The Meyers Leonard Thread

[Rastapopoulos]

As a lot of threads seem to devolve into disputes about Meyers Leonard, how 'bout we confine them to a single thread? Personally, I'm ready to give up on him. He's got a decent shot and can dunk with the best of them on a breakaway, but he's too exasperating to stand any longer. Maybe it's the frat-boy looks (if he had a face like Gustavo Ayon, perhaps I wouldn't find him so distasteful) but I just want him gone. He doesn't do any of the things you need from a center: his defense is atrocious, his rebounding is anemic, and he must be the worst shotblocker for an athletic 7 footer outside of maybe Andrea Bargnani. He's like a poor man's Channing Frye.

Here's what I would suggest to the Bucks. (Of course, I'd prefer this one, but that would be pushing our luck.) Given some of the decisions they've been making, maybe it would make sense to them. And after all, they would be left with two very good rebounders and shotblockers, so maybe it wouldn't be a terrible move for them.

 

[Blazinaway]

I am disappointed as well but it is SL and I give him this yr to improve enough to show us he can develop, if not then adios. I think he simply should not be allowed any 3 pt shots until he can show he can rebound consistently and at least play half ass defense

 

[Mediocre Man]

We need to be patient with Meyers. He is only 21 years old, and no other 21 year old center in the history of the league has been any good. Patience I tell you. Give him another 10-11 years, and we will be laughing at all those other teams that passed on him.

 

[TripTango]

What's in it for the Bucks, exactly?

I don't think we're going to get anything for Meyers that's more valuable than what we might get letting him develop for a couple seasons. I know he's raw, but I'm still not convinced that we can't find him a useful niche on the court.

 

[Wizard Mentor]

Olshey drafted him and will be his advocate - he'll be the last one to give up on him.

I'm not ready to give up on him either, but I came into summer league hoping he was a 15-18 mpg player. Now I think he's an 8-10 mpg player - a big difference.

If Lopez doesn't play in at least 75 games this year we will be in serious trouble unless Olshey uses the room exception on a Center.

 

[3RA1N1AC]

he is the best/worst ever

he will get better/worse with time, he is only/already 21

 

[craigehlo]

My optimism for making the playoffs has taken a hit if Meyers has to play heavy minutes in the 2nd unit. Sure he's 4 years away, but we only have a 2 year window to convince LA to stay (if that's the direction management want's to go). We aren't a team that can develop a player for 4 years on the practice squad like the Spurs. We need all players to be productive.

 

[Blaze01]

If POR had only kept Withey

 

[oldmangrouch]

Random musing: some fans were less than enthusiastic over the McCollum pick. I wonder if there is some correlation between anti CJ/pro Lynyrd sentiment (and vice-versa).

 

[Wheels]

he is the best/worst ever

he will get better/worse with time, he is only/already 21

repped

 

[Reep]

I agree that Leonard hasn't looked good in summer league. I still would give him at least this next year. Lopez is the rightful starter. See what happens. Worst case is that your backup center doesn't improve much. I can't imagine he has much trade value right now anyway. Give him at least one more year before the big write off.

Having said that, once mandatory workouts start back up before the season, I would make sure I had the right big man coach form Leonard and would start hammering into him the importance of his presence in the post.

 

[Mediocre Man]

Random musing: some fans were less than enthusiastic over the McCollum pick. I wonder if there is some correlation between anti CJ/pro Lynyrd sentiment (and vice-versa).

I was probably one of the people less enthusiastic about the McCollum pick, and obviously HATED the Leonard pick. The difference to me is that I never thought McCollum would suck. I thought we probably picked an offensive role player, and thinking that teams either need star power type players, or defensive specialists, it was sort of a wasted pick, IMO.

Leonard on the other hand was always a bust in my mind. Be it my stupid American born white center theory, or whatever.

 

[BlazerBeav]

In fairness to him, I'd say this summer league roster is hardly one that is doing him any favors. With our real roster, he gets left alone. With this one - he's one of the more serious offensive threats. Lillard can create opportunities for him, whereas this bunch is just playing hot potato.

