Miller Expects to start

[PapaG]

Wow. Did you even see any of the Sixers playoff games? He was easily the second best player on his team. 21 ppg, 5.3 apg, 6.5 rpg. .475 shooting. His problem doesn't seem to be performing in the playoffs.

His problem is that he's had pretty crappy teammates over his career, he can't hit a three pointer and his defense is getting worse.

He can't do anything about bad past teammates.

If he can't hit a three pointer by now, I doubt he ever will (I guess you could argue that he could pull a Jason Kidd. But the odds aren't good.) If he does really want to improve three point shooting, he can practice that on his own.

His defense is getting worse because he's getting older and slower.



The guy is an NBA ironman health-wise. He's easily fit in everywhere he's gone except the Clippers. This will be his 5th different stop. He probably knows the drill by now of how to make it work on a new team.

I'm not saying that what Miller is doing, or rather not doing, is a bad thing. The results in his career thus far, however, certainly don't validate that his offseason approach leads to postseason success.

 

[RR7]

I'm just curious what the point behind your post was. Do you feel that Blake being at the practice facility gives him a leg up on winning the job? Do you feel because of that time spent, he will have a better chance at making people look better through our offense or a better chance of running the offense? It was stated in a way to imply criticism of Miller, and praise for Blake, yet you distanced yourself from that, and said you were merely stating where they were at.

 

[PapaG]

I'm just curious what the point behind your post was. Do you feel that Blake being at the practice facility gives him a leg up on winning the job? Do you feel because of that time spent, he will have a better chance at making people look better through our offense or a better chance of running the offense? It was stated in a way to imply criticism of Miller, and praise for Blake, yet you distanced yourself from that, and said you were merely stating where they were at.

It's a minor criticism of Miller, and I have no problem saying this. I also don't think it means anything in terms of who wins the starting spot. I think Miller will win it, and if he does, I have absolutely no problem with it. That said, I imagine he will show up over the next few weeks in order to get a head start on the season. The apparent fact that he does this every offseason, however, does trouble me a bit since he has not won with this approach. I am merely offering my observations, and with all of the defense of the "Miller approach", the bottom-line is that he simply has not won. Is it because of this approach? Who knows? Would working out in the summer make him injury-prone? Perhaps. I have an opinion, and I don't find it particularly inflammatory or unreasonable.

 

[mook]

I'm not saying that what Miller is doing, or rather not doing, is a bad thing. The results in his career thus far, however, certainly don't validate that his offseason approach leads to postseason success.

He also hasn't won an MVP award, a defensive player of the year award or the Powerball Lottery with his offseason approach either.

Causation or correlation? You decide.

 

[PapaG]

He also hasn't won an MVP award, a defensive player of the year award or the Powerball Lottery with his offseason approach either.

Causation or correlation? You decide.

Or neither.

 

[mook]

Or neither.

No, there's clearly a correlation. He has a certain practice routine in the summer. He fails in the playoffs. He doesn't win the league MVP. He doesn't win the Powerball lottery. Lots of correlations.

The question is if he did his summer routine differently, would he win more playoff games, an MVP award and the Powerball Lottery? Does his summer activities cause these other results?

 

[THE HCP]

So let me get this straight. Everybody is pretty much on the same page with Miller. Great upgrade. But there is ONE PERSON who will be drinking HATORADE all season!

 

[Erroneous Subterfuge]

The apparent fact that he does this every offseason, however, does trouble me a bit since he has not won with this approach. I am merely offering my observations, and with all of the defense of the "Miller approach", the bottom-line is that he simply has not won. Is it because of this approach? Who knows? Would working out in the summer make him injury-prone? Perhaps. I have an opinion, and I don't find it particularly inflammatory or unreasonable.

Kevin Garnett always worked out very hard in the offseason, never helped him much in Minnesota. By your "logic" he maybe should have switched it up and taken it easy in the offseason, try a new approach and all. But no, what changed was his team, not his routine. Miller is currently the iron man in the NBA and he's produced on the floor. To suggest he needs to be at the PF now because he hasn't won anything in the past is unreasonable. He already knows our offense inside and out, as evidenced by his interview with Nate during the summer.

 

[PapaG]

No, there's clearly a correlation. He has a certain practice routine in the summer. He fails in the playoffs. He doesn't win the league MVP. He doesn't win the Powerball lottery. Lots of correlations.

The question is if he did his summer routine differently, would he win more playoff games, an MVP award and the Powerball Lottery? Does his summer activities cause these other results?

