Keon Johnson

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TBpup said:
From the Trade Deadline on, I want to see a healthy dose of:

Ant
Keon
Watford
Brown
.....and sadly Nas can't join that group.

Give them run, see what you've got. Develop them into contributors or pieces that can be used this Summer in a trade.
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What about Snell, Blevins, and CJE?

I kid. Basically, I said this exact thing yesterday. Couldn't agree more. Great Minds....
 
wizenheimer said:
Johnson was part of the goddamn trade, and people who seem hell-bent on propping up the talent Portland got from the trade while dismissing the talent they traded away keep chattering about his value being set by having been the !!!21st pick in the draft!!! because it's been said here a hundred times in 40 hours. SO IT SURE SEEMS JUSTIFIED to point out that the team most able to judge his real NBA value has placed the 51st selection in the same draft above him in the rotation so maybe he doesn't have 21st pick talent if a late 2nd round pick is taking the minutes. And of course, that team just traded him away

I decided on caps because they are so popular around here lately
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Sorry but your logic still makes no sense on this subject. You think that I am justifying the trade based on Keon? I am not justifying the trade at all. I am simply pointing out how ridiculous it is for people to think that because the Clippers played the 51st pick in the draft ahead of him that it means Keon is not any good. Brandon Boston's success as a rookie has nothing to do with Keon. No matter how many times or ways that you post it. You and I and everyone else on this board really do not know how he will turn out.

I guess I missed all the posts that claim he justifies the trade. Can you find them for me? Saying he was the 21st pick is simply saying we got a 1st round pick. Nothing more. I get that for some teams in a trade they would prefer to choose their own 1st round pick, and that is true, but we still got a young prospect. And no this does not justify the trade.
 
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Pinwheel1 said:
Sorry but your logic still makes no sense on this subject. You think that I am justifying the trade based on Keon? I am not justifying the trade at all. I am simply pointing out how ridiculous it is for people to think that because the Clippers played the 51st pick in the draft ahead of him that it means Keon is not any good. Brandon Boston's success as a rookie has nothing to do with Keon. No matter how many times or ways that you post it. You and I and everyone else on this board really do not know how he will turn out.

I guess I missed all the posts that claim he justifies the trade. Can you find them for me?
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it's the often repeated claim around here that he was the 21st pick!! And it's mentioned that often in attempts to put lipstick on that pig of a trade.

try it this way:

upload_2022-2-7_13-5-55.png

Brown was the 43rd pick, and he's arguably outperforming the 21st pick. I think the reality is that neither player, at this point, has the value of a 1st round pick

I don't know what his upside is and have never claimed to know. Johnson, as of yet, in college and the NBA, has not shown any ability to hit a perimeter shot. Now, his FG and 3pt percentages are actually better than Trent's as a rookie, but Trent only played 14 games and 111 minutes as a rookie; and he shot over 40% on three's at Duke. Keon was at 27%. On the other hand, Johnson has shown a knack for getting to the foul line in college and in the NBA as well, on a small sample size

but again, that's not the point I was arguing. That being that the inclusion of Johnson in that trade was not consequential value at this time.
 
Pinwheel1 said:
Sorry but your logic still makes no sense on this subject. You think that I am justifying the trade based on Keon? I am not justifying the trade at all. I am simply pointing out how ridiculous it is for people to think that because the Clippers played the 51st pick in the draft ahead of him that it means Keon is not any good. Brandon Boston's success as a rookie has nothing to do with Keon. No matter how many times or ways that you post it. You and I and everyone else on this board really do not know how he will turn out.

I guess I missed all the posts that claim he justifies the trade. Can you find them for me? Saying he was the 21st pick is simply saying we got a 1st round pick. Nothing more. I get that for some teams in a trade they would prefer to choose their own 1st round pick, and that is true, but we still got a young prospect. And no this does not justify the trade.
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Generally, the primary point that is made regarding Johnson is that teams rarely trade 1st round picks in their rookie seasons, and that if a team does so, it generally signals a lack of faith in that player's future from the team that drafted him, and thus we as the receiving team should not value him at standard FRP value. The fact that Boston plays and Johnson hasn't is more referenced as supporting evidence for that primary point.
 
WesleyMatthews said:
This changes my opinion of him.

Maybe he is a long term Blazer.
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not-funny-its-not-funny.gif
 
Pinwheel1 said:
Saying he was the 21st pick is simply saying we got a 1st round pick.
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That is the problem with your statement. No we did not get a first round pick. Not any more than my neighbor can sell me his "brand new car" that has been sitting in his driveway for awhile.

Yes it was new once. It isn't new now. Keon isn't a first round pick today. In fact history has shown that FORMER first round picks traded during the first year of their rookie contract are routinely worth very little if anything. Teams don't trade away a high upside valuable first round pick after seeing them every day for months if there is amazing untapped upside.

They trade them when they realize there is little upside and other franchises haven't caught on to the stink yet.

A first round pick has way more value than Keon.

Not to say Keon has no value, with the lack of talent on our squad he probably is the most talented young player after Simons/NAS. But his value is way less than the 21st pick value back at the draft, or a future first round pick.
 
WesleyMatthews said:
That is the problem with your statement. No we did not get a first round pick. Not any more than my neighbor can sell me his "brand new car" that has been sitting in his driveway for awhile.

