What playoff team could most use Jerami Grant?

[Natebishop3]

I'm intrigued by New Orleans.

They're underperforming and supposedly they want to move Ingram because he wants a full max.

 

[RR7]

I'm intrigued by New Orleans.

They're underperforming and supposedly they want to move Ingram because he wants a full max.

View attachment 67031

But Ingram is better than Grant and they have Murphy and Jones on the wings, don't wanna lock in to 4 years of Jerami

 

[Natebishop3]

But Ingram is better than Grant and they have Murphy and Jones on the wings, don't wanna lock in to 4 years of Jerami

True, but they're looking at losing him for nothing this summer and nobody wants to pay the guy a max deal, so why would they give them something valuable? They gotta do something.

 

[CJ_is_Gone]

True, but they're looking at losing him for nothing this summer and nobody wants to pay the guy a max deal, so why would they give them something valuable? They gotta do something.

So Pelicans 'spend' 2 first for a worse player, just so they don't loose Ingram for nothing???

You logic makes absolutely no sense...
Given those choices, they would be much better off letting BI just walk.

 

[tlongII]

You'd have to tell me who the playoff teams are first.

 

[blazerkor]

I still think it's the Lakers.

We get: Rui Hachimura to flip, we take Vincent and Reddish to waive. They send us a 2029 swap with no protections, they get the worst of our pick, Boston's, Milwaukee's and their own. They also send us a top 3 protected 2030 FRP which rolls to 2031 if in the top 3 and is top 3 protected again but if it lands in the top 3 both in 2030 and 2031 then we get their 2031 second round pick.

They get: Grant


This trade begs the question, what playoff team could most use Rui?

 

[Sheldon Shape]

I still think it's the Lakers.

We get: Rui Hachimura to flip, we take Vincent and Reddish to waive. They send us a 2029 swap with no protections, they get the worst of our pick, Boston's, Milwaukee's and their own. They also send us a top 3 protected 2030 FRP which rolls to 2031 if in the top 3 and is top 3 protected again but if it lands in the top 3 both in 2030 and 2031 then we get their 2031 second round pick.

They get: Grant


This trade begs the question, what playoff team could most use Rui?

Nobody is paying a 1st for Rui. Maybe a couple 2nds.

 

[BankTeller]

I saw a Grant proposal for Middleton + a young prospect package that I liked as a bare minimum offer, and I’d expect their ‘31 1st top 10 protected that turns into multiple 2nds if not conveyed as well.

 

[Natebishop3]

So Pelicans 'spend' 2 first for a worse player, just so they don't loose Ingram for nothing???

You logic makes absolutely no sense...
Given those choices, they would be much better off letting BI just walk.

They're pretty comparable. Ingram is younger but he wants a full max contract. Grant is locked in for the next 4 years at reasonable rate compared to Ingram.

If they want to win now, which maybe they don't anymore. Zion has looked mediocre. CJ is.... CJ. But losing BI for nothing would be bad.

 

[Foxx]

Milwaukee! He's best buds with Dame!

(actually, he would be a decent fit there, IMHO, as he could be a solid 3rd option)

Not a bad call. Let’s take the rest of their picks

 

[SharpeScooterShooter]

The Blazers when we nail the 6th seed next year as we continue to get better.

 

[blazerkor]

Nobody is paying a 1st for Rui. Maybe a couple 2nds.

I was thinking that maybe if the Lakers chipped in the Clippers second in the upcoming draft and we put in the Wolves second rounder in 2027 then maybe the Hawks would do Rui and those two seconds for Larry Nance Jr and the Lakers 2025 FRP.

 

[wizenheimer]

why would the Lakers look at Grant as enough of an upgrade over Rui to be willing to add a first round pick to the equation:



Rui is playing better. Higher efficiency with solid production

besides that, using Rui, the Lakers would have to make a 3 for 1 trade; they'd need to sign somebody and that would likely put them over the 2nd apron

 

[Natebishop3]

why would the Lakers look at Grant as enough of an upgrade over Rui to be willing to add a first round pick to the equation:

View attachment 67228

Rui is playing better. Higher efficiency with solid production

besides that, using Rui, the Lakers would have to make a 3 for 1 trade; they'd need to sign somebody and that would likely put them over the 2nd apron

Because a 5 game sample size is silly?

 

[Pinwheel1]

Because a 5 game sample size is silly?

I was thinking the same.....when you quoted Ant's 3-point shooting stats.

 

[wizenheimer]

Because a 5 game sample size is silly?

ok...then last season + this season:



so again I ask, how is this enough of an upgrade that would warrant the Lakers giving up a 1st round pick, make a 3 for 1 trade, and go over the 2nd apron?

I'd also point out something that the Lakers would be well aware of: those numbers for Grant are him being either option 1a or 1b, while Rui's numbers are 4th option numbers. Grant would be a 3rd or 4th option for the Lakers

 

[RR7]

Do you think NBA GMs pull up per 100 stats absent of role, and just compare across the board to determine who would be a better player or fit with their squad? I'm not saying Grant is going to land us 2 1sts, or even a 1st and Rui from the Lakers, but I highly doubt teams operate in statistical vacuums and say ok, we're good with what we have, because this guy playing off of lebron and AD is currently giving us this, while this other guy, who has had to lead a garbage squad in PDX, is doing something similar.

