Politics Portland Antifa attacks, sends journalist to the hospital

[Road Ratt]

Is there a video of him actually getting hit by anything at all?

 

[Orion Bailey]

Is there a video of him actually getting hit by anything at all?

 

[Orion Bailey]

Is there a video of him actually getting hit by anything at all?

 

[barfo]

Are you serious with these comparisons? I mean what are the options for the building jumper? to be caught by a flying bird? To spread his wings? The jumper knows with 100% certainty the outcome will be smacking the pavement.

It's not 100%, but it is close.

NGO doesn't know with 100% certainty he will be a victim of violence.

Right. He might have been disappointed in his quest for victimhood, but this time he wasn't.

I'M about done with this back and forth if you arent going to use rational explanations(which you cant, because there is no rational justification for the violence the guy received)

I'm making no attempt at all to justify anyone being violent towards him. He is responsible for his actions, and they are responsible for theirs.

Can we please have a real discussion and not these left field apples to oranges comparisons that dont equate?

You can surrender if you want, it's your choice, just like it was his choice to put his face in front of people who made the choice to punch it.

barfo

 

[Orion Bailey]

It's not 100%, but it is close.



Right. He might have been disappointed in his quest for victimhood, but this time he wasn't.



I'm making no attempt at all to justify anyone being violent towards him. He is responsible for his actions, and they are responsible for theirs.



You can surrender if you want, it's your choice, just like it was his choice to put his face in front of people who made the choice to punch it.

barfo

Your posting is to defend Antifa and minimalize thier actions by stating the victim chose to be a victim.

Flawed logic on so many levels.

Then everyone chooses to be a victim everyday for stepping out of their home. Might get hit by a car crossing the street. They chose to.

EVERYONE choses everything. Stop minimalizing this. Just stop.

 

[Road Ratt]

And yet, still no video of him getting hit by anything at all. In none of those videos does it actually show him getting hit with a milk/cement shake.

 

[barfo]

Your posting is to defend Antifa and minimalize thier actions by stating the victim chose to be a victim.

Flawed logic on so many levels.

Then everyone chooses to be a victim everyday for stepping out of their home. Might get hit by a car crossing the street. They chose to.

EVERYONE choses everything. Stop minimalizing this. Just stop.

Sure, his choice to attend/participate in a riot is analogous to someone stepping out of their house.

I'm not defending antifa. I've stated numerous times now that they should be held accountable.

You are defending his choice to provoke violence.

If I walked into a biker bar and called everyone pussies and queers, I'm guessing I might get beat up. You'd say it was all the fault of the bikers, right? I'd have zero responsibility for my actions, since I didn't throw any punches?

barfo

 

[Orion Bailey]

Sure, his choice to attend/participate in a riot is analogous to someone stepping out of their house.

I'm not defending antifa. I've stated numerous times now that they should be held accountable.

You are defending his choice to provoke violence.

If I walked into a biker bar and called everyone pussies and queers, I'm guessing I might get beat up. You'd say it was all the fault of the bikers, right? I'd have zero responsibility for my actions, since I didn't throw any punches?

barfo

Attending protests isn't provocation. Another fundamental flaw in your post.

Did he walk into the protest saying anything? He is merely there capturing the events on video.

Just stop. you ARE defending the actions. I don't care if you say they should be held accountable when you say that NGO was provoking them in the same sentence.


So your rational is that anyone who has an opposing viewpoint and states as much on social media as a reporter, should then steer clear of activities of those he doesn't support because he would be provoking them into violence??????????????


stick and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me...

Unless i'm a snowflake antifa member that is............

 

[barfo]

Attending protests isn't provocation. Another fundamental flaw in your post.

Provoking is provocation though.

Did he walk into the protest saying anything? He is merely there capturing the events on video.

Right. And probably he was helping little old ladies across the street when he was attacked.

Just stop. you ARE defending the actions. I don't care if you say they should be held accountable

Ok... then I won't bother repeating it once again. Since you aren't able to grasp the concept that I think both sides are at fault.

when you say that NGO was provoking them in the same sentence.

I've said those things in difference sentences.

So your rational is that anyone who has an opposing viewpoint and states as much on social media as a reporter, should then steer clear of activities of those he doesn't support because he would be provoking them into violence??????????????

I'm saying he certainly should have, and probably did, expect violence if he got within punching distance. Yet he chose to do so.

barfo

 

[Orion Bailey]

Provoking is provocation though.



Right. And probably he was helping little old ladies across the street when he was attacked.



Ok... then I won't bother repeating it once again. Since you aren't able to grasp the concept that I think both sides are at fault.



I've said those things in difference sentences.



