Rumor What's going on in Portland?

[RR7]

Ok, you called "them" out, generically, and held them accountable. You've done it multiple times over the last 2 months. What purpose did it serve? And why does it continue to be a point of emphasis here?

 

[Orion Bailey]

Ok, you called "them" out, generically, and held them accountable. You've done it multiple times over the last 2 months. What purpose did it serve? And why does it continue to be a point of emphasis here?

because i simply posted a link with a statement.

then you and several others came at me over it.

Made it all personal and then couldn’t handle the backlash of your insistence on making ME the focal point of the post instead of the news i posted.

typical for you and some others. But im just understanding that when certain people respond like that, they don't want a conversation, they wNt to defend their stance and call me out instead of just discuss the article i linked.

And then call me out as if I'm not able to have a conversation. Cracks me up.

I post a link aNd people took it a personal. I didn't call anyone out individually in it, but some people responded as if i did... that's what started this crap.

 

[Orion Bailey]

This is the norm for around here. A conservative posts a link and some of the non conservatives go after the poster instead of the news in the post.
But then bitch when they get the response they do, saying” blah blah. Guy cant have a conversation, has meltdowns, blah blah fucking blah. ”

no shit. It never started as a conversation......

 

[SlyPokerDog]

This is the norm for around here. A conservative posts a link and some of the non conservatives go after the poster instead of the news in the post.
But then bitch when they get the response they do, saying” blah blah. Guy cant have a conversation, has meltdowns, blah blah fucking blah. ”

no shit. It never started as a conversation......

Yes, you've had some meltdowns. Go back and read your posts since Sunday. Lot's of meltdowns.

You build strawmen and make wild generalizations over anyone who disagrees with you.

You've insulted people.

You have a serious issue with anyone who doesn't agree with your narrow point of view.

Some people disagree with you that the Antifa idiots in downtown are as guilty as the idiots on Jan 6th.

That's all this is about. This is what you're getting so upset over.

Differences of opinion.

So please, call me name, accuse me of being biased, say you want to fuck my mother, I don't care. You are free to do this all you want.

But, the insults and hostility against everyone else over their opinions needs to stop.

Again, I invite you to make any complaint or insult against me you want. If you need help I can even throw in a few for you.

But this endless meltdown you're having needs to stop.

 

[Orion Bailey]

Yes, you've had some meltdowns. Go back and read your posts since Sunday. Lot's of meltdowns.

You build strawmen and make wild generalizations over anyone who disagrees with you.

You've insulted people.

You have a serious issue with anyone who doesn't agree with your narrow point of view.

Some people disagree with you that the Antifa idiots in downtown are as guilty as the idiots on Jan 6th.

That's all this is about. This is what you're getting so upset over.

Differences of opinion.

So please, call me name, accuse me of being biased, say you want to fuck my mother, I don't care. You are free to do this all you want.

But, the insults and hostility against everyone else over their opinions needs to stop.

Again, I invite you to make any complaint or insult against me you want. If you need help I can even throw in a few for you.

But this endless meltdown you're having needs to stop.

Lmfao!!!!!

 

[Orion Bailey]

@SlyPokerDog

here are my initial posts during all of this. Didnt address one person. Didnt call one person out.

but your first post was (dont deny it) a response to mine.

you are full of shot just like the other few.
You say you want up and up conversations.

Bullshit.

me having a meltdown is your opinion. I call kickin as and takin names.

oh btw, tortured is still waiting for that comversation you sooo wanted.....

lol.
Now go back to your group, tag out, let a other tag in and blow some more smoke and spin Nd ill then tackle that post as well.
Maybe if you were aware enough to acknowledge that i have only responded to those posting at me. I never initially called anyone out.
If i have a strawman stance, you ARE the strawman...

Im sure my response to your rant and spin will also be considered a meltdown.
Do i give a shit?

nope. Cause i know the truth.

https://thepostmillennial.com/break...thouse-attempt-to-break-into-bank-in-portland

Sigh.....

Trying to raid federal buildings. I wonder if this will receive the same criticisms and condemnations that the jan6th idiots got.
Lets see....

anyone who defends this shit for any reason at all are no better than anyone who defended jan. 6th.
Period.