 

[blazerkor]

ok...then last season + this season:

View attachment 67229

so again I ask, how is this enough of an upgrade that would warrant the Lakers giving up a 1st round pick, make a 3 for 1 trade, and go over the 2nd apron?

I'd also point out something that the Lakers would be well aware of: those numbers for Grant are him being either option 1a or 1b, while Rui's numbers are 4th option numbers. Grant would be a 3rd or 4th option for the Lakers

I think that Jerami would be far more consistent and efficient as a 3rd or 4th option than he is as a 1a or 1b. I don't think the upgrade is worth giving up 2 FRPs like Joe has said he would need but I do think the Lakers would give up at least one FRP if not that and a swap.

When you say it has to be a three for one, you act like that's a bad thing. The Lakers get off of Vincent's contract for next season and they won't care about replacing a guy like Reddish. They're currently carrying 15 players so they could easily just replace Vincent and Reddish with a non guaranteed undrafted free agent and then pick up someone who could contribute in the playoffs off of the buyout market and I think that would keep them under the second apron.

I guess the question to you is, do you think that Jerami is a better player as a third or fourth option with LeBron and AD than Rui is and if so do you think it's a big enough difference to cost the Lakers a FRP and maybe a swap? When considering this forget the numbers because the situations the two guys are playing in are way too different to try and compare them apples to apples.

 

[wizenheimer]

I think that Jerami would be far more consistent and efficient as a 3rd or 4th option than he is as a 1a or 1b. I don't think the upgrade is worth giving up 2 FRPs like Joe has said he would need but I do think the Lakers would give up at least one FRP if not that and a swap.

When you say it has to be a three for one, you act like that's a bad thing. The Lakers get off of Vincent's contract for next season and they won't care about replacing a guy like Reddish. They're currently carrying 15 players so they could easily just replace Vincent and Reddish with a non guaranteed undrafted free agent and then pick up someone who could contribute in the playoffs off of the buyout market and I think that would keep them under the second apron.

I guess the question to you is, do you think that Jerami is a better player as a third or fourth option with LeBron and AD than Rui is and if so do you think it's a big enough difference to cost the Lakers a FRP and maybe a swap? When considering this forget the numbers because the situations the two guys are playing in are way to different to try and compare them apples to apples.

why hasn't it happened yet?

 

[Pinwheel1]

I guess the question to you is, do you think that Jerami is a better player as a third or fourth option with LeBron and AD than Rui is and if so do you think it's a big enough difference to cost the Lakers a FRP and maybe a swap? When considering this forget the numbers because the situations the two guys are playing in are way to different to try and compare them apples to apples.

I think this is key when we look at shooting stats. Now I know some fans will argue that he is getting paid too much to be a 3rd or 4th option, but teams like the Lakers who want to win now, don't care about long-term salaries.

 

[blazerkor]

why hasn't it happened yet?

I honestly think Joe is trying to get two FRPs for him and that is too much. One FRP is probably the most likely and Joe might get a team to throw in a swap too but that team would need to really value what they project Jerami would bring as a role player instead of a 1a/1b type guy.

That being said, you answered my question with a question. Again, do you think that Jerami is more valuable than Rui is in that role and would that difference be worth a FRP if you were the Lakers GM?

 

[Natebishop3]

ok...then last season + this season:

View attachment 67229

so again I ask, how is this enough of an upgrade that would warrant the Lakers giving up a 1st round pick, make a 3 for 1 trade, and go over the 2nd apron?

I'd also point out something that the Lakers would be well aware of: those numbers for Grant are him being either option 1a or 1b, while Rui's numbers are 4th option numbers. Grant would be a 3rd or 4th option for the Lakers

I want to call attention to two key things that Jerami does that Rui does not do.



Jerami gets to the line MUCH more than Rui. He more than doubled the number of attempts last season and he shot something like 8% better from the line.



He also passes the ball. Almost twice as many assists.

Getting to the line and passing the ball are two very key skills on a playoff team.

 

[wizenheimer]

That being said, you answered my question with a question. Again, do you think that Jerami is more valuable than Rui is in that role and would that difference be worth a FRP if you were the Lakers GM?

I really thought I answered that question in my posts. Is Grant better than Rui? As long as rebounding doesn't matter, yes. Is he better enough that the Lakers would risk giving up a 1st round pick after Lebron has retired and AD could have walked? That's 5 drafts from now, at the earliest. I am extremely skeptical about that

we'll see. It sure looks like several posters here are counting on the Lakers caving. I'm not

 

[Natebishop3]

I really thought I answered that question in my posts. Is Grant better than Rui? As long as rebounding doesn't matter, yes. Is he better enough that the Lakers would risk giving up a 1st round pick after Lebron has retired and AD could have walked? That's 5 drafts from now, at the earliest. I am extremely skeptical about that

we'll see. It sure looks like several posters here are counting on the Lakers caving. I'm not

No. I don't think they'll cave. I think their GM is a moron and he's gonna waste LeBron's last couple years.

