Jimmy Butler wants out? (He does.)

[UKRAINEFAN]

Here is a quote on his Wolves teammates: I don't consider it putting them down or derogatory. "We were just playing soft," Butler said. "We tend to do that from time to time. Whenever we play hard good things happen, which is what a lot of people have been preaching around here lately. I just think everybody, no matter the talent level, you go out there and compete, you do your job, but [over] all else you just play harder than everybody.”

And: "We just gotta get tougher. We gotta play like some dogs with a sense of urgency," Butler said Tuesday. "Teams just do whatever they want against us. I don't like it. Ain't no coach in the world that can make somebody play hard. Ain't no coach in the world that can make anybody want it."

"We gotta have that will to want to guard. We haven't done that all year," he said. "We've had stretches where it's looked solid, and then we go back to what you've been seeing. All in all, we just gotta want to play defense. Thibs, he don't got too much to do with that."

 

[James lamphear]

Stuff happens behind the scenes. I have a friend with a source in Chicago's front office. Its not good.

Also, if he has this to say about Hoiberg, then Stotts definitely isn't the coach for him.

I was going to say exact same thing.

 

[tester551]

If there weren't character questions I'd trade CJ for him in a heartbeat.

If it weren't for those concerns, it would cost a whole lot more than CJ.

Character isn’t what wins championships. This isn’t the Boy Scouts. And the whole point of building a “culture” is so you can take chances on guys with questionable off court issues.

And it’s not like the guy is a criminal. He probably has an alpha personality and might have been pushed into a leadership role he wasn’t fit for.

Agreed.

 

[UKRAINEFAN]

He's called out teammates before and essentially said it was his way or Fred Hoibergs way in Chicago.

I'm gonna stick with my original opinion. I don't think calling out your teammates is wrong and it;s not the same as putting them down. I don't see anything disrespectful he has said about a coach. I think he is actually milder in confronting teammates than Jordan or Bryant. If you have some inside info, I'd be happy to hear it.

 

[BonesJones]

McCollum, Turner and a pick for Butler, Gibson, and Patton?

Makes a lot of sense. We'd shed $40M next season if Butler left.

Lillard (36) / Baldwin (12)
Butler (21) / Curry (27)
Harkless (30) / Butler (15) / Aminu (3)
Aminu (27) / Gibson (18) / Collins (3)
Nurkic (30) / Collins (18)

 

[BonesJones]

I'm gonna stick with my original opinion. I don't think calling out your teammates is wrong and it;s not the same as putting them down. I don't see anything disrespectful he has said about a coach. I think he is actually milder in confronting teammates than Jordan or Bryant. If you have some inside info, I'd be happy to hear it.

I'm basing it off stuff I'm hearing that hasn't gone public.

 

[BonesJones]

Here is a quote on his Wolves teammates: I don't consider it putting them down or derogatory. "We were just playing soft," Butler said. "We tend to do that from time to time. Whenever we play hard good things happen, which is what a lot of people have been preaching around here lately. I just think everybody, no matter the talent level, you go out there and compete, you do your job, but [over] all else you just play harder than everybody.”

And: "We just gotta get tougher. We gotta play like some dogs with a sense of urgency," Butler said Tuesday. "Teams just do whatever they want against us. I don't like it. Ain't no coach in the world that can make somebody play hard. Ain't no coach in the world that can make anybody want it."

"We gotta have that will to want to guard. We haven't done that all year," he said. "We've had stretches where it's looked solid, and then we go back to what you've been seeing. All in all, we just gotta want to play defense. Thibs, he don't got too much to do with that."

Quotes like these arent the problem.....

 

[Propagandist]

Here is a quote on his Wolves teammates: I don't consider it putting them down or derogatory. "We were just playing soft," Butler said. "We tend to do that from time to time. Whenever we play hard good things happen, which is what a lot of people have been preaching around here lately. I just think everybody, no matter the talent level, you go out there and compete, you do your job, but [over] all else you just play harder than everybody.”

And: "We just gotta get tougher. We gotta play like some dogs with a sense of urgency," Butler said Tuesday. "Teams just do whatever they want against us. I don't like it. Ain't no coach in the world that can make somebody play hard. Ain't no coach in the world that can make anybody want it."

"We gotta have that will to want to guard. We haven't done that all year," he said. "We've had stretches where it's looked solid, and then we go back to what you've been seeing. All in all, we just gotta want to play defense. Thibs, he don't got too much to do with that."

God, I want Jimmy Butler on the Trail Blazers.