 

[Pinwheel1]

Keep him and add another center. You need 3 centers. I view Freeland as a PF.

I would not waste time on thinking of trade scenarios for Leonard. Just sign some other big body.

 

[Rhal]

I don't get the hoopla about making a big deal about this because of summer league. SL isn't to kind for big and its more of a guards game and its nothing like actual NBA ball. Its fun to watch if you'v got a talented guard/wing on your SL team but to grade bigs on SL play is like grading how an apple tastes just by how it looks, shouldn't happen.

 

[magnifier661]

I am disappointed as well but it is SL and I give him this yr to improve enough to show us he can develop, if not then adios. I think he simply should not be allowed any 3 pt shots until he can show he can rebound consistently and at least play half ass defense

That's the thing. It's summer league and he still sucks. I couldn't imagine how terrible he'll be against actual nba rotation players.

 

[magnifier661]

I don't get the hoopla about making a big deal about this because of summer league. SL isn't to kind for big and its more of a guards game and its nothing like actual NBA ball. Its fun to watch if you'v got a talented guard/wing on your SL team but to grade bigs on SL play is like grading how an apple tastes just by how it looks, shouldn't happen.

I wasn't really concerned about the stats as I was with actually watching how he reacts, takes contact and looks to dunk over the smaller players. Instead he pops from 5 ft from the basket, usually shying away from any contact. I wish he had a tougher demeanor. White players like Brad Miller and lambier should be the mold for him.

Piss off the other team with your mark madson annoyance!

 

[Reep]

I wasn't really concerned about the stats as I was with actually watching how he reacts, takes contact and looks to dunk over the smaller players. Instead he pops from 5 ft from the basket, usually shying away from any contact. I wish he had a tougher demeanor. White players like Brad Miller and lambier should be the mold for him.

Piss off the other team with your mark madson annoyance!

You guys saw the ball slap and "T" he got in the first game, right? He is banging more, just needs to make the banging more productive.

I'm just glad we have Lopez so Leonard's quick development isn't so critical.

 

[Rastapopoulos]

I don't get the hoopla about making a big deal about this because of summer league. SL isn't to kind for big and its more of a guards game and its nothing like actual NBA ball. Its fun to watch if you'v got a talented guard/wing on your SL team but to grade bigs on SL play is like grading how an apple tastes just by how it looks, shouldn't happen.

You're assuming we didn't watch him play last season.

 

[Natebishop3]

That's the thing. It's summer league and he still sucks. I couldn't imagine how terrible he'll be against actual nba rotation players.

Good grief Mags.... you realize he DID play against NBA rotation players last year, right? The guy isn't a rookie. You don't have to "imagine" anything.

I'm annoyed with Leonard as well, but I'm not nearly as worked up as some of you. The dude is a project, and project players don't develop in one year. Travis Outlaw took at least two or three years before he could even contribute, and he was a forward, not a center. It takes time to develop centers. Joel Przybilla looked like shit his first few years in the league.

Compare their rookie seasons... Joel obviously projects to be a much better rebounder and defender, while Meyers projects to be a much better offensive player. That's just who they are. He's not a defensive specialist like Joel was.

But look at Joel's first few years in the league.

He didn't really start playing well until his fifth season when he arrived in Portland. He had terrible foul trouble, even when he played here at first. You have to be patient with big men. They hardly ever just step in and dominate, especially not at Meyers age. The guy is still very young.

 

[MARIS61]

Basketball reference projects him to be a 12/8 player this season if the coach plays him, with excellent %'s in all shooting categories.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/l/leoname01.html

 

[Natebishop3]

Basketball reference projects him to be a 12/8 player this season if the coach plays him, with excellent %'s in all shooting categories.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/l/leoname01.html

But people will still be pissed about his poor defensive rating and lack of physical play.... you can't make a square peg fit in a round hole. The guy isn't Joel Przybilla.

 

[magnifier661]

Good grief Mags.... you realize he DID play against NBA rotation players last year, right? The guy isn't a rookie. You don't have to "imagine" anything.

I'm annoyed with Leonard as well, but I'm not nearly as worked up as some of you. The dude is a project, and project players don't develop in one year. Travis Outlaw took at least two or three years before he could even contribute, and he was a forward, not a center. It takes time to develop centers. Joel Przybilla looked like shit his first few years in the league.

Compare their rookie seasons... Joel obviously projects to be a much better rebounder and defender, while Meyers projects to be a much better offensive player. That's just who they are. He's not a defensive specialist like Joel was.

But look at Joel's first few years in the league.

He didn't really start playing well until his fifth season when he arrived in Portland. He had terrible foul trouble, even when he played here at first. You have to be patient with big men. They hardly ever just step in and dominate, especially not at Meyers age. The guy is still very young.

I did take that into account. But the aggressiveness of those players were much stronger. Also, last season, Leonard couldn't even stay on the court because of his "deer in the headlights" defense.

I want someone to be a better 2nd rotation player. Sorry if that makes people upset; but Leonard is at least 3 years from being a good rotation player, IMO.

 

[3RA1N1AC]

Basketball reference projects him to be a 12/8 player this season if the coach plays him, with excellent %'s in all shooting categories.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/l/leoname01.html

with only half a 3 per game!

 

[Natebishop3]

I did take that into account. But the aggressiveness of those players were much stronger. Also, last season, Leonard couldn't even stay on the court because of his "deer in the headlights" defense.

I want someone to be a better 2nd rotation player. Sorry if that makes people upset; but Leonard is at least 3 years from being a good rotation player, IMO.

Define "better 2nd rotation player"....

 

[KeepOnRollin]

I think we were all expecting the big sophomore jump. We may not get it. But Meyers wasn't even as bad as people were complaining last year. Guy is more advanced then 70% of the Centers that come out of the draft offensively. Problem is he might be in the bottom 30% defensively.

 

[Eastoff]

You guys saw the ball slap and "T" he got in the first game, right? He is banging more, just needs to make the banging more productive.

I'm just glad we have Lopez so Leonard's quick development isn't so critical.

Trying to search online, I couldn't find anything about this. Could you describe more please?

 

[Natebishop3]

I think we were all expecting the big sophomore jump. We may not get it. But Meyers wasn't even as bad as people were complaining last year. Guy is more advanced then 70% of the Centers that come out of the draft offensively. Problem is he might be in the bottom 30% defensively.

He's not a defensive player. That's just not him. Maybe he'll develop into one, but I can't think of a guy developing defensive instincts. Meyers is vastly ahead, offensively, compared to other centers at his age, but his defensive numbers are definitely low and when you compare him to guys like Prz or Tyson Chandler, you could already see that those guys had defensive chops.

 

[B-Roy]

Good grief Mags.... you realize he DID play against NBA rotation players last year, right? The guy isn't a rookie. You don't have to "imagine" anything.

I'm annoyed with Leonard as well, but I'm not nearly as worked up as some of you. The dude is a project, and project players don't develop in one year. Travis Outlaw took at least two or three years before he could even contribute, and he was a forward, not a center. It takes time to develop centers. Joel Przybilla looked like shit his first few years in the league.

Compare their rookie seasons... Joel obviously projects to be a much better rebounder and defender, while Meyers projects to be a much better offensive player. That's just who they are. He's not a defensive specialist like Joel was.

But look at Joel's first few years in the league.

He didn't really start playing well until his fifth season when he arrived in Portland. He had terrible foul trouble, even when he played here at first. You have to be patient with big men. They hardly ever just step in and dominate, especially not at Meyers age. The guy is still very young.

Good post. Agree with pretty much everything you said. What I find funny is that some of the people wanting Portland to tank are the ones who are clamoring to replace Leonard with a more productive player.

 

[Natebishop3]

Trying to search online, I couldn't find anything about this. Could you describe more please?

Meh, it was a non-event. Guy drove to the hole, a foul was called, and Leonard sort of slapped at the ball a little more aggressively than the guy liked. They got into it a bit and a tech was called on Myle.