 

[wizenheimer]

I want to call attention to two key things that Jerami does that Rui does not do.

View attachment 67233

Jerami gets to the line MUCH more than Rui. He more than doubled the number of attempts last season and he shot something like 8% better from the line.

View attachment 67234

He also passes the ball. Almost twice as many assists.

Getting to the line and passing the ball are two very key skills on a playoff team.

his assist rate has been around 12% the last 4-5 seasons. On the Lakers who have Lebron, Russell, Reaves, and AD; all better passers than Grant, I don't believe the Lakers would find Grant's passing to be a compelling factor. That's not to say it wouldn't be valued at some level. By the way, Grant's career assist rate is 9% and his high was 14.3%. Nurkic's career assist rate is 15.6% and his best was 21.4%. Not sure how much of a gauge that is, but it does offer some perspective

he does have a good FT rate. But again, he generally gets to the line by having the ball in his hands and driving into the paint. Those opportunities won't be as common as a Laker

maybe look at spot-up and catch & shoot stats as a primary component of the roles either Rui or Grant would play as a Laker. I'm not sure what they'll show but I'll look them up now

spot-up this season: Grant 72nd percentile....Rui 94th percentile
spot-up last season: Grant 66th percentile (2022-23; 2023-24 missing)....Rui 90th percentile

catch & shoot this season: Grant eFG 56.0%....Rui 76.5%
catch & shoot last season: Grant 62nd percentile....Rui 64th percentile

 

[PtldPlatypus]

Would just like to point out that since the season is in full force, the 15-man limit comes into play here. We wouldn't be able to trade Grant for 3 players unless we also opened up 2 more roster spots, even if we're waiving incomings. Sure, we'd only be losing Banton and Reath, but that shouldn't be ignored.

 

[SharpesTriumph]

why would the Lakers look at Grant as enough of an upgrade over Rui to be willing to add a first round pick to the equation:

View attachment 67228

Rui is playing better. Higher efficiency with solid production

besides that, using Rui, the Lakers would have to make a 3 for 1 trade; they'd need to sign somebody and that would likely put them over the 2nd apron

It makes much more sense to me if the Lakers can keep Rui and do the trade in December when Max Christie salary can be used instead.

 

[wizenheimer]

It makes much more sense to me if the Lakers can keep Rui and do the trade in December when Max Christie salary can be used instead.

I think it's very likely the case that the Lakers want to keep Russell for this season; and probably Rui as well

but I don't see how Christie's salary solves the 2nd apron issue. Grant's salary is 29.8M. To avoid 2nd apron hell, the Lakers have to at least match that in a 2-for-1 trade or exceed it by a couple of million in a 3-for-1 trade. According to Spotrac, the Lakers are only 45K below the 2nd apron



Vincent+Vanderbilt+Christie = 28.9M. So the three of them are 900K shy of matching Grant's salary

Russell + Vincent doesn't work either; and again, I'm thinking the Lakers are reluctant to move Russell

 

[beast blazer]

I really thought I answered that question in my posts. Is Grant better than Rui? As long as rebounding doesn't matter, yes. Is he better enough that the Lakers would risk giving up a 1st round pick after Lebron has retired and AD could have walked? That's 5 drafts from now, at the earliest. I am extremely skeptical about that

we'll see. It sure looks like several posters here are counting on the Lakers caving. I'm not

It was widely reported that they had a deal in place to send Rui + filler + 2 FRP then backed out and wanted to only offer 1.

You may not think that'd be a good deal for the Lakers, but I don't think the Lakers agree.

But the answer to your question: is that comparing the efficiency of high volume vs low volume shooters is flawed. Meyers Leonard is a perfect example, he had great shooting numbers because he was so hyper selective of his shots (to a fault).

I think Grant's efficiency would improve if he were the 3rd wheel with a super star on the team to keep him in line. He wouldn't be calling his own number as much.

 

[wizenheimer]

It was widely reported that they had a deal in place to send Rui + filler + 2 FRP then backed out and wanted to only offer 1.

You may not think that'd be a good deal for the Lakers, but I don't think the Lakers agree.

where was this widely reported?

the only thing I remember was speculation about Rui + Vincent + Knecht + a 1st. I don't believe there was any "reporting" about that. IIRC, that was advocated by Blazer fans during the summer after Knecht had signed (so, a 30-day hold)

this is the only thing I found and it's just a speculative trade from a guy at Bleacher Report:

"In a new proposal by Grant Hughes of Bleacher Report, Grant is sent to Los Angeles and Portland gets a nice haul in return.
In the deal, Portland would receive forward Rui Hachimura, guard Gabe Vincent, rookie guard Dalton Knecht, and a 2029 first-round draft pick. This is probably about as good as Portland will get for Grant, especially with his massive contract."

https://www.si.com/nba/trailblazers...l-sends-blazers-jerami-grant-to-lakers-ml0802