Merged: Deng to Portland?

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Denny Crane said:
The moral of the story is, the 20/10 PF bird in the hand is worth 2 in the bush.

And Deng is the 18/7 SF who has received as many all-nba defensive team votes as Batum, and Batum is the P-P-P-P-POTENTIAL guy.
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I can see where you are coming from, but Batum's NBA play is far from potential - and his actual advanced statistics are better than Deng all-around.

Batum's 2nd year PER is better than any of Deng's years PER but 1, Batum's WS/48 score is higher than any of Deng's years and he does it with a much lower usage% than Deng. Deng is far from the worst contract in the NBA as some paint him - but Batum is already a more efficient player than Deng - while being younger and used less.

No disrespect to Deng - but if I had a horse in this race - it would be Batum.
 
Denny Crane said:
Let me explain my view by analogy.

The Bulls drafted Elton Brand. He was co-rookie of the year. He made noises about leaving if the Bulls didn't put together a winner. The Bulls did have Artest and Brad Miller to go with him. And they would have been pretty awesome if the three stayed together. Did Artest make the all-star game? If so, that's three all-stars.

Anyhow, Jerry Krause traded Brand for the #2 pick in the draft and selected Tyson Chandler. All the potential in the world, and he was seen before the draft taking and making shots beyond the 3pt line and everything. P-P-P-P-POTENTIAL!

The moral of the story is, the 20/10 PF bird in the hand is worth 2 in the bush.

And Deng is the 18/7 SF who has received as many all-nba defensive team votes as Batum, and Batum is the P-P-P-P-POTENTIAL guy.

But in the world of CBA economics, if having a SF on his rookie deal is part of the strategy, then Batum is a good one. If it's Paul Allen's money, I'd rather have Deng.
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Your analogy doesn't quite wash because you are comparing Chandler to Batum when one was not even an NBA player and the other has already played a couple of seasons in the league. Granted Nic hasn't yet logged 30+ minutes a game in a season, but he has shown that he can hit the three pointer as a large part of his repetoire (versus Deng's very occasional 3 as a ratio to his total field goal attempts), Deng has also shown himself to be a consistent injury risk. Batum had trouble with his shoulder last year too, so that might be a push, but when you are talking about a guy on their rookie scale deal versus a guy set to make 50+ million for the next 4 years, one injury risk is a lot easier to stomach versus another.

And really if history has taught us anything every team has to consider CBA economics until they've found the formula that generates championship caliber squads, if you hamstring yourself before you've tapped into that particular mix of players (such as the Lakers have found) then you lose flexibility and you end up looking a lot like the Hornets.
 
Denny Crane said:
The moral of the story is, the 20/10 PF bird in the hand is worth 2 in the bush.
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Yes, because you traded a proven player for someone who had not been in the NBA yet. Big difference.

Denny Crane said:
And Deng is the 18/7 SF who has received as many all-nba defensive team votes as Batum, and Batum is the P-P-P-P-POTENTIAL guy.
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So same amount of All-NBA defensive team votes? But Deng has been in the league for 6 years, and plays in central time, in Chicago. Batum has played 1.5 years, on pacific time in Portland. Hmm, I'll take the p-p-p-potential, and the consideration when nobody seems him as an equal defender in Batum, for 10 million less a year, thanks.
 
noknobs said:
Boy you're sure trying to sell him, sounds like you vastly can't wait to get rid of him, and his vast contract. I vastly wonder why that is.
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Don't let it be said that I can't wait to get rid of him anymore.
 
BoomChakaLaka said:
Would Batum and Miller get us Nash?

Nash
Roy
Deng
LMA
Oden
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A) Of course Batum and ____ could get us Nash.

B) Seriously? You want to give up a 22 year old kid who is already our best defensive player for a year rental on Steve Nash? Yikes.
 
I try to keep an open mind about these things. The first thing I would remind people is Deng is a proven scorer with playoff experience. The second thing I would remind folks about is that Batum is capable of playing multiple positions, and one thing that has crossed my mind occasionally is the fact that last summer he took the place of Tony Parker as the PG for the French National team. I also think Deng would be an awesome 6th man. Think of it this way. Martell is gone. Wouldn't Deng make a hell of an uprade?
 
hasoos said:
I try to keep an open mind about these things. The first thing I would remind people is Deng is a proven scorer with playoff experience. The second thing I would remind folks about is that Batum is capable of playing multiple positions, and one thing that has crossed my mind occasionally is the fact that last summer he took the place of Tony Parker as the PG for the French National team. I also think Deng would be an awesome 6th man. Think of it this way. Martell is gone. Wouldn't Deng make a hell of an uprade?
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Not with his $12m+/Per salary.
 
Fez Hammersticks said:
Not with his $12m+/Per salary.
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After this years free agent feeding frenzy I don't think his salary is really that bad. Luol Deng is only 25 years old, and averaging about 18 points and 7 boards a game. When was the last time we had a small forward who averaged that?

They must feel strongly about signing a free agent guard if they think they can move Bayless/Joel and pull this off.
 
hasoos said:
I try to keep an open mind about these things. The first thing I would remind people is Deng is a proven scorer with playoff experience. The second thing I would remind folks about is that Batum is capable of playing multiple positions, and one thing that has crossed my mind occasionally is the fact that last summer he took the place of Tony Parker as the PG for the French National team. I also think Deng would be an awesome 6th man. Think of it this way. Martell is gone. Wouldn't Deng make a hell of an uprade?
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The problem I see with this is Nate would play Deng to much and Batum not enough. I don't want anybody to take any minutes from Batum unless his name is Lebron not Deng.
 
