If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Period!!

[Denny Crane]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

We should pay more for health care. Our population is 317M. Germany's, for example, is 81M. Britain's is 63M, France 65M.

 

[donkiez]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

We should pay more for health care. Our population is 317M. Germany's, for example, is 81M. Britain's is 63M, France 65M.

chart is per capita

 

[Denny Crane]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

chart is per capita

So let's pay less!

Start with your fiancé, mom, and dad.

(My point is someone's oxe is going to be gored, whoever it is won't like it)

 

[MarAzul]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

chart is per capita

The US has many Illegals riding the system, about as many people has 1/3 of the population of the UK
Probably screws of the charting a tad. Then we do have a hell of a lot of money spent in this country on pricey cosmetic surgery and implants.
People come to the US for health care, My neighbor up in BC was just down to UCLA last year.

All these odd item sort of screw up the view in these charts I would wager.

 

[donkiez]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

The US has many Illegals riding the system, about as many people has 1/3 of the population of the UK
Probably screws of the charting a tad. Then we do have a hell of a lot of money spent in this country on pricey cosmetic surgery and implants.
People come to the US for health care, My neighbor up in BC was just down to UCLA last year.

All these odd item sort of screw up the view in these charts I would wager.

You probably wager right on the illegals. I don't think cosmetic is considered in these numbers though as its considered elective. My stance on the illegals is make them pay taxes, give them limited healthcare..... we are paying for them already, might as put it on the books and work on mitigating their cost to the rest of us in a realistic way.

Certain areas of our health care system are still very good and even world leading, although very expensive. I'm sure you friend at UCLA is getting very good care. People also go to China for heath care for various reason also.

 

[Denny Crane]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

You probably wager right on the illegals. I don't think cosmetic is considered in these numbers though as its considered elective. My stance on the illegals is make them pay taxes, give them limited healthcare..... we are paying for them already, might as put it on the books and work on mitigating their cost to the rest of us in a realistic way.

Certain areas of our health care system are still very good and even world leading, although very expensive. I'm sure you friend at UCLA is getting very good care. People also go to China for heath care for various reason also.

Every non-life threatening procedure is elective. That is, a procedure they don't immediately admit you to the hospital and perform surgery right away.

 

[donkiez]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

So let's pay less!

Start with your fiancé, mom, and dad.

(My point is someone's oxe is going to be gored, whoever it is won't like it)

Not my preferred place to start, but everyone's OX in that corral could take a hit and with change someone always get it worse than someone else. I would start with insurance companies and how their contracts are negotiated with hospitals. There really is no rhyme or reason to some of the pricing structures, one insurance company can pay vastly different rates to different hospitals for the same procedure, also many insurance companies can pay vastly different rates to the same hospital for the same procedure. And if you don't have insurance you will be paying out of pocket far more than any insurance company. Also often you don't even get what you pay for either as the highest cost hospitals bill more because they are more inefficient, which results in higher cost with worse care.

 

[donkiez]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

Every non-life threatening procedure is elective. That is, a procedure they don't immediately admit you to the hospital and perform surgery right away.

ok if boob jobs are included in those number then I agree thats kinda fucked.

 

[Denny Crane]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

Not my preferred place to start, but everyone's OX in that corral could take a hit and with change someone always get it worse than someone else. I would start with insurance companies and how their contracts are negotiated with hospitals. There really is no rhyme or reason to some of the pricing structures, one insurance company can pay vastly different rates to different hospitals for the same procedure, also many insurance companies can pay vastly different rates to the same hospital for the same procedure. And if you don't have insurance you will be paying out of pocket far more than any insurance company. Also often you don't even get what you pay for either as the highest cost hospitals bill more because they are more inefficient, which results in higher cost with worse care.

I went 10 years without insurance. My medical bills were at a discount. The doctors and labs all knocked a big portion off the bill when they found I was paying cash.

Maybe all insurance should be catastrophic with $10K deductibles, and people should pay for their own care otherwise. When I have to shop, I'll compare what I'd pay between two doctors and choose accordingly.

Government should get the fuck out of it. There's no reason insurance companies shouldn't be competing for our business, like they do for auto insurance.

Heck, life insurance is way cheaper than health insurance, and it's guaranteed to pay off (when people die), and frequently the pay outs are far more than the most expensive medical treatment, even ongoing.

 

[donkiez]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

I went 10 years without insurance. My medical bills were at a discount. The doctors and labs all knocked a big portion off the bill when they found I was paying cash.