 

[julius]

Why not? Worst case scenario is you dump CJs contract, which isn’t the worst thing to me.

Because dumping his salary isn't all the sudden going to make it so they can replace his output.

This team thrives when they have threats from deep. Butler is not really a threat from deep. 16% of his shots are from 16 feet and out, meaning he scores mostly from 16 feet and in. That doesn't help spread the offense.

He's not known for creating his own shot (albeit, CJ is a bit of a ball hog).

How do you justify to Damian that you want him to stay in Portland if you basically throw away the teams chances like this? The ONLY way it makes sense to trade for Butler (CJ or not) is if he signs an extension. If not, you basically better win the title in 2018-19, because it's pretty much a team that is going to be dismantled after that. They aren't going to compete with the likes of LA to sign any of the "big name" free agents next summer,

Yeah, the team (as it currently is) isn't going to win the title. But neither would the team with Damian, Butler, Nurk (etc) as the starting 5.

Look at the players traded for Chris Paul (slightly different scenarios, but I'd argue CP3 is a bigger name than Butler). It's not exactly a bunch of proven stars .

 

[BonesJones]

If it weren't for those concerns, it would cost a whole lot more than CJ.


Agreed.

No it wouldn't. CJ is somewhat close in value, and when you consider that Butler is a flight risk who's expiring and demanded a trade, even if he was a perfect person he'd still be equal at best to CJ in terms of trade value here.

 

[tester551]

Here is a quote on his Wolves teammates: I don't consider it putting them down or derogatory. "We were just playing soft," Butler said. "We tend to do that from time to time. Whenever we play hard good things happen, which is what a lot of people have been preaching around here lately. I just think everybody, no matter the talent level, you go out there and compete, you do your job, but [over] all else you just play harder than everybody.”

And: "We just gotta get tougher. We gotta play like some dogs with a sense of urgency," Butler said Tuesday. "Teams just do whatever they want against us. I don't like it. Ain't no coach in the world that can make somebody play hard. Ain't no coach in the world that can make anybody want it."

"We gotta have that will to want to guard. We haven't done that all year," he said. "We've had stretches where it's looked solid, and then we go back to what you've been seeing. All in all, we just gotta want to play defense. Thibs, he don't got too much to do with that."

Portland suffers from these same issues too.

 

[BonesJones]

Portland suffers from these same issues too.

Were have all the same issues that Chicago did, so why should we trade for him then?

 

[tester551]

Look at the players traded for Chris Paul (slightly different scenarios, but I'd argue CP3 is a bigger name than Butler). It's not exactly a bunch of proven stars .

Since when is CJ a 'proven star'?

He's good, but no where near a star. He's closer to the Eric Gordon tier than the CP3 or Butler tier

 

[BonesJones]

Since when is CJ a 'proven star'?

He's good, but no where near a star. He's closer to the Eric Gordon tier than the CP3 or Butler tier

I don't think that's what he's saying.

 

[BigGameDamian]

 

[julius]

Since when is CJ a 'proven star'?

He's good, but no where near a star. He's closer to the Eric Gordon tier than the CP3 or Butler tier

that doesn't really change what I said. CJ is 27, and coming off of 3 years of 20+ ppg. No player lik him was traded for CP3.

If you say Lou Williams was, I say A: was older than CJ is when the Rockets traded him and B: had his first season where he averaged 20+ ppg (after 12 years) and that was *after* he was traded. If the Blazers had traded CJ for Lou Williams, people here (cept for the ones who are always negative) would have felt it was a huge downgrade.

 

[tester551]

Were have all the same issues that Chicago did, so why should we trade for him then?

Because we need a full team of players holding each other accountable.

Also Portlands issues with effort come and go. I don't believe it's as chronic as in Chicago.

Quotes like these arent the problem.....

Then what is? If you're in 'the know' - then share why you think he's such a bad person.

Butler is hyper competitive. I know there are issues with him calling out teammates, but i haven't seen any evidence of him being a bad person.

Jordan & Kobe both berated teammates on multiple occasions. It happens in sports. It doesn't make it right or even ok.... but it also doesn't make someone a bad person

 

[Boob-No-More]

Portland suffers from these same issues too.

Really, I thought we were a top 8 defensive team last year. Min was 27th overall, and dead last in defense when they didn't have Butler. Not really the same thing at all.

Dame really upped his effort on the defensive end last year, and our two most important young guys (Nurk and Collins) are tough, hard nosed defenders. Zach Collins actually looks pissed when someone scores on him. It's rare that a player so young takes so much pride in his defense and the exact opposite of what Butler called out his teammates about.