I'm saying he certainly should have, and probably did, expect violence if he got within punching distance. Yet he chose to do so.

barfo

Your posts are irrational. Ill just leave it at that.


Should expect violence...


SMH.....

On that note, I should expect nonsense posts from you too then.

Clearly never going to find some middle ground as long as you place blame on the reporter for being violently attacked while at a protest the reporter doesn't support.

That's just ridiculous, and basically along the lines of thinking that is ruining our country.


You argue semantics and I argue black and whites. Sentence... breath... paragraph. You clearly win the" Argue the irrelevant points and dismiss the meat of the statement" award.

 

[Orion Bailey]

@barfo I just want to add, that I DO like debating with you. Just not on this round.

 

[MarAzul]

Well I guess I would rather not bumble into the Antifa bunch when I go downtown, but I suppose I might.
Then from that I gather, I will likely get punched because I bumbled in.
So I suppose a proper preemptive plan is in order.
Do these dumb asses always wear Black?

 

[barfo]

Your posts are irrational. Ill just leave it at that.


Should expect violence...

You don't think one should expect violence at a riot? Seems... irrational.

SMH.....

On that note, I should expect nonsense posts from you too then.

Clearly never going to find some middle ground as long as you place blame on the reporter for being violently attacked while at a protest the reporter doesn't support.

Clearly we are not going to find middle ground, since you think he's pure as the driven snow and probably will be elevated to sainthood sometime very soon.

That's just ridiculous, and basically along the lines of thinking that is ruining our country.

So you don't believe in personal responsibility? SAD!

You argue semantics and I argue black and whites.

Yeah, there's the problem right there. The world isn't black and white. It's 50 Shades of Grey.

Sentence... breath... paragraph. You clearly win the" Argue the irrelevant points and dismiss the meat of the statement" award.

I'm not even sure what you think the meat of the statement is, in this case. Is it that Ngo is blameless? Or that antifa is evil?

barfo

 

[barfo]

@barfo I just want to add, that I DO like debating with you. Just not on this round.

Sometimes we just have to do things we don't like...

barfo

 

[Orion Bailey]

You don't think one should expect violence at a riot? Seems... irrational.

I thinks its irrational to equate a protest as a riot.

Clearly we are not going to find middle ground, since you think he's pure as the driven snow and probably will be elevated to sainthood sometime very soon.

I never once said he was pure. However i did say he is a journalist who, as far as i know, has never been aggressive or violent while attending these “ralleys”. But when people with opposing views sees him within thier midst, the initiate violence on him.

So you don't believe in personal responsibility? SAD!

I do believe in personal responsibility. I have not seen Gno acting irresponsibly in any video. If he were, i would expect him to own up to it.
Having an opposing viewpoint and showing up to a protest to protest it, has been the game of protesting from the get go.
However, those who initiate violence condemn their own agenda, and should be held accountable for their actions.

Yeah, there's the problem right there. The world isn't black and white. It's 50 Shades of Grey.

The world is. Not everything within it is. Like how those who initiate violence against a non aggressive individual being anything other than wrong.

I'm not even sure what you think the meat of the statement is, in this case. Is it that Ngo is blameless? Or that antifa is evil?

barfo

The meat of the statement is no one should try to deflect or minimize the violence by pointing at Gno and saying he is part to blame or responsible.

 

[MarAzul]

The meat of the statement is no one should try to deflect or minimize the violence by pointing at Gno and saying he is part to blame or responsible.

No doubt.
And if Sly is right, this guy is attacked every time this Antifa trash shows up, then the mere presents of their asses on the street should trigger a response by law enforcement to get their proven untrustworthy butts off the street.

 

[Hoopguru]

The thing about Antifa is they believe in violence, as a way to deter people, I heard the leader of Rose Antifa say,they need to be the aggressors, in interview.
That reporter could have been standing 5 blocks on a corner and they would have sought him out.
The Portland Mayor has not managed this well at all, imo. He's more interested in procurement of several hundred honey buckets.

 

[Orion Bailey]

The thing about Antifa is they believe in violence, as a way to deter people, I heard the leader of Rose Antifa say,they need to be the aggressors, in interview.
That reporter could have been standing 5 blocks on a corner and they would have sought him out.
The Portland Mayor has not managed this well at all, imo. He's more interested in procurement of several hundred honey buckets.

Did the civil rights movement of the 60’s come about by using violence?
Even in the midst of government law enforcement using violence against the protestors, they by and large remained peaceful. And it worked!

What antifa is doing is actively instigating violence and they have no idea the ramifications of achieving their apparent agenda of anarchy.

