Nocioni and Hughes?

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Netted

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Thought about this trade in the Josh Smith thread and thought it deserved it's own discussion.

The Nets can trade Swift, KVH and Simmons to Chicago for Nocioni and Hughes (Hughes expires in 2010). Chicago saves $4.2mm this season, $10.6mm next season and $28.3mm over the next 4 years. Gives them room to sign Deng and possibly Gordon. And it can be done now if they do 2 simultaneous trades: Swift and KVH for Hughes and Simmons for Nocioni. No need to wait the 60 days with Simmons. That trade adds experience, defense and gives a clearer picture at SF.

Harris/Dooling
Carter/Hughes/Hayes
Nocioni/CDR/Hassell
Yi/Najera/Anderson
Boone/Lopez/Williams

Gives us legit depth should Carter get injured for any amount of time. Cut Ager and pick-up a 3rd pg.

**Before anyone freaks out we will still have room for Lebron.**
 
As a Bulls fan, I would say this is an interesting and fair deal that I would go for.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Netted @ Jul 24 2008, 11:18 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Thought about this trade in the Josh Smith thread and thought it deserved it's own discussion.

The Nets can trade Swift, KVH and Simmons to Chicago for Nocioni and Hughes (Hughes expires in 2010). Chicago saves $4.2mm this season, $10.6mm next season and $28.3mm over the next 4 years. Gives them room to sign Deng and possibly Gordon. And it can be done now if they do 2 simultaneous trades: Swift and KVH for Hughes and Simmons for Nocioni. No need to wait the 60 days with Simmons. That trade adds experience, defense and gives a clearer picture at SF.

Harris/Dooling
Carter/Hughes/Hayes
Nocioni/CDR/Hassell
Yi/Najera/Anderson
Boone/Lopez/Williams

Gives us legit depth should Carter get injured for any amount of time. Cut Ager and pick-up a 3rd pg.

**Before anyone freaks out we will still have room for Lebron.**</div>

I think this is a fantastic deal and very fair for both sides. If i were the Bulls, I'd get rid of Hughes in a hearbeat to clear playing time for Thabo, Hinrich, Rose, maybe Gordon, Deng, etc. Nocioni is a loss but I think for the Bulls, he's kind of expendable. You also get Swift and KVH's contracts coming off the books, Swift playing for the last contract of his career, and Simmons who can somewhat shoot when healthy and looking to prove himself.

For the Nets, Nocioni at the three is legit, in my eyes, because he's a solid defender, albeit a lil slow on the perimeter, but he's a grinder ala Najera, plays very hard, and can hit the occasional three. Hughes would also be a SOLID guy off the bench, when healthy..... that is.. when he's healthy at least.

AND I REITERATE, We will STILL have cap room in 2010. This would be a FANTASTIC move.. maybe we could throw Ager or Hassell in there, PLEASE GET RID OF THESE BUMS.
 
I think you overestimate Nocioni's ability. He suffered from plantar fasciitis two seasons ago, and he's not been the same player since he's come back, IMO. His offense has become far more 3pt oriented, where he used to mix in quite a few slashing type drives; he's still good around the basket tho. His defense is funny to watch; one game he tried to guard LeBron, got up into his grill, and LeBron went around him like he wasn't there. Maybe not fair to Noc, but I don't think it takes a guy of LeBron's caliber to go around him like he wasn't there...

He actually had his best success playing PF for us in our smallball lineups under Skiles.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Denny Crane @ Jul 24 2008, 11:37 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I think you overestimate Nocioni's ability. He suffered from plantar fasciitis two seasons ago, and he's not been the same player since he's come back, IMO. His offense has become far more 3pt oriented, where he used to mix in quite a few slashing type drives; he's still good around the basket tho. His defense is funny to watch; one game he tried to guard LeBron, got up into his grill, and LeBron went around him like he wasn't there. Maybe not fair to Noc, but I don't think it takes a guy of LeBron's caliber to go around him like he wasn't there...