Yes it was new once. It isn't new now. Keon isn't a first round pick today. In fact history has shown that FORMER first round picks traded during the first year of their rookie contract are routinely worth very little if anything. Teams don't trade away a high upside valuable first round pick after seeing them every day for months if there is amazing untapped upside.

They trade them when they realize there is little upside and other franchises haven't caught on to the stink yet.

A first round pick has way more value than Keon.

Not to say Keon has no value, with the lack of talent on our squad he probably is the most talented young player after Simons/NAS. But his value is way less than the 21st pick value back at the draft, or a future first round pick.
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Go look at Powell first three years contributions, he was a second round pick too. And wasn't highly though of coming out of college after 4 years.
You nor I know just how good a player KPlayer will turn out to be after 3-4 years in the league, wherever he's at.
Simons been with the team 4 years and is just now getting consistent play and ready to get paid big. Keon is 19 year old.
 
A FRP you didn't actually pick ain't a FRP. Come on now.
So Morey would be happy with CJ and 3 FRPs: Nards, Zach, and Swanigan? Those are FRPs right? I can't believe this is being debated.

No one in their right mind thinks a FRP another team chose is the same as one you pick yourself.
 
WesleyMatthews said:
Teams don't trade away a high upside valuable first round pick after seeing them every day for months if there is amazing untapped upside.
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They do if they want to win now. Did the Clipper not get a lot from us in the trade? If they want to contend and they have other young players, why would they not give up 1 young talent? They have to give us something? Many here were willing to give up Ant or Little early this season. Plus young rookies (and those who are about to enter the draft) often show "amazing untapped upside"....with some risk.
Few are a guarantee to be good. No one saying Keon is a sure thing. But that does not mean he can't be good.
 
Pinwheel1 said:
They do if they want to win now. Did the Clipper not get a lot from us in the trade? If they want to contend and they have other young players, why would they not give up 1 young talent? They have to give us something? Many here were willing to give up Ant or Little early this season. Plus young rookies (and those who are about to enter the draft) often show "amazing untapped upside"....with some risk.
Few are a guarantee to be good. No one saying Keon is a sure thing. But that does not mean he can't be good.
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In your estimation, will johnson ever in his career, even reach Powell caliber as his ceiling?
 
Hoopguru said:
Go look at Powell first three years contributions, he was a second round pick too. And wasn't highly though of coming out of college after 4 years.
You nor I know just how good a player KPlayer will turn out to be after 3-4 years in the league, wherever he's at.
Simons been with the team 4 years and is just now getting consistent play and ready to get paid big. Keon is 19 year old.
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Great story.

Doesn't mean Keon today has the value of a first round pick.
 
Cugel said:
A FRP you didn't actually pick ain't a FRP. Come on now.
So Morey would be happy with CJ and 3 FRPs: Nards, Zach, and Swanigan? Those are FRPs right? I can't believe this is being debated.

No one in their right mind thinks a FRP another team chose is the same as one you pick yourself.
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Thats what I would've thought as well.

Welcome to 2022 Blazer fans rationalizing an indefensible franchise blunder.

I feel like I'm arguing with the same people that said we had to give Meyers a max extension offer the summer before he could become a free agent. 50/40/90 Dirk 2.0... we can't risk him leaving as a free agent.
 
PtldPlatypus said:
"First and foremost for me, I gotta see what his game is..." I guess those who say that Chauncey was familiar with him were a little off.
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difference between seeing him on some tape and in person.
 
PtldPlatypus said:
Just hope we don't trade for PJ Tucker
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hey...I have an excuse for being even more of a blithering idiot than I usually am. Had a colonoscopy this morning after shitting my brains out and not eating yesterday; then no sleep last night. Still I think I could have got a better deal for Norm and RoCo than Cronin got

CJ...PJ...rhyming matters
 
illmatic99 said:
In your estimation, will johnson ever in his career, even reach Powell caliber as his ceiling?
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No idea. Way too early to tell.

I always liked Norm, even in college. Loved the way he attacked the basket. Did not understand the " dislike" he got in the weeks prior to the trade on this board. I would have liked to see a Dame, Ant, NP 3 guard rotation.

I see Keon as strictly a guard. No SF in his future. I think it is possible he can be as good as Norm but again I have always preached that young rookies (especially one and done) are not even close to being ready. They are drafted on potential and will only succeed if they have a great work ethic. They all have weaknesses they need to address.
 
wizenheimer said:
hey...I have an excuse for being even more of a blithering idiot than I usually am. Had a colonoscopy this morning after shitting my brains out and not eating yesterday; then no sleep last night. Still I think I could have got a better deal for Norm and RoCo than Cronin got

CJ...PJ...rhyming matters
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Hey, I thought you were clever. Although if I were you, I wouldn't admit to storing my brains close to my sphincter.
 
wizenheimer said:
hey...I have an excuse for being even more of a blithering idiot than I usually am. Had a colonoscopy this morning after shitting my brains out and not eating yesterday; then no sleep last night. Still I think I could have got a better deal for Norm and RoCo than Cronin got

CJ...PJ...rhyming matters
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Have you had epic farts? I've heard post colonoscopy farts are next level
 
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