Tortimer said:
The problem I see with this is Nate would play Deng to much and Batum not enough. I don't want anybody to take any minutes from Batum unless his name is Lebron not Deng.
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Yea I don't trust Nate either. But I still think he is an upgrade over the previous player. I also think he is insurance in case Batum get's hurt again.
 
hasoos said:
Yea I don't trust Nate either. But I still think he is an upgrade over the previous player. I also think he is insurance in case Batum get's hurt again.
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For sure over Webster.
 
I just don't see how he makes any sense if we still have Batum.

Like I said earlier, this has to be a precursor to another move that involves Batum

Nic is not a backup. Dung is too expensive to not start. But then again this is all probably a moot point -- this was all started by O-Live for fuck sakes!
 
Fez Hammersticks said:
I just don't see how he makes any sense if we still have Batum.

Like I said earlier, this has to be a precursor to another move that involves Batum

Nic is not a backup. Dung is too expensive to not start. But then again this is all probably a moot point -- this was all started by O-Live for fuck sakes!
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Which is what makes it even funnier. That's the state of ESPN's sports journalism at this point, newspaper message boards equal, "The Oregonian is reporting."
 
Just for fun's sake, let's say this rumor is true. Let's also say that NOH ownership really plans on keeping Paul but would be willing to trade Collison for Batum. Takers?
 
why would you trade Batum for Collison? That's a big hell no from me.
 
I want to see Collison play again next year because I still can't believe he blew up like that.
 
Tortimer said:
Deng is ok but and I have seen enough of Batum to know if he got the minutes Deng got he would have just as good and probably better. I just don't want Deng on the team because he is a veteran and we will end up with something similar to Blake and Miller last year. Right now we have a rookie Babbitt backing up Batum. So, I think Nate will have to play Batum 30-35 minutes. He has screwed with Batum for 2 years now. He starts plays great is taken out after 8 minutes and many times doesn't see any more time until the second half. Some games Batum is our best player and Nate still doesn't play him outside of his screwed up schedule of 8 minutes at the start of the game. We got rid of Webster and I want no part of Deng messing up Nate's head with playing time. Batum is the real deal IMO. He plays great defense, good shooter and has all the tools. I have seen many of these guys with hype potential but Batum IMO is the real deal.
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First of all, Nic wasn't supposed to play much at all his rookie year. He was lucky Webster got hurt. He was a rookie and very young. I don't see how Nate "screwed with him.". Last season, he was hurt half the year but was still given his starting spot back pretty quickly despite Martell playing well. I'm not sure how Nate has screwed with him.
 
RR7 said:
why would you trade Batum for Collison? That's a big hell no from me.
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I wouldn't either, but then, I wouldn't take Deng and his crappy contract in the first place...which is why I doubt that this rumor has any legs to it.
 
KingSpeed said:
First of all, Nic wasn't supposed to play much at all his rookie year. He was lucky Webster got hurt. He was a rookie and very young. I don't see how Nate "screwed with him.". Last season, he was hurt half the year but was still given his starting spot back pretty quickly despite Martell playing well. I'm not sure how Nate has screwed with him.
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I'm not talking as much about his rookie year but mostly about last year. When he was healthy Batum had many good games and a few really good games where he would be shooting and playing great in the first quarter. Nate would pull him after 8 minutes or so and then he wouldn't get back in until the second half. Nate screwed Batum over many games last year. No matter how well he played he would only get his normal 15-18 minutes.

Also I would love to have Collison but I wouldn't trade Batum for him.
 
If we get Deng, I would trade Batum for Collison in a HEARTBEAT. In 37 games as a starter last year, he averaged 19 ppg and 9 apg on 48% shooting from the field, 43% from the three point line, and 85% shooting from the free throw line. And that was as a rookie! He's already world's better than Miller or Blake, our two options last year and hos great shooting complements Roy very well.
 
Tortimer said:
I'm not talking as much about his rookie year but mostly about last year. When he was healthy Batum had many good games and a few really good games where he would be shooting and playing great in the first quarter. Nate would pull him after 8 minutes or so and then he wouldn't get back in until the second half. Nate screwed Batum over many games last year. No matter how well he played he would only get his normal 15-18 minutes.
.
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Batum averaged 25 mpg. And he was recovering from surgery. And we had another very competent player at his position.
 
KingSpeed said:
Batum averaged 25 mpg. And he was recovering from surgery. And we had another very competent player at his position.
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Some say Dante is not a SF.

barfo
 
RR7 said:
why would you trade Batum for Collison? That's a big hell no from me.
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Hell no to 19/9 and 48/43/85? Plus and 18/7 guy in place of Batum. You're crazy if you don't like that.
 
Assuming we had Deng for sure ... a Collison for Nic swap eh? I admit that's slightly intriguing, but I don't think I could pull the trigger on that deal.
 
Cake said:
A) Of course Batum and ____ could get us Nash.

B) Seriously? You want to give up a 22 year old kid who is already our best defensive player for a year rental on Steve Nash? Yikes.
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No but how about Collison? Collison is Nash except he's Batum's age.
 
KingSpeed said:
Batum averaged 25 mpg. And he was recovering from surgery. And we had another very competent player at his position.
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I agree as Nate got more confident in Batum he did give him more minutes. I just think Batum will be great if given 35 minutes a game and I don't want to make it hard for Nate to play him that much with having Deng. I'm not a huge fan of Deng. He is just ok IMO and is another injury prone player we don't need for that much money. I also think Joel with Miller at the trade deadline could get us a better player hopefully a PG.
 
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