He actually had his best success playing PF for us in our smallball lineups <u>under Skiles</u>.</div>
The bolded portion could be one of the problems with his game recently. The guy is pretty solid and with this drive and kick offense the Nets are implimenting I can see his 3pt shooting being effective.
 
Harris, Dooling, Hughes, Nocioni, Hassell and Najera (and possibly Julius Hodge).

replacing

Kidd, Marcus Williams, Nachbar, Malik Allen, Wright, and RJ.


That's six (or seven) plus defensive players in for five huge liabilities and a scrub.

Since I want the Nets to make the playoffs, I say go for it, but a lot of folks think they would be better off losing games this year.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ghoti @ Jul 24 2008, 11:47 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Harris, Dooling, Hughes, Nocioni, Hassell and Najera (and possibly Julius Hodge).

replacing

Kidd, Marcus Williams, Nachbar, Malik Allen, Wright, and RJ.


That's six (or seven) plus defensive players in for five huge liabilities and a scrub.

Since I want the Nets to make the playoffs, I say go for it, but a lot of folks think they would be better off losing games this year.</div>
Would be a hell of a change, wouldn't it?
 
id still take josh smith over hughes and non
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Netted @ Jul 24 2008, 11:57 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (ghoti @ Jul 24 2008, 11:47 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Harris, Dooling, Hughes, Nocioni, Hassell and Najera (and possibly Julius Hodge).

replacing

Kidd, Marcus Williams, Nachbar, Malik Allen, Wright, and RJ.


That's six (or seven) plus defensive players in for five huge liabilities and a scrub.

Since I want the Nets to make the playoffs, I say go for it, but a lot of folks think they would be better off losing games this year.</div>
Would be a hell of a change, wouldn't it?
</div>

And it's not like that bottom group is that far ahead offensively, either.
 
Hmm. I wouldn't be unhappy with this one, but I would prefer to see what Bobby Simmons has left.

The optimistic view is that he was still recovering from the major foot surgery last year, was playing for a bad coach that he disliked, couldn't get the PT to find his rhythm early and only really started to come around late in the year. He did have a fantastic April, and (per NI) a major Milwaukee blogger felt Simmons started showing signs of physical improvement (quickness, I presume) late in the season. Simmons said in his press conference that he began working to recapture his prior form immediately after the season ended (well before he realized he would be traded, obviously). That's the kind of work ethic that makes you think he might actually be ABLE to recapture his form.

At the very least, he will be a decent open shooter, better than RJ in that respect. So he can help balance the floor offensively, if nothing else.

The other factor is that he is already well acquainted with Yi and can therefore increase his sense of familiarity and comfort when he arrives at camp. That's in everyone's best interests.
 
If this trade happened, I'd use Noc off the bench. I don't consider Noc as capable of being a full time starter at SF. At his best, he is a 25 MPG combo forward off the bench with spot starts. Start Hughes at SG and slide Vince over to SF.

The trade(s) is certainly a win for the Nets on talent as they give up 2 players only valuable for their contract and a question mark of health for 1 player of value and lesser question mark of health.

Now lets look at the rotation (with estimated minutes).

Starters: Harris (35), Hughes (28), Vince (37), Yi (25) & Boone (25) - Hughes provides another ball handler and someone that can alternate with Harris and Vince at initiating the offense. Floor spacing is likely to be an issue in a half court set.

Minutes check: 240 - 150 = 90

Significant Bench Players: Dooling (20), Nocioni (25), Najera (20), Hayes & Lopez

Minutes check: 90 - 65 = 25

Players fighting for crumbs: Williams, Anderson, CDR, Hassell & Ager/Hodge

The player this hurts the most from a development standpoint is Sean Williams. Anderson will still see the floor because of his shooting
 
I like this trade... But I would prefer to have Josh Smith more if possible.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (cpawfan @ Jul 24 2008, 09:32 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>If this trade happened, I'd use Noc off the bench. I don't consider Noc as capable of being a full time starter at SF. At his best, he is a 25 MPG combo forward off the bench with spot starts. Start Hughes at SG and slide Vince over to SF.

