Massachusetts going from Blue to Brown?

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Republicans got things passed with less than 60 republicans in the senate. Heck, they even got Ted to sponsor no child left behind. The republicans had obstructionist democrats and a gang of 14 moderates to deal with. Somehow they passed a massive medicare drug bill.

The Dems simply misplayed their hand by trying to exclude republicans (except for Snowe).

It's absurd to think the Dems couldn't do anything they wanted.

Denny- they COULD have. But Dems aren't lock-step goose-trodding GOP members.

That was my point. They actually have debate in-party. I think I read somewhere we call that Democracy? Not sure though. Perhaps you are right and we are more like Mussolini's Italy..
 
Denny- they COULD have. But Dems aren't lock-step goose-trodding GOP members.

That was my point. They actually have debate in-party. I think I read somewhere we call that Democracy? Not sure though. Perhaps you are right and we are more like Mussolini's Italy..

You missed my point about the gang of 14? That was 7 republicans not in lock step with the party.
 
So your quotes were completely irrelevant to the point you were trying to make.

Thrilla is trying to say Coakley lost a 30pt lead because of a weak campaign, and a weak candidate.

The quotes show that Coakley's own party is saying it was about the issues, policies, and voter anger. NOT about a bad campaign or a crappy candidate.

The quotes are completely relevant, and show that Thrilla is talking out of his ass.

Thrilla lives in that part of the country I'll take his first hand account of the situation.

You're going to take an opinion from some nobody, with an obvious bias, talking out of his ass, over a bunch of direct quotes from the party in question, saying they need to change the focus of their policies?

Suit yourself.
 
A View From Inside Coakley’s Camp
By MICHAEL COOPER
Martha Coakley’s campaign had originally planned on spending less money in the general election against Scott Brown than it had spent winning the Democratic primary, its chief strategist said in an interview today.

Many people had expected the four-way primary to be tougher than the general election against Mr. Brown, a little-known Republican state senator. So the Coakley campaign, which spent roughly $5 million to win the Democratic nomination, entered the general election with only about $450,000 left and plans to spend only about $1.8 million against Mr. Brown in the final stretch, which was less than two months long.

At first things looked like they were conforming to plan. A poll the campaign conducted just before Christmas showed Martha Coakley, the Democratic attorney general, with a 19-point lead over Mr. Brown, said Dennis Newman, the Coakley campaign’s chief strategist. Ms. Coakley took some time off the trail to celebrate Christmas, prepare for the debate, film ads and try to raise money.

Mr. Brown filled his days full of appearances and put ads on television; the Coakley campaign stayed dark, marshalling its resources for the final two weeks, which had been its plan all along. Just after New Year’s, though, public polls showed the race tightening, setting off alarms. But Mr. Newman said many donors felt tapped out from giving money in the primary, and many did not believe the race could be close.

“We were concerned, we were working hard, Martha was on the phones trying to raise money, which was difficult,’’ Mr. Newman said.

The polls were energizing Republicans, he said. “The one big concern that we had was if national groups came in and gave Scott Brown money or support, it could be problematic,’’ he said. After public polls showed the race tightening he said, “outside groups became involved.’’

Aides to Mr. Brown said that as his poll standings improved, and he appeared on conservative radio shows, his Internet fundraising took off; by the election he even had vastly more Facebook friends then Ms. Coakley.

Mr. Newman also said that the campaign was hurt when Mr. Brown made the race into a referendum on health care, which allowed him to attract campaign donations from across the country and which put Ms. Coakley in the tricky position of defending a health care bill to voters in a state that already has near-universal coverage. “It’s not easy in a sound bite, not easy in a 30-second rebuttal in the debate,’’ he said.

In the end, when Mr. Brown surged and attracted national support, the Coakley campaign was able to raise about $4 million, more than twice what it had planned. But Mr. Newman estimated that based on press reports, they may have been outraised by as much as three to one by the Brown campaign. And although some vigorous finger-pointing has broken out in recent days, Mr. Newman had nothing put praise for the White House and national Democrats, repeating several times that they were “tremendously helpful.”

