The super Melo to Portland thread + The Big Blockbuster

[SIeepwalker]

There are only 3 people here, one has severe multiple personality disorder

But we also have a dog and a bot, so I would say it's pretty multicultural

 

[THE HCP]

Wonder who The HCP is in ClutchLand

 

[BLAZINGGIANTS]

And we have this dude BNM who writes novels about the NBA in forum posts

At least if he's gonna write novels, they're intelligent ones.

 

[Chupacabra]

Now Melo is trolling you guys (with that video)...

eh, that is to cryptic to troll. Can't make out anything from it. I thought it looks more like Blazer colors than Rockets to be honest (gray, black, red). Anything he post is like "How does this mean he is coming to the Rockets?". It has gotten so bad with the fake news, and people looking at every detail for clues that half the responses are jokes or mimes.

 

[julius]

Wonder who The HCP is in ClutchLand

I bet he goes by CCP.

Caucasian Causing Panic.

 

[Boob-No-More]

Wonder who The HCP is in ClutchLand

No one. They deport Mexicans in that part of the country.

BNM

 

[SIeepwalker]

At least if he's gonna write novels, they're intelligent ones.

Never said the opposite

 

[BLAZINGGIANTS]

Never said the opposite

Never said you did.

 

[SIeepwalker]

Never said you did.

Never said you said I did






This is the thread to boost our message count, correct ?

 

[Minstrel]

Never said you did.

He never said you said he said the opposite.

 

[Nhawz]

Not sure if you fall into the short attention span tl;dr crowd, but if you do...

Executive summary: POR has more than enough to offer the Knicks for Carmelo, if he waives his NTC. HOU has nothing the Kicks would want - NOTHING.

The only way NYK gets either Nurkic or Collins is if they also include Porzingis. And even then, I think POR would hesitate to give up Nurkic. He is such a great fit, on both ends of the court, with the rest of our roster. After the Nurk trade, our team 3FG% skyrocketed and we became a top 10 defense. That's how important he is to this team. Mason Plumlee isn't a bad player - great motor and one of the best passing bigs in the league, but he has limitations that Nurk doesn't have. On paper, the difference doesn't look that big. On the court, it's huge.

Even without Nukic and Collins, we have everything a rebuilding team, like the Knicks, could want.

We have a young, improving 23-year old proven NBA starter they covet in Maurice Harkless, who is locked in for three more years on a very team friendly, below market contract. HOU has nothing close to that.

We have a decent expiring contract in Ed Davis. He could be part of a package to make the salaries match and will be long gone and off their cap by the time they need to give extensions to Porzingis, Hernangomez and the rest of their young players. HOU's only significant expiring contract is Trevor Ariza. His salary is comparable to Davis', but supposedly CP3 doesn't want HOU to trade Ariza. This is the only trade asset where HOU is equal to POR, and you'd still need to include Ryan Anderson, or possibly Eric Gordon plus a few of the small non-guaranteed contracts Morey has been hording. Would either team for an Ariza + Gordon for Melo swap? It further depletes the Rockets already thin roster and it gives NYK two players over the age of 29 - one who is locked in for 3 more years. Not exactly something of interest to a rebuilding team.

POR also owns all of their future first round picks. HOU already gave up their 2018 first round pick in the CP3 trade. Due to the Ted Stepien Rule, that means 2020 is the first available first round pick the Rockets can trade. Do the Knicks really want to wait three years for what would likely be a pick in the late 20s? The Blazer can offer their 2018 first round pick and if necessary both their 2018 and 2020 picks.

POR also has a $12.9 million traded player exception from the Allen Crabbe trade. It cannot be used in combination with other salaries, but it happens to be a perfect match for Courtney Lee's salary. So, as part of a separate trade, we can also take one of the Knicks biggest contracts off their hands. At 32, Lee clearly doesn't fit in the the Knicks rebuilding plans. POR actually needs help at back up shooting guard after trading Crabbe. Lee would replace Crabbe's lost shooting, and is a much better defender than Crabbe. He would actually be a useful 3 and D guy coming of the bench for POR. Using that TPE for Lee would push POR back over the luxury tax threshold, but if Paul Allen wants Carmelo Anthony badly enough, he will bite the bullet and pay the tax. HOU has nothing comparable to offer NYK.