The actions were the same. Regardless of who instigated or how many. The actions of a few are just as bad as the actions of many.

so lets get detailed. The person who ignited the fire in Portland is less guilty that the person who damaged property inside on jan 6th?

yes or no?

Shopping lifting and murder are the same since they're both crimes.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

@SlyPokerDog

here are my initial posts during all of this. Didnt address one person. Didnt call one person out.

but your first post was (dont deny it) a response to mine.

you are full of shot just like the other few.
You say you want up and up conversations.

Bullshit.

me having a meltdown is your opinion. I call kickin as and takin names.

oh btw, tortured is still waiting for that comversation you sooo wanted.....

lol.
Now go back to your group, tag out, let a other tag in and blow some more smoke and spin Nd ill then tackle that post as well.
Maybe if you were aware enough to acknowledge that i have only responded to those posting at me. I never initially called anyone out.
If i have a strawman stance, you ARE the strawman...

Im sure my response to your rant and spin will also be considered a meltdown.
Do i give a shit?

nope. Cause i know the truth.

You missed quite a few of posts before my quote including a lot of snarky and condescending replies by you to other people since your initial post. People were trying to have a conversation with you and you rejected it unless they agreed with you.

 

[calvin natt]

Welp. Just read the last 9 pages and lost 15 mins of my life I cant get back now. Thanks all.

 

[Orion Bailey]

@SlyPokerDog you are so full of shit.

The first person who actually atttempted was tyrant. I was snarky to him? The second was phat guy. My response was snarky????

its all below. Please show my how my response to tyrant or phat was snarky??????

https://thepostmillennial.com/break...thouse-attempt-to-break-into-bank-in-portland

Sigh.....

Trying to raid federal buildings. I wonder if this will receive the same criticisms and condemnations that the jan6th idiots got.
Lets see....

Great way to get people to stand behind a cause....

NOT....

This is snarky???

oh i agree but we must hold the same consistency to all regardless the outcome.

thsi is kind of like sayin a guy who tried to rob a bank but only got away with 5o bucks is not near as bad as a guy who robbed a bank and got away with 50k.

the crime is the same regardless of the result.

I'm fairly sure those arrested and convicted of the same sort of crime will get the same sort of punishment, whether here in Portland or in Washington DC.

maybe this is snarky????

i hope so.

Here is phats first post to me.

How many died here? How many were at risk of dying? 0

That building is made of concrete, steel, and glass. A burning pallet leaned against the wall is not a threat.

Which national leader incited this behavior?

This is nothing like the capital riots...

this is my response. Its snarky???? Its a meltdown?

The actions were the same. Regardless of who instigated or how many. The actions of a few are just as bad as the actions of many.

so lets get detailed. The person who ignited the fire in Portland is less guilty that the person who damaged property inside on jan 6th?

yes or no?

then here is your quote you say i had a bunch of snark prior to....

Shopping lifting and murder are the same since they're both crimes.

You missed quite a few of posts before my quote including a lot of snarky and condescending replies by you to other people since your initial post. People were trying to have a conversation with you and you rejected it unless they agreed with you.

what posts did i miss? Please enlighten me??

 

[SlyPokerDog]

‘You are not helping.’ Black community leaders join mayor in denouncing anarchist-related vandalism

Black community leaders on Monday joined Portland’smayor, deputy police chief, the sheriff and the state’s acting top federal prosecutor to decry a resurgence of vandalism to businesses and the federal courthouse, calling the targeted unrest at odds with the social justice movement.


They accused anarchists of co-opting the Black Lives Matter movement and causing senseless damage while speaking out in support of the Police Bureau’s renewed use last week of a mass arrest tactic.

“The misguided and miseducated anarchists reject civility and instead intentionally create mayhem through criminally destructive behavior, tearing up our city and this must stop,”said Avel Gordly, a former state state senator,during the video news conference. “You are not helping. You are hurting Black people. We need peacemakers and peacekeepers.”



Former state Sen. Margaret Carter said she stands with people who take to the streets to seek change. “But I don’t stand with you in seeking our city being torn apart.”