Its not even that i disagree with some of their viewpoints. But when they break the law, block traffic and harass innocent people simple trying to move on with their day... when they mask their face to remain unidentifiable and vandalize property, they lose their voice. I dont giVe a shit if they are right or wrong.

Two wrongs never make a right.

 

[Hoopguru]

Did the civil rights movement of the 60’s come about by using violence?
Even in the midst of government law enforcement using violence against the protestors, they by and large remained peaceful. And it worked!

What antifa is doing is actively instigating violence and they have no idea the ramifications of achieving their apparent agenda of anarchy.

Its not even that i disagree with some of their viewpoints. But when they break the law, block traffic and harass innocent people simple trying to move on with their day... when they mask their face to remain unidentifiable and vandalize property, they lose their voice. I dont giVe a shit if they are right or wrong.

Two wrongs never make a right.

amen!

 

[barfo]

I thinks its irrational to equate a protest as a riot.

Well, it was something more than a protest. I think the cops called it a 'civil disturbance', is that acceptable?

I never once said he was pure. However i did say he is a journalist who, as far as i know, has never been aggressive or violent while attending these “ralleys”. But when people with opposing views sees him within thier midst, the initiate violence on him.



I do believe in personal responsibility. I have not seen Gno acting irresponsibly in any video. If he were, i would expect him to own up to it.
Having an opposing viewpoint and showing up to a protest to protest it, has been the game of protesting from the get go.

So which is it? Is he a journalist, or a protester?

However, those who initiate violence condemn their own agenda, and should be held accountable for their actions.

The world is. Not everything within it is. Like how those who initiate violence against a non aggressive individual being anything other than wrong.

The meat of the statement is no one should try to deflect or minimize the violence by pointing at Gno and saying he is part to blame or responsible.

Well, I've not defended antifa. All I've said about them is that they (whoever threw the punches) should be prosecuted. I suspect we actually agree completely about that.

There's no law of conservation of blame. The fact that Ngo acted irresponsibly doesn't make the guys who punched him any less criminally liable.

It was your statement that Ngo is an 'innocent' that I've been arguing with. You seem to think admitting that he's anything less than innocent (in the non-legal sense) means that the punchers are something less than guilty. That isn't the case.

barfo

 

[Orion Bailey]

Well, it was something more than a protest. I think the cops called it a 'civil disturbance', is that acceptable?



So which is it? Is he a journalist, or a protester?



Well, I've not defended antifa. All I've said about them is that they (whoever threw the punches) should be prosecuted. I suspect we actually agree completely about that.

There's no law of conservation of blame. The fact that Ngo acted irresponsibly doesn't make the guys who punched him any less criminally liable.

It was your statement that Ngo is an 'innocent' that I've been arguing with. You seem to think admitting that he's anything less than innocent (in the non-legal sense) means that the punchers are something less than guilty. That isn't the case.

barfo

I never said Gno was a protestor. I said people protest protests.
He is not slinging his agenda while there. He is reporting on the happenings.

To focus on the supposed irresponsibility of Gno is minimizing the actions of the aggressors.
Your insistence that he is part to blame is the flaw.
Based on your position, anyone who heads out to report aBout public disturbances, is acting irresponsibly and i believe that to be wrong and a handcuffing position to all who want to report happenings.
You are wrong to try to deflect some blame to Gno and that is what you are doing, whether you think so or not.

 

[Lanny]

Not if they are the ones destroying property and hurting innocent people. And oh, preventing freedom of speech with hate.
Those are the dirt bags that need to get their ass's kicked and put behind bars and on a work crew. Fine them $5000 and take away their drivers license.

He said it as a joke. I don't see anything in his post that advocates violence.
The violent ones need to be dealt with. If you can do it peacefully then do it. If you can't do it peacefully then throw them in the slammer.
I only approve of violence by an injured party in response to violent action against the injured party and then only if law enforcement isn't nearby or responding.

 

[Lanny]

Well, it was something more than a protest. I think the cops called it a 'civil disturbance', is that acceptable?



So which is it? Is he a journalist, or a protester?



Well, I've not defended antifa. All I've said about them is that they (whoever threw the punches) should be prosecuted. I suspect we actually agree completely about that.

There's no law of conservation of blame. The fact that Ngo acted irresponsibly doesn't make the guys who punched him any less criminally liable.

It was your statement that Ngo is an 'innocent' that I've been arguing with. You seem to think admitting that he's anything less than innocent (in the non-legal sense) means that the punchers are something less than guilty. That isn't the case.

barfo

He's certainly no journalist.
However, even if his action of putting himself in harm's way was incredibly stupid, he does not deserve to get beat up.

