Science What is a racist?

[Chris Craig]

It is my observation, these are your observations capped with you judgement.
But you use a word you can not define nor reliably define when it is correctly use.

I hope we can do better.

I know when it is correctly used. I may not have experienced much of it first hand, but I have seen it. I have seen how terrible it is. I know what it is in that way. And I call it by its name. I feel I have defined it as best I can. It is hate manifested as the product of fear.

Judgment? I am not judging my dad. I understand why he had certain views. I don't blame him. I blame a society that has perpetuated such views. That is not to say I do not hold him responsible for his words and actions. I am simply calling it what it is.

 

[MarAzul]

Its both racism and classicism, two different things. It just happens to be one circumstance where both are in play.

Do you know both are in play or you do not know which it is?

 

[riverman]

Do you know both are in play or you do not know which it is?

words are just words but it's not the word or definition...it's how they are used or the effect they have when directed at someone...a word used with serious intent or contentious aggression is defined by tone more than the dictionary...the same word can be used in sarcasm or humor with a different result.
ex: It's going to rain!
It's going to rain?
It's going to rain. one may mean excitement...one disappointment and one inquisitive...all containing the exact same words. Racist is a word I seldom use but when I do, it's used as a negative thing.

 

[MarAzul]

I think the definition is clear

Do you have a definition better than the dictionary?

Can you express this definition that will attract a consensus acceptance in this forum. Exclude me if you like.

 

[Chris Craig]

Do you know both are in play or you do not know which it is?

Did you read my post. I said both are in play. Its not either or. Its both. Its a circumstance where both are in play

 

[MarAzul]

words are just words but it's not the word or definition...it's how they are used or the effect they have when directed at someone...a word used with serious intent or contentious aggression is defined by tone more than the dictionary...the same word can be used in sarcasm or humor with a different result.
ex: It's going to rain!
It's going to rain?
It's going to rain. one may mean excitement...one disappointment and one inquisitive...all containing the exact same words. Racist is a word I seldom use but when I do, it's used as a negative thing.

Nodoubt you are correct.
So then when the word is flung out there, the meaning is of the intent of the user. Do I have the hang of it?

 

[Chris Craig]

Do you have a definition better than the dictionary?

Can you express this definition that will attract a consensus acceptance in this forum. Exclude me if you like.

Must I repeat my self

Hate against a person based on race, manifested as the product of fear.

 

[Chris Craig]

words are just words but it's not the word or definition...it's how they are used or the effect they have when directed at someone...a word used with serious intent or contentious aggression is defined by tone more than the dictionary...the same word can be used in sarcasm or humor with a different result.
ex: It's going to rain!
It's going to rain?
It's going to rain. one may mean excitement...one disappointment and one inquisitive...all containing the exact same words. Racist is a word I seldom use but when I do, it's used as a negative thing.

When does the word racist not refer to a negative thing?

 

[MarAzul]

Did you read my post. I said both are in play. Its not either or. Its both. Its a circumstance where both are in play

Ok, can you share how you know?

 

[Chris Craig]

Ok, can you share how you know?

I have read a lot of books

 

[MarAzul]

Must I repeat my self

Do you feel abused?

 

[MarAzul]

I have read a lot of books

Very good.
Can you share how you know.

 

[Chris Craig]

Do you feel abused?

Nah, I feel that if you actually read my posts, you'd save yourself a lot of time

 

[barfo]

Do you have a definition better than the dictionary?

Maybe. Can you define the word 'definition' first? And 'have'? And 'the'?

Because if you want to talk about those things we need a clear definition that everyone can agree on, better than the dictionary.

barfo

 

[Chris Craig]

Very good.
Can you share how you know.

How they are both in play here in the forum?

 

[MarAzul]

How they are both in play here in the forum?

No, I can't recall anyone that speaks of the Ainu. None that can definitively say why and how their oppression is of racial hate and how it is of class hate. You indicated you knew, I merely ask you to share.

 

[MarAzul]

Such insight might be helpful closer to home.

 

[MarAzul]

Nah, I feel that if you actually read my posts, you'd save yourself a lot of time

They require very little time to read.