Portland also has other young players that are still on their rookie contracts than that Knicks may want. Noah Vonleh is still only 21 (will turn 22 later this month). So, age wise, he fits in well with their rebuilding plan. He has started over half of POR's games at PF the last two seasons. His offensive game is still immature, but he is an above average rebounder and excellent defender. He played much better next to Nurkic, than he did next to Plumlee. Over the last month of the season he scored in double digits 8 times and had 6 games with at least 11 rebounds. He would be great coming off the bench in New York. Portland drafted two guys in Collins and Swanigan that play the same position. So, Vonleh is expendable.

Finally, the other thing that has changed over the last month is almost every team that had enough cap space to act as a third party and absorb Ryan Anderson's contract has used that cap space up. BRK was Morey's best bet and Neil Olshey eliminated that option with the Allen Crabbe trade. Olshey killed two birds with one stone. He caused BRK to use up their cap space and acquired a $12.9 million TPE that could prove to be a valuable trade asset in the pursuit of Carmelo Anthony.

There is absolutely zero doubt that should Carmelo expands he list of acceptable destinations to include Portland, the Blazers easily have the assets to make it happen. They can offer the Knicks a package that includes a prove young player they covet on a team friendly contract (Harkless), an expiring contract to make the salaries work (Davis), an additional young player (Vonleh), one or more future first round draft picks (2018 or 2018 and 2020) and they have a huge TPE that can be used for the Knicks to offload a highly paid 32-year old who no longer fits their plans.

HOU can't come close to that. Right now, what HOU has to offer has negative net value to a rebuilding team. Ryan Anderson is a 1-dimensional 3-point shooter who has an absolutely terrible contract. He is also 29-years old, injury prone and doesn't play defense. He also plays the same position as the 22-year old face of the franchise that is the very heart of the Knicks rebuilding effort. Morey overpaid Anderson and nobody else wants to bail him out and take Ryan Anderson off his hands to help the Rockets get better. No rebuilding team wants Anderson, and even if they did, would not give up assets the Knicks would want. No contending team has the cap space to absorb Anderson's contract and wouldn't willingly help the competition get better if they could. Anderson is pretty much locked in as HOU's $20 million a year 4th option.

Face it, after the CP3 trade, the cupboard in HOU is bare. Acquiring one disgruntled star guts your roster. Acquiring two is damn near impossible. Morey shot his wad on the CP3 trade. He has nothing left to offer the Knicks and is desperately seeking another team to help him out. The problem is, HOU is so devoid of trade assets, he doesn't have anything anyone else would want either.

BNM

I want to drop this in clutch fans

 

[julius]

Not sure if you fall into the short attention span tl;dr crowd, but if you do...

Executive summary: POR has more than enough to offer the Knicks for Carmelo, if he waives his NTC. HOU has nothing the Kicks would want - NOTHING.

The only way NYK gets either Nurkic or Collins is if they also include Porzingis. And even then, I think POR would hesitate to give up Nurkic. He is such a great fit, on both ends of the court, with the rest of our roster. After the Nurk trade, our team 3FG% skyrocketed and we became a top 10 defense. That's how important he is to this team. Mason Plumlee isn't a bad player - great motor and one of the best passing bigs in the league, but he has limitations that Nurk doesn't have. On paper, the difference doesn't look that big. On the court, it's huge.

Even without Nukic and Collins, we have everything a rebuilding team, like the Knicks, could want.

We have a young, improving 23-year old proven NBA starter they covet in Maurice Harkless, who is locked in for three more years on a very team friendly, below market contract. HOU has nothing close to that.

We have a decent expiring contract in Ed Davis. He could be part of a package to make the salaries match and will be long gone and off their cap by the time they need to give extensions to Porzingis, Hernangomez and the rest of their young players. HOU's only significant expiring contract is Trevor Ariza. His salary is comparable to Davis', but supposedly CP3 doesn't want HOU to trade Ariza. This is the only trade asset where HOU is equal to POR, and you'd still need to include Ryan Anderson, or possibly Eric Gordon plus a few of the small non-guaranteed contracts Morey has been hording. Would either team for an Ariza + Gordon for Melo swap? It further depletes the Rockets already thin roster and it gives NYK two players over the age of 29 - one who is locked in for 3 more years. Not exactly something of interest to a rebuilding team.