The trade(s) is certainly a win for the Nets on talent as they give up 2 players only valuable for their contract and a question mark of health for 1 player of value and lesser question mark of health.

Now lets look at the rotation (with estimated minutes).

Starters: Harris (35), Hughes (28), Vince (37), Yi (25) & Boone (25) - Hughes provides another ball handler and someone that can alternate with Harris and Vince at initiating the offense. Floor spacing is likely to be an issue in a half court set.

Minutes check: 240 - 150 = 90

Significant Bench Players: Dooling (20), Nocioni (25), Najera (20), Hayes & Lopez

Minutes check: 90 - 65 = 25

Players fighting for crumbs: Williams, Anderson, CDR, Hassell & Ager/Hodge

The player this hurts the most from a development standpoint is Sean Williams. Anderson will still see the floor because of his shooting</div>

Boone (20)
Lopez (15)
Yi (28)
Vince (35)
Nocioni (27)
Hughes (30)
Najera (18)

are the only changes I would make.
 
Nice proposal Netted, this is a pretty fair trade for both sides. I like it because I think we need a guy like Hughes more than we would Simmons because of Hughes being a better passer and defender (albeit a gambling one) plus we get Noc. This downside though is the impact it could have on CDR's minutes with vets like Dooling, Hayes, and now Larry in front of him. But overall it's def an upgrade for NJ and gives us even more assets to play with because while expiring contracts do have their worth, good role players are better trade chips in my opinion. Especially with a growing number of teams with expendable young talent that are looking for vets to help complete their championship puzzles to try and capitalize on their windows of opportunity.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (reganomics813 @ Jul 24 2008, 12:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Nice proposal Netted, this is a pretty fair trade for both sides. I like it because I think we need a guy like Hughes more than we would Simmons because of Hughes being a better passer and defender (albeit a gambling one) plus we get Noc. This downside though is the impact it could have on CDR's minutes with vets like Dooling, Hayes, and now Larry in front of him. But overall it's def an upgrade for NJ and gives us even more assets to play with because while expiring contracts do have their worth, good role players are better trade chips in my opinion. Especially with a growing number of teams with expendable young talent that are looking for vets to help complete their championship puzzles to try and capitalize on their windows of opportunity.</div>
Thanks. My biggest concern is that we have players like Hayes, Simmons, Hassell and even CDR who are more SFs then SGs. I'm not sure they have the speed or lateral quickness to defend 2 guards. If Carter gets hurt we maybe forced to start Dooling at the 2. Hughes alleviates that issue. Plus, like you said he's another player that can initate offense.

The line-up Cpaw mentions works well. Lots of possibilities. But I too share his concern about Sean not getting minutes, but I really don't see this trade impacting him. This trade impacts the 2/3 positions. May need another trade to alleviate the log jam up front. Boone, Yi, Lopez, Anderson and Najera are the ones that are mostly eating into his minutes. He doesn't bring anything to the table that warrants minutes ahead of those guys. Yi and Anderson bring a jumpshot. Lopez brings a post game and Najera brings a hustle and BBall IQ that Sean lacks. Boone's a proven commodity that plays within himself and is good in pick n' roll. It's tough upfront. Sean only brings athleticism and shot blocking.
 
Another possibilty is to send Sean to the D-League. The guy hasn't played a ton of organized bball during his life and getting a lot of minutes on the court is the best thing for him. Only then will the Nets really know what they have. Or if they already think they know maybe they should trade him for a player like Lowry and a pick before the "potential" tag wears off and his value drops.
 
I just was thinking and I realized this is a bad trade for the Nets. First off Larry Hughes is just a horrible shooter. He can't make a shot any more and his shooting percentage is just declining to the point that you can't like the guy. Any fan who has recently had Larry on their hates him due to the fact he takes so many shots but misses most of them. His shooting secelection is very poor. I typed his name in google and the third site that game up was a fan site dedicated to make Larry stop taking so many bad shots.