Maybe all insurance should be catastrophic with $10K deductibles, and people should pay for their own care otherwise. When I have to shop, I'll compare what I'd pay between two doctors and choose accordingly.

Government should get the fuck out of it. There's no reason insurance companies shouldn't be competing for our business, like they do for auto insurance.

Heck, life insurance is way cheaper than health insurance, and it's guaranteed to pay off (when people die), and frequently the pay outs are far more than the most expensive medical treatment, even ongoing.

Not optimaI could go with something like that insurance wise I suppose. My biggest beef with Obama care is that it is to complicated and forces people to actually do something. People are usually reactive by nature.

I disagree with keeping government out of it though. Its an industry that needs to be regulated. Capitalism in its purest form breeds corruption and greed at the expense of everything else and is just as dangerous as communism or socialism in their purest forms. Ill reference our current free market health care system for an example. Personally I feel that education, healthcare and prison are the only aspects of society that should be social institutions. These are all investments in our future society.

 

[Denny Crane]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

Where has capitalism in its purest form ever been tried?

 

[donkiez]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

Where has capitalism in its purest form ever been tried?

No where completely I guess, the US is as close as you will get and it yielded us Standard Oil, US steel, AT&t and microsoft. All great innovative companies of their time but with absolute power breeds absolute corruption and ends up destroying competition. Also giving incentive to cut safety corners, pollute, and treat their workers like shit. Oligopoly's are also just as bad and a little more in style these days.

One of my favorite joke commercials for you, Ive posted it before but it deserves a second run.
[video=youtube;BJT3M7C8LfY]

 

[Denny Crane]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

No where completely I guess, the US is as close as you will get and it yielded us Standard Oil, US steel, AT&t and microsoft. All great innovative companies of their time but with absolute power breeds absolute corruption and ends up destroying competition. Also giving incentive to cut safety corners, pollute, and treat their workers like shit. Oligopoly's are also just as bad and a little more in style these days.

One of my favorite joke commercials for you, Ive posted it before but it deserves a second run.
[video=youtube;BJT3M7C8LfY]

Companies don't pollute. People do.

What would this country be like if there was no Standard Oil, US Steel, AT&T, and Microsoft?

The US isn't even close to being capitalism, and never was. As soon as the government was formed, Hamilton moved to establish the Bank of the USA and there was no pure capitalism after that.

 

[donkiez]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

Companies don't pollute. People do.

What would this country be like if there was no Standard Oil, US Steel, AT&T, and Microsoft?

The US isn't even close to being capitalism, and never was. As soon as the government was formed, Hamilton moved to establish the Bank of the USA and there was no pure capitalism after that.

companies are people these days. Money is a powerful motivator for many evils.

We need capitalism and those companies mentioned. Just making an example to show how once they crush everyone bad things happen and free markets disappear.

How did that kill capitalism here?

 

[Denny Crane]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

companies are people these days. Money is a powerful motivator for many evils.

We need capitalism and those companies mentioned. Just making an example to show how once they crush everyone bad things happen and free markets disappear.

How did that kill capitalism here?

Corporations are people in the sense government can't discriminate against one to favor another. That's it. That's what the supreme court ruled. I think it makes perfect sense.

Without those corporations, we wouldn't have much infrastructure. Infrastructure that everyone leveraged to build the nation.

http://www.fee.org/the_freeman/deta...-the-perils-of-state-capitalism#axzz2lRCwWlV8

 

[maxiep]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

Whether or not Obama is a good leader doesn't really have anything to do with whether or not the website went down. That's what I don't get. There is so much to harp on Obama about, why overextend it? It's weakens the actual criticisms.

You think I'm criticizing just the website? M'kay, cowboy.

 

[maxiep]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

Yea, fuck those democrats and the black man they rode in on! They voted for him now they can suffer and live with their failures. Hahahaha I cant wait to taste their delicious tears of sorrow. Sound about right?

What does race have to do with being really bad at one's job?

 

[maxiep]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

I know it was a bullshit fix to appease republicans and deflect blame. The funniest part though is when he finally caves then he is an asshole for not following the law. I'm not a diehard Obama lover but the circle of crazy ends up making me defend Obama, to the likes of you, more than I care to. I read the exchange you mentioned also, I'm not sure why he took that position. I mean we all knew he grew up in Kenya right?

The correction you posted though seems to have more to do with the CA board of insurance's decision.

