Notice Matisse Thybulle came to Portland via the Josh Hart trade (1 Viewer)

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AmirIcon said:
We get that. Which means the deal could have been done separately. Hart getting traded had nothing to do with us getting Thybulle. It just got rolled into one for simplicity sake.
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I suspect it would have been simpler to do multiple trades instead of one big one, so my guess (and no, I am not going back in time to figure out who had to trade what to be legal under the CBA) is that it had to be done that way to be legal.
 
andalusian said:
I suspect it would have been simpler to do multiple trades instead of one big one, so my guess (and no, I am not going back in time to figure out who had to trade what to be legal under the CBA) is that it had to be done that way to be legal.
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Also, I'm sure tons of multi-team trades could be broken down into smaller trades, but they're expanded out to simplify moving of multiple assets.
 
Natebishop3 said:
But. It. Wasn't.
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On the strictest of technicalities. Josh Hart was so irrelevant to the acquisition of Matisse Thybulle that some of the most credible NBA insiders didn't report the trade that way including Woj and Zach Lowe.

But yes, Thybulle was acquired in a Hart trade.

Congrats.
 
AmirIcon said:
On the strictest of technicalities. Josh Hart was so irrelevant to the acquisition of Matisse Thybulle that some of the most credible NBA insiders didn't report the trade that way including Woj and Zach Lowe.

But yes, Thybulle was acquired in a Hart trade.

Congrats.
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thank-you-bow.gif
 
wizenheimer said:
if you're having a discussion with somebody about the value, both incoming and outgoing, of trades in Cronin's tenure it would be stupid to debate assets that weren't involved in the trade as if they were
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Doesn't seem to change the assessment that Cronin gets fleeced in most of his trades. Trading Hart for Thybulle is not an upgrade. LMAO.
 
AmirIcon said:

  • PORTLAND, Ore. — The Portland Trail Blazers are acquiring defensive standout Matisse Thybulle from the Philadelphia 76ers in a three-team trade between the Blazers, 76ers and Charlotte Hornets, according to Chris Haynes of Bleacher Report and Adrian Wojnarowski of ESPN.

    According to Bobby Marks of ESPN, this is the full framework of the trade:
    • Portland receives: Thybulle
    • Philadelphia receives: Jalen McDaniels, 2024 second-round pick from New York (via Charlotte), 2029 second-round pick from Portland
    • Charlotte receives: Svi Mykhailiuk (from New York via Portland), 2023 second-round pick (more favorable of Atlanta, Charlotte and Brooklyn via Philadelphia), 2027 second-round pick (more favorable of Pelicans/Blazers via Blazers)
https://www.kgw.com/article/sports/...ulle/283-25d0c359-3a4d-4959-a44c-2a0d9f707f06

There doesn't seem to be a consensus that you believe there is.

Still not sure why you aren't including Kris Murray in the deal since he was the result of trading Josh Hart.
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and Bobby Marks was wrong, wasn't he?
 
Natebishop3 said:
Also, I'm sure tons of multi-team trades could be broken down into smaller trades, but they're expanded out to simplify moving of multiple assets.
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Or they create tools for later moves like TPEs that persuaded one of the teams to participate and allowed the inclusion of another team.

The point is that multiple team trades are often happening because of the intricacies of the CBA or the willingness of some teams to do them because it creates other opportunities. It is rather silly to be sure some deals would have happened anyway if these other teams did not participate. It is often something that is not obvious on the surface like the Nance inclusion in the CJ trade, iirc, to create the TPE that allowed for the Grant trade).
 
AmirIcon said:
Doesn't seem to change the assessment that Cronin gets fleeced in most of his trades. Trading Hart for Thybulle is not an upgrade. LMAO.
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Trading a guy who probably wasn't going to come back and getting Thybulle and a pick is an upgrade. Something instead of nothing is an upgrade.

Joe even basically said that Josh wanted out - "my history has shown that I’ve done this with CJ McCollum and Josh Hart where we worked together to find them good landing spots and getting a fair return for the Trail Blazers."
 
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Natebishop3 said:
Trading a guy who probably wasn't going to come back and getting Thybulle and a pick is an upgrade. Something instead of nothing is an upgrade.

Joe even basically said that Josh wanted out - "my history has shown that I’ve done this with CJ McCollum and Josh Hart where we worked together to find them good landing spots and getting a fair return for the Trail Blazers."
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Probably isn't going to cut it, my guy. Josh Hart opted in didn't he? Because there was no market for him. And he would have opted in with Portland as well.

Joe said a lot of things, I wouldn't take it as gospel if I were you but you seem perfectly comfortable getting lied to which I can't say that I am.

We're still bending over backwards in every trade Cronin gets fleeced in. Now we're doing it with Josh Hart after Cronin said "we want 5 Josh Harts, one at every position."

Okay, Joe. Just going to plug my ears from now on when he speaks.
 
Natebishop3 said:
I can't prove when the decision was made, but I had been saying for years that he would leave and he did. It wasn't a last minute decision. That we can be sure of. That's why Kim Hughes was fired. It was known that he would not be returning practically during the middle of that playoff series. He bailed on us.

But you're right. I think there was indications that he would leave years in advance and we should have traded him. Only proof I have is the rumors that he basically asked out the year before we beat Houston in the first round.
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Kim Hughes was fired after LMA final season and after the playoffs. Yeah LMA quit on the team in the playoffs it was obvious he was a flight risk then. That was many months after the trade deadline and after Wes injury.

Year before we beat Houston the team lost 13 straight to end the season and LMA predictably/understandably didn't want that. Then he had monster games in the playoffs next year beating Houston and wanted to retire a Blazer. Then next year Wes got injured and LMA left. LMA was a dude who was wishy washy and changed what he wanted all the time.

CBA wouldn't let veterans do extensions for full price back then or we'd have likely completed an extension year prior and if not traded him. Sucks the Blazers got nothing for him but I never saw evidence it was a done deal he'd leave the Blazers and personally believe that was a stupid hindsight opinion.
 
AmirIcon said:
Josh Hart opted in didn't he?
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He opted in for the Knicks. I have heard he's going to sign an extension for 20ish million per year. I guess we will see. We will revisit this conversation at a later date.
 
SharpesTriumph said:
Kim Hughes was fired after LMA final season and after the playoffs. Yeah LMA quit on the team in the playoffs it was obvious he was a flight risk then. That was many months after the trade deadline and after Wes injury.

Year before we beat Houston the team lost 13 straight to end the season and LMA predictably/understandably didn't want that. Then he had monster games in the playoffs next year beating Houston and wanted to retire a Blazer. Then next year Wes got injured and LMA left. LMA was a dude who was wishy washy and changed what he wanted all the time.

CBA wouldn't let veterans do extensions for full price back then or we'd have likely completed an extension year prior and if not traded him. Sucks the Blazers got nothing for him but I never saw evidence it was a done deal he'd leave the Blazers and personally believe that was a stupid hindsight opinion.
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How is it hindsight? I was preaching it for years before he left. I guess we will just have to disagree on this. I thought there were tons of red flags that LMA would leave, and we should have traded him when there were initially rumors that he asked out.
 
Natebishop3 said:
He opted in for the Knicks. I have heard he's going to sign an extension for 20ish million per year. I guess we will see. We will revisit this conversation at a later date.
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Bogus to think he would have opted out and another creative way to give Cronin an out. Players go for the money and the Blazers could have worked with him on an extension.
 
andalusian said:
Josh Hart opted in because it would allow NYK to offer him a $80m extension next year and allowed NYK to get Donte DiVincenzo who played with him and Brunson for Villanova.
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He would have opted in post new CBA. There was no money out there for him.
 
AmirIcon said:
Probably isn't going to cut it, my guy. Josh Hart opted in didn't he? Because there was no market for him. And he would have opted in with Portland as well.

Joe said a lot of things, I wouldn't take it as gospel if I were you but you seem perfectly comfortable getting lied to which I can't say that I am.

We're still bending over backwards in every trade Cronin gets fleeced in. Now we're doing it with Josh Hart after Cronin said "we want 5 Josh Harts, one at every position."

Okay, Joe. Just going to plug my ears from now on when he speaks.
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Wut? Dude it's NYC. His family wanted to be there. His family didn't want to be here.

Like wtf bullshit is that? Like at least use logic and common sense once when you post.
 
Strenuus said:
Wut? Dude it's NYC. His family wanted to be there. His family didn't want to be here.

Like wtf bullshit is that? Like at least use logic and common sense once when you post.
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Doesn't change the fact that he wouldn't have opted out in the new CBA. It doesn't matter where he wants to be. Ask James Harden.

Maybe try reading the new CBA and looking at what other potential free agents did or didn't do before commenting.
 
Portland was good, but it was just so far and I’m not from the West Coast,” Hart recently told Andscape. “It was tough. Not on me, but more so on my wife because she’s not a huge fan of flying. So, she’s all the way in the Pacific Northwest, not really flying, just by herself. That was one of the things that was weighing on me a little bit, just seeing her struggle with that. So, me being gone but being close to home, it’s been great.

“I was superexcited about the trade. My first call was to my wife. Oh, man, she was excited. She was freaking out a little bit because obviously she’s got a doctor [in Portland], and everything is kind of situated. But once we got everything situated on that front, she was ecstatic.”
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Dude was not going to opt in here. Opting in to NY does not by any means signify he would have opted in here. It's quite obvious he wanted to be back east for his wife. But hey, if it helps people bash Joe, so be it I guess?

There's one trade where there can be an argument made where he was "fleeced". There really isn't for any other. And just repeating it doesn't make it so.
 
Strenuus said:
Don't knock Joe if you're reasoning is fucking stupid and not based on reality.

Be better.
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Get your nose out of Cronin's ass and into the literature of the new CBA. I'll even send you a link if you aren't resourceful enough to find it.
 
Natebishop3 said:
You didn't win. :lol:

We're going to revisit this after he re-signs with NY for well over what we would have wanted to pay him.
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It doesn't matter if he signs there for the minimum, he wanted his wife to be happy, she was pregnant with twins. He was not going to stay here.
 
AmirIcon said:
Get your nose out of Cronin's ass and into the literature of the new CBA. I'll even send you a link if you aren't resourceful enough to find it.
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DId the new CBA eliminate the MLE?
 
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