Miami Heat Dame Trade Ideas and Rumors (2 Viewers)

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wizenheimer said:
I had never really watched Nikola Jovic play. I just watched some game 'film' with him, and have a question:

is Pat Riley using a Rope-a-Dope on the Blazers? trying to make the Blazers want Jovic because Riley is pretending he doesn't want to trade him? Because I'm not seeing it; I'm not seeing a lot of talent or upside. He just turned 20, has length, and seems fairly mobile, so he does have a path to being a good player. But he's a long way from being that player right now

obviously he represents an asset Portland needs to get if it's Dame-->Miami, but right now he looks like a fairly minor asset
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Yup. He sits on the three point line. He doesn’t play good defense. He can’t really drive. He’s a backup stretch four at best.
 
Some have been predicting that the cream of first round draft picks is in 2025 and that's the pick you want. Those later Miami picks are going to suck. You want Charlotte or Minnie or Orlando picks.
 
RR7 said:
My way too big idea.
Says failed because of Jaquez, so will be legal July 31s. Agreed to now.
Bulls swap out a better player in LaVine to get younger and save money at the position.
I put Philly '27 pick outgoing on accident, I'd prefer to switch it to the '27 PHX pick. Brooklyn takes on an extra year or 2 of high salary, but get a good lead guard to play alongside Bridges, Johnson and Claxton. It's not a super competitive championship roster, but gets them in that lower half of the playoffs potentially. They lose a pick for moving Simmons, and then a pick(Clowney) for adding LaVine.
Accidentally clicked on protections on that Miami pick, and don't feel like going back to alter it. But Miami gets their guy in Lillard. They have to take on Nurk to do the deal. They move Herro, Jaquez, Jovic, and 2 future picks. 27 and 29. Wasn't sure how to include them, but would want swaps, for whatever they're worth, in 26 and 28 as well.
We dump Nurk with Lillard. We add 2 rookies in Jaquez and Clowney, Young big in Jovic. 3 1st round pick, 2 swaps, and a reclamation project/flier in Simmons.
Can then work with Lowry on a buyout, which I'm sure he'd be happy to o, or facilitate a follow up move for him to get to a competitor. Or, worst case, you keep him on as a good vet mentor for Scoot, which I wouldn't mind at all.


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Miami can't trade 2027 pick. 2026 is possibly going to OKC and Stephen restrictions don't allow two consecutive picks to be traded. 2028 and 2030 picks are the ones they can freely trade with swaps in 2027 2029.
 
Looking at a Miami deal more it just has to be a 3 way trade where Herro goes to a 3rd team. Brooklyn seems to make the most sense, but the Spurs or Thunder or some other teams could work as well. Miami doesn't have very good players to give up, so they need to give us all of their future draft equity.

OKC does this deal as they change the 2025 protected pick they are owed to a straight unprotected 2026 pick in a more coveted draft. In theory they probably have to give up a second rounder or something of value for this, if so then send that to PDX too.
Nets do this deal as they get out of Simmons contract, pickup some young upside in Jacquez, and give up one great pick in the 2027 Phoenix pick but one mediocre pick in the lesser of 2025 Brooklyn/Houston pick which Houston can swap. They save $7 million as well as more next year.
Heat do this deal as they get the best star player in Dame, they get to keep Martin and Robinson for role playing depth, and they add front court depth in Nurkic. They save $30k
Blazers do this deal primarily for the picks, plus take a flyer on Jovic and maybe that small chance Simmons is worth more in a trade later.

The Blazers getting a 2025 and 2027 pick from the Nets lets them get much more value in their swaps with the Heat. So the picks the Blazers get are;
Unprotected 2024 from Miami
Unprotected 2028 from Miami
Unprotected 2030 from Miami
2025 Nets pick which is lesser of their own and Houston (Houston has swap rights)
Unprotected 2027 Phoenix pick via Nets
Three second round picks from Miami (2026 2029 2030)
Unprotected swap from Miami in 2025 - Blazers get the best one or two picks of their own, lesser of Nets/Rockets, Miami - Miami only gets the single worst pick
Unprotected swap from Miami in 2027 - Blazers get the best one or two picks of their own, Phoenix, Miami - Miami only gets the single worst pick
Unprotected swap from Miami in 2029 - Blazers get the best of their own or Miami pick - Miami gets the worst.

