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Denny Crane said:
They're burning coal at night and when the wind isn't blowing.

Rely on green energy, and you will need candles and a gas generator to keep the fridge cold.

Like I said, the physics is impossible to ignore. Or do so to all our detriment.
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Denny... Have you ever fucking heard of a battery? I know you have I know you have batteries somewhere in your house... Jesus...
 
dviss1 said:
Denny... Have you ever fucking heard of a battery? I know you have I know you have batteries somewhere in your house... Jesus...
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Batteries have a limited life, are really expensive, and there isn't enough lithium on the earth.

There's a reason a Tesla costs a ridiculous amount of money.
 
Denny Crane said:
Batteries have a limited life, are really expensive, and there isn't enough lithium on the earth.

There's a reason a Tesla costs a ridiculous amount of money.
Click to expand...

There isn't enough gas and coal on the earth either so what are you talking about? If the entire Earth was filled with oil it would only last for 300 years. Do you not expect our species to live longer than that? Now answer the question as to whether or not you're for or against nuclear.
 
dviss1 said:
Use your brain. It's a smart one.

https://www.tesla.com/POWERWALL
Click to expand...
20160116_WBC062_0.png


40M tons. Nowhere near enough.
 
dviss1 said:
Answer this question for me @Denny Crane are you for or against Nuclear energy?
Click to expand...
For. It's virtually unlimited and requires a very small footprint. It is clean, too.

Our energy demands will increase over time. All the smart devices that will be installed in millions of homes aren't free to use, energy wise.

It's a safe bet that future innovations will require more energy, too.

Here's an analysis of what going all in with the powerwall means. For a nation of 20M or less.

http://www.smh.com.au/technology/in...ring-higher-energy-costs-20160211-gmr6y4.html
 
Denny Crane said:
20160116_WBC062_0.png


40M tons. Nowhere near enough.
Click to expand...

Electrical companies don't want to burn coal. They want to burn natural gas. Gas is cheaper and maintenance is much cheaper. Coal is dirty, the cost of keeping those plants running is too expensive compared to nat gas.
 
FWIW, I drive a Prius and my other car is a golf cart.

Since the local poer company stopped buying back power at retail rates, no solar dealer will even talk to me about installing solar. I even tried telling the salespersons I don't care if I can sell the power to the electric company, but they refuse.

My electric bill is $hundreds less than the loan payment on a solar system sufficient to run my house during the day. Add in the cost to buy power to run it at night and it is an absurd proposition.
 
SlyPokerDog said:
Electrical companies don't want to burn coal. They want to burn natural gas. Gas is cheaper and maintenance is much cheaper. Coal is dirty, the cost of keeping those plants running is too expensive compared to nat gas.
Click to expand...
They don't want to close their coal plants. It's not like they're losing money selling power at a profit.
 
Denny Crane said:
They don't want to close their coal plants. It's not like they're losing money selling power at a profit.
Click to expand...

Yes, many electrical companies are closing their coal plants and it has nothing to do with regulations or clean air. Portland General Electric is closing their coal plant because of age and cost of operation. As coal plants are closed due to age they are being replaced with natural gas burning plants.
 
SlyPokerDog said:
Yes, many electrical companies are closing their coal plants and it has nothing to do with regulations or clean air. Portland General Electric is closing their coal plant because of age and cost of operation. As coal plants are closed due to age they are being replaced with natural gas burning plants.
Click to expand...
Sure. New plants are likely going to burn gas.

Still, the bulk of Germany's power is from coal, and coal is at least 1/3 of our energy.

Renewable energy, outside of hydroelectric, of about 5% of the power we use. Solar is about 1/2 of 1%. Wind is 4%.
 
SlyPokerDog said:
Portland General Electric is closing their coal plant because of age and cost of operation.
Click to expand...

Portland General Electric has the benefit of the Oregon State PUC. The Democrats control this you know. When you are granted rates that insure you make a profit, a percentage of the operating cost, Life is good. You can always have new plants the rate payers pay to build and then pay some more, and then again.
 
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MarAzul said:
Portland General Electric has the benefit of the Oregon State PUC. The Democrats control this you know. When you are granted rates that insure you make a profit, a percentage of the operating cost, Life is good. You can alway have new plants the rate payers pay to build and then pay some more, and then again.
Click to expand...

