Official 2013 Draft thread (2 Viewers)

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you don't think that either Kabongo or Wolters (or both?) will be there at 39?
 
BrianFromWA said:
you don't think that either Kabongo or Wolters (or both?) will be there at 39?
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I don't. Wolters looks like a first rounder to me and I think Myck will move up after workouts.
 
MickZagger said:
Dieng's alright. I'm just afraid he has no upside. With the 10th pick I'd rather go with a guy with more upside.
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The Dude likes guys with upside too, but I also like guys who can play. Players like Leonard who have all the upside in the world don't matter because they aren't very good to begin with. While guys like Lillard, who are older, might not have as much upside, but can already play. If the draft pick remains ours, I hope they take a player who can contribute now, and has a little upside still. Rather than a player who has this potential next to his name that is years away from helping
 
I've cooled on Zeller.

His McHale-esque footwork is neutralized on his level with his 8'9" reach. I didn't know until recently hat his reach is on par with SF's.

For bigs, their reach is the most important measurement.

Centers should at the very least be in the 9'0" range.
 
The Dude said:
The Dude likes guys with upside too, but I also like guys who can play. Players like Leonard who have all the upside in the world don't matter because they aren't very good to begin with. While guys like Lillard, who are older, might not have as much upside, but can already play. If the draft pick remains ours, I hope they take a player who can contribute now, and has a little upside still. Rather than a player who has this potential next to his name that is years away from helping
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Yeah, well, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man.

A pretty good one, actually.
 
JDC said:
Would love McCollum as he'd be a fun to watch with Lillard, but the fit isn't great. At this point, I'm alright with trading down for either Dieng or Adams and picking up some vet depth. Intrigued by the bucks 15th pick and would be fine with something like the 10th for their pick plus either Udoh or Ayon.

For second round guys I's like to see them package 39 and 40 for an early 2nd / late first and grab Myck Kabongo or Nate Wolters.

Trevor Mbakwe isn't even on DX 's latest mock draft, but I'd love to get him with the 45th.
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Do you really think we would get much trading down? My feeling is the most we would get is another 2nd round pick or maybe switching 2nd round spots. (Which isn't bad mind you if we really moved up to the top of the 2nd?)
I guess if they wanted to get rid of a player, but that would eat cap space.
 
Pinwheel1 said:
Do you really think we would get much trading down? My feeling is the most we would get is another 2nd round pick or maybe switching 2nd round spots. (Which isn't bad mind you if we really moved up to the top of the 2nd?)
I guess if they wanted to get rid of a player, but that would eat cap space.
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The have a lot of rotational bigs on their roster (sanders, henson, dalembert, udoh, mbah a moute, ayon) and they seem to like some guys at the top. I think they'd definitely do a trade like that if McCollum is there at 10. They are going to need a guard with potentially both Jennings and Ellis not being on the roster next year.
 
JDC said:
The have a lot of rotational bigs on their roster (sanders, henson, dalembert, udoh, mbah a moute, ayon) and they seem to like some guys at the top. I think they'd definitely do a trade like that if McCollum is there at 10. They are going to need a guard with potentially both Jennings and Ellis not being on the roster next year.
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I like and agree with your thinking and I believe Wes if from there correct? They could draft MCW with #10 as their PGOTF, unless they really like TreyBurke, all this depends on whether Jennings leaves and Monta opts out.
 
Boise Blazer said:
I dont know why but that made me wonder if the nba will ever have a player with a prosthetic limb?
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No.

Not unless they make significant improvements in making it more similar to a "human" limb. Otherwise, they would have no chance against the best athletes in the world.
 
Looks like Chad Ford has us taking Kentavious Caldwell-Pope in his Mock 2.0

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/draft2013/story/_/id/9252354/2013-nba-draft-chad-ford-mock-draft-20 (Insider Only)

Overall Rank 14
Position Rank 4
Hollinger PER 27.62
Projection Lottery Pick
Positives
Deadly shooter
Deep range
Quick release on his jump shot
Good athlete
Good passer
Excellent defender
Negatives
Needs to improve his ball handling
Needs to develop a midrange game
http://insider.espn.go.com/nbadraft/results/players/_/id/19705/kentavious-caldwell-pope
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I've never seen this kid play a minute. Anybody have an opinion worth sharing?
 
Scouts view on measurements - what is important by position:

SG/SF/PG: wingspan
PF/C: standing reach

Zeller's 8'9" reach is going to certainly hurt his effectiveness at the next level.
Bennett has a rumored reach that's near 9'0" -- he has that Faried-like freaky build.
 
Fez Hammersticks said:
Scouts view on measurements - what is important by position:

SG/SF/PG: wingspan
PF/C: standing reach

Zeller's 8'9" reach is going to certainly hurt his effectiveness at the next level.
Bennett has a rumored reach that's near 9'0" -- he has that Faried-like freaky build.
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Makes sense that he tested well in length. Just watching him play, for a guy that was listed at 6'7" out of high school, he definitely plays bigger. I mean, he held his own on the boards against UNC's size and length. For a guy who's major "weakness" is his size, that can be pretty telling.

I posted a thread a while back in OT about player's actual heights and weights compared to what the league lists them at, and I don't think a guy who's proven he can produce the way Bennett has should really be knocked for something like being "undersized."
 
Also, sort of irrelevant to the Blazers' draft, but I just watched a clip where Broussard and Bayless were picking their "worst #1 pick teams," and Skip Bayless pretty much had a whole team of centers. LaRue, Oden, Kwame, and Ellison. Broussard had Benson, Olowokandi, and Bargnani on his team. Neither team had Andrew Bogut, even though based on his draft position he could be considered a bust.

