Measure 97

[Sinobas]

Gotta love the Dems and their Pro-Tax new era (not saying you are one Sinobas). Tax EVERYTHING, in the name of the Schools and Children! Fear-mongering B.S. while Government waste continues in Portland.

I see your economist and raise with this economist:

http://portlandtribune.com/pt/9-news/322921-201885-economist-says-no-to-measure-97

And just 18 of the 89 economists cited as supporters of Measure 97 are from Oregon.

If you want real data on this, read this:

https://www.oregonlegislature.gov/lro/Documents/RR 3-16 Measure 97.pdf

Ok, so whoever wrote that simply repeated the fallacy that the corporate tax would be passed on to consumers.

Look at this comprehensive study which found no correlation between state corporate taxes and consumer prices. http://oregonconsumerleague.org/wp-content/uploads/Side-by-Side-Shopping-Cart-Study.pdf

In addition to not bearing out in the real world, I think that theory in general is faulty. If a business incurs a higher cost to sell a good, that higher cost will either eat into profits or be passed onto the consumer. It depends on the elasticity of demand on that product. Businesses already set their prices according to what they think will maximize profit, so they thought they could sell it for more and not drive down demand to the point of a net loss, they'd already be selling the product for that amount.

It's a shame that this sort of bs is being used to scare the public away from a tax increase that would bring in billions and shift the tax burden more towards wealthy corporations.

 

[BLAZINGGIANTS]

As a resident in SoCal and a past resident of Oregon - allow me to provide you with some real data.

The terrible tax laws that California established in 2012 has been a huge economic success. The state has gone from a huge budget crisis to having a $9b surplus estimate in 2018. The state is seeing almost $7b increase per year in revenue. At the same time - the CA economy has been either the fastest or 2nd fastest in the nation since 2013.

I would also like to point out that California does not have a problem with population fleeing it's borders, the population continues to grow by around 1% per year, same as it has been since the late 2000s.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/carl-gibson/kansas-tax-cuts_b_5589663.html

Groovy.

Now go back to California!

 

[andalusian]

Now go back to California!

I actually miss Portland. Have not been for a visit in several years. Hope to fix that this summer! (I am not coming back for the winters, thanks)

 

[BLAZINGGIANTS]

It disgusts me how brainwashed some people are. Saw a discussion on income inequality a month or so ago. And read online comments on fb of poor people defending multibillion dollar corporations paying them 30k/year while ceos make 20 million.

In no universe does that make sense. In the late 80s it was 20/1 or 50/1 ratios. Now you have 2000/1 ratios.

This is how I feel reading everything online and on my FB page about Hillary. I absolutely loathe both of our presidential candidates, and they are total scumbags. The difference is Trump supporters know he's a scumbag. Hillary supporters won't say nary a bad thing about her. Vote for whomever you like, but be honest with yourself about the number of shortcomings BOTH candidates have.

 

[BLAZINGGIANTS]

I actually miss Portland. Have not been for a visit in several years. Hope to fix that this summer! (I am not coming back for the winters, thanks)

Visiting California always seems like a good idea, until I get there. San Francisco, formerly my favorite city to visit, has gotten so dirty. And the traffic sucks pretty much everywhere. I enjoy my vacays there when I am holed up somewhere near the beach and I otherwise don't have to venture out (like my wife's aunt's oceanfront condo in Oceanside).

Of course, Portland traffic blows now, too. Of course, I moved away from that.

 

[MarAzul]

shift the tax burden more towards wealthy corporations.

I find it difficult to believe you actual think this is a valid thought.
If you do, then why not tax them at 91% like dviss wants to return to? (Business were never taxed this high but that is beside the point).
Fuckum take all they got! Why not?

 

[andalusian]

San Francisco, formerly my favorite city to visit, has gotten so dirty.

I believe San Francisco building codes are pretty much the cause of that. You can not build anything to handle the population growth, leading to crazy housing market, leading to an increase in homeless population - this is a city bursting at the seams.

And the traffic sucks pretty much everywhere.

Some places are better than others, but LA, SF and the East bay are really bad pretty much consistently.

I enjoy my vacays there when I am holed up somewhere near the beach and I otherwise don't have to venture out (like my wife's aunt's oceanfront condo in Oceanside).

