Next bargain-bin player?

[Wizard Mentor]

Did Miami have "luck", or did they draft and develop some useful players while the Blazers were farting around with guys like Simons, Swanigan, Zach, etc?

So, the Heat have been farting around for many years, and now they decided to develop some useful players? What a bunch of idiots, they should have just done that years ago....

 

[wizenheimer]

So, the Heat have been farting around for many years, and now they decided to develop some useful players? What a bunch of idiots, they should have just done that years ago....

of course, they are idiots enough to have won 3 championships in the last 14 years...the same number as Golden State. They have also appeared in the finals 5 times in that span and might show up a 6th time this year

 

[RR7]

of course, they are idiots enough to have won 3 championships in the last 14 years...the same number as Golden State. They have also appeared in the finals 5 times in that span and might show up a 6th time this year

Yeah, and those title appearances were all because of solid drafting and development right. Come on, youre better than that.

 

[wizenheimer]

Yeah, and those title appearances were all because of solid drafting and development right. Come on, youre better than that.

ok then...maybe I missed the thread within the thread...sorry

they did draft DWade but like Dame, he didn't need to have much development

 

[TBpup]

Who will be this year's Anthony Tolliver or Mario Hezonja? That is grounds for firing right there that Olshey thought those two would help this team take the next step from a winless WCF appearence. Seriously? That was the thinking? Simons as the backup PG?

Neil has shown the ability to find servicable players later in the 1st round or in the 2nd, but none of them have been THAT big of a deal and the choices made with earlier 1st round picks has been hit-or-miss at best. This roster needs a serious upgrade or re-do. Otherwise, it will just be more of the same mediocrity that we've seen for the vast majority of Dame's time here.

Bargin Bin isn't going to fix a damned thing.

I get that some of the moves were out of pure necessity. Whiteside because Nurkic was going to be out. Melo because almost anyone playing the 3/4 was out. But those were survival moves, not moves that would make this team better. Melo, for all his inefficient shooting which once in a while nets a big shot, is a HORRIBLE/TURBLE defender and Whiteside (while a shot blocker) is useless outside of the circle.

It is a wing league but Olshey keeps going small or inept. Stop wasting Dame's prime and step it up.

 

[Hoopguru]

Meyers Leonard will be back as Whiteside sign with Lakers.

You can take Meyers out of the blazers but you cant take they blazers out of Meyers.
He'll be back.....

 

[Sheldon Shape]

Who will be this year's Anthony Tolliver or Mario Hezonja? That is grounds for firing right there that Olshey thought those two would help this team take the next step from a winless WCF appearence. Seriously? That was the thinking? Simons as the backup PG?

Neil has shown the ability to find servicable players later in the 1st round or in the 2nd, but none of them have been THAT big of a deal and the choices made with earlier 1st round picks has been hit-or-miss at best. This roster needs a serious upgrade or re-do. Otherwise, it will just be more of the same mediocrity that we've seen for the vast majority of Dame's time here.

Bargin Bin isn't going to fix a damned thing.

I get that some of the moves were out of pure necessity. Whiteside because Nurkic was going to be out. Melo because almost anyone playing the 3/4 was out. But those were survival moves, not moves that would make this team better. Melo, for all his inefficient shooting which once in a while nets a big shot, is a HORRIBLE/TURBLE defender and Whiteside (while a shot blocker) is useless outside of the circle.

It is a wing league but Olshey keeps going small or inept. Stop wasting Dame's prime and step it up.

Those guys were acquired to fill out the end of the bench. Unfortunately we have a coach who would rather play below mediocre veterans than rookies who can offer something. If it wasn't for Ariza not playing we would have never gotten Trent Jr. Nassir Little and Wenyen Gabriel were losing minutes to Tolliver and Mario the whole season.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

Those guys were acquired to fill out the end of the bench. Unfortunately we have a coach who would rather play below mediocre veterans than rookies who can offer something. If it wasn't for Ariza not playing we would have never gotten Trent Jr. Nassir Little and Wenyen Gabriel were losing minutes to Tolliver and Mario the whole season.

Wenyen Gabriel is a prime example of a bargain bin player.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

Who will be this year's Anthony Tolliver or Mario Hezonja? That is grounds for firing right there that Olshey thought those two would help this team take the next step from a winless WCF appearence. Seriously? That was the thinking? Simons as the backup PG?

Neil has shown the ability to find servicable players later in the 1st round or in the 2nd, but none of them have been THAT big of a deal and the choices made with earlier 1st round picks has been hit-or-miss at best. This roster needs a serious upgrade or re-do. Otherwise, it will just be more of the same mediocrity that we've seen for the vast majority of Dame's time here.

Bargin Bin isn't going to fix a damned thing.