 

[Hoopguru]

He said it as a joke. I don't see anything in his post that advocates violence.
The violent ones need to be dealt with. If you can do it peacefully then do it. If you can't do it peacefully then throw them in the slammer.
I only approve of violence by an injured party in response to violent action against the injured party and then only if law enforcement isn't nearby or responding.

I know he did, and its true there are good people on both sides, not everyone either left or right are extreme to the point of violence. And both sides are entitled to their view points, they just need to be respectful. Young people are picking up on all the hate being slung, I have teachers in my family at elementary and Jr. High and kids are being called Nazi's and other names they pick up from their parents or the crazy news networks.

 

[dviss1]

Stop equating the entire left with Antifa and we'll stop calling all of y'all racist hillbillies.

Deal?

Because y'all don't say SHIT about the proud boys and the racist Nazis that did this:

 

[barfo]

I never said Gno was a protestor. I said people protest protests.

Ok. So your comment about having an opposing viewpoint and showing up to protest was a non sequitur, I guess?

To focus on the supposed irresponsibility of Gno is minimizing the actions of the aggressors.

Sorry, but I am (and I believe you are) capable of having two ideas at once. Gno and his attackers are different people. We can evaluate them both.

Your insistence that he is part to blame is the flaw.
Based on your position, anyone who heads out to report aBout public disturbances, is acting irresponsibly and i believe that to be wrong and a handcuffing position to all who want to report happenings.

That, of course, is not what I've said, and is not reality. Take a moment to reflect on how many journalists reported on that event, and how many got attacked.

You are wrong to try to deflect some blame to Gno and that is what you are doing, whether you think so or not.

No, that's the way you are interpreting my position. Your black and white world doesn't allow for there to be multiple parties at fault, so Gno has to be 'innocent'. My grey world says that whoever punched him is criminally liable, but he knew what he was doing putting himself close enough to be punched, and it served no legitimate journalistic purpose. It did, however, allow him to become the subject of the story, rather than a reporter.

barfo

 

[Orion Bailey]

Ok. So your comment about having an opposing viewpoint and showing up to protest was a non sequitur, I guess?



Sorry, but I am (and I believe you are) capable of having two ideas at once. Gno and his attackers are different people. We can evaluate them both.



That, of course, is not what I've said, and is not reality. Take a moment to reflect on how many journalists reported on that event, and how many got attacked.



No, that's the way you are interpreting my position. Your black and white world doesn't allow for there to be multiple parties at fault, so Gno has to be 'innocent'. My grey world says that whoever punched him is criminally liable, but he knew what he was doing putting himself close enough to be punched, and it served no legitimate journalistic purpose. It did, however, allow him to become the subject of the story, rather than a reporter.

barfo

did I say show up to protest or to A protest? If I said to protest I meant to A protest as he isnt protesting from anything Ive seen in the videos.

Its a 50 shades of grey world. This instance is black and white.

I DGAF if he was there protesting or reporting really. He did nothing aggressive and did not deserve or initiate anything to reep the violence bestowed upon him.

Your insistence in not agreeing with that and trying to pick it apart as shades of grey is moot.

 

[Orion Bailey]

Violence is wrong. Period. When someone else isn't being aggressive, I don't care what he is doing or how far from offender the victim is. Its wrong. Period.

No amount of debating will change my stance on this. However those that continue to try, I question their morality then.

 

[barfo]

did I say show up to protest or to A protest? If I said to protest I meant to A protest as he isnt protesting from anything Ive seen in the videos.

Well, that certainly clears it right up.

Its a 50 shades of grey world. This instance is black and white.

I DGAF if he was there protesting or reporting really.

I don't either. Actually, I don't think he was there doing either one.

He did nothing aggressive and did not deserve or initiate anything to reep the violence bestowed upon him.

Right, he was just randomly chosen as a victim. It's the same as if a meteor had fallen on him while he was sleeping, right? Totally an act of god and/or antifa, both of which work in mysterious ways.

Your insistence in not agreeing with that and trying to pick it apart as shades of grey is moot.

I don't agree with it because it's obviously not true. You'd have us believe that he was randomly chosen from the crowd for victimhood, and that it could not possibly have been a foreseeable outcome.

barfo

 

[barfo]

Violence is wrong. Period. When someone else isn't being aggressive, I don't care what he is doing or how far from offender the victim is. Its wrong. Period.

No amount of debating will change my stance on this. However those that continue to try, I question their morality then.

Misrepresenting the argument is wrong. Period. When someone is aggressively misrepresenting what someone says, I don't care what he is saying or how far from correct the victim is. Its wrong. Period.

No amount of additional misrepresentation will change my stance on this. However those that continue to try, I question their debate skills then.

barfo