Rumor What's going on in Portland? (1 Viewer)

[riverman]

Ground hog day....

 

[Orion Bailey]

Nobody in this thread has control over their city or the police. What leader supported that behavior?

im not sure what you mean or are asking?

no one needs control of anything to point a finger and condemn.
My comment had nothing to do with leaders or control it had to do with how some in this forum were treated for simply asserting vandalism is wrong and will stem the tide of a good cause.
Can you please clarify yourself, im not understanding the question.

 

[Orion Bailey]

Yeah, so I believe evidence. Not rumors. So when the police decide they want to wear body cams to gather the evidence they are not currently gathering it will be much easier to keep the criminals in jail.

okay so now we're changing the goal posts to it being the cops fault there isn't evidence. Rather
Got it.

 

[julius]

OK, got it now. All the locals are cool with the situation. OK, @Stevenson, notwithstanding. But, what does he know.

Ok, guess you're going to continue not being serious about things. Good to know.

 

[jlprk]

So then i must ask, when is it possible to say the vandalism is bad without being labeled as having priorities wrong?

Never, if your priorities are the reverse of what they should be.

Try to see the cause of what you don't like, and change the cause.

 

[calvin natt]

I've seen no evidence to support that being true. Anybody arrested with evidence of committing harm or theft to people or property are to be charged and held according to the law.

There were people being released because of a lack of evidence of those things. But isn't that what we're supposed to do when we don't have evidence of a crime?

I believe 90% of the people arrested have had their charges dropped. I know a good chunk are within a day or two. The DA put this in place. There have been people arrested twice in two days.

 

[Lanny]

Never doubted that you were born in Portland. Not sure what that has to do with anything.

You've shared biased articles before. that's the point.

He grew up in house about a quarter mile from me and went to high school right across the street from where I now live. A useless factoid but yet interesting.

 

[ABM]

Ok, guess you're going to continue not being serious about things. Good to know.

I'm being totally serious. You seem to think most in here including yourself, are perfectly fine with the current state of affairs in Portland, and, as such, would prefer an outsider such as myself stay out of your local matters.

 

[Lanny]

All true.

Over the summer, I could’ve told you what they’re protesting. #BLM. I encouraged my children to go protest, and they did and they got teargassed and I was proud of them.

But someone please tell me and @ABM what they’re protesting now. Or answer the question of the original post - what is going on in Portland?

What are they protesting, what do they hope to accomplish, why is vandalizing the city acceptable.? How is it anything but a bunch of anarchists coming up with a “reason” to f with our beloved city?

anyone, anyone?

I and most of my neighbors have Black Lives Matter signs in our lawns right here in affluent Lake Oswego. Mine is right at the base of my lighted 20 foot American flag directly across the street from one of the larger high schools in Oregon. I use to have an Army flag just below but it wore out.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

IF someone gets arrested during any of these riots, they are promptly let out - many times same night. That’s like one of my sons stealing from 7-Eleven and I take him home, make him sit in his room for 20 mins and then let him out

Yes, if someone is arrested during a one of these riots for a misdemeanor or low jail time felony they are booked and then released. This is done because there is no safe place to hold them in the jail because of the pandemic. Then the DA gets the police reports and decides if they will pursue charges.

(Explaining this is not me supporting what the police or DA is doing.)

 

[Lanny]

And this makes the situation in Portland any different exactly how? Nashville is not making the national headlines other than the lone incident Cliffy so conveniently pointed out. Go back and read @Stevenson's comments if you're really wanting a more local perspective on the matter. I highly doubt we'd be seeing these same comments from you if he had been the only one posting the concern in this thread.

I don't like people attacking you with such vigor. Even when I disagree with you I never feel like attacking you. I do enjoy sticky my elbow in your ribs from time to time but that's because I like you. There, I said it.

 

[Orion Bailey]

Never, if your priorities are the reverse of what they should be.

Try to see the cause of what you don't like, and change the cause.

but what if you believe the cause will be exasperated by the vandalism? What if you believe that the vandalism gives ammunition to increase racial hatred and if we don't separate right from wrong period , then racism will continue to grow?

What if you believe that is exactly what racists want so they can rationalize their bigotry?

remember that saying... never say never...

 

[Lanny]

A poll of opinion doesn't have anything to with facts or reality.

There is cause for concern in every major city. It is a national problem which can not be solved effectively at the state or city level.

Polls that go against us should give us pause to reexamine our position.

 

[Lanny]

the issue last summer and again now, is that when myself or others even mentioned the vandalism was bad, we were accused of having priorities backwards, basically claiming, don't bring it up or your on the wrong side...

so you are saying no one was saying its acceptable, but you are also saying if someone brought the vandalism up as wrong, their priorities were fucked up.
Thats just semantics.
People were basically condemned for bringing it up, as borderline racists, having priorities fucked up, etc.

You dont see the no win situation for anyone who merely wanted to point out the vandalism will kill the good cause?

and then again, several people said “so what, the stores with damaged fronts have insurance”.
Thats also accepting the vandalism.


So then i must ask, when is it possible to say the vandalism is bad without being labeled as having priorities wrong?

Vandalism is bad. The End.

 

[calvin natt]

I and most of my neighbors have Black Lives Matter signs in our lawns right here in affluent Lake Oswego. Mine is right at the base of my lighted 20 foot American flag directly across the street from one of the larger high schools in Oregon. I use to have an Army flag just below but it wore out.

Its funny. I live here too and you see tons of BLM signs, not many American flags (unlike yourself) but LO is the most racist town in the world!!