“I ask you to cease and desist immediately from your violent acts of destruction in our city,” she said.



Mayor Ted Wheeler, City Attorney Robert Taylor and Deputy Police Chief Chris Davis defended the police decision to “kettle” what they described as an unruly crowd on Friday night in the Pearl District -- surrounding and boxing in a group while blocking off all exit pointsto make arrests.



And Wheeler vowed that police will continue to revise their tactics to address the ongoing vandalism.



“I’m just hearing loudly and clearly from our community for months that they’re sick and tired of this criminal destruction,” he said. “The community at large has already figured out that this has nothing to do with Black Lives Matter or any noble causes. This is just about people getting together to break stuff because they think they can get away with it.”



Some people showing up to the gatherings clearly have violent intent, he said.



“When you come to a quote protest and you bring your gun or you bring your slingshot or you bring your ax or your hammer, that doesn’t tell me you’re there for peaceful purposes,” he said. “That tells me that you are there as a bad actor for the purposes of conducting criminal acts.”

Buoyed by recent favorable rulings from two federal judges and a state judge, the Police Bureau used kettling for the first time in several years.



Davis said police employed the controversial tacticpeacefully without having to use munitionsand it helped curtail further damage to businesses and other properties as people blocked streets and smashed windows in a gathering advertised as a “direct action.”



The circumstances on the ground fit the legal parameters for such mass arrests, said Davis and Taylor, the city attorney.



Davis cited similar “direct actions” promoted by self-described anarchists, including one on Feb. 27, also in the Pearl District, that caused significant damage to businesses.



When a group acts “in a coordinated manner”to engage in criminal conduct, its members can be detained for purposes of a criminal investigation, Taylor said.



“Portland police followed the law,” he said.

Police surrounded about 100 people, took their names and photographs, and arrested 13, after the group had blocked traffic and refused to get out of the street, Davis said.Officers allowed legal observers and journalists to leave, he said.



Of those arrested, the Multnomah County District Attorney’s Office has so far pursued cases against one adult on interfering with police, disorderly conduct and resisting arrest allegations and one juvenile. The district attorney’s office rejected one other case against a woman accused of carrying a concealed weapon and unlawfully possessing a loaded firearm in a public place, and asked police to provide more documentation.



In the 10 other cases, people were cited and released, and those haven’t yet been referred to the district attorney’s office.



Davis said police moved in after some in the group dragged outdoor furniture from businesses into the street and smashed four to six windows near Northwest 15th Avenue and Overton Street.



“We decided at that point not to wait until there was more widespread destruction to take the appropriate action,” Davis said. “This was not a protest group. This was a group of people who’ve come to believe that they’re entitled to damage other people’s property, threaten community members and assault our police officers.”



Police incident commanders called for detaining the entire group based on reasonable suspicion ofdisorderly conduct for those walking in the street and criminal mischief for those damaging property, Davis said.

Police also recovered at least one gun, knives and slingshots, which some in the kettled crowd appeared to have discarded, he said. After their release, some people tried to harm police, including one person who threw a full can of beer at an officer, he said.



Oregon’s Acting U.S. Attorney Scott Asphaug decried the window-breaking and graffiti over the weekend at the Mark O. Hatfield United States Courthouse downtown by “the few who hope to hold our city hostage by petty crime and violence.”



Asphaug urged family members of the young men and women who appear dedicated to creating the havoc to “raise your voice to tell them to stop.”



“I work in the building that’s become ground zero for what’s been inaccurately described as protest-related violence,” Asphaug said. “That description is false and plays into the hands of the few agitators whose criminal actions work to hijack the goals of social and racial justice.”



Multnomah County Sheriff Mike Reese also participated in the news conference. Police Chief Chuck Lovell was out of town for training and didn’t attend the news conference, according to a police spokesman.

Former Trail Blazer Terry Porter said he’s deeply concerned about the city and called the widespread vandalism a disturbing distraction to needed reforms.



“This is not what the Black Lives movement is about,” he said. “It does not make me as a Black man any safer.”



