Should Obama/Romney, military personnel, and police officers be worshipped?

[huevonkiller]

Are these people your masters, or better than you? Since they act like they are, I want to know what you people think.

Should you blindly worship cops? Do you see these people as warriors that should be worshiped regardless of whether or not they expropriate you at gunpoint? Is the state heroic?

Is it brave to force others to subsidize your military campaigns, even if they don't want to?

 

[speeds]

I'm not going to get into the idea of worship. As a SecProg obviously I don't know much about or have an appreciation for the word. It takes many forms.

I think it is appropriate and should be encouraged to appreciate the work that police and military personnel do. Both are difficult jobs that only a small percentage of the population are willing to fulfill. They're all human beings and you're going to find examples of misbehaviour and criminality among them but it shouldn't sour your entire view of the occupations. Their duty is to serve and protect, at the lowest and highest ranks. I personally know a lot of policemen and servicemen and although I am in another country I think it is generally the same--they aren't authoritarians. Some of them are dicks, and obviously the difference between a dickish cashier and a dickish policeman can really impact your life, but most of them aren't.

Politicians are a different case. To succeed in politics at the highest level requires compromising. I think in Obama's case he was able to ride a tidal wave of good fortune into the White House, which gives me hope that he isn't a complete shill. He was able to bypass many obstacles that might otherwise have required what you might call unsavory dealings. Obviously there are a lot of reasons he isn't the best person for the job, but the best person for that job will never get it--and frankly no amount of good work and decision making would convince the other 50% that the job was well done. Romney on the other hand seems to be an automaton who can be programmed and reprogrammed depending on the audience and the goal. He's publicly compromised so much that it would seem behind the scenes he is simply fed his new opinions daily to be regurgitated on camera or on a soapbox when required. Sadly this was the case with John McCain as well, who, for example, had to go back on his intensely personal views on torture.

Whether you believe we choose our leaders and heroes or if we only have the illusion of choice is another discussion. If you feel like condescending people are in charge of you it could be your own insecurity.

 

[huevonkiller]

Statistically you're wrong though.

First of all, being a farmer, mechanic, construction worker is statistically more dangerous than being a police officer. So spare me a bit of that speeds, you're better than that. All those people are more courageous, and private police officers are actually held accountable for their actions.

Additionally, the individual is heroic. A state is not heroic, a state is a collection of people with a monopoly on violence. Their profits are guaranteed, and the quality of their service is poor.

Some police officers and soliders are heroic, most are not. They are merely an extension of the central planner's inefficient plans. Further FDR disagrees with you speeds, he was scared of public unions for a reason. Public unions result in inefficiency and in a superfluous amount of worker's rights. In california policemen are free and willing to kill, they barely have to fill out details when they murder someone as well.

I'll get into this more later but you went on a tangent about Obama. This isn't really about him, moreso about the entire history of the state. Also I do not support Romney and think Obama is actually a tad better, just to reiterate this point. They're both horrible obviously.

 

[speeds]

I never used the word dangerous or mentioned unions so your arguments are non sequiturs.

a farmer, mechanic, construction worker is statistically more dangerous than being a police officer... All those people are more courageous

In california policemen are free and willing to kill, they barely have to fill out details when they murder someone as well.

Ludicrous on both counts.

I don't know if I can keep up with this discussion. You're moving in a lot of different directions.

 

[barfo]

And if not worshiped, should they be horsewhipped?

barfo

 

[SlyPokerDog]

People should worship internet basketball forum mods.

 

[MARIS61]

And if not worshiped, should they be horsewhipped?

barfo

They should be war-shipped, off to fight their own wars.

 

[Denny Crane]

The opposite of whatever MARIS61 writes is usually a good answer.

 

[speeds]

They should be war-shipped, off to fight their own wars.

We shouldn't not be peace-held, on fro surrender our other people's peace.

Denny, this isn't working.

 

[mook]

Be kind; everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle. - John Watson

 

[Denny Crane]

We shouldn't not be peace-held, on fro surrender our other people's peace.

Denny, this isn't working.

Our military is run by civilians. The commander in chief these days got his training for the job as a community organizer. At least Leon Panetta served.

The military does a really good job of doing what's asked of it, and not a whole lot more.

 

[maxiep]

I worship no mortal. I admire many, however.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

I worship no mortal. I admire many, however.

Thank you, I think highly of you too.

 

[e_blazer]

Thank you, I think highly of you too.

Is your real name "Manny", Sly?

 

[SlyPokerDog]

Is your real name "Manny", Sly?

LOL! Not that I know of.

 

[huevonkiller]

I never used the word dangerous or mentioned unions so your arguments are non sequiturs.

Well sorry but I already proved you don't understand how dangerous different careers are. Your lack of knowledge is your problem, not mine.

Second unions figure exactly into the problems associated with the state. I'd be happy to retort anything else you have to say though.

Public unionization makes the state more corrupt and violent, and FDR agreed. They reduce the quality of the services they provide and make police officers more violent.

Ludicrous on both counts.

I don't know if I can keep up with this discussion. You're moving in a lot of different directions.

"Farmers, ranchers, commercial fishermen, loggers, garbage collectors, truck drivers, construction workers, pilots, steel workers, roofers, and others are far more likely to face death on the jobs than police or firefighters, according to the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics"

Please, continue to ignore the nuanced metrics. Your arguments are extremely unscientific.

 

[huevonkiller]

"The state Supreme Court’s Copley Press v. San Diego decision in 2006 shrouds allegations of police misconduct in secrecy. The public can have access to complaints raised against doctors, lawyers and others, but in California the misbehavior of public employees who have the legal right to use deadly force are off limits to scrutiny. Because of an exemption in the public-records act, police agencies need not release most details of their reports of officer-involved shootings.

Furthermore, the Peace Officers Procedural Bill of Rights (POBOR) gives accused officers such strong protections that officers can rarely be disciplined or fired. The code of silence is alive and well in police agencies, which are allowed to operate in virtual secrecy. Most citizen-review panels are toothless. We should never condone violent protests, but it’s not hard to understand the frustration in central Anaheim. What if it were your child or your neighbor's child?"

http://reason.com/archives/2012/07/27/anaheim-riots-spotlight-need-for-broad-p

Keep talking big speeds, it seems you should stick to Canadian subjects. You don't know jack.