Well, the only one I care about is winning in the postseason, so you can continue to comment on your red herrings.

Not working out in the summer = no playoff series won in career. That's my focus. Discuss it, or continue to throw out ridiculous asides that take the focus off of the bolded statement.

So, it's correlation in that regard. The "neither" was for the silly Powerball example, since that is based on luck and not effort.

 

[PapaG]

Kevin Garnett always worked out very hard in the offseason, never helped him much in Minnesota. By your "logic" he maybe should have switched it up and taken it easy in the offseason, try a new approach and all. But no, what changed was his team, not his routine. Miller is currently the iron man in the NBA and he's produced on the floor. To suggest he needs to be at the PF now because he hasn't won anything in the past is unreasonable. He already knows our offense inside and out, as evidenced by his interview with Nate during the summer.

I'm not saying anything about what Miller should do, just the team results of what he has done has yielded. You get this, right?

 

[PapaG]

So let me get this straight. Everybody is pretty much on the same page with Miller. Great upgrade. But there is ONE PERSON who will be drinking HATORADE all season!

I'm excited to see Miller play and am thrilled to have him on the Blazers. Where do you get that I hate him?

 

[Erroneous Subterfuge]

I'm not saying anything about what Miller should do, just the team results of what he has done has yielded. You get this, right?

I actually think I understand what you type better than you do.

 

[THE HCP]

Being surrounded by poor talent his whole career=no playoff series won

 

[PapaG]

I actually think I understand what you type better than you do.

Yeah, I noticed. Arguing a point is much easier when you get to choose both sides.

 

[PapaG]

Being surrounded by poor talent his whole career=no playoff series won

Yep, could be.

 

[THE HCP]

I'm excited to see Miller play and am thrilled to have him on the Blazers. Where do you get that I hate him?

I'm sure you don't hate him, but I'm seeing a negative view already. For no reason.

 

[PapaG]

I'm sure you don't hate him, but I'm seeing a negative view already. For no reason.

Well, I don't see it as negative. I see it as an observation, and having people argue against working out in the offseason seems to have put me in a trench that I wasn't supposed to be in.

Just so I'm clear here, is Miller beyond questioning, but players like Blake and Outlaw are fair game?

 

[yakbladder]

I'm sure you don't hate him, but I'm seeing a negative view already. For no reason.

Actually, I don't think he hates him at all. I think he's just saying for all Miller is doing / has done that it hasn't translated into wins. Is that because of crappy teammates? Possibly. Is that because he was doing something wrong / poorly? Possibly, though not likely.

As to his three point shooting if he wants to stick around I'd suggest he learn how to shoot one. He's getting slower so D will be an issue and eventually it will take a toll on his ability to drive inside. So, yes, I think Miller should be working on SOMETHING to improve his game.

If that means every day he spends 10 minutes on his sport court at his mansion shooting 3's...fine.

I also agree that it's a little odd that Blake is so open to criticism. He didn't do poorly in the playoffs at all, IMO, but I guess that's what happens when you don't have an All Star at every position...always something to improve upon / gripe about.

 

[BrianFromWA]

If Andre doesn't pass Nate's conditioning test, I will happily say that you are welcome to the notion that he's lazy because he didn't keep himself in shape in the offseason. Same with Blake. Same with Outlaw. Same with whoever else doesn't pass.

I don't particularly agree with the "offseason relax = no playoffs", but I'm not going to bash you for it.

Maybe it'd make it simpler if I stated what my opinion was: If you show up to camp ready to go, you could backpack China all summer for all I care. If you don't show up for camp ready to go, be prepared for someone to question your choices and professionalism.

 

[PapaG]

If Andre doesn't pass Nate's conditioning test, I will happily say that you are welcome to the notion that he's lazy because he didn't keep himself in shape in the offseason. Same with Blake. Same with Outlaw. Same with whoever else doesn't pass.

I don't particularly agree with the "offseason relax = no playoffs", but I'm not going to bash you for it.

Maybe it'd make it simpler if I stated what my opinion was: If you show up to camp ready to go, you could backpack China all summer for all I care. If you don't show up for camp ready to go, be prepared for someone to question your choices and professionalism.

I was under the assumption that there is no conditioning test this year.

 

[RR7]

Steve Blake has never won a playoff series. Steve Blake has always worked out hard in the post season. So right now, ideally, Steve Blake would leave the practice facility and sit on his ass, because what he did in the past didn't work for him.

