Minnesota: full of shit (confirmed)

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Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

Natebishop3 said:
The guy has obviously been sold a bill of goods by his agent. He has an inflated self worth and I don't think he's going to be happy with anything under 11 or 11.5 a year. There's no way he's worth that, so we should really be looking at other options to trade him.
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Maybe we'll see how good of a salesman Olshey really is? ... assuming Nidaye (sic?) will let him actually talk with him.
 
Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

I think the conventional wisdom about not paying Batum on potential is that he was never used the right way in Portland (See Jermaine Oneal). In another situation he'd thrive and earn the $11-$12 mil that's being thrown around. Apparently other teams see this potential and are willing to invest to see it... maybe.
 
Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

Duckhook said:
I think the conventional wisdom about not paying Batum on potential is that he was never used the right way in Portland (See Jermaine Oneal). In another situation he'd thrive and earn the $11-$12 mil that's being thrown around. Apparently other teams see this potential and are willing to invest to see it... maybe.
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I just think in the new CBA, it's much more dangerous to take that kind of risk. You better be damn sure that a guy is going to live up to a contract like that before you get him to sign on the dotted line.
 
Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

Natebishop3 said:
I just think in the new CBA, it's much more dangerous to take that kind of risk. You better be damn sure that a guy is going to live up to a contract like that before you get him to sign on the dotted line.
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Totally agree with you. But with the amnesty do-over maybe some GMs are willing to gamble like this?
 
Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

Duckhook said:
Totally agree with you. But with the amnesty do-over maybe some GMs are willing to gamble like this?
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You can amnesty contracts that were signed during the old CBA. Any new deals this year do not qualify for amnesty. Unless you're talking about amnestying old contracts so they can sign new bad ones.
 
Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

ironcrotch said:
You can amnesty contracts that were signed during the old CBA. Any new deals this year do not qualify for amnesty. Unless you're talking about amnestying old contracts so they can sign new bad ones.
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Nope, I was uninformed on old verses new amnesties. Thanks IC.
 
Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

I just think there's a greater chance that a GM lives to regret signing Batum to this deal, rather than Nic actually living up to it.
 
Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

Duckhook said:
I think the conventional wisdom about not paying Batum on potential is that he was never used the right way in Portland (See Jermaine Oneal). In another situation he'd thrive and earn the $11-$12 mil that's being thrown around. Apparently other teams see this potential and are willing to invest to see it... maybe.
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So that's why Batum averaged 7ppg with Steve Nash guarding him in the playoffs? I remember it totally differently from you; the coaches begged Batum to be aggressive and attack but he was playing passive and timid.

The job of a coach is to get the TEAM to maximize their output, not maximize the output of one individual player. If a player can't excel for the good of the team he's a role playing specialist.
 
Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

Draco said:
So that's why Batum averaged 7ppg with Steve Nash guarding him in the playoffs?

The job of a coach is to get the TEAM to maximize their output, not maximize the output of one individual player. If a player can't excel for the good of the team he's a role playing specialist.
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That was so painful to watch.
 
Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

That series was ugly! Nate tried to isolate Nic on Nash but the spacing was atrocious.

I wont miss Nate-ball.
 
Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

Draco said:
So that's why Batum averaged 7ppg with Steve Nash guarding him in the playoffs? I remember it totally differently from you; the coaches begged Batum to be aggressive and attack but he was playing passive and timid.

The job of a coach is to get the TEAM to maximize their output, not maximize the output of one individual player. If a player can't excel for the good of the team he's a role playing specialist.
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And that's why it's all bullshit and Nic is just making excuses. The only thing McMillan did which I would consider stupid was limiting his minutes and messing with his rhythm. I highly doubt that he forced Nic to play passive basketball or camp out on the perimeter.
 
Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

VanillaGorilla said:
Honestly, I don't have much faith that Batum could have posted up on Nash any better last season.
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Fair enough.

What's interesting to me is that some consider the $11mil an investment in potential improvement, when Nic's value now based on consistent, never improving behavior, is $11mil according to Wages of Wins. Even playing the same Nic more minutes ups that value.

I'm all for getting a deal, and we've been successful with LMA on that front. I'm also fine with investing in potential improvement (again, LMA proved us right in the investment so far). I look at LMA when he was 23 and think back to the folks who thought he'd never toughen up or work down low, that he's just a rich man's Channing Frye. Improvement between the ages of 23 and 26 seems almost inevitiable in people who show initial talent.

So I just don't see how you don't give Nic a chance. If I'm Minny, I'd much rather sign Nic over Roy... that Roy signing seems too sentimental and risky to me.
 
Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

I come in peace.

Apparently it's being reported the Wolves are finalizing a trade for Kyle Korver, but at the same time a good friend of Korver's told me that Korver's agent has been told he'll end up in LA or Portland.

Sounds like part of a three team trade, or at the very least an attempt for the Wolves to clear more cap space because Korver's only guaranteed 500k next year.
 
Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

john2jer said:
I come in peace.

Apparently it's being reported the Wolves are finalizing a trade for Kyle Korver, but at the same time a good friend of Korver's told me that Korver's agent has been told he'll end up in LA or Portland.

Sounds like part of a three team trade, or at the very least an attempt for the Wolves to clear more cap space because Korver's only guaranteed 500k next year.
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A trade is the best case for all involved.
 
Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

john2jer said:
I come in peace.

Apparently it's being reported the Wolves are finalizing a trade for Kyle Korver, but at the same time a good friend of Korver's told me that Korver's agent has been told he'll end up in LA or Portland.

Sounds like part of a three team trade, or at the very least an attempt for the Wolves to clear more cap space because Korver's only guaranteed 500k next year.
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Could be? It will be fun to see what happens. Either way I hope Batum ends up out of Portland if he truly would rather be somewhere else.
 
Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

Mediocre Man said:
Could be? It will be fun to see what happens. Either way I hope Batum ends up out of Portland if he truly would rather be somewhere else.
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And no one believes you know a good friend of Korver's BTW
 
Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

Mediocre Man said:
And no one believes you know a good friend of Korver's BTW
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Believe me, I have zero interest in trying to impress anyone here or anywhere else on the internet. Don't care what you believe. Just kicking a little information down the line.
 
Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

john2jer said:
I come in peace.

Apparently it's being reported the Wolves are finalizing a trade for Kyle Korver, but at the same time a good friend of Korver's told me that Korver's agent has been told he'll end up in LA or Portland.

Sounds like part of a three team trade, or at the very least an attempt for the Wolves to clear more cap space because Korver's only guaranteed 500k next year.
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Five team trade. Lakers end up with Korver, MN gets Batum, Orlando gets Bynum, Chicago gets Martell, and Portland gets Dwight Howard. Seems fair.

barfo
 
Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

3RA1N1AC said:
wages of wins

i have been following this for years
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I'm sorry, but I can't find Batum on that page. Where does it say he's worth $11m? He produced the 86th-most wins in 2011, and it seems unlikely that the NBA would have 86 players all making $11m+ a year, and even less so that players like Tony Allen, Ed Davis, Josh McRoberts and Dorell Wright (all ahead of him on the list) would be.

I might be missing something, of course. Please help me understand :)

Ed O.
 
Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

john2jer said:
Believe me, I have zero interest in trying to impress anyone here or anywhere else on the internet. Don't care what you believe. Just kicking a little information down the line.
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Coming from you, via Minnesota, that would be up the line when referring to Portland
 
Re: Minnesota: full of shit?

Ed O said:
I'm sorry, but I can't find Batum on that page. Where does it say he's worth $11m? He produced the 86th-most wins in 2011, and it seems unlikely that the NBA would have 86 players all making $11m+ a year, and even less so that players like Tony Allen, Ed Davis, Josh McRoberts and Dorell Wright (all ahead of him on the list) would be.

I might be missing something, of course. Please help me understand :)

Ed O.
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http://wagesofwins.com/2012/07/06/the-2012-nba-free-agency-cheat-sheet/

Nic is between Camby and Duncan.

The value is more based on WS/48 than total WS's.
 
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