There is nothing preventing you from burning coal in your home and boat.
 
SlyPokerDog said:
There is nothing preventing you from burning coal in your home and boat.
Click to expand...

I have wood here, I don't have to go far to get it. I did get some coal though, all the way from Medford when I was experimenting with melting large amounts of lead.
Turns out that Cedar worked the best to make a quick hot fire. Coal is hard to burn, you need to blow air on it hard, to get hot.
 
dviss1 said:
If God is love what exists between the two gay people? Love created by God. If God makes no mistakes why are gay people born that way? These analogies don't really matter. What matters is people who concentrate on gay sex more than love. That's my whole point.
Click to expand...
I don't claim to be able to answer for God, nor do I feel I need to; however I believe that this logic of "God allows it so it must be OK" is highly fallacious.

First of all, you decry the focus on sex rather than love, when--as I've stated--homosexual sex is (in my reading of scripture) the only act in a homosexual relationship that is inherently sinful. Also, it should be stated that Paul made a point of saying that those in the church have no right or responsibility to judge those outside the church, but only those inside. So while I find homosexual sex to be sinful--just as I do premarital sex, adultery, violence, deceit, greed, gluttony, wrath, etc.--I don't judge people for their sins, because it's not my place to do so.

Now as for the question of "why are gay people born that way?"--I can only assume it's the same reason that some babies are stillborn, some are born with disabilities or chronic infirmities, some are born with mental illnesses, some are born to mothers who die in childbirth, some are born in abject poverty with no prospect of relief, some are born into families full of abuse and alcoholism, and some are born orange with pompadours and tiny hands. This is a fallen, sinful world, and many things happen--while still inside God's sovereign will--outside His original perfect design, because humanity brought sin into the equation. The fact that something exists in the world God created does not necessarily make that thing good in and of itself. So no, I cannot take the notion of people being born gay as God's tacit approval of homosexuality. Otherwise, people being born sinful (as scripture indicates) would equate to His tacit approval of sin, which is simply silly.

Regardless...my reasoning for my beliefs regarding homosexuality being what they are, I still fail to see how they make me "intolerant" (the original thrust of the discussion), when I don't treat gay people any differently than I do straight people. The only thing I'm intolerant of is (as proscribed by scripture) a willful persistent unrepentant adherence by a member of the church to a sinful lifestyle, and that isn't limited to homosexual sex.
 
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PtldPlatypus said:
I don't claim to be able to answer for God, nor do I feel I need to; however I believe that this logic of "God allows it so it must be OK" is highly fallacious.

First of all, you decry the focus on sex rather than love, when--as I've stated--homosexual sex is (in my reading of scripture) the only act in a homosexual relationship that is inherently sinful. Also, it should be stated that Paul mashed a point of sing that those in the church have no right or responsibility to judge those outside the church, but only those inside. So while I find homosexual sex to be sinful--just as I do premarital sex, adultery, violence, deceit, greed, gluttony, wrath, etc.--I don't judge people for their sons, because it's not my place to do so.

Now as for the question of "why are gay people born that way?"--I can only assume it's the same reason that some babies are stillborn, some are born with disabilities or chronic infirmities, some are born with mental illnesses, some are born to mothers who die in childbirth, some are born in abject poverty with no prospect of relief, some are born into families full of abuse and alcoholism, and some are born orange with pompadours and tiny hands. This is a fallen, sinful world, and many things happen--while still inside God's sovereign will--outside His original perfect design, because humanity brought sin into the equation. The fact that something exists in the world God created does not necessarily make that thing good in and of itself. So no, I cannot take the notion of people being born gay as God's tacit approval of homosexuality. Otherwise, people being born sinful (as scripture indicates) would equate to His tacit approval of sin, which is simply silly.

Regardless...my reasoning for my beliefs regarding homosexuality being what they are, I still fail to see how they make me "intolerant" (the original thrust of the discussion), when I don't treat gay people any differently than I do straight people. The only thing I'm intolerant of is (as proscribed by scripture) a willful persistent unrepentant adherence by a member of the church to a sinful lifestyle, and that isn't limited to homosexual sex.
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I am not religious in any way. So, the two of us will never completely see eye to eye. But, I just wanted to commend you for writing a very nicely worded post about your beliefs. Mine are different, but, props for the great explanation.
 
theprunetang said:
I am not religious in any way. So, the two of us will never completely see eye to eye. But, I just wanted to commend you for writing a very nicely worded post about your beliefs. Mine are different, but, props for the great explanation.
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Thanks Pruner, comments like that actually mean a lot. I don't ever expect to argue someone into the Kingdom, but in this world where so many self-professed Christians do so much to give God a bad name, it's nice to hear someone indicate that I'm not joining their ranks.
 
PtldPlatypus said:
Thanks Pruner, comments like that actually mean a lot. I don't ever expect to argue someone into the Kingdom, but in this world where so many self-professed Christians do so much to give God a bad name, it's nice to hear someone indicate that I'm not joining their ranks.
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That's why I like you. You have your beliefs and stick to them, but you have reasoning. I can tell that you have thought about this. I don't agree with your ideas because I have also thought about things a lot and have come to different conclusions. But, we are both decent people with different ideas. I can appreciate your thoughts because you have actually gone through the process of actually thinking about them rather than just spouting off some dogma. Cheers sir.
 
Denny Crane said:
For. It's virtually unlimited and requires a very small footprint. It is clean, too.

Our energy demands will increase over time. All the smart devices that will be installed in millions of homes aren't free to use, energy wise.

It's a safe bet that future innovations will require more energy, too.

Here's an analysis of what going all in with the powerwall means. For a nation of 20M or less.

http://www.smh.com.au/technology/in...ring-higher-energy-costs-20160211-gmr6y4.html
Click to expand...

Trick question.

If you and @SlyPokerDog are so for nuclear energy then why are you against solar!? The sun is the largest nuclear reactor in our solar system! At present we utilize 1 billionth of a millionth of its daily energy output. Ain't no conservative or libertarian gonna be able to convince me the most powerful nuclear reactor cannot power our entire planet.

Get. The. Fuck. Outta. Here. With. That Bullshit.

Solar_System_3.jpg


Humans are smart! Figured that shit out before we kill ourselves!

And while you're complaining about not having enough lithium, we don't have enough oil and coal either! We don't have enough uranium either!! And that's shit kills us...

You're not making sense.
 
PtldPlatypus said:
I don't claim to be able to answer for God, nor do I feel I need to; however I believe that this logic of "God allows it so it must be OK" is highly fallacious.

First of all, you decry the focus on sex rather than love, when--as I've stated--homosexual sex is (in my reading of scripture) the only act in a homosexual relationship that is inherently sinful. Also, it should be stated that Paul made a point of saying that those in the church have no right or responsibility to judge those outside the church, but only those inside. So while I find homosexual sex to be sinful--just as I do premarital sex, adultery, violence, deceit, greed, gluttony, wrath, etc.--I don't judge people for their sins, because it's not my place to do so.

Now as for the question of "why are gay people born that way?"--I can only assume it's the same reason that some babies are stillborn, some are born with disabilities or chronic infirmities, some are born with mental illnesses, some are born to mothers who die in childbirth, some are born in abject poverty with no prospect of relief, some are born into families full of abuse and alcoholism, and some are born orange with pompadours and tiny hands. This is a fallen, sinful world, and many things happen--while still inside God's sovereign will--outside His original perfect design, because humanity brought sin into the equation. The fact that something exists in the world God created does not necessarily make that thing good in and of itself. So no, I cannot take the notion of people being born gay as God's tacit approval of homosexuality. Otherwise, people being born sinful (as scripture indicates) would equate to His tacit approval of sin, which is simply silly.

Regardless...my reasoning for my beliefs regarding homosexuality being what they are, I still fail to see how they make me "intolerant" (the original thrust of the discussion), when I don't treat gay people any differently than I do straight people. The only thing I'm intolerant of is (as proscribed by scripture) a willful persistent unrepentant adherence by a member of the church to a sinful lifestyle, and that isn't limited to homosexual sex.
Click to expand...

Fair enough.

I think it's funny that God is so worried about what we do in our bedrooms but doesn't really seem to be focused on the real atrocities that are happening and the world. The book was written by men. Fallible men and could not explain their surroundings by using their own five senses. So since they could not explain it they created omnipotence to explain it for them. They used fear of death and the unknowing of what happens afterward to control.

See, I was raised Baptist Christian since birth. I'm went to church 3 times a week. I went to Sunday school every Sunday and vacation bible school every summer. I was on the Usher Board and in the junior choir. I had to go to every church function. That was me in the front of the entire church of about 250+ winning Bible drills. I've read the Bible cover to cover two times. This inundation has created a disdain for Christianity in my adult life. Because when reading the Bible I was taken aback by the many atrocities and contradictions in it. I am now agnostic (because atheists are assholes. They don't know that there is not a god like they claim) because the fact of the matter is, nobody really knows how we got here. People can use a book to try to explain what humans could not comprehend thousands of years ago, but that's not something I would do. But people can believe what they want. And when you reside in a country that has the freedom to practice those different faiths, those belief systems should be respected. I applaud the fact that you would not attempt to insert your belief system into laws that govern those who don't believe. That in itself is tolerance.
 
dviss1 said:
Trick question.

If you and @SlyPokerDog are so for nuclear energy then why are you against solar!? The sun is the largest nuclear reactor in our solar system! At present we utilize 1 billionth of a millionth of its daily energy output. Ain't no conservative or libertarian gonna be able to convince me the most powerful nuclear reactor cannot power our entire planet.

Get. The. Fuck. Outta. Here. With. That Bullshit.

Solar_System_3.jpg


Humans are smart! Figured that shit out before we kill ourselves!

And while you're complaining about not having enough lithium, we don't have enough oil and coal either! We don't have enough uranium either!! And that's shit kills us...

You're not making sense.
Click to expand...

We have enormous amounts of coal.

http://www.geocraft.com/WVFossils/Energy.html

Nuclear works at night. The sun doesn't shine at night.

The more solar is put up, it becomes less a % of all the energy we use. Think about that.

If we want plentiful and clean energy, nuclear is the way to go. If we can harness fusion, that's even better.

There are 450 nuclear reactors in 30 nations. It took a natural event equivalent to a meteor strike for one to go bad.
 
Denny Crane said:
We have enormous amounts of coal.

http://www.geocraft.com/WVFossils/Energy.html

Nuclear works at night. The sun doesn't shine at night.

The more solar is put up, it becomes less a % of all the energy we use. Think about that.

If we want plentiful and clean energy, nuclear is the way to go. If we can harness fusion, that's even better.

There are 450 nuclear reactors in 30 nations. It took a natural event equivalent to a meteor strike for one to go bad.
Click to expand...

So let's continue to destroy our planet by strip mining and Mountain Top removal as well as polluting our environment with fossil fuels that kill us all in the name of what? Our children. Sorry Denny I call bullshit still. And now since we got a fat pile of butterscotch pudding in the White House, we'll be destroying our environment even more in the next four years.
 
dviss1 said:
So let's continue to destroy our planet by strip mining in Mountain Top destruction as well as polluting our environment with fossil fuels that kill us all in the name of what? Our children. Sorry Denny I call bullshit still. And now since we got a fat pile of butterscotch pudding in the White House, we'll be destroying our environment even more in the next four years.
Click to expand...

See that's a straw man argument.

Where did I say we should strip mine mountain tops, blah blah blah?

That has nothing to do with nuclear energy.
 
dviss1 said:
Trick question.

If you and @SlyPokerDog are so for nuclear energy then why are you against solar!? The sun is the largest nuclear reactor in our solar system! At present we utilize 1 billionth of a millionth of its daily energy output. Ain't no conservative or libertarian gonna be able to convince me the most powerful nuclear reactor cannot power our entire planet.

Get. The. Fuck. Outta. Here. With. That Bullshit.

Solar_System_3.jpg


Humans are smart! Figured that shit out before we kill ourselves!

And while you're complaining about not having enough lithium, we don't have enough oil and coal either! We don't have enough uranium either!! And that's shit kills us...

You're not making sense.
Click to expand...

I'm for solar.

Denny's lithium argument is silly. Battery tech is rapidly evolving. Fusion is the future. Many countries investing heavily in it. It appears we'll be cutting our research in it. Because we discovered clean coal.
 
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