The Brilliance of the Evan Turner Signing: Creating Catch and Shoot Opportunities for Our Shooters

[Strenuus]

I have no problems. Nothing serious here

 

[BonesJones]

A mediocre man thinks he's never wrong. He just has to live up to that persona!

 

[BLAZINGGIANTS]

Same thing as half y'all fools here.

 

[STOMP]

I love Nico, but he is not worth the salary difference for 0.2 more apg, questionable better defense and less game on the court (because he always has little injuries)

They're the same age and came into the league the same season, but Nic has played 17,236 minutes to Evans 13,390 over the course of their respective careers. Nic's extra length, versatility on D & deep ball are what separates the two as talents.

STOMP

 

[Schilly]

I love Mediocre Man, even though he comes across as a condescending prick, he's really only condescending... Prick is a bit too far. He does have knowledge of the game I will grant him that credit, and he sticks to his guns, right wrong or otherwise. I also think he really really enjoys getting under people's skin for the sake of riling them up, he may want to seek therapy for that trait... All in all I'm glad he's here.

 

[-Ace-]

They're the same age and came into the league the same season, but Nic has played 17,236 minutes to Evans 13,390 over the course of their respective careers. Nic's extra length, versatility on D & deep ball are what separates the two as talents.

STOMP

I think Nic has two extra years on Turner in the league, actually.

 

[BonesJones]

I also think he really really enjoys getting under people's skin for the sake of riling them up, he may want to seek therapy for that trait... All in all I'm glad he's here.

If he loves trolling why does he deny it?

 

[andalusian]

They're the same age and came into the league the same season, but Nic has played 17,236 minutes to Evans 13,390 over the course of their respective careers. Nic's extra length, versatility on D & deep ball are what separates the two as talents.

STOMP

Turner entered the league 2 years after Nic.

In the last 3 years ET missed 2 games, Nic missed 23 (*) - and one assumes that Nic played some of these with minor injuries and thus with less efficiency.

I do believe Nic has more talent. I just do not think that he is worth the difference in salary given the small difference in output and his nagging injuries.

(*) - this includes the one outlier season for Nic where he did not miss a game, one would assume that normally you will see 10-15 games missed per year for him.

 

[Orion Bailey]

While Zbo as a person exercised poor judgement at times, Zbo the basketball player is one of my favorite and one of the best at a dying skill set. He seems to be one of the few power forwards who still enjoying playing near the basket and are good at it. He has a variety of post moves, can get his shot off with more skill than athleticism against bigger players, and has exceptional positioning and timing while rebounding. While I recognize that LMA is great at the mid range shot, I hate that he takes so many of them. Being a long time Blazer fan I grew with power forwards like Lucas and Buck. Player who pounded down low around the basketball. When motivated Zbo was also in that mold.

Is Noah like that? No. Can Noah become that? He's more athletic than Zbo, seems raw but has some great instincts.

Does Karl Malone have a basketball camp? I would send him there.

MM this right here. This is what I was trying to compare and assimilate. As for the Blazers, we have not seen a low post presence be an impact for this team on a consistent basis since Randolph. All I am saying is I think he will be the next Pf in the paint to make an impact, since Randolph. He will be our next Randolph.

That is all.

For the record, Id have a beer with MM in a heart beat.

 

[STOMP]

Turner entered the league 2 years after Nic.

In the last 3 years ET missed 2 games, Nic missed 23 (*) - and one assumes that Nic played some of these with minor injuries and thus with less efficiency.

I do believe Nic has more talent. I just do not think that he is worth the difference in salary given the small difference in output and his nagging injuries.

(*) - this includes the one outlier season for Nic where he did not miss a game, one would assume that normally you will see 10-15 games missed per year for him

my bad on the start date of their respective careers, but the obvious counter to your claim that Turner is on the court more still stands. Subtract out those first two seasons of minutes from Nic's totals and he still leads substantially in total minutes played 14,904 to 13,390. You reference the last 3 seasons for games missed & I'd again point out that Nic played more total minutes then Evan in each of those seasons.

It's easier to stay healthy when you spend more time clapping courtside & coming off the bench for short spurts rather then playing starter's minutes.

STOMP

 

[Mediocre Man]

MM this right here. This is what I was trying to compare and assimilate. As for the Blazers, we have not seen a low post presence be an impact for this team on a consistent basis since Randolph. All I am saying is I think he will be the next Pf in the paint to make an impact, since Randolph. He will be our next Randolph.

That is all.

For the record, Id have a beer with MM in a heart beat.