I get that some of the moves were out of pure necessity. Whiteside because Nurkic was going to be out. Melo because almost anyone playing the 3/4 was out. But those were survival moves, not moves that would make this team better. Melo, for all his inefficient shooting which once in a while nets a big shot, is a HORRIBLE/TURBLE defender and Whiteside (while a shot blocker) is useless outside of the circle.

It is a wing league but Olshey keeps going small or inept. Stop wasting Dame's prime and step it up.

So... "some bargain players are bad so never get bargain players"?

 

[Buffalo Custard]

So... "some bargain players are bad so never RELY ON bargain players"?

FIFY

 

[Rastapopoulos]

FIFY

Fucked it up For Me?

1. The second half STILL doesn't follow from the first half
2. This thread is about acquiring bargain players. That has nothing to do with RELYING on them

 

[lawai'a]

don't forget we offered demarcus cousins a contract while he was injured, before we signed nurk extension, and IIRC the number was around $5 mill. cousins played a lot of 4 for sacramento the last year there. he was taking 5-6 3pt attempts per game and making them above league average. last couple seasons with SAC kings he played quite a bit at the 4. as i mentioned before in a post he looks like a potential reclamation project on the relative cheap. maybe BAE or less cheap. still rehabbing acl, achilles good to go and then some. kind of a miss leading lead in cause they never talk to boogie in the video

Demarcus Cousins's Opens up About Return and the NBA Bubble
https://www.si.com/nba/video/2020/08/07/demarcus-cousins-return-and-th-nba-bubble

DeMarcus Cousins was recently a member of the Los Angeles Lakers but what is the free-agent big man up to now as he fully recovers from an ACL injury? Sports Illustrated's Rohan Nadkarni got a chance to catch up with Boogie and shared what he learned with SI host Robin Lundberg
Once again a free agent, Cousins will likely have to latch on to another team 2020-21 on a one-year deal to re-establish himself as one of the league's best big men.

 

[tester551]

don't forget we offered demarcus cousins a contract while he was injured, before we signed nurk extension, and IIRC the number was around $5 mill. cousins played a lot of 4 for sacramento the last year there. he was taking 5-6 3pt attempts per game and making them above league average. last couple seasons with SAC kings he played quite a bit at the 4. as i mentioned before in a post he looks like a potential reclamation project on the relative cheap. maybe BAE or less cheap. still rehabbing acl, achilles good to go and then some. kind of a miss leading lead in cause they never talk to boogie in the video

Demarcus Cousins's Opens up About Return and the NBA Bubble
https://www.si.com/nba/video/2020/08/07/demarcus-cousins-return-and-th-nba-bubble

DeMarcus Cousins was recently a member of the Los Angeles Lakers but what is the free-agent big man up to now as he fully recovers from an ACL injury? Sports Illustrated's Rohan Nadkarni got a chance to catch up with Boogie and shared what he learned with SI host Robin Lundberg
Once again a free agent, Cousins will likely have to latch on to another team 2020-21 on a one-year deal to re-establish himself as one of the league's best big men.

He would be my #1 FA target. Given his injury concerns, I wouldn't offer him more than the BAE.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

He would be my #1 FA target. Given his injury concerns, I wouldn't offer him more than the BAE.

Not to be a Debby Downer, but
a) Do players like that have a place in the New NBA (especially if he's even slower and ground-bound post-injury)?
b) As a free agent wishing to prove yourself, would you choose a middle-of-the-pack team with a guy who is certain to start ahead of you and take most of what Center minutes there are?

 

[Rastapopoulos]

Bargin Bin isn't going to fix a damned thing.

Bet the other East teams wish the Heat had thought that before they got all those good cheap players. (Ditto the Raptors.)

 

[lawai'a]

Not to be a Debby Downer, but
a) Do players like that have a place in the New NBA (especially if he's even slower and ground-bound post-injury)?
b) As a free agent wishing to prove yourself, would you choose a middle-of-the-pack team with a guy who is certain to start ahead of you and take most of what Center minutes there are?

he was definetly a stretch 5 pre injury- 2 years before injury he shot 36.1% & 35.4% on 5-6 atts.. also avg 4.6 & 5.4 assists those seasons. 1 1/2 blocks and steals too. bet houston's new coach would be happy to have him on that roster. he is 2 years removed from the Achilles. and over a year since acl.

 

[TBpup]

Bet the other East teams wish the Heat had thought that before they got all those good cheap players. (Ditto the Raptors.)

So with that being the case, then ours are just that bad.....or the other possibility is, Butler is just that better than Dame? I'm not saying that but I mean think about it. Dame has CJ and Nurk. Not many Blazer fans would trade either of those two for anyone on the Heat roster other than Butler....and Butler is their Dame so you take him out of the equation.

 

[tester551]

Not to be a Debby Downer, but
a) Do players like that have a place in the New NBA (especially if he's even slower and ground-bound post-injury)?
b) As a free agent wishing to prove yourself, would you choose a middle-of-the-pack team with a guy who is certain to start ahead of you and take most of what Center minutes there are?