POR also owns all of their future first round picks. HOU already gave up their 2018 first round pick in the CP3 trade. Due to the Ted Stepien Rule, that means 2020 is the first available first round pick the Rockets can trade. Do the Knicks really want to wait three years for what would likely be a pick in the late 20s? The Blazer can offer their 2018 first round pick and if necessary both their 2018 and 2020 picks.

POR also has a $12.9 million traded player exception from the Allen Crabbe trade. It cannot be used in combination with other salaries, but it happens to be a perfect match for Courtney Lee's salary. So, as part of a separate trade, we can also take one of the Knicks biggest contracts off their hands. At 32, Lee clearly doesn't fit in the the Knicks rebuilding plans. POR actually needs help at back up shooting guard after trading Crabbe. Lee would replace Crabbe's lost shooting, and is a much better defender than Crabbe. He would actually be a useful 3 and D guy coming of the bench for POR. Using that TPE for Lee would push POR back over the luxury tax threshold, but if Paul Allen wants Carmelo Anthony badly enough, he will bite the bullet and pay the tax. HOU has nothing comparable to offer NYK.

Portland also has other young players that are still on their rookie contracts than that Knicks may want. Noah Vonleh is still only 21 (will turn 22 later this month). So, age wise, he fits in well with their rebuilding plan. He has started over half of POR's games at PF the last two seasons. His offensive game is still immature, but he is an above average rebounder and excellent defender. He played much better next to Nurkic, than he did next to Plumlee. Over the last month of the season he scored in double digits 8 times and had 6 games with at least 11 rebounds. He would be great coming off the bench in New York. Portland drafted two guys in Collins and Swanigan that play the same position. So, Vonleh is expendable.

Finally, the other thing that has changed over the last month is almost every team that had enough cap space to act as a third party and absorb Ryan Anderson's contract has used that cap space up. BRK was Morey's best bet and Neil Olshey eliminated that option with the Allen Crabbe trade. Olshey killed two birds with one stone. He caused BRK to use up their cap space and acquired a $12.9 million TPE that could prove to be a valuable trade asset in the pursuit of Carmelo Anthony.

There is absolutely zero doubt that should Carmelo expands he list of acceptable destinations to include Portland, the Blazers easily have the assets to make it happen. They can offer the Knicks a package that includes a prove young player they covet on a team friendly contract (Harkless), an expiring contract to make the salaries work (Davis), an additional young player (Vonleh), one or more future first round draft picks (2018 or 2018 and 2020) and they have a huge TPE that can be used for the Knicks to offload a highly paid 32-year old who no longer fits their plans.

HOU can't come close to that. Right now, what HOU has to offer has negative net value to a rebuilding team. Ryan Anderson is a 1-dimensional 3-point shooter who has an absolutely terrible contract. He is also 29-years old, injury prone and doesn't play defense. He also plays the same position as the 22-year old face of the franchise that is the very heart of the Knicks rebuilding effort. Morey overpaid Anderson and nobody else wants to bail him out and take Ryan Anderson off his hands to help the Rockets get better. No rebuilding team wants Anderson, and even if they did, would not give up assets the Knicks would want. No contending team has the cap space to absorb Anderson's contract and wouldn't willingly help the competition get better if they could. Anderson is pretty much locked in as HOU's $20 million a year 4th option.

Face it, after the CP3 trade, the cupboard in HOU is bare. Acquiring one disgruntled star guts your roster. Acquiring two is damn near impossible. Morey shot his wad on the CP3 trade. He has nothing left to offer the Knicks and is desperately seeking another team to help him out. The problem is, HOU is so devoid of trade assets, he doesn't have anything anyone else would want either.

BNM

while that is all true, keep in mind..the NBA hates Houston, so obviously this will happen for them.

 

[Boob-No-More]

I want to drop this in clutch fans

Go for it!

BNM

 

[Chupacabra]

Not sure if you fall into the short attention span tl;dr crowd, but if you do...

...
It further depletes the Rockets already thin roster and it gives NYK two players over the age of 29 - one who is locked in for 3 more years. Not exactly something of interest to a rebuilding team.
...
Face it, after the CP3 trade, the cupboard in HOU is bare. Acquiring one disgruntled star guts your roster. Acquiring two is damn near impossible. Morey shot his wad on the CP3 trade. He has nothing left to offer the Knicks and is desperately seeking another team to help him out. The problem is, HOU is so devoid of trade assets, he doesn't have anything anyone else would want either.