 

[julius]

I'm being totally serious. You seem to think most in here including yourself, are perfectly fine with the current state of affairs in Portland, and, as such, would prefer an outsider such as myself stay out of your local matters.

no you're not, because no one has said that. We prefer that someone who is getting information 2nd and 3rd hand not tell people who live there what is happening as if they have a better grasp on what is going on. And we'd probably prefer it that when said person is informed of this, they don't double down and act like they're being picked on, nor would we prefer that person exhibit hyperbole and fallacious arguments.

But go ahead and argue against stuff no one said or mentioned. It suits you.

 

[Stevenson]

The point I am trying to make, and it surprises me to say this, is that at this point the mayor and police should be much tougher. Stop with the Portland nice, let's all share our feelings B.S. There seems to be no consequences (at least as far as I can see) for continued looting and vandalism.

Lock them up!

A little deterrence would go a long way imo.

 

[calvin natt]

no you're not, because no one has said that. We prefer that someone who is getting information 2nd and 3rd hand not tell people who live there what is happening as if they have a better grasp on what is going.

But go ahead and argue against stuff no one said or mentioned. It suits you.

But I don’t understand this. I live here. Portland is a fucking mess.

 

[Hoopguru]

The point I am trying to make, and it surprises me to say this, is that at this point the mayor and police should be much tougher. Stop with the Portland nice, let's all share our feelings B.S. There seems to be no consequences (at least as far as I can see) for continued looting and vandalism.

Lock them up!

A little deterrence would go a long way imo.

You must have some civil/law and order in open society. Otherwise it will fester like it has some.

 

[julius]

But I don’t understand this. I live here. Portland is a fucking mess.

You have to remember the whole "news from nashville" contingent was from a while ago, and he was trying to act like he knew that the entire city was in flames, riots and impossible to get around.

the city isn't in ruins, it's not unsafe to walk in town, and it was made into a boogie man by people who don't live here and in some cases, never have been here.

 

[BLAZINGGIANTS]

Y’all still arguing with some doucheba...ggery posts?

Y’all bein’ trolled. Don’t feed them!

 

[Phatguysrule]

im not sure what you mean or are asking?

no one needs control of anything to point a finger and condemn.
My comment had nothing to do with leaders or control it had to do with how some in this forum were treated for simply asserting vandalism is wrong and will stem the tide of a good cause.
Can you please clarify yourself, im not understanding the question.

My question wasn't about anybody in this forum. It was about the actual problem with an eye on actual solutions...

 

[Phatguysrule]

I believe 90% of the people arrested have had their charges dropped. I know a good chunk are within a day or two. The DA put this in place. There have been people arrested twice in two days.

Yes. The DA said they should not be arresting people who are protesting without EVIDENCE of harm to people or property. So when they arrest people who are just standing in the street those people will be released. And when they arrest that same person the next day they will be released again.

 

[Phatguysrule]

okay so now we're changing the goal posts to it being the cops fault there isn't evidence. Rather
Got it.

It's the cops fault if they aren't gathering better evidence... Who else's fault would it be? Are you advocating for holding people without evidence?

 

[Orion Bailey]

It's the cops fault if they aren't gathering better evidence... Who else's fault would it be? Are you advocating for holding people without evidence?

when they are outnumbered 100-1, you cant expect the cops’ cameras to catch everything, even if they are on...

seems like an excuse to accept vandalism to me.

 

[Phatguysrule]

The point I am trying to make, and it surprises me to say this, is that at this point the mayor and police should be much tougher. Stop with the Portland nice, let's all share our feelings B.S. There seems to be no consequences (at least as far as I can see) for continued looting and vandalism.

Lock them up!

A little deterrence would go a long way imo.

The mayor nor anybody else with any power thinks people committing vandalism is okay. If we could get evidence of that vandalism happening and arrest that person they would be charged. Nobody above the police is preventing that from happening. At least, not that I've been able to find evidence of.

 

[jlprk]

but what if you believe the cause will be exasperated by the vandalism? What if you believe that the vandalism gives ammunition to increase racial hatred and if we don't separate right from wrong period , then racism will continue to grow? What if you believe that is exactly what racists want so they can rationalize their bigotry?

Then how do you stop the police killings we read about? If you say through the legislative or legal systems, remember, that has been tried forever. They won't budge.

When, if ever, do you approve of using any anti-government method to change things?

Conservatives want us to live without using the government, until they see people do so.

 

[Orion Bailey]

The mayor nor anybody else with any power thinks people committing vandalism is okay. If we could get evidence of that vandalism happening and arrest that person they would be charged. Nobody above the police is preventing that from happening. At least, not that I've been able to find evidence of.

unless a fellow vandal is going to testify against his/her buddy, you are asking for near impossibilities. Cops must be on hand to witness and be them be evidence.
We can install cameras every five feet of every block downtown, but how muhc money will that cost and how much more when tye vandals tear them down?
The only way i can think of off hand is to drastically increase police presence on an already squeezed department.
How do you think that would go over, if done?


Let me ask you this, what would be your answer to stopping the vandalism, capturing and convicting the guilty?

 

[Orion Bailey]

Then how do you stop the police killings we read about? If you say through the legislative or legal systems, remember, that has been tried forever. They won't budge.

When, if ever, do you approve of using any anti-government method to change things?

well first, i would direct my malcontent at the government. Not small business owners.
shall i continue?
But lets not kid ourselves. Some are out there provoking chaos under the mask of a good cause. Hiding behind them.

 

[jlprk]

well first, i would direct my malcontent at the government. Not small business owners.
shall i continue?

Sure. As I just said, whatever you suggest has been tried forever, and the government won't budge. Fire away.