Nocioni is a solid player. But last year he played 82 games and only averaged 13 pts and 4 rebs a game. I know Simmons is not the player he once was but don't try to tell me Simmons can't put up the exact same numbers if not better. Also taking Nocioni's contract is not what we want to do. Keep Simmons who has 2 years left and they'll produce about the same.

I know you want to dump Stromile and KVH but cmon taking Hughes back will just kill us. I'd rather see C-D-R shoot at a .360 clip than Hughes. Trust me we do not want Hughes, hes washed up.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kk30 @ Jul 24 2008, 01:26 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I just was thinking and I realized this is a bad trade for the Nets. First off Larry Hughes is just a horrible shooter. He can't make a shot any more and his shooting percentage is just declining to the point that you can't like the guy. Any fan who has recently had Larry on their hates him due to the fact he takes so many shots but misses most of them. His shooting secelection is very poor. I typed his name in google and the third site that game up was a fan site dedicated to make Larry stop taking so many bad shots.

Nocioni is a good solid player. But last year he played 82 games and only averaged 13 pts and 4 rebs a game. I know Simmons is not the player he once was but don't try to tell me Simmons can't put up the exact same numbers if not better. Also taking Nocioni's contract is not what we want to do. Keep Simmons who has 2 years left and they'll produce about the same.

I know you want to dump Stromile and KVH but cmon taking Hughes back will just kill us. I'd rather see C-D-R shoot at a .360 clip than Hughes. Trust me we do not want Hughes, hes washed up.</div>
You are looking at just the offensive stats. Those 2 guys bring a ton of defense to the team. Depending on the roll that is required of them they can be very effective.

Also, RJ (16) and Nachbar (8) combined for 24 shots per game last season. Nocioni (10.7) and Hughes (11.5) combined for 22 shots per game with the Bulls. Plenty of shots to go around.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Netted @ Jul 24 2008, 01:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kk30 @ Jul 24 2008, 01:26 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I just was thinking and I realized this is a bad trade for the Nets. First off Larry Hughes is just a horrible shooter. He can't make a shot any more and his shooting percentage is just declining to the point that you can't like the guy. Any fan who has recently had Larry on their hates him due to the fact he takes so many shots but misses most of them. His shooting secelection is very poor. I typed his name in google and the third site that game up was a fan site dedicated to make Larry stop taking so many bad shots.

Nocioni is a good solid player. But last year he played 82 games and only averaged 13 pts and 4 rebs a game. I know Simmons is not the player he once was but don't try to tell me Simmons can't put up the exact same numbers if not better. Also taking Nocioni's contract is not what we want to do. Keep Simmons who has 2 years left and they'll produce about the same.

I know you want to dump Stromile and KVH but cmon taking Hughes back will just kill us. I'd rather see C-D-R shoot at a .360 clip than Hughes. Trust me we do not want Hughes, hes washed up.</div>
You are looking at just the offensive stats. Those 2 guys bring a ton of defense to the team. Depending on the roll that is required of them they can be very effective.
</div>

I am looking at offesnive stats because at this point because the league average in scoring is about 100 pts a game. The Nets have picked up a few good defensive pieces but at this point they need offense more than anything else. Vince Carter is already decling and he will see a ton of double teams. For us to average 100 pts we need Vince to score 25 a game because I don't see where the help will come from. Getting Nocioni and Hughes is a move to win now. It is a move to get us in the playoffs this year. But those 2 guys don't help that much more than Simmons will help. Simmons and Nocioni are about the same defensively IMO and Hughes is a good defender but he hurts you too much on offense. Hughes also hurts us if we want a FA in 2009. Cmon I really don't want Hughes on the team because if you guys watched him play your'll know why. you guys are still thinking back to his last season with washington. Hes not that guy anymore.

