven the team down a narrow dead end lane. There was no room to turn around so the team bus had to be backed out of the dead end. Portland has not lost a thing of any real value with these trades. They were locked on a treadmill of crappy draft picks and 1st round exits. Where they are right now, is a better place than where they were a week ago.

but go ahead, convince me. With Philly now out of the running now, give me a couple of examples of realistic teams that would trade for dame and give up the kinds of assets you guy keep assuring everybody that Portland would get. And keep in mind that the trades they just made are the back drop for the kind of assets they'd get for Dame
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I agree that we needed to blow it up. I have been saying that for months.

However if you're going to blow it up, you fully commit and you trade Dame. You also get way better value for Norm in terms of young players or picks, which we did not do. We got crappy young players and we got crappy picks. Everything you said basically just supported my point that we're not going to be able to put a contender around Dame in a short period of time. If Portland lost no real value, what value do they currently have to make moves to acquire talent?

Also, I flatly disagree that the Simmons/Harden trade is the back drop of the kind of assets we would get for Dame. Those two players are massive headcases. Harden has forced his way out of two teams in two years. Simmons has been sitting out for months now. Dame is nothing but class, a great leader and a great teammate. Not even in the same ballpark.
 
Put good players around him and maintain flexibility. If it's not enough we can trade Dame if/when he asks out.
 
bemac said:
First of all, I've never seen a championship contender built around a 6'2 point guard, so that's a problem. The fact that the Blazers already have at least 80% of said point guard in a rookie contract, well, there's your answer. There is no other way out than to trade Dame.
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Zeke's Detroit Pistons. Then again, he was only 6'1".
 
With more 1st round picks it may be possible, but not getting value for RoCo and Powell effectively torpedoed any idea of rebuilding with Dame. The only possible way it could occur is for a group of vets to decide they are willing to take the vet min to come to Portland and build an aging super team. That ain't happening.
 
Phatguysrule said:
Cap space to make lopsided deals. Don't commit bad (long term) contracts.
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But that's usually how you use cap space to make lopsided deals. You take back bad contracts. And what assets are we providing in those lopsided deals?
 
Natebishop3 said:
But that's usually how you use cap space to make lopsided deals. You take back bad contracts. And what assets are we providing in those lopsided deals?
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We'll have assets, I don't think for a second that Cronin is done.
 
How do you build a contender around Dame?
Well, you start by trading away the ball hog. This will open up more ball movement (aka: passing) and a feeling of all being involved.
But, before you do that, you get rid of dead weight in the starting lineup, and replace with solid players, hungry to make a name for themselves.
After that, you just ride out the rest of the year, hopefully, you've created enough salary flexibility to make some trades or better yet, acquire a borderline all star or two.
I think that is the plan.
 
Natebishop3 said:
Also, I flatly disagree that the Simmons/Harden trade is the back drop of the kind of assets we would get for Dame. Those two players are massive headcases. .
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I didn't use that trade as the template. I used the RoCo-CJ-Powell-Nance trades as an indicator of return because right now, the same GM would be making the Dame trade. Don't know about the off-season

but this discussion is going nowhere...we simply aren't going to agree at this time. I don't give a flying fuck how many times people say building a team around Dame can't be done. None of you can predict the future. What I want to see is at least one honest effort to do it before giving up
 
maxiep said:
Zeke's Detroit Pistons. Then again, he was only 6'1".
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Okay, if we can put together a supporting cast similar to what Zeke had, I'm all for it. He was in his late 20's with one of the best supporting casts in the game, so it will be a challenge.

Of course, with the value of Dame right now, there is a much better chance of using him to build that team around Simons. The key to is all, is to trade him for a player who becomes the best player on the team, and Simons is 2nd.
 
wizenheimer said:
I didn't use that trade as the template. I used the RoCo-CJ-Powell-Nance trades as an indicator of return because right now, the same GM would be making the Dame trade. Don't know about the off-season

but this discussion is going nowhere...we simply aren't going to agree at this time. I don't give a flying fuck how many times people say building a team around Dame can't be done. None of you can predict the future. What I want to see is at least one honest effort to do it before giving up
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Exactly. We owe him that much.
 
1. Do well in the lottery. Draft Jabari Smith and hope Shaeden Sharpe declares and draft him, too.

2. Use your cap space judiciously on at least two guys who are shooters and who will work hard on defense. Not guys who can shoot, but guys who make open 3s on offense if they do anything at all.

3. If you have room left, sign or get a competent back-up big who can play 12-15 minutes per night without killing his own team.

4. Invest in bubblewrap to keep Nas from breaking.

5. Try to hold on to DSJ, Justise and Ben (unless you have to trade them; I can live with letting them go in a deal). They've shown me they can play roles that will benefit a decent team.

6. Hope Ibou Dianko Badji is available with our second-round pick.
 
PCmor7 said:
1. Do well in the lottery. Draft Jabari Smith and hope Shaeden Sharpe declares and draft him, too.

2. Use your cap space judiciously on at least two guys who are shooters and who will work hard on defense. Not guys who can shoot, but guys who make open 3s on offense if they do anything at all.

3. If you have room left, sign or get a competent back-up big who can play 12-15 minutes per night without killing his own team.

4. Invest in bubblewrap to keep Nas from breaking.

5. Try to hold on to DSJ, Justise and Ben (unless you have to trade them; I can live with letting them go in a deal). They've shown me they can play roles that will benefit a decent team.

6. Hope Ibou Dianko Badji is available with our second-round pick.
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DSJ can't shoot..
But he does EVERYTHING else really really well.
Love how he pushes and passes...
He is the type of guy a winning team needs.
Very impressed with Winslow. He seems a 'jack of all trades' type.
 
Of course, holding on to Lillard long enough to lure a big name free agent and then trading him would not be a bad plan.
 
Wade Garrett said:
DSJ can't shoot..
But he does EVERYTHING else really really well.
Love how he pushes and passes...
He is the type of guy a winning team needs.
Very impressed with Winslow. He seems a 'jack of all trades' type.
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DSJ doesn't have to shoot because he does everything else the Blazers need in a back-up guard, and the fact that he can't shoot might be the one thing that means there won't be a market to sign him away from the Blazers. He has value here.

But I meant for most of our other spots, fill them with shooters like the Bucks and so many other winning teams have done in recent years. If there's a skill that can help your team in a role player, it's being able to knock down open 3s consistently when your offensive stars occupy extra defenders.
 
Now, since deadline past...Beal + Draymond (forces his way to join Dame)...is our only hope for a "contender". And fwiw, both attended Lillards wedding last year :dunno:

And yes, I'm ruling out a draft day miracle already. Lol
 
Watching the game last night with one of my sons, who is 9. Trying to explain all the trades and money, draft picks, he loves it. And surprisingly gets it. Then he asked "do you think they will win another championship in your life"? Ugh. Not sure bud. But hopefully yours.

Excuse me I think I have something in my eye
 
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