You think it was done to "appease republicans"? Hilarious.

 

[maxiep]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

I love it when people use the word "capitalism" to criticize free markets. I bet most aren't aware who coined it.

 

[MARIS61]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

What would this country be like if there was no Standard Oil, US Steel, AT&T, and Microsoft?

Oh, don't tease me like that!

It would be close to perfect.

Not to mention the many other countries that might not have been as wartorn for corporate profit.

 

[TradeNurkicNow]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

You think I'm criticizing just the website? M'kay, cowboy.

No, I don't. That's why I said "Why overextend it?" As in, why blame Obama for everything? Why not just blame him for the things he's in control of?

 

[maxiep]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

No, I don't. That's why I said "Why overextend it?" As in, why blame Obama for everything? Why not just blame him for the things he's in control of?

This piece of shit legislation was his baby. He took 100% credit for it; he encouraged the term "Obamacare". No one can tell him "no" in the Executive Branch; he had complete control of everything.

He is the Chief Executive. He deliberately misled the American people to pass the bill and to win re-election. He designed it to be frontloaded with goodies, only to deliver the incredibly high bill once the election was over. Even after having three years to get this thing up and running, the website still has 30%-40% of the code unwritten. Mind you, he stated is was completely ready to go and would run like Amazon or Travelocity.

The bottom line is that any other CEO would have been fired after such a debacle. Now he's a bystander, angrier than anyone about how the problems. Is nothing his fault?

Ask yourself another simple question: Do you think if this fiction would have been a success among the American people (I actually think many Democrats and Obama himself believe this legislation is accomplishing exactly what they wanted it to do), he wouldn't be "spiking the football"?

Like I said, he seeks to take all the credit and none of the blame, which is the opposite of what any executive should do. He's not qualified to run a McDonald's, much less the country. However, we voted for him, so we get precisely what we deserve.

 

[Denny Crane]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

Oh, don't tease me like that!

It would be close to perfect.

Not to mention the many other countries that might not have been as wartorn for corporate profit.

You would be spending all day and much of the night chopping wood to stay warm and to cook food, making candles to read by (if you can even get a book), hunting for your food, etc. And if you or your wife got sick, you'd have to wait for the doctor to arrive on horseback to apply leaches.

Perfect.

 

[MarAzul]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

Where has capitalism in its purest form ever been tried?

USA around 1880 I would guess. Surely not since the progressives started running amok, like Teddy Roosevelt and Woodrow Wilson. A republican and a Democrat but Progressive at heart in mind and actions.
Conservative have lost ground inch by inch every since.

 

[TradeNurkicNow]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

 

[Denny Crane]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

USA around 1880 I would guess. Surely not since the progressives started running amok, like Teddy Roosevelt and Woodrow Wilson. A republican and a Democrat but Progressive at heart in mind and actions.
Conservative have lost ground inch by inch every since.

Nope. It was never tried.

 

[MarAzul]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

This piece of shit legislation was his baby. He took 100% credit for it; he encouraged the term "Obamacare". No one can tell him "no" in the Executive Branch; he had complete control of everything.

He is the Chief Executive. He deliberately misled the American people to pass the bill and to win re-election. He designed it to be frontloaded with goodies, only to deliver the incredibly high bill once the election was over. Even after having three years to get this thing up and running, the website still has 30%-40% of the code unwritten. Mind you, he stated is was completely ready to go and would run like Amazon or Travelocity.

The bottom line is that any other CEO would have been fired after such a debacle. Now he's a bystander, angrier than anyone about how the problems. Is nothing his fault?

Ask yourself another simple question: Do you think if this fiction would have been a success among the American people (I actually think many Democrats and Obama himself believe this legislation is accomplishing exactly what they wanted it to do), he wouldn't be "spiking the football"?

Like I said, he seeks to take all the credit and none of the blame, which is the opposite of what any executive should do. He's not qualified to run a McDonald's, much less the country. However, we voted for him, so we get precisely what we deserve.

Geez Max! Why don't you say it like it is?

 

[TradeNurkicNow]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

 

[MarAzul]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

This cartoon is really funny. Who the hell uses a typewriter these days?

 

[TradeNurkicNow]

Re: If you like your Healthcare coverage, you can keep your Healthcare coverage! Peri

This cartoon is really funny. Who the hell uses a typewriter these days?

that's part of the joke. notice the aol disc and the old school windows logo