I also don't want to hear any B.S about veteran Leadership or helping the young kids. What did Kidd ever teach Marcus? Wasn't Marcus supposed to learn under Kidd- never happened. Veterans still want to play and see the court. They don't want kids taking their playing time away.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kk30 @ Jul 24 2008, 01:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I am looking at offesnive stats because at this point because the league average in scoring is about 100 pts a game. The Nets have picked up a few good defensive pieces but at this point they need offense more than anything else. Vince Carter is already decling and he will see a ton of double teams. For us to average 100 pts we need Vince to score 25 a game because I don't see where the help will come from. Getting Nocioni and Hughes is a move to win now. It is a move to get us in the playoffs this year. But those 2 guys don't help that much more than Simmons will help. Simmons and Nocioni are about the same defensively IMO and Hughes is a good defender but he hurts you too much on offense. Hughes also hurts us if we want a FA in 2009. Cmon I really don't want Hughes on the team because if you guys watched him play your'll know why. you guys are still thinking back to his last season with washington. Hes not that guy anymore.</div>
All the more reason you need players like Hughes and Noc over Simmons and “?. Have you watched Hughes? You Googled him! They are way better defensively and offensively. Simmons and Nocioni are not the same. And we aren't going after anyone in 2009. It's all about 2010.

Besides if you have a suffocating defensive team you won't need to score as much. In the end defense still wins in this league. Look at Cletics, Spurs, and Pistons.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Netted @ Jul 24 2008, 01:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kk30 @ Jul 24 2008, 01:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I am looking at offesnive stats because at this point because the league average in scoring is about 100 pts a game. The Nets have picked up a few good defensive pieces but at this point they need offense more than anything else. Vince Carter is already decling and he will see a ton of double teams. For us to average 100 pts we need Vince to score 25 a game because I don't see where the help will come from. Getting Nocioni and Hughes is a move to win now. It is a move to get us in the playoffs this year. But those 2 guys don't help that much more than Simmons will help. Simmons and Nocioni are about the same defensively IMO and Hughes is a good defender but he hurts you too much on offense. Hughes also hurts us if we want a FA in 2009. Cmon I really don't want Hughes on the team because if you guys watched him play your'll know why. you guys are still thinking back to his last season with washington. Hes not that guy anymore.</div>
All the more reason you need players like Hughes and Noc over Simmons and ???. Have you even watched Hughes? You Googled him! They are way better defensively and offensively. Simmons and Nocioni are not the same. And we aren't going after anyone in 2009. It's all about 2010.

Besides if you have a suffocating defensive team you won't need to score as much. In the end defense still wins in this league. Look at Cletics, Spurs, and Pistons.
</div>

ya the celtics just played great TEAM defense vs the lakers... they threw so many combinations vs kobe... and we all have to admit kobe is the best player in the league rite now...

defense should always come first cuz offense will follow... offense wins games... defense wins championships!
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kk30 @ Jul 24 2008, 12:57 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Great Trade too bad your not a GM though.</div>

It's not far-fetched. The Nets have talked to the Bulls about Nocioni.
 
I really like the trade just what we need now to at least look a little competitive for whoever we get in 2010. The reason i don't know if the trade will work is Noccioni had 5 years left at 8 million a year and the Bulls may feel they are not getting enough in return besides the money they make. I would think we would have to throw in a little something extra like a draft pick or something
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (J Piz @ Jul 24 2008, 02:06 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I really like the trade just what we need now to at least look a little competitive for whoever we get in 2010. The reason i don't know if the trade will work is Noccioni had 5 years left at 8 million a year and the Bulls may feel they are not getting enough in return besides the money they make. I would think we would have to throw in a little something extra like a draft pick or something</div>
They need to shed Nocioni's salary to keep Deng. Denver gave away Camby to have that kind of flexibility. PLUS we are taking Hughes off their books!! That's the bonus for them.