I'd love that, except I don't like beer. God knows I've tried. It's all about hard liquor....or used to be, for me

 

[andalusian]

my bad on the start date of their respective careers, but the obvious counter to your claim that Turner is on the court more still stands. Subtract out those first two seasons of minutes from Nic's totals and he still leads substantially in total minutes played 14,904 to 13,390. You reference the last 3 seasons for games missed & I'd again point out that Nic played more total minutes then Evan in each of those seasons.

It's easier to stay healthy when you spend more time clapping courtside & coming off the bench for short spurts rather then playing starter's minutes.

I would ignore ET's time in inept Philli and look at his Boston career under a good coach - and the time played difference even in minutes is not that big.

Again, I just do not think that Nic is worth the premium you would pay for him over Turner.

 

[Orion Bailey]

I'd love that, except I don't like beer. God knows I've tried. It's all about hard liquor....or used to be, for me

Then Crown Royal it is... or Apple Juice.

 

[Daweez04]

Wow, 80% of this thread was unreadable.

Anywho, for me what Turner brings that Batum never did was the ability to drive, then dish. Batum COULD get to the rack whenever he wanted, but loved to play the roll of sitting in the corner and shooting spot up 3s. I think Turner will be much better at collapsing defenses by playing inside the arc, and has the passing ability to hit our shooters on the outside.

The one major discrepancies is unless Aminu is on, we don't have that 3rd 3-point shooter the GSW had in Barnes (and now have in... KD, FML).

Batum has too much Euro ball in him, I though getting him over here at 19 that coaches would make getting to the rim part of his game. If he could have developed that as a consistent part of his game, he would be worth every penny of that contract, and the comparisons to Scottie Pippen would have had some weight behind them.

 

[STOMP]

I would ignore ET's time in inept Philli and look at his Boston career under a good coach - and the time played difference even in minutes is not that big.

so excuses for Turner and negative exaggerations for Nic... got it.

STOMP

 

[PDXFonz]

I would ignore ET's time in inept Philli and look at his Boston career under a good coach - and the time played difference even in minutes is not that big.

Again, I just do not think that Nic is worth the premium you would pay for him over Turner.

Philly had a decent team when turner was there. He was there during that group of Iggy, Elton Brand, Thadd Young, Jrue Holiday, ET.

Turner is going to surprise a lot of people who look at his Boston stats. He's going to fit this system really well, and will probably shoot around 35-38% from 3 this season. One of those situations where our system here will make yet another player look better than they have. Will the Thrill is one of the few players in recent years who has left Portland and found more success with their new teams. But like Nic Batum, much of that could be a product of the increased opportunity/role they were given.

 

[andalusian]

so excuses for Turner and negative exaggerations for Nic... got it.

Call it what you want, I do believe however that data from the last 3 years when comparing two players is a lot more important than historical data from 6 to 8 years ago. I also have no problems with you believing that Nic is woth $1.7 for every $1 that Turner earns. I do not believe it.

 

[STOMP]

I also have no problems with you believing that Nic is woth $1.7 for every $1 that Turner earns. I do not believe it.

where do I say anything along those lines? What I've been pointing out is that Nic has played more then Evan throughout their respective careers, including each of the past 3 seasons.

When I say something wrong (when their careers started) I own it. Apparently when you say something wrong (Turner on the court more), you make excuses and try to change the subject with red herrings.

STOMP

 

[andalusian]

where do I say anything along those lines? What I've been pointing out is that Nic has played more then Evan throughout their respective careers, including each of the past 3 seasons.

When I say something wrong (when their careers started) I own it. Apparently when you say something wrong (Turner on the court more), you make excuses and try to change the subject with red herrings.

You are absolutely right that Nic played more minutes, but I am also right that he was available for less games. Is there a correlation between the two? Likely. Is it better to have a player available for more games or more minutes? I do not know. I suspect that a coach would rather have someone that is available every game and is more consistent but maybe not - I am not a coach.

You seem to be really hung on this issue of minutes, as I said, in the last 3 years the difference is not that big. Nic played 700 more minutes in the last 3 years and that includes his outlier 82 games season. At the same 3 years - Turner only missed 2 games vs. 20+ for Nic. Both of these statements are correct - and all my arguments lead to the same conclusion:

I do not believe that the difference in output between Nic and Turner is worth the price difference.

I most certainly believe that Nic is a better and more talented player, I really do not know why you are so hung on the minutia of specific items - but if you believe I am not reliable or that my opinions have no merit because I "did not admit" that Nic played a whopping 700 more minutes in the last 3 years, I am just fine with it.