It just made me realize that, with the #1 pick, the pick that should be a sure-fire franchise changing pick, so many teams have fucked up by picking big men with potential.

I'm not 100% on Noel, would rather have Davis, and think a lot of Noel's projection is based on his Q-rating, but even with the history of big men projects being taken first overall, and more importantly, with the way the game is trending outside of the post, I'd be nervous taking him first overall.

Maybe there's some sort of comparison bias going on with Noel filling Davis' shoes, but let's be real, Davis was an elite college defender as a freshman, whereas Noel was just a good defender. Add that to the fact that his offensive game nowhere near Davis', who isn't even an offensive threat, and it sheds some light on how weak the top of this draft really is.

With that said, there are a lot of guys getting disrespected in this draft. I think that both Myck Kabongo and Seth Curry can become great pro's, but the top of this draft is shaping up to be the worst since 2000. I was high on Smart until he opted out, I'm still high on Oladipo, and I'm a fan of Burke's, but overall, this is a draft where the better value seems to be in a mid-first to early second round pick than a lottery pick.
 
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NOVoodoo said:
Makes sense that he tested well in length. Just watching him play, for a guy that was listed at 6'7" out of high school, he definitely plays bigger. I mean, he held his own on the boards against UNC's size and length. For a guy who's major "weakness" is his size, that can be pretty telling.

I posted a thread a while back in OT about player's actual heights and weights compared to what the league lists them at, and I don't think a guy who's proven he can produce the way Bennett has should really be knocked for something like being "undersized."
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It makes me wonder why Brand was always labeled "undersized" his entire career - his reach is identical to LMA's at 9'2".

DMC has the deadly combo of touch and reach: 9'5" - on par with Shaq.
 
Bogut is only a bust during the times he is hurt and can't step on the floor.
 
Looking at the draft from around 15 down I think Barton would easily be a first rounder this year.
 
NOVoodoo said:
Also, sort of irrelevant to the Blazers' draft, but I just watched a clip where Broussard and Bayless were picking their "worst #1 pick teams," and Skip Bayless pretty much had a whole team of centers. LaRue, Oden, Kwame, and Ellison. Broussard had Benson, Olowokandi, and Bargnani on his team. Neither team had Andrew Bogut, even though based on his draft position he could be considered a bust.
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Gotta agree with the guys above, I wouldn't label Bogut a bust. Guy is a really good player. When healthy he might be top 5 at his position. Hes an elite defensive player, hes lead the league in blocks, made an all-NBA third team. Injuries have held back his career, but just look at him this post season. Hes controlling the paint for a GS club that was forced to play smaller when DLee went down. Averaging 11 boards in 29 minutes and generally just the second most important player on the W's.
 
I initially shared the objection to calling Bogut a bust. But on second thought, injuries are the only thing that have kept Oden from above average (arguably much above) productivity. Lots of centers have been derailed by injuries, so maybe it is fair to take that into account and measure sustained, average contributions for top picks, not just healthy levels.
 
handiman said:
I initially shared the objection to calling Bogut a bust. But on second thought, injuries are the only thing that have kept Oden from above average (arguably much above) productivity. Lots of centers have been derailed by injuries, so maybe it is fair to take that into account and measure sustained, average contributions for top picks, not just healthy levels.
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I don't think you can compare the two. Bogut has played every game in a season before, and also has 78, 69, and 66 game seasons. Oden has played 82 games over 6 seasons.
 
VanillaGorilla said:
I don't think you can compare the two. Bogut has played every game in a season before, and also has 78, 69, and 66 game seasons. Oden has played 82 games over 6 seasons.
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Sure, they're at different points of the injury-prone spectrum, but they're viewed through the same lens. Are they productive enough when healthy to be worth keeping around the rest of the time? With Shaq, the answer was yes. With Oden, the answer was no. Bogut seems to be somewhere in between.
 
Boise Blazer said:
I dont know why but that made me wonder if the nba will ever have a player with a prosthetic limb?
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One player has had a prosthetic limb. In fact he took a picture of it and sent it to his gf, and got into trouble for it. Unfortunately, it hindered his motion too much and he only played in 82 games in 3 seasons.
 
Run BJM said:
Gotta agree with the guys above, I wouldn't label Bogut a bust. Guy is a really good player. When healthy he might be top 5 at his position. Hes an elite defensive player, hes lead the league in blocks, made an all-NBA third team. Injuries have held back his career, but just look at him this post season. Hes controlling the paint for a GS club that was forced to play smaller when DLee went down. Averaging 11 boards in 29 minutes and generally just the second most important player on the W's.
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I'm a really big fan of Andrew Bogut. I was really outspoken about his worth when he was with the Bucks. His offensive numbers were low, but the Bucks never ran any plays for the guy. Overall, he's had a very good, although injury ridden career. The whole "bust" comment, came in the perspective of the #1 pick.

For example, in the segment I was referring to, Broussard had John Lucas as his worst #1 pick PG. Lucas was far from a "bust," except when you look at in the context of a #1 pick. Bogut didn't have a Howard, Shaquille, Robinson, Ewing, or Olajuwon-esque impact for a #1 pick, and that's the standard that a #1 pick should be held to. Is he a bust of a player? Hell no. A bust of a #1 pick? Definitely, especially because he never took the team that originally drafted him anywhere. A #1 pick should be a franchise changer, and Bogut never lived up to that billing. There were bigger center busts, like Olowokandi, but Bogut's akin to Derrick Coleman in that they had very, very high expectations based on their draft status, had (or are having) good careers, but never measured up to the expectations nor the careers of the players drafted right after them enough to justify their #1 pick.
 
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