Wheeler, who on New Year’s Day made a similar plea to address anarchist violence, said thenthat he wanted to meet with federal, state and local law enforcement and electedofficials to stem anarchist-related violence and develop a restorative justice-type program calling for people convicted of vandalizing property to do community service and meet with the property owners to do repairs.



“Neither of those things have happened at this point,” the mayor conceded, saying he didn’t have enough interest from lawmakers.



He said he has tried to invite people who fall into the anarchist category to meet with him but hasn’t had “any takers.” When he did meet last year with some people invited to a roundtable, he said the conversations weren’t productive because they “basically shoved a megaphone in my face and swore at me for 20 minutes.”



He described the overwhelming number of people committing the vandalism as young, white males.



Wheeler said the city and police have been working more closely now with the Multnomah County district attorney to ensure people are held accountable in a way that wasn’t happening in the past. A representative from the district attorney’s office was in the police incident command center during Friday night’s demonstration.

Though the news release for Monday’s media event referenced white supremacists, the focus of speakers was on anarchist vandalism. Yet when pressed, Wheeler said the city recognizes that white nationalism remains the number one public safety threat in the nation.



“There is no room for violence or criminal destruction, and I don’t give a damn what your politics are, nor should anybody else,” he said.



Wheeler said he believed the kettling tactic was used appropriately, lawfully and successfully by police on Friday night and applauded police for their actions. In certain circumstances, similar to what police faced Friday night, it’s effective, he said.



But he added that a police incident commander makes the decision whether to direct officers to kettle a group.



“It’s my expectation as police commissioner and the mayor, it will be done so legally,” the mayor added.



Recent court rulings dismissed legal challenges to police kettling that occurred during dueling demonstrations in downtown in June 2017.



U.S. District Judge Michael W. Mosman in January ruled that officers had authority to hold a group of people on suspicion of disorderly conduct. “Officers are entitled to have reasonable suspicion as to a moderately cohesive group,” regardless of whether the people are ideologically aligned, he ruled. He also found that the mass detention didn’t amount to an arrest.

U.S. Magistrate Judge Jolie A. Russo in late December recommended dismissing a separate class-action suit brought by the ACLU of Oregon, finding that the kettling was legal and didn’t rise to an unlawful seizure under the Fourth Amendment violation as alleged.



Though Russo expressed some concern that police made little effort to distinguish between those acting unlawfully and innocent bystanders, she found that police could have believed reasonable suspicion existed to detain the crowd for parading without a permit or disorderly conduct based on “the boisterous and rapidly evolving” events of the day, officers’ past experience with marchers and the sheer number of people involved.



The ACLU is now challenging Russo’s recommendation to a federal district judge. The ACLU contends that the police decision to kettle in 2017 wasn’t based on “individualized probable cause or reasonable suspicion” but was planned by police in advance and was “pretextual.”



A Multnomah County judge previously found that reasonable suspicion “merely requires” an officer to have an “objectively reasonable basis to suspect criminal activity is either afoot or about to be afoot, and that the officer be able to articulate specific facts in support of that suspicion.”

The Oregon Justice Resource Center and the Council on Islamic-American Relations, known asCAIR-Oregon, joined with the ACLU to call for a federal investigation into the police decision Friday night to detain “an entire city block of people for protesting on their own streets in their own city” and then requiring them to remove their masks, be photographed and show ID before being allowed to leave.



They argued that the information obtained by police will be used to intimidate and “dox” people -- publicly identify or publish private information about them.



In depositions taken of Portland police in the 2017 kettling cases, a Portland sergeant said the photos of individuals taken during a kettling are sometimes used to compare to video police took of earlier criminal acts to determine if anyone can be identified and tied to the acts, according to court records.



-- Maxine Bernstein

https://www.oregonlive.com/crime/20...n-denouncing-anarchist-related-vandalism.html

 

[Orion Bailey]

@SlyPokerDog ...
Answer please.....

@SlyPokerDog you are so full of shit.

The first person who actually atttempted was tyrant. I was snarky to him? The second was phat guy. My response was snarky????

its all below. Please show my how my response to tyrant or phat was snarky??????







This is snarky???




maybe this is snarky????

Here is phats first post to me.


this is my response. