Notice Matisse Thybulle came to Portland via the Josh Hart trade (1 Viewer)

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AmirIcon said:
He would have opted in post new CBA. There was no money out there for him.
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Dillon Brooks got $20m. There is certainly a market for Hart's talent / production. By any reasonable measure, Josh Hart is a much better player than Brooks.

PER: 17.4 vs 9.4
VORP: 1.0 vs -1.1
WS: 2.8 vs 1.6
WS/48: 0.179 vs 0.034

Sorry, I don't believe in any way and shape that Brooks can get $20m/year and Hart can not. This makes no sense. If Hart really wanted to chase the money - he would have done so. Instead, he chose to create a path to reunite with his college championship crew in NY - and allow them to extend him next year when Evan Fournier gets off the books. You will see that this is exactly what is going to happen next year, it's pretty obvious if you know the history of these guys.
 
Natebishop3 said:
You didn't win. :lol:

We're going to revisit this after he re-signs with NY for well over what we would have wanted to pay him.
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None of us win when the GM is making trades that downgrade the roster. Talent for talent, Hart is superior to Matisse and it's not even close. You don't even know what you're arguing anymore.
 
Nate just stop it just cause you did a pod with TB or have something on youtube does not make you an expert or whatever on the Blazers your just making yourself look silly right now.
 
andalusian said:
Dillon Brooks got $20m. There is certainly a market for Hart's talent / production. By any reasonable measure, Josh Hart is a much better player than Brooks.

PER: 17.4 vs 9.4
VORP: 1.0 vs -1.1
WS: 2.8 vs 1.6
WS/48: 0.179 vs 0.034

Sorry, I don't believe in any way and shape that Brooks can get $20m/year and Hart can not. This makes no sense. If Hart really wanted to chase the money - he would have done so. Instead, he chose to create a path to reunite with his college championship crew in NY - and allow them to extend him next year when Evan Fournier gets off the books. You will see that this is exactly what is going to happen next year, it's pretty obvious if you know the history of these guys.
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Did you bother to take a look at how many teams were under the cap? I know you didn't so don't even lie.

Everything you're saying is conjecture. You, like Cronin, come at it in a position of weakness. Oh, we can't do anything because this guy and that guy want to go somewhere else but are under contract.

Your mentality is why we're a lottery team as soon as Cronin took over. I hope you enjoy.
 
AmirIcon said:
How is that relevant when that's basically less than what he was making?
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I don't understand the relevance of you telling people to read the CBA in general. But the MLE is 12.2. He makes 12.9. Guys sacrifice a little bit of $$ to be some where they prefer. With his statements on his wife, I don't think it's at all far fetched to think he would opt out if still here, and sign for 12.2 elsewhere. But you know what? It doesn't matter! You can't prove he would have stayed here. I can't prove he would have left. I think it's pretty obvious with statements about his wife, that he would have left. But regardless, we traded away a free agent, or potential free agent, for an all defensive team level wing and a 1st round pick. That's great value for an expiring guy.
Here's where you can shout again about Joe being fleeced.
 
Ripcity4life77 said:
Nate just stop it just cause you did a pod with TB or have something on youtube does not make you an expert or whatever on the Blazers your just making yourself look silly right now.
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What are you even talking about?
 
Josh Hart as a Blazer hesitatingly shot 30.4% from 3
Matisse shot 38.8% from 3 and was willing to shoot
Being a free agent and having his and his wife's families in Maryland on the east coast, Josh's wife didn't like flying that far to be with family. Josh wanted to go to New York..we helped him and got Mattisse, Reddish and the 23rd pick (Murray) in the deal....no way we lost that trade as he could have walked for nothing like Lamarcus did. I don't get why this isn't a clearly good move by the Blazers. Josh could've asked to be back in Portland after the season...he didn't.
 
AmirIcon said:
None of us win when the GM is making trades that downgrade the roster. Talent for talent, Hart is superior to Matisse and it's not even close. You don't even know what you're arguing anymore.
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So first of all, I'm not going to debate this with you until we know what he signs for, but there's no way in hell we would re-sign Hart for 20 million per year and that's what some people are reporting he will sign for.

Second, there was plenty of reports that he wanted to be back on the east coast with his wife. Joe even said that he worked with Josh to get him where he wanted to be and Josh came out and spoke very highly of this organization. So you're the one who has literally zero actual evidence to stand on.
 
AmirIcon said:
Did you bother to take a look at how many teams were under the cap? I know you didn't do don't even lie.
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I don't need to find all these teams, I just need to find one. Hart opted in a day before Brooks signed his new contract.

AmirIcon said:
Everything you're saying is conjecture. You, like Cronin, come at it in a position of weakness. Oh, we can't do anything because this guy and that guy want to go somewhere else but are under contract.
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Sorry, and what you say is not? Somehow you don't believe that a player of Hart's caliber has a market, yet there is an obvious example of a lesser player finding more.

AmirIcon said:
Your mentality is why we're a lottery team as soon as Cronin took over. I hope you enjoy.
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I am not, nor have I ever been a member of the Portland Trailblazers organization. I can assure you that my mentality, not matter what you read into it, has no bearing on the team's success on the court.

All I am doing is combining multiple pieces of information with some history to understand what is happening. You are welcome to disbelieve it, but it is pretty clear to me (and many others) what is happening, and we got enough clues from Cronin, Hart himself etc... that seem to indicate we are correct.
 
AmirIcon said:
Everything you're saying is conjecture.
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pot-kettle.gif
 
riverman said:
Josh Hart as a Blazer hesitatingly shot 30.4% from 3
Matisse shot 38.8% from 3 and was willing to shoot
Being a free agent and having his and his wife's families in Maryland on the east coast, Josh's wife didn't like flying that far to be with family. Josh wanted to go to New York..we helped him and got Mattisse, Reddish and the 23rd pick (Murray) in the deal....no way we lost that trade as he could have walked for nothing like Lamarcus did. I don't get why this isn't a clearly good move by the Blazers. Josh could've asked to be back in Portland after the season...he didn't.
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Small sample size for a guy who found his way kicked out of the rotation, no?

Okay. We're a significantly inferior team replacing Hart with who we got back. But keep telling yourself otherwise.
 
Ripcity4life77 said:
Nate -- Your comment on that Clippers trade and how it was good cause it got the team Sharpe please tell me you were joking or being sarcastic or something.
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I feel like I shouldn't have to explain this to you.

Pay attention.
 
AmirIcon said:
Small sample size for a guy who found his way kicked out of the rotation, no?

Okay. We're a significantly inferior team replacing Hart with who we got back. But keep telling yourself otherwise.
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You're welcome to your opinion. I don't need to tell myself..my post was in response to your opinion. Hart was not disgruntled nor was Mattisse....sounds like you were though. Matisse...two time all NBA defense. We didn't get worse. Murray is going to be really good too.
 
AmirIcon said:
Small sample size for a guy who found his way kicked out of the rotation, no?

Okay. We're a significantly inferior team replacing Hart with who we got back. But keep telling yourself otherwise.
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We picked 7th and 3rd in seasons we had Hart. We sucked anyways! If we're vastly inferior now, then maybe we'll get the top pick.
 
RR7 said:
We picked 7th and 3rd in seasons we had Hart. We sucked anyways! If we're vastly inferior now, then maybe we'll get the top pick.
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Yeah, Cronin lying to Dame and the vets to sit down for the second half of the season and not having any size on the roster doesn't have anything to do with our record. Sure.

But that ain't Joe's fault either. Lol
 
AmirIcon said:
Small sample size for a guy who found his way kicked out of the rotation, no?

Okay. We're a significantly inferior team replacing Hart with who we got back. But keep telling yourself otherwise.
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LOL dude....

Josh Hart is 28 years old. He's going to sign for a lot more money with the Knicks. Why would we bring him back on this team? Is he better than Thybulle? Sure, and he's going to get paid like it.

Completely ignoring the fact that there was a TON of smoke about him not wanting to come back because of his family, we signed Thybulle for half of what the Knicks are probably going to sign Hart for.

We got a really good defensive player who is younger and signed for A LOT less money than what Hart is going to sign for. We also got Kris Murray, who may or may not work out, but he fits our timeline a lot better than Hart.
 
And here I thought it was ME that was the one driving people away and keeping people from joining and needing to be put on IGNORE. I’m confused @SlyPokerDog
 
gawddam...there are a lot of fights in this forum right now. I feel bad I'm not in any

I need to pick a fight with somebody...anybody. Maybe Nate because he punches like a girl...a drunk girl with iron-poor blood. Is that sexist? I can't tell anymore
 
Natebishop3 said:
Completely ignoring the fact that there was a TON of smoke about him not wanting to come back because of his family, we signed Thybulle for half of what the Knicks are probably going to sign Hart for.
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There is also a lot of smoke about what Hart did with NYK. Let's not forget that he and NYK agreed to delay his opt-in day - clearly they were working on something which turned out to be being able to get Donte DiVincenzo into their TPE. I am sure that if it didn't work, he would have opted out and got the big contract immediately.
 
Natebishop3 said:
LOL dude....

Josh Hart is 28 years old. He's going to sign for a lot more money with the Knicks. Why would we bring him back on this team? Is he better than Thybulle? Sure, and he's going to get paid like it.

Completely ignoring the fact that there was a TON of smoke about him not wanting to come back because of his family, we signed Thybulle for half of what the Knicks are probably going to sign Hart for.

We got a really good defensive player who is younger and signed for A LOT less money than what Hart is going to sign for. We also got Kris Murray, who may or may not work out, but he fits our timeline a lot better than Hart.
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We keep conjuring up why all the deals made were actually good. You pay more money to better players. Look at...

- Our record since the trade
- Dame asking out
- Now we have to rebuild

We can talk about who wanted to go where and for what cost but the front office has been completely ineffective since taking over for Olshey who had his own issues.

This gives me John Nash vibes all over again. But Cronin is such a nice man!
 
AmirIcon said:
We keep conjuring up why all the deals made were actually good. You pay more money to better players. Look at...

- Our record since the trade
- Dame asking out
- Now we have to rebuild
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Our record...... while tanking?
 
Ripcity4life77 said:
Nate -- Your comment on that Clippers trade and how it was good cause it got the team Sharpe please tell me you were joking or being sarcastic or something.
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What great player did we give up in this clipper trade?
 
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