BNM

Thanks, good info.

The only thing that is not true is the depleted roster. The trade for CP3 involved a lot of rockets. but little value

Pat Bev - Starter, great guy, will be missed, but CP3 is an upgrade
Lou Williams - good scorer, 6MOY candidate. Him and EGo do similar things. easier to replace than EGo.
Dekker - Solid bench player, will end up being a solid bench player - Replaced with P J Tucker - Upgrade
Harrel - we played him out of position. We played him as our 3rd C. He is a 4, with no range. High energy guy. Might be a solid bench player - Replaced with Luc - upgrade
and 3 other players and a pick.
so roster was depleted of people, but only 1 starter.

The cupboard is bare of assets, which is the 2nd bolded area. This is true. That is making ther trade tough. The trade was done with Phil. His firing through a huge monkey-wrench into the works.
Morey will have to find a team that will accept RA, and the Knicks want whatever the equivalent salary returns. Like the article said, teams are getting slim.

 

[Chupacabra]

No one. They deport Mexicans in that part of the country.

BNM

Sanctuary City for however long that last.

 

[Chupacabra]

I want to drop this in clutch fans

it is know. We have pessimist and optimist about the trade. My thought is if anyone is going to pull it off, it will be Morey, as long as the price isn't too high.

 

[Chupacabra]

while that is all true, keep in mind..the NBA hates Houston, so obviously this will happen for them.

You know the NBA, NFL, MLB, ESPN, has an east coast bias and hates everything west of the Mississippi.
Wait ... NBA ... Thats the Laker/Celtic/Knicks bias. Ignore the 1st line.
We have so many conspiracy theories it is hard to keep track of. /s

I am surprised how many people think NBA, NFL, media plan things against Houston.

 

[BLAZINGGIANTS]

Never said you said I did





This is the thread to boost our message count, correct ?

Never said you said I said you said I did.


And yes.

 

[THE HCP]

BUMP

 

[Boob-No-More]

Thanks, good info.

The only thing that is not true is the depleted roster. The trade for CP3 involved a lot of rockets. but little value

Pat Bev - Starter, great guy, will be missed, but CP3 is an upgrade
Lou Williams - good scorer, 6MOY candidate. Him and EGo do similar things. easier to replace than EGo.
Dekker - Solid bench player, will end up being a solid bench player - Replaced with P J Tucker - Upgrade
Harrel - we played him out of position. We played him as our 3rd C. He is a 4, with no range. High energy guy. Might be a solid bench player - Replaced with Luc - upgrade
and 3 other players and a pick.
so roster was depleted of people, but only 1 starter.

The cupboard is bare of assets, which is the 2nd bolded area. This is true. That is making ther trade tough. The trade was done with Phil. His firing through a huge monkey-wrench into the works.
Morey will have to find a team that will accept RA, and the Knicks want whatever the equivalent salary returns. Like the article said, teams are getting slim.

I wasn't referring to your depth chart. I meant depleted of trade assets. It takes several pieces to trade for a superstar. HOU used up those piece to get CP3 and the pieces they signed to replace them can't be traded until December 15. So today, HOU has nothing the Knicks want in a trade and nothing a third party would accept in exchange for giving the Knicks something they would value.

BNM

 

[Chupacabra]

I wasn't referring to your depth chart. I meant depleted of trade assets. It takes several pieces to trade for a superstar. HOU used up those piece to get CP3 and the pieces they signed to replace them can't be traded until December 15. So today, HOU has nothing the Knicks want in a trade and nothing a third party would accept in exchange for giving the Knicks something they would value.

BNM

True, and that is our stalemate. So we hope someone(including the Knicks) will change their mind on RA, or the Knicks lower the asking price, or Melo warms to another team.

To put chances on where he ends up? lots of variables and using the SWAG method

45% Rockets - Mainly cause CP3 on the team, Knicks had told him and others he would be a rocket (before Perry), the players think he is coming, Vegas has us as the favorites.
35% Knicks - Mainly cause Melo doesn't change his mind easily from reports (so reluctant to go to another team), Perry is trying to make a name for himself ... and do right for the knicks (for once).
20% other teams - unknowns

 

[SIeepwalker]

Never said you said I said you said I did.


And yes.

Never.... eh I give up

 

[Boob-No-More]

True, and that is our stalemate. So we hope someone(including the Knicks) will change their mind on RA, or the Knicks lower the asking price, or Melo warms to another team.