 

[dviss1]

They're the same age and came into the league the same season, but Nic has played 17,236 minutes to Evans 13,390 over the course of their respective careers. Nic's extra length, versatility on D & deep ball are what separates the two as talents.

STOMP

I'm sorry, but who the hell ever thought Batum was good at guarding Power Forwards?

Not me.

 

[Blaz06Draft]

Dame shoots 20 times a game. If Turner can help him convert 10% (wild guess, but still less than Splashed Bros) of those opportunities to catch and shoots at a gain of 0.25 points per possession, he would score 0.5 points more per game.

CJ shoots 18 times a game. If Turner can help him convert 10% (wild guess, but still less than Splashed Bros) of those opportunities to catch and shoots at a gain of 0.25 points per possession, he would score 0.45 points more per game.

Crabbe shoots 8 times a game. If Turner can help him convert 10% (wild guess, but still less than Splashed Bros) of those opportunities to catch and shoots at a gain of 0.40 points per possession, he would score 0.32 points more per game.

So if ET can get our volume shooters 10% more catch and shoots, the Blazers might score 1.27 more points per game.

 

[Trackjack]

With Durant there I can Splashed get lesser shots this year.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

Dame shoots 20 times a game. If Turner can help him convert 10% (wild guess, but still less than Splashed Bros) of those opportunities to catch and shoots at a gain of 0.25 points per possession, he would score 0.5 points more per game.

CJ shoots 18 times a game. If Turner can help him convert 10% (wild guess, but still less than Splashed Bros) of those opportunities to catch and shoots at a gain of 0.25 points per possession, he would score 0.45 points more per game.

Crabbe shoots 8 times a game. If Turner can help him convert 10% (wild guess, but still less than Splashed Bros) of those opportunities to catch and shoots at a gain of 0.40 points per possession, he would score 0.32 points more per game.

So if ET can get our volume shooters 10% more catch and shoots, the Blazers might score 1.27 more points per game.

Can I subscribe to your newsletter?

 

[Denny Crane]

Through the first 4 seasons, Batum and Turner played roughly the same minutes. If anything, Turner played more (I didn't add it up) because Batum played 37 and 59 games in two of those seasons. Both averaged about 30 MPG.

The year Philly traded Turner to Indy, he averaged 17 PPG, more than Batum ever has. Indy buried him on their bench after acquiring him. Turner is no Paul George, and Lance Stephenson was a triple double machine at that point in his career.

Turner averages 10.7 PPG for his career, Batum 11.7.

Turner averages 3.8 APG for his career, Batum 3.4 APG.

Turner has a career DRtg of 101, Batum 107.

That said, Batum established himself as a big minutes starter, Turner never has (until this year!). As a starter and getting starter's minutes (~35 or more), Batum handed out ~5 APG, with 5.9 his best last season.

Batum is clearly a better 3pt shooter and it looks like shooter in general.

Either one would complement our current starters. I'm perfectly fine with Turner. I think he'll make us a better team than Batum would.

 

[STOMP]

lots of wishful thinking in this thread. Par for the course here that the new guy is the flavor of the month before (inevitably) much of the board turns on him no matter how he plays. I've seen plenty of Turner & my expectations aren't very high... I think he'll be okay. My wish is that he could shoot from deep.

STOMP

 

[BonesJones]

lots of wishful thinking in this thread. Par for the course here that the new guy is the flavor of the month before (inevitably) much of the board turns on him no matter how he plays. I've seen plenty of Turner & my expectations aren't very high... I think he'll be okay. My wish is that he could shoot from deep.

STOMP

Shooting from deep is the only thing he's not good at and he's shown potential. Plus everyone shoots better in Portland.

 

[Denny Crane]

lots of wishful thinking in this thread. Par for the course here that the new guy is the flavor of the month before (inevitably) much of the board turns on him no matter how he plays. I've seen plenty of Turner & my expectations aren't very high... I think he'll be okay. My wish is that he could shoot from deep.

STOMP

I wish he shoots good from deep, too. We all do.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

lots of wishful thinking in this thread. Par for the course here that the new guy is the flavor of the month before (inevitably) much of the board turns on him no matter how he plays. I've seen plenty of Turner & my expectations aren't very high... I think he'll be okay. My wish is that he could shoot from deep.

STOMP

I hate the wishful thinkers. Being positive and optimistic about a player we just signed?!? Crazy!

 

[Blazinaway]

I hate the wishful thinkers. Being positive and optimistic about a player we just signed?!? Crazy!

No Kiddin, after the HCP thread I want to rip some fuckin heads off! lol I also believe Turner will be a pleasant surprise

 

[SlyPokerDog]

Hey you kids, get off my forum lawn!