In theory Blazers could end up with these lottery picks
2024 #1 and #2 overall
2025 #1 and #2 overall
2026 #1 overall
2027 #1 and #2 overall
2028 #1 and #2 overall
2029 #1 overall
2030 #1 and #2 overall

So this gives Portland FIVE additional first round picks that are all unprotected and could all be in the top of the lottery. They have all the Miami draft equity outside of 2026, they also have draft equity in Phoenix for 2027. Is it possible Miami has late picks many of these years? Of course, but its also possible Dame/Butler have massive declines and or Bam is hurt and they have a couple of major stinker seasons. It's possible a few of these years Miami gets "lucky" jumping in the lottery but the Blazers getting that benefit of a top4 pick.

If I were negotiating for Cronin I'd initially ask for all of this as well as Caleb Martin (who could likely be flipped for a first), and an additional first from the Nets. But I'd agree to this type of trade. If the Nets aren't interested then get Herro to a different 3rd team for a 2027 pick.

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wizenheimer said:
that was 2 years ago against essentially high school competition

last season, at Duke, he averaged 8.3 points and 2.4 rebounds. He only had a 6.8% rebound rate which is very weak for college; and he only shot 41% on two's. And he didn't get to the FT line. He did shoot 43% on college three's on 98 attempts but that's about the only encouraging stat he had. Statistically, he looks like a one-trick pony (Allen Crabbe?), but I've never seen him play. Statistically speaking, I'm not impressed, but I might be missing something

I saw Jaquez play in college quite a few times. He's competent and can do a lot of things. From what I know (which isn't a lot), I'd rather have him than Whitehead. But it won't come down to having to choose between the two
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I do find it very curious that as of yet, according to Spotrac, neither Clowney or Whitehead have signed their rookie scale yet. In fact, if you look at their draft page, only 3 first round picks haven't signed, and the other one who hasn't, besides the Net's duo, was involved in a draft day trade:

https://www.spotrac.com/nba/draft/

I doubt it has to do with a Dame trade, but the coincidence is certainly noticeable
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That Duke system was a mess and he spent part of the year injured. If I’m plucking guys off of other teams I’m looking at upside only.

Jaquez is a nice player, I’ll take him too.
 
I am very happy nothing was done early this week and nothing appears on the horizon. It's now a game of chicken between us and the M'eat. They need Dame right now more than we need a return for him. They have gutted their roster to accommodate his salary. The louder they squawk publicly, the more you know the pressure is working.

If I were Cronin, I may make a few calls regarding some players I want on other teams, to see their price. I would forward that information to Riley to include in a trade. However, it's on Goodwin and Riley to make a deal work. It's not on us.
 
If Dame had given us a list of several teams, I would have 100% rooted for him to succeed wherever he ended up. Now? I hope the Heat crash and burn if he's traded there. I hope they don't make the playoffs. I hope Riley retires and they fall into squalor.
 
maxiep said:
I am very happy nothing was done early this week and nothing appears on the horizon. It's now a game of chicken between us and the M'eat. They need Dame right now more than we need a return for him. They have gutted their roster to accommodate his salary. The louder they squawk publicly, the more you know the pressure is working.

If I were Cronin, I may make a few calls regarding some players I want on other teams, to see their price. I would forward that information to Riley to include in a trade. However, it's on Goodwin and Riley to make a deal work. It's not on us.
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I have been saying for a while that we have no incentive to rush to make a trade. But a part of me also realizes the market for Dame is pretty minimal given his age and contract. Are we prepared to forego a ROY caliber yr from Scoot to drag this on for a few more months? And can we be sure that a better deal will manifest in Feb?

Goodwin/Haynes et al have already exercised the extent of their leverage. But the question is... How much more do we have as the team?
 
Natebishop3 said:
If Dame had given us a list of several teams, I would have 100% rooted for him to succeed wherever he ended up. Now? I hope the Heat crash and burn if he's traded there. I hope they don't make the playoffs. I hope Riley retires and they fall into squalor.
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This is it, exactly. It was his PUBLIC declaration that he was going to be a M'eat. Kevin Durant wanted to go to Phoenix, but he requested that sole destination privately and Marks was able to hold an auction for him across the League to get better value for him from the team he wanted all along.

