Rumor: Blazers discussions with Suns (1 Viewer)

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First off, I think Ed_O is grossly overrating Amare...We've all seen what kind of team PHX has been the last 5 years or so.
My take is, Steve Nash, along with the now defunct D'Antoni system severely inflated the value of players, especially a guy like Amare.
There are so many examples of guys who leave PHX after excelling and turn out to be somewhat mediocre, and others who have struggled in PHX post-D'Antoni.

Barbosa
Bell
Marion
Q. Richardson
T. Thomas

All of these guys had inflated numbers in PHX. Add Amare to that list.

Portland's system is the OPPOSITE end of the spectrum. I wouldn't even trade LMA straight up for Amare. Pre-microfracture, no doubt, but he's damaged goods...It's definitely debatable, but throwing a guy like Bayless AND Raef's contract in, it's just ludicrous.
 
i only want amare if we turn around and trade him for devin harris. and i dont want aldridge traded in either one of those moves. bayless yes, raef yes, sergio yes, outlaw yes, webster yes, frye yes, rudy yes, freeland yes, kopponen yes.
 
One other problem I have is it still doesn't resolve our SF issue and we give up THE guy who's supposed to be our starting PG in 2-3 years.
Can Amare take us to the next level, a championship level in 2-3 years over an older, improved LMA? I'm not sure...
 
C_note said:
There are so many examples of guys who leave PHX after excelling and turn out to be somewhat mediocre, and others who have struggled post-D'Antoni.

Barbosa
Bell
Marion
Q. Richardson
T. Thomas

All of these guys had inflated numbers in PHX. Add Amare to that list.
Click to expand...

Wrong. It's a popular perception, but wrong. In fact, while examples might exist of "post D'Antoni letdown" might exist, the five you list certainly aren't among them.

Barbosa's not scoring as much this year, but his PER is at an all-time high.
Raja Bell's two years in Utah were just as good as any he had with the Suns.
Shawn Marion was about the same player under D'Antoni that he was under Scott Skiles and Frank Johnson.
QRich was better in LA than he was in Phoenix.
Thomas played a mere 26 regular season games with the Suns and was a superior player his first year as a Clipper.

What else do you have to support the theory?

Ed O.
 
An opposing team's scout sizes up the Suns

... Amaré Stoudemire is a horrific defender, and when you look at somebody so athletically skilled as he is, you have to wonder if it's a matter of effort.

... Stoudemire is past the age where you talk about his potential. Will he be a winner? The reason he fell to No. 9 in the 2002 draft was because teams were scared of him as an inconsistent personality. He is an exceptional talent, but one thing he has never done is defend. He just doesn't do it. So I don't know how much of a building block he can be as they move forward hoping to create more of a defensive-mindedness. ...

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/basketball/nba/10/22/suns/

Last season, Stoudemire finished second-to-last in "Defensive Adjusted +/-" among power forwards and centers who played over 2,000 minutes.
http://www.82games.com/ilardi2d.htm#table

You can also compare Stoudemire and Aldridge in "Defensive Adjusted +/-" last season, with Stoudemire recording a -2.63 and Aldridge checking in at +3.06.

http://www.82games.com/ilardi2d.htm#table

In other words, according to that advanced metric, Aldridge saved his team 5.69 points defensively per 100 possessions when compared to Stoudemire. And in "Overall Adjusted +/-", Aldridge scored a +5.27 to Stoudemire's +1.76, meaning that Aldridge was worth 3.51 more points per 100 possessions overall.

http://www.82games.com/ilardi2.htm#table

Those results may not be perfect, but they constitute some food for thought.

Let's also take into account that Aldridge plays in a much slower paced offense and doesn't have a world class PG getting him high percentage shots.
 
C_note said:
My take is, Steve Nash, along with the now defunct D'Antoni system severely inflated the value of players, especially a guy like Amare.
Click to expand...

Joe Johnson proved that assumption wrong. Same with Diaw and Bell playing well for the Bobcats.
 
alex42083 said:
Can Amare take us to the next level, a championship level in 2-3 years over an older, improved LMA? I'm not sure...
Click to expand...

Yes, I think so. We only have one surefire star right now, Roy. I have plenty of belief that Oden can reach that level, too, but nothing is guaranteed. Aldridge is not star level yet and he's largely stagnated this year. Amare gives us a second bonafide star. I think that's enormous. If Oden does successfully develop into a star also, that's the foundation for a dynasty. But even if Oden disappoints and never becomes more than a good player, having a second star in Amare gives Portland some margin to still allow title-contention even if Oden doesn't turn into a star.
 
Amare is a scoring force. At the same age (23) Amare was a 26/9 player. I don't like the rumored deal at all but some of you guys are underrating Amare' because he's having a down year this season. The guy is a top-5 PF only only 2 years (4 months) older than LaMarcus.

A Roy/Amare combo is very enticing.
 
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Defensively, LaMarcus tries, but it's a lateral move IMO. Neither guys are good defenders.
 
Minstrel said:
Yes, I think so. We only have one surefire star right now, Roy. I have plenty of belief that Oden can reach that level, too, but nothing is guaranteed. Aldridge is not star level yet and he's largely stagnated this year. Amare gives us a second bonafide star. I think that's enormous. If Oden does successfully develop into a star also, that's the foundation for a dynasty. But even if Oden disappoints and never becomes more than a good player, having a second star in Amare gives Portland some margin to still allow title-contention even if Oden doesn't turn into a star.
Click to expand...

Yeah, it's certainly a tough call and having that bonafide star next to Brandon is intriguing. I'm just guessing there's a lot of hesitation because LaMarcus is one of those guys we've been grooming the past few years, he's likable and we want to see the core of Roy/Aldridge/Oden be those guys who take us to the title.

It'd be pretty sad to see LaMarcus go, but if KP believes Amare can take us to another level, I'd be all for it. Amare just better not bolt in 2010 or start sulking like a crybaby because he's playing second fiddle to Roy.
 
This sounds like more than we should have to give up for Amare. Still, I am intrigued. I always like to get the best player in the deal. In this case, we consolidate some of our depth for not just the best player, but a superstar. There are a lot of questions though. Mainly, Amare's attitude as far as I'm concerned.

I'm not a member of the LMA > Amare camp....so I think it would be a mistake for KP to not be in talks with them. I'd be a lot happier if got to keep Bayless, though.

Edit: the other big question mark in my book is: will Amare re-sign with us in 2010?
 
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Bayless, Freeland and Raef is the offer for Stoudamire, who will be traded to a 3rd team for future draft picks.

LaMarcus is staying put for certain.
 
Fez said:
Dallasbasketball.com called an Amare/Aldridge trade last week...

CBSsports.com is now calling an Amare/Aldridge+others trade...

Where there is smoke there is fire?
Click to expand...

More like where there's smoke, there's Steve Kerr taking a huge bong hit. That trade is unbelievably lopsided in favor of the team with no leverage.
 
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