 

[MarAzul]

You misquoted me

Yes I did. My error. Thanks for your input Chris.

 

[Chris Craig]

No, I can't recall anyone that speaks of the Ainu. None that can definitively say why and how their oppression is of racial hate and how it is of class hate. You indicated you knew, I merely ask you to share.

I like to read about history. I have read a bit on Japan's history. From my point of view there seems to be both racism and classicism in play. Japan has revised their history to downplay the significance of the Ainu people. They have disregarded them. They have discriminated against the Ainu people by not recognizing their race. Racism. They have discriminated against them because of their way of life. They seem them as a people at the bottom of the heap to be forgotten. Classicism.

 

[MarAzul]

Well I take it hate is a key ingredient in Chris' definition. Hate motivated by fear. Superiority may not be the salient emotion being expressed.

Can this reach a consensus? Even in this forum?

I suppose it is possible. I think you could find hate for that danged old MarAzul! But hell, he is the racist to some, and he can't even experience racism!! How about Toyota San? What the hell does he have to fear of a few Ainu up in Hokkaido?

Better not close the thread yet, more input needed.

 

[Chris Craig]

Well I take it hate is a key ingredient in Chris' world. Hate motivated by fear. Superiority may not be the salient emotion being expressed.

Can this reach a consensus? Even in this forum?

I suppose it is possible. I think you could find hate for that danged old MarAzul! But hell, he is the racist to some, and he can't even experience racism!! How about Toyota San? What the hell does he have to fear of a few Ainu up in Hokkaido?

Better not close the thread yet, more input needed.

Hate motivated by fear yes, that is racism at its root. Superiority is a mask, an attempt to avert the fear.

I don't hate you old blue sea. Not at all. I don't agree with you all the time. Sometimes I do. You can experience racism. I never said you couldn't.

The Ainu are simply trying to keep their culture alive. Most have been assimilated into the japanese culture. Nothing wrong with diversity.

 

[MarAzul]

I like to read about history. I have read a bit on Japan's history. From my point of view there seems to be both racism and classicism in play. Japan has revised their history to downplay the significance of the Ainu people. They have disregarded them. They have discriminated against the Ainu people by not recognizing their race. Racism. They have discriminated against them because of their way of life. They seem them as a people at the bottom of the heap to be forgotten. Classicism.

Thank you for sharing. I tend to agree but I see no fear.

 

[Chris Craig]

Thank you for sharing. I tend to agree but I see no fear.

The Japanese fear the cultures of other races in their society. They value their own to such extreme, they see no other, nor wish for cultures to integrate. They are afraid of such change. They do not comprehend diversity only conformity and adherance

 

[MarAzul]

They are afraid of such change. They do not comprehend diversity only conformity and adherance

I think I might word it slightly different.
They desire very little change.
Their Islands are full, little room for diversity even if they desired it.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

I think I might word it slightly different.
The desire very little change.
Their Islands are full, little room for diversity even if they desired it.

But why do "they desire very little change". Is it possibly because they fear the potential negative impacts of said change?

 

[dviss1]

Racism = Hey you different looking people who are only 1% different... We're afraid you're gonna take our stuff because we really don't know you, we just assume you are based upon very little info! And hey! We're gonna set up systems of oppression that help keep you in your situation.

Those that stand idly by while the system oppresses are just as bad as the racists.

"There comes a time when silence is betrayal." "Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter." "In the end, we will remember not the words of our enemies, but the silence of our friends."

- Martin Luther King

 

[riverman]

When does the word racist not refer to a negative thing?

when for example a white supremacist proudly declares their right to be one

 

[Chris Craig]

when for example a white supremacist proudly declares their right to be one

Isn't that a negative thing

 

[riverman]

Isn't that a negative thing

to me yes...to them unfortunately a jaded badge of honor...Hitler sense of bullshit superiority..I'd like to see the whole practice become something shunned like cannibalism or head hunting...sort of looked at in history as a taboo practice society has outgrown...a day when people collectively looked upon racism with horror and shock in the same way they look upon other things these days