I love Oceanside. I actually love the entire North SD county. So many great places - Encinitas, RSF, Solana Beach, Del Mar. Even the inland has gotten really nice in areas. There are some fantastic areas in Escondido, Carlsbad, Fallbrook etc... - I admit that I just love San Diego county at large. A really nice place.

 

[blue32]

I find it difficult to believe you actual think this is a valid thought.
If you do, then why not tax them at 91% like dviss wants to return to? (Business were never taxed this high but that is beside the point).
Fuckum take all they got! Why not?

I honestly don't understand this "fair share" mentality. What exactly is a 'fair share' and why do rich people, well off people, or businesses have to pay a 'fair share' when they are already paying taxes like the rest of us. If loopholes are your problem then go after them. But to throw more tax at successful people or companies just blows my mind. Of course I am an extreme conservative when it comes to money.

 

[MarAzul]

I honestly don't understand this "fair share" mentality. What exactly is a 'fair share' and why do rich people, well off people, or businesses have to pay a 'fair share' when they are already paying taxes like the rest of us. If loopholes are your problem then go after them. But to throw more tax at successful people or companies just blows my mind. Of course I am an extreme conservative when it comes to money.

dun no! I just thought he ought to take it all the way to see if it is logical.

 

[MarAzul]

I admit that I just love San Diego county at large. A really nice place.

Man! I thought it was the greatest when I first saw it 60 years ago. Perhaps it was too.

 

[dviss1]

This is how I feel reading everything online and on my FB page about Hillary. I absolutely loathe both of our presidential candidates, and they are total scumbags. The difference is Trump supporters know he's a scumbag. Hillary supporters won't say nary a bad thing about her. Vote for whomever you like, but be honest with yourself about the number of shortcomings BOTH candidates have.

This is only true of the Hillbots.

 

[dviss1]

I honestly don't understand this "fair share" mentality. What exactly is a 'fair share' and why do rich people, well off people, or businesses have to pay a 'fair share' when they are already paying taxes like the rest of us. If loopholes are your problem then go after them. But to throw more tax at successful people or companies just blows my mind. Of course I am an extreme conservative when it comes to money.

Loopholes are only part of the problem. The problem is me paying +35% for working and Paris Hilton paying 13% while lying poolside. That's also a reason why I support Estate Tax.

 

[dviss1]

I honestly don't understand this "fair share" mentality. What exactly is a 'fair share' and why do rich people, well off people, or businesses have to pay a 'fair share' when they are already paying taxes like the rest of us. If loopholes are your problem then go after them. But to throw more tax at successful people or companies just blows my mind. Of course I am an extreme conservative when it comes to money.

Also LOTS of rich people pay 0 effective tax.

Donald Trump hasn't paid taxes in 18 fucking years.

Fuck THAT.

 

[blue32]

Also LOTS of rich people pay 0 effective tax.

Donald Trump hasn't paid taxes in 18 fucking years.

Fuck THAT.

I just read it was Bill Clinton that enabled one of those carry forward tax relief items. Haha.

Don't blame Trump, everyone uses that dude. Blame the corrupt system.

 

[blue32]

Loopholes are only part of the problem. The problem is me paying +35% for working and Paris Hilton paying 13% while lying poolside. That's also a reason why I support Estate Tax.

So you support a flat tax?

 

[dviss1]

So you support a flat tax?

God no. Regressive on the poor.

I support progressive taxes.

 

[dviss1]

I just read it was Bill Clinton that enabled one of those carry forward tax relief items. Haha.

Don't blame Trump, everyone uses that dude. Blame the corrupt system.

Dems/Repubs = 2 headed snake

 

[MarAzul]

Donald Trump hasn't paid taxes in 18 fucking years.

I support progressive taxes.

A progressive taxes? How much should that be on a loss?

 

[BLAZINGGIANTS]

This is only true of the Hillbots.

There seems to be a lot of them.

 

[bodyman5000 and 1]

Dems/Repubs = 2 headed snake

Stupid thing to say. They're a two assed skunk.

 

[dviss1]

Stupid thing to say. They're a two assed skunk.

 

[bodyman5000 and 1]

Look, technology seems to make us stupid but it can be a tool. If you don't like that they are going to make some kr eventually all Oreos in Mexico don't buy them.

 

[dviss1]

There seems to be a lot of them.

I've got lots of friends who are Dems NOT voting for Clinton.