The longer this goes on, the more it seems like these conversations had been going on between Dame's team (Goodwin's job is to provide deniability for Dame) and the M'eat. They knew they didn't have the assets to get Dame in an open market, so they have been trying to depress that market by denying entry to other franchises. It's tampering, it's selling us down the river, it should be illegal, but it happens all the time. Our only response is to be patient and get closer to the season where Dame's competitive desperation will kick in. Does he really want to sit out of camp? If he does, he's KILLING his brand.

Our response right now is reasonable. Just expand your list to a team that stands a chance to compete to go deep in the playoffs, don't just tell us one destination that doesn't have the assets for fair compensation. If he does that, the pressure then gets put on Cronin. We're then the ones viewed as holding Dame hostage. Right now, it's Dame holding us hostage.
 
illmatic99 said:
I have been saying for a while that we have no incentive to rush to make a trade. But a part of me also realizes the market for Dame is pretty minimal given his age and contract. Are we prepared to forego a ROY caliber yr from Scoot to drag this on for a few more months? And can we be sure that a better deal will manifest in Feb?

Goodwin/Haynes et al have already exercised the extent of their leverage. But the question is... How much more do we have as the team?
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They can just tell Dame to sit. I'm pretty unsympathetic to someone making millions of dollars even given the circumstance. But even if they didn't, the Heat have a lot more to lose if all we're losing is "a ROY year from Scoot".

Way I'm reading the tea leaves is: Blazers would probably accept Miami's best offer, but Miami hasn't put their best offer on the table yet. So this is just going to go on until Miami puts their best offer on the table.
 
illmatic99 said:
I have been saying for a while that we have no incentive to rush to make a trade. But a part of me also realizes the market for Dame is pretty minimal given his age and contract. Are we prepared to forego a ROY caliber yr from Scoot to drag this on for a few more months? And can we be sure that a better deal will manifest in Feb?

Goodwin/Haynes et al have already exercised the extent of their leverage. But the question is... How much more do we have as the team?
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Heat need to get us a pick(s) for Herro and all their 1st/swaps. If they aren't at least giving us that probably better to sit on Dame. He'd still likely have that value of their lesser offers at the deadline or 2024 off-season. If the Heat do offer all that I'd probably ultimately take the deal as yeah ideally we want this resolved before training camp and the season. I'd give up a little bit of expected value to move on, but I'm not dumping Dame in a trade we are clearly losing big.
 
Anyone know when Lowry contract is guaranteed? This could be a bit of a "deadline" to complete the deal.
 
B-Roy said:
They can just tell Dame to sit. I'm pretty unsympathetic to someone making millions of dollars even given the circumstance. But even if they didn't, the Heat have a lot more to lose if all we're losing is "a ROY year from Scoot".

Way I'm reading the tea leaves is: Blazers would probably accept Miami's best offer, but Miami hasn't put their best offer on the table yet. So this is just going to go on until Miami puts their best offer on the table.
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Was thinking about how Houston handled the Harden exit.

1. Harden makes trade demand over the summer.
2. Gets completely outta shape and doesn't show up to training camp.
3. Rumors about other destinations surface (remember the Olshey-Rockets GM photo from Moda before game 1?)
4. Harden drops 40.
5. Harden creates drama with disparaging comments seemingly every week and the team comes up with bullshit excuses to not play him.
6. Harden hires a third party agency/lawfirm to facilitate trade discussion (wonder if Dame will do this...)
7. Harden gets traded in January
 
illmatic99 said:
Was thinking about how Houston handled the Harden exit.

1. Harden makes trade demand over the summer.
2. Gets completely outta shape and doesn't show up to training camp.
3. Rumors about other destinations surface (remember the Olshey-Rockets GM photo from Moda before game 1?)
4. Harden drops 40.
5. Harden creates drama with disparaging comments seemingly every week and the team comes up with bullshit excuses to not play him.
6. Harden hires a third party agency/lawfirm to facilitate trade discussion (wonder if Dame will do this...)
7. Harden gets traded in January
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This timeline would be fine with me. Dame is no Harden. He won't do anything but give his very best.
 
B-Roy said:
They can just tell Dame to sit. I'm pretty unsympathetic to someone making millions of dollars even given the circumstance. But even if they didn't, the Heat have a lot more to lose if all we're losing is "a ROY year from Scoot".

Way I'm reading the tea leaves is: Blazers would probably accept Miami's best offer, but Miami hasn't put their best offer on the table yet. So this is just going to go on until Miami puts their best offer on the table.
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The fastest way this gets done is for Dame to pressure Miami to not get cute. I don't think Dame is all that motivated to do this yet—'he wants to play with Caleb Martin!!!'
 