To put chances on where he ends up? lots of variables and using the SWAG method

45% Rockets - Mainly cause CP3 on the team, Knicks had told him and others he would be a rocket (before Perry), the players think he is coming, Vegas has us as the favorites.
35% Knicks - Mainly cause Melo doesn't change his mind easily from reports (so reluctant to go to another team), Perry is trying to make a name for himself ... and do right for the knicks (for once).
20% other teams - unknowns

Why in god's name would the Knicks change their mind about Ryan Anderson??? In that last month, he hasn't gotten any younger, any cheaper or learned how to play defense? He is the same Ryan Anderson he was a month ago. Even Phil wasn't dumb enough to make that trade. The Knicks didn't want Anderson then, and they sure as hell don't want him now. Especially now that they have a competent GM that isn't openly fueding with his start player.

Nothing that has happened in the last month makes a Carmelo to HOU trade any more likely. In fact, two significant things have happened that make it less likely - as mentioned the hiring of a competent GM that isn't publicly pushing an anti-Carmelo agenda and the number if teams with the cap space to absorb Ryan Anderson's contract.

As mentioned, Neil Olshey eliminated BRK from contention as a facilitator. Due to his predecessor giving all of BRK's first round picks to the Celtics, Sean Marks has shown he's willing to take on other teams' bad contracts, as long as they come with a first round draft pick attached. Thanks to Crabbe's $19.3 million salary, the Nets are now $13.5 million short of being able to absorb Anderson's contract, and since Morey already gave up your 2018 first round pick, it's not like you had anything to induce BRK (or anyone else) to eat Anderson's contract anyway.

BNM

 

[riverman]

I bet he goes by CCP.

Caucasian Causing Panic.

nah....PCP....Pollack Causing Panic!....they even named a drug after him!!!

 

[SlyPokerDog]

Never.... eh I give up

Close but a little off.

Never gonna give you up
Never gonna let you down
Never gonna run around and desert you
Never gonna make you cry
Never gonna say goodbye
Never gonna tell a lie and hurt you

 

[Dougnsalem]

No HE makes our fan base look clueless!

No worse than you....

What's your issue with me? You always come at me sideways, and I don't think I've ever even interacted with you on here? Do you have a problem with me we should address?

You're getting your panties in a bunch over that comment? REALLY??? Look buddy, you are the only person on this board that has been disrespectful towards me. SO, if there's something I say that offends you, well..... You can Kiss. My. Ass.

YOU are the one who was flipping King shit. So you get pissed when someone flips it back at you??? Whatever. Stop playing the victim....

 

[Chupacabra]

...
Nothing that has happened in the last month makes a Carmelo to HOU trade any more likely. In fact, two significant things have happened that make it less likely - as mentioned the hiring of a competent GM that isn't publicly pushing an anti-Carmelo agenda and the number if teams with the cap space to absorb Ryan Anderson's contract.
...
BNM

As long as the $ is equal, teams can still trade. Rockets have alot of pieces to move (NGs and draft and stash guys) to get with in the 125%+100K. so we can take on more $ to match.

 

[SwissBlazer]

As long as the $ is equal, teams can still trade. Rockets have alot of pieces to move (NGs and draft and stash guys) to get with in the 125%+100K. so we can take on more $ to match.

What do you think about my guy Capela. Untradeable in your opinion ?

 

[Chupacabra]

Why in god's name would the Knicks change their mind about Ryan Anderson??? BNM

Ryan's contract is what sucks. He is not a bad player. He was injury free with the rockets, except when he cut his finger/thumb taking out the trash. I get the injury prone label though. and I said the others teams (including the knicks). Does not mean the knicks are the only ones that can change their mind. Utah can use a stretch 4. Toronto.

 

[H.C.]

Ryan's contract is what sucks. He is not a bad player. He was injury free with the rockets, except when he cut his finger/thumb taking out the trash. I get the injury prone label though. and I said the others teams (including the knicks). Does not mean the knicks are the only ones that can change their mind. Utah can use a stretch 4. Toronto.

The geko's resigned Ibaka 3 years 65mil.
Reported by espn on july 2nd.

I think most on s2 will agree with you saying Anderson isn't a bad player. It's the 20mil per he makes for the next 3 seasons that takes him from a valuable asset. To an albatross contract.