I think he'd be a great fit here and is exactly what this team needs.

BNM

 

[BonesJones]

Because we need a full team of players holding each other accountable.

Also Portlands issues with effort come and go. I don't believe it's as chronic as in Chicago.


Then what is? If you're in 'the know' - then share why you think he's such a bad person.

Butler is hyper competitive. I know there are issues with him calling out teammates, but i haven't seen any evidence of him being a bad person.

Jordan & Kobe both berated teammates on multiple occasions. It happens in sports. It doesn't make it right or even ok.... but it also doesn't make someone a bad person

I don't have specific instances. I just talk to people who know prople. There are quotes that have become public about GMs and what they think of him. Olshey should do some more digging, but he's questionable. I saw what people were talking about when he was sitting on the bench berating and heckling Zach Collins while they were up 20 with 3 minutes left.

 

[BonesJones]

I don't have specific instances. I just talk to people who know prople. There are quotes that have become public about GMs and what they think of him. Olshey should do some more digging, but he's questionable. I saw what people were talking about when he was sitting on the bench berating and heckling Zach Collins while they were up 20 with 3 minutes left.

Think about Aldridge...

 

[James lamphear]

I don't have specific instances. I just talk to people who know prople. There are quotes that have become public about GMs and what they think of him. Olshey should do some more digging, but he's questionable. I saw what people were talking about when he was sitting on the bench berating and heckling Zach Collins while they were up 20 with 3 minutes left.

I remember that occasion last year. I said before he is questionable team mate. That and one year left on his contract. The guy very talented and love to win but question how he leads though. Maybe playing with Dame will give him different mind set.

 

[BBert]

So, first it was "bad" that we weren't included, then it was "bad" that we were? Which is worse, the exclusion of the inclusion?

According to the original article:

"Although Woj reports that few, if any, teams “are engaged in serious conversations with the Timberwolves on Butler,” there are others waiting till the dust clears on Minnesota’s intentions with Butler."

Being first isn't always the best position to be in in these situations. It is often better to sit back, see what others are offering, and then beat those offers. By then, you'll have a clearer picture of what it will take to get a deal done without overpaying.

BNM

Oh come on. If Woj doesn't report that Portland is interested in a player, then Neil is a bum. If Woj says Portland is interested, then Neil paid Woj, Woj is a liar and Neil is a bum. If Neil isn't quoted as saying he tried to get every player that gets traded, then Neil is a bum. If Neil is quoted saying he tried to get a player but they didn't accept our offer, then Neil is a bum. If Woj tweets that we tried to get a certain player, or that we were in the running for the player, then Woj is a liar, and Neil is a bum. If it's reported that Portland tried to make a trade or lure a free agent, and we don't sign him, then Neil is a bum, and he paid the reporter to lie. What don't you understand?

 

[Propagandist]

I googled "is jimmy butler an asshole" and now I feel like he is.

Conversely, I googled "is damian lillard an asshole" and everything pretty much confirmed how cool he is...

 

[hoopsjock]

McCollum, Turner and a pick for Butler, Gibson, and Patton?

Makes a lot of sense. We'd shed $40M next season if Butler left.

Lillard (36) / Baldwin (12)
Butler (21) / Curry (27)
Harkless (30) / Butler (15) / Aminu (3)
Aminu (27) / Gibson (18) / Collins (3)
Nurkic (30) / Collins (18)

I'd love that trade. It doesn't sound like Minny will trade Butler without Dieng attached though.

 

[BonesJones]

I'd love that trade. It doesn't sound like Minny will trade Butler without Dieng attached though.

They'll likely have to choose between getting back a player of McCollums caliber and offloading Dieng.

 

[hoopsjock]

They'll likely have to choose between getting back a player of McCollums caliber and offloading Dieng.

I get the feeling they'd rather get rid of Dieng, even if it means the return is slightly less.

 

[BonesJones]

I get the feeling they'd rather get rid of Dieng, even if it means the return is slightly less.

Then Turner and Meyers for Butler and Dieng hahaha.

 

[Hoopguru]

I'd love that trade. It doesn't sound like Minny will trade Butler without Dieng attached though.

who would the wolves have to play the 4 if they gave up Gibson? I believe Dieng is a 5.

 

[BonesJones]

who would the wolves have to play the 4 if they gave up Gibson? I believe Dieng is a 5.

Towns/Dieng can play the 4. They'd probably play Bates-Diop some, with Wiggins playing some small-ball 4.

 

[RR7]