Samuel said:
The fastest way this gets done is for Dame to pressure Miami to not get cute. I don't think Dame is all that motivated to do this yet—'he wants to play with Caleb Martin!!!'
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I find it really frustrating that Goodwin met with Cronin about making a deal but not Riley.
 
Ok I found out for Lowry its the waive and stretch provision the Heat could use to lower luxury tax, deadline is Sep 1.

https://www.miamiherald.com/sports/nba/miami-heat/article276659416.html

According to two sources, the Heat has been giving thought to potentially using the waive-and-stretch provision on Lowry if Miami is unable to trade him, though a firm decision on that has not been made. That waive-and-stretch mechanism would allocate his remaining cap hit equally over three seasons.

In other words, if the Heat goes the waive-and-stretch route, Lowry would have a cap hit of $9.9 million each of the next three seasons instead of $29.7 million next season, which would be his cap hit otherwise

.....

That option will be moot if the Heat includes Lowry in a potential trade for Portland guard Damian Lillard — who has not asked for a trade — or another transaction. But the decision must be made this summer, because the waive-and-stretch provision can only be used before Sept. 1.

If the Heat keeps Lowry beyond Sept. 1, Miami would need to hope that his contract could be parlayed into assets, perhaps at next February’s trade deadline should he remain on the roster that long. At this past season’s trade deadline, the Lakers appreciably upgraded their team by parlaying Russell Westbrook’s expiring contract — the one that paid him $47 million last season — into three helpful rotation players.

.....

Los Angeles Clippers: Power forwards Marcus Morris (due $17.1 million) and Robert Covington ($11.7 million) would be a cap match for Lowry if the Clippers want a veteran point guard. This would make sense if the Heat gets Lillard, especially if Caleb Martin is sacrificed in the deal. But the Heat likely would need to throw in a sweetener for the Clippers to consider.
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maxiep said:
This is it, exactly. It was his PUBLIC declaration that he was going to be a M'eat. Kevin Durant wanted to go to Phoenix, but he requested that sole destination privately and Marks was able to hold an auction for him across the League to get better value for him from the team he wanted all along.

The longer this goes on, the more it seems like these conversations had been going on between Dame's team (Goodwin's job is to provide deniability for Dame) and the M'eat. They knew they didn't have the assets to get Dame in an open market, so they have been trying to depress that market by denying entry to other franchises. It's tampering, it's selling us down the river, it should be illegal, but it happens all the time. Our only response is to be patient and get closer to the season where Dame's competitive desperation will kick in. Does he really want to sit out of camp? If he does, he's KILLING his brand.

Our response right now is reasonable. Just expand your list to a team that stands a chance to compete to go deep in the playoffs, don't just tell us one destination that doesn't have the assets for fair compensation. If he does that, the pressure then gets put on Cronin. We're then the ones viewed as holding Dame hostage. Right now, it's Dame holding us hostage.
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All Dame has to say is “trade me to the Lakers” and everyone here will be rooting for him to go to Miami.
 
SharpesTriumph said:
Ok I found out for Lowry its the waive and stretch provision the Heat could use to lower luxury tax, deadline is Sep 1.

https://www.miamiherald.com/sports/nba/miami-heat/article276659416.html
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Why would the Heat waive and stretch Lowry if they acquired Dame (both parties would probably want his salary in the deal instead of DRob because it's expiring), 'and' in a scenario where Dame doesn't come (they'd need a PG)?

I get that deadlines drive action but I don't see any scenario where they want to waive and stretch Lowry.
 
Samuel said:
Why would the Heat waive and stretch Lowry if they acquired Dame (both parties would probably want his salary in the deal instead of DRob because it's expiring), 'and' in a scenario where Dame doesn't come (they'd need a PG)?

I get that deadlines drive action but I don't see any scenario where they want to waive and stretch Lowry.
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If Miami doesn't think they will be able to close a Dame deal stretching Lowry could save tens of millions.

I guess with them not retaining free agents or using the MLE though you may be right - they probably don't have the tax burden that this article considered before they lost Strus/Vincent.
 
I love that this boner wants to bash on ESPN and the Blazers for pushing a narrative.... but not a word about Haynes or Shams or Fentress etc. This guy looks like he should be running a chop shop or pushing stocks.

 
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