A) how is it any different than Nurk? You can afford to have 1 player on the floor like that.
B) Centers play ~24-28 mins a game. Plenty for 2 guys to split

 

[RR7]

A) how is it any different than Nurk? You can afford to have 1 player on the floor like that.
B) Centers play ~24-28 mins a game. Plenty for 2 guys to split

Do you mean 2 guys to split 28 minutes?

 

[tester551]

Do you mean 2 guys to split 28 minutes?

No. Games are 48 mins. Having 2 guys split time, each would average ~24 mins

 

[PtldPlatypus]

So with that being the case, then ours are just that bad.....or the other possibility is, Butler is just that better than Dame? I'm not saying that but I mean think about it. Dame has CJ and Nurk. Not many Blazer fans would trade either of those two for anyone on the Heat roster other than Butler....and Butler is their Dame so you take him out of the equation.

Dragic/Bam are arguably better than CJ/Nurk.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

A) how is it any different than Nurk? You can afford to have 1 player on the floor like that.

...and we already have Nurk.

B) Centers play ~24-28 mins a game. Plenty for 2 guys to split

But this assumes that you want a big lumbering center on the court for the full 48 minutes, and I doubt ANY team does that. When Nurk sits, it's time to go small or at least nimble.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

So with that being the case, then ours are just that bad.....

Trent is the envy of most of the league.
[Edit: I guess he doesn't really count, since we drafted him. All right, we got Nurk by a process of acquiring bargain bin players and flipping them.]

 

[TBpup]

Dragic/Bam are arguably better than CJ/Nurk.

If that is the case, then we are WAY overpaying. CJ makes 50% more than Dragic and Bam makes about 1/4 of what Nurkic gets....and Nurk is supposedly on a 'friendly' salary. Also, if that is the case, why are SO MANY Portland fans against moving either of those two?

 

[PtldPlatypus]

If that is the case, then we are WAY overpaying. CJ makes 50% more than Dragic and Bam makes about 1/4 of what Nurkic gets....and Nurk is supposedly on a 'friendly' salary. Also, if that is the case, why are SO MANY Portland fans against moving either of those two?

Bam's still on his rookie deal, so you can't really count that. You know he'll get max once eligible to do so.

I think most around here agree that CJ is overpaid.

 

[TBpup]

Bam's still on his rookie deal, so you can't really count that. You know he'll get max once eligible to do so.

I think most around here agree that CJ is overpaid.

Of course Bam is on a rookie deal. So Olshey needs to Draft better. He traded to picks to take Collins 3 slots ahead of Bam. That Draft was brutal for Olshey in terms of opportunities missed. It's probably why I was never on board with CJ. We already had a smallish scoring lead guard. D69 was ADAMANT that Giannis would be a Top-3 player or better out of that Draft for months before the selections. We needed balance, not duplication.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

Of course Bam is on a rookie deal. So Olshey needs to Draft better. He traded to picks to take Collins 3 slots ahead of Bam. That Draft was brutal for Olshey in terms of opportunities missed. It's probably why I was never on board with CJ. We already had a smallish scoring lead guard. D69 was ADAMANT that Giannis would be a Top-3 player or better out of that Draft for months before the selections. We needed balance, not duplication.

We seem to have strayed off course from the original (dubious) "Is Butler better than Dame based on accomplishing more with a lesser supporting cast" question...

 

[wizenheimer]

We seem to have strayed off course from the original (dubious) "Is Butler better than Dame based on accomplishing more with a lesser supporting cast" question...

they are both elite, but Dame is better than Butler, IMO, but that could be my Blazer bias talking

however, Butler is an elite two-way wing, and he's elite on both ends of the floor. Arguably, that may represent more generic value than a 6'2 PG

clearly though, when it comes to qualities of leadership and loyalty, Dame has a big edge. That has value too

 

[Buffalo Custard]

they are both elite, but Dame is better than Butler, IMO, but that could be my Blazer bias talking

however, Butler is an elite two-way wing, and he's elite on both ends of the floor. Arguably, that may represent more generic value than a 6'2 PG

clearly though, when it comes to qualities of leadership and loyalty, Dame has a big edge. That has value too

With Butler's antics it is easy to forget he is older than Dame and has been in the league longer. Not a huge difference, but still surprising given how much less mature he sometimes appears to be.

 

[blazerkor]

Dragic/Bam are arguably better than CJ/Nurk.

I like Nurk a lot but you're probably right that Bam is going to be better going forward but they are different types of players. If we got to the finals against the Heat and they were matching Bam up against Nurk, I'd take Nurk all day. I realize it's not as simple as a one on one match up because Bam does so much all over the place but Bam's shot is way worse than Nurk's and what Bam has in athleticism Nurk has in size.

As far as Dragic and CJ go, I think CJ is the superior player now, is like 5 years younger and both guys next to Dame would be the same kind of nightmare.