The fact that Noc and Deng play the same position makes it rough for them. The money actually doubles if you factor saved luxury taxes.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Netted @ Jul 24 2008, 01:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kk30 @ Jul 24 2008, 01:41 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I am looking at offesnive stats because at this point because the league average in scoring is about 100 pts a game. The Nets have picked up a few good defensive pieces but at this point they need offense more than anything else. Vince Carter is already decling and he will see a ton of double teams. For us to average 100 pts we need Vince to score 25 a game because I don't see where the help will come from. Getting Nocioni and Hughes is a move to win now. It is a move to get us in the playoffs this year. But those 2 guys don't help that much more than Simmons will help. Simmons and Nocioni are about the same defensively IMO and Hughes is a good defender but he hurts you too much on offense. Hughes also hurts us if we want a FA in 2009. Cmon I really don't want Hughes on the team because if you guys watched him play your'll know why. you guys are still thinking back to his last season with washington. Hes not that guy anymore.</div>
All the more reason you need players like Hughes and Noc over Simmons and ?€œ?. Have you watched Hughes? You Googled him! They are way better defensively and offensively. Simmons and Nocioni are not the same. And we aren't going after anyone in 2009. It's all about 2010.

Besides if you have a suffocating defensive team you won't need to score as much. In the end defense still wins in this league. Look at Cletics, Spurs, and Pistons.
</div>

Celtics, Spurs and Pistons all put up a ton of points also but why wouldn't you want FAs in 2009. DO you honestly think you can get two big name free agents in 2010? I either want to win or rebuild. It's extremely hard to do both at the same time. If we get Hughes and NOcioni what makes you think that we'll a playoff team? They were both on the Bulls and they had a horrible season. Cleveland did much better once Hughes left. 2009 will porbably be just as big as an off season as this offseason. stop with the nonsens only 2010. Why are we making any moves this off season than? The Nets know taking Hughes and Nocioni are huge contracts that will not help them in the win total by maybe just a few games. If the Nets don't make the playoffs this year, they'll have little flexibility in trying to sign and trade for people if they wanted to make a run in 2009. I say take this year to rebuild and play the rookies a lot. 2009 should be a playoff year and 2010 should be very attractive for Lebron.

By the way if its all about 2010 why would you want Nocioni who plays the same postion as Lebron and will be making 8 mil. Do you really want an 8 mil bench player who would be getting up there in age.

And I have watched Hughes as Lebron has been televised quite a lot over the pass few years. Hughes is just a horrible basketball player offensively and you almost fell bad for Lebron watching those games where lebron has to go through triple teams to score while Hughes can't make and open 15 footer

It's not the worst trade you can make, but from a basketball standpoint it doesn't make sense, why take on two overpaid contract for the next few years when these players are older guys who are declining in basketball skills. If we were making a run at the playoffs and we needed one of them I'll say fine do it, but right now it makes us older and not really better
 
Hey Netted, come up with a trade for getting GINOBLI!
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (kk30 @ Jul 24 2008, 02:18 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Celtics, Spurs and Pistons all put up a ton of points also but why wouldn't you want FAs in 2009. DO you honestly think you can get two big name free agents in 2010? I either want to win or rebuild. It's extremely hard to do both at the same time. If we get Hughes and NOcioni what makes you think that we'll a playoff team? They were both on the Bulls and they had a horrible season. Cleveland did much better once Hughes left. 2009 will porbably be just as big as an off season as this offseason. stop with the nonsens only 2010. Why are we making any moves this off season than? The Nets know taking Hughes and Nocioni are huge contracts that will not help them in the win total by maybe just a few games. If the Nets don't make the playoffs this year, they'll have little flexibility in trying to sign and trade for people if they wanted to make a run in 2010. I say take this year to rebuild and play the rookies a lot. 2009 should be a playoff year and 2010 should be very attractive for Lebron.</div>
There won't be enough room to sign someone in 2009. All we'll have is the MLE. Yes, I definitely think we got a shot at one of them in 2010, but only if we are a winning team that is one player away (and the arena is on track).

And Noc will make $7mm in 2010 (it's a declining contract). Maybe he goes to Cleveland in a S&T? All you need is enough cap space to be a credible threat and you can force a S&T. At worse he's a great bench player behind Lebron. He'll be 31 then with 2 years left on his deal. Not bad.
 
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NOMAM @ Jul 24 2008, 02:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Hey Netted, come up with a trade for getting GINOBLI!</div>
Don't think the Spurs are in any rush to get rid of him.
 

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