“One of the things we missed, and I guess you could call it a mistake, was the pent-up anger,’’ he said, likening the mood to 1990, when the state elected a Republican governor in the midst of a regional recession. “There was some very pent-up anger and people took it out at the ballot box, and I think we misjudged that and he tapped into it.’’

http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/01/20/a-view-from-inside-coakleys-camp/
 
Mr. Newman also said that the campaign was hurt when Mr. Brown made the race into a referendum on health care, which allowed him to attract campaign donations from across the country and which put Ms. Coakley in the tricky position of defending a health care bill to voters in a state that already has near-universal coverage. “It’s not easy in a sound bite, not easy in a 30-second rebuttal in the debate,’’ he said.

Anyhow, love him or hate him, Karl Rove was really good at managing local campaigns from a national position, and as an advisor to the president. Republicans did defy history in 2002 and 2004 by gaining seats in both houses.

It's pretty obvious that the Dems have nobody like that involved at this point. Howard Dean isn't involved anymore.
 
Denny- they COULD have. But Dems aren't lock-step goose-trodding GOP members.

That was my point. They actually have debate in-party. I think I read somewhere we call that Democracy? Not sure though. Perhaps you are right and we are more like Mussolini's Italy..

I think your definition of "Democracy" is wrong.

Ed O.
 
BTW the reason Mass folks don't care about socialized healthcare at the national level is because they have it at the State level. So I would not read too much into this election as a turning point in the nations politics. If the Dems solve the economy than they will be loved.
 
I think policy was only a small part of it. As I pointed out already, when it was equal footing, and both candidates were mostly unknown, people supported the "D" blindly, some polls up to 30%. Once the campaign started rolling, people learned about the candidates, as individuals, and that is when things changed.

Nearly two-thirds of those who supported Brown over Democrat Martha Coakley said their vote was intended partly to show opposition to the Democratic agenda in Washington, including the health care overhaul.

Owned.

link
 

Ha, 2/3 of his voters were with him the entire time. I'm talking about the swing voters. People who were undecided until the last couple weeks, or people who initially supported the Democrats, but switched. Telling me that Scott Brown's base hates what is going on is Washington is not owning me, it's owning yourself.
 
Ha, 2/3 of his voters were with him the entire time. I'm talking about the swing voters. People who were undecided until the last couple weeks, or people who initially supported the Democrats, but switched. Telling me that Scott Brown's base hates what is going on is Washington is not owning me, it's owning yourself.

Do some math, then post.

Considering the size of Coakley's initial lead, obviously many of those that switched will fall in this 2/3.

Like I said, owned.
 
Coakley was originally 60-40. Brown won 52-47.

Roughly 2.2 million people voted for either one, it total.

Brown ended up with about 1.1 million votes.

Had he only gotten 40%, like the original polls, he would have ended up with about 900,000 votes. (This would be his base number)

2/3 of his actual voters is 733,000.

You fail.
 
Coakley was originally 60-40. Brown won 52-47.

Roughly 2.2 million people voted for either one, it total.

Brown ended up with about 1.1 million votes.

Had he only gotten 40%, like the original polls, he would have ended up with about 900,000 votes. (This would be his base number)

2/3 of his actual voters is 733,000.

You fail.

Ha. Nice. You can't work with probabilities, and you say I fail.

Owned.
 
Coakley was originally 60-40. Brown won 52-47.

Roughly 2.2 million people voted for either one, it total.

Brown ended up with about 1.1 million votes.

Had he only gotten 40%, like the original polls, he would have ended up with about 900,000 votes. (This would be his base number)

2/3 of his actual voters is 733,000.

You fail.

Ha. Nice. You can't work with probabilities, and you say I fail.

Owned.

multi fail? are you both right? or both wrong? funny:biglaugh:
 
http://www.boston.com/news/local/massachusetts/articles/2010/01/10/senate_poll_coakley_up_15_points/

She was up 50-35 with 7% undecided. Including the undecideds as they were leaning at the time, she was up 53-36. Yes, Kennedy was at ~9%.

He finished with 52% of the vote, so 17% switched, or 1 in 6.

17% of the ~2.2M votes is ~375K voters

Considering he got 1.17M votes, 1/3 of his voters were not with him the whole time and clearly that 1/3 switched for the reasons BB posted:

"their vote was intended partly to show opposition to the Democratic agenda in Washington, including the health care overhaul."
 
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