 

[PapaG]

If Andre doesn't pass Nate's conditioning test, I will happily say that you are welcome to the notion that he's lazy because he didn't keep himself in shape in the offseason. Same with Blake. Same with Outlaw. Same with whoever else doesn't pass.

I don't particularly agree with the "offseason relax = no playoffs", but I'm not going to bash you for it.

Maybe it'd make it simpler if I stated what my opinion was: If you show up to camp ready to go, you could backpack China all summer for all I care. If you don't show up for camp ready to go, be prepared for someone to question your choices and professionalism.

Found this and thought it was interesting.

http://blog.oregonlive.com/behindblazersbeat/2008/10/conditioning_test_la_martell_s.html

Regarding Outlaw's failed test, neither McMillan nor Outlaw was concerned. At all.
...

Outlaw, who has battled asthma since his childhood, said he in fact made progress this season. For the first time, he finished all 20 trips up and down the court. He said when it comes time to push himself, it brings up bad memories of his childhood, when he often had to be rushed to the hospital because of breathing problems when he exerted himself.

"I get to that point and I get scared,'' Outlaw said. "But I was happy I finished every run.''

Travis Outlaw does cardio work following practiceAs punishment for not passing the test, Outlaw for the next seven days must put in 30 minutes of cardiovascular work after every practice. Same with the others who did not participate in the drill because of injuries: Ike Diogu, Brandon Roy, Channing Frye and Greg Oden.

 

[PapaG]

Steve Blake has never won a playoff series. Steve Blake has always worked out hard in the post season. So right now, ideally, Steve Blake would leave the practice facility and sit on his ass, because what he did in the past didn't work for him.

Well, if that's your opinion, I won't argue with it.

 

[RR7]

Well, if that's your opinion, I won't argue with it.

I'm using your reasoning here. What someone did in the past didn't help the team, so they should do something different. How does it not apply with Blake? Has he had playoff success? Did I miss that?

 

[BlazerWookee]

I was under the assumption that there is no conditioning test this year.

What led you to make that assumption?

 

[PapaG]

I'm using your reasoning here. What someone did in the past didn't help the team, so they should do something different. How does it not apply with Blake? Has he had playoff success? Did I miss that?

Oh come on now. That's not my reasoning. Why are you so upset that I pointed out Miller's offseasons and how they relate to the ends of his seasons.

Unless your point is that not practicing has the same impact on a player's game as practicing does? And again, I'm not even making the claim that Miller taking the offseasons off is the cause of his lack of playoff success.

 

[PapaG]

What led you to make that assumption?

I read it on this board. Can't remember who posted it, but I had no reason to doubt it based on who posted it.

 

[RR7]

I'm not upset at all. You said Miller should be working out, because he hasn't won a playoff series in the past. And that what he was doing wasn't working.
Now, using YOUR logic, likewise, the results in Blake's career thus far, don't validate that his offseason approach leads to postseason success either. So why should one change up their approach, while another's approach seems to be a good one to you, even though, thus far, they have both had similar success in the post season with their differing approaches?

 

[PapaG]

I'm not upset at all. You said Miller should be working out, because he hasn't won a playoff series in the past. And that what he was doing wasn't working.
Now, using YOUR logic, likewise, the results in Blake's career thus far, don't validate that his offseason approach leads to postseason success either. So why should one change up their approach, while another's approach seems to be a good one to you, even though, thus far, they have both had similar success in the post season with their differing approaches?

I thought I merely pointed out that he had never won a playoff series using that approach. Again, if you're going to argue that not working out is the same as working out, then your "logic" is off-base. No need to apply what you think is my logic to prove whatever point it is you're trying to make.

Maybe Blake should take a break during the summer. Whatever. I do know as a fan, I feel much better knowing somebody is out trying to improve himself.

 

[RR7]

It doesn't bother you that what he's doing has never worked for him in the past? That he's just continuing to do the same thing? Odd that you have a double standard for players, based on, seemingly, what YOU think is the right approach. Since neither have had playoff success.

Who is saying that working out is the same as not working out? Where has anyone made that argument that those two things are the same thing? I was mentioning that differing offseason approaches have thus far returned the same result. You are annoyed that the one you think is better is not being followed by our new PG. But you seem to want to distance yourself from actually taking a stand about it by making generic statements, and saying well, it hasn't worked in the past. And neither has what Blake has done in the past. Maybe Blake's postseason failures are a result of him working too hard in the offseason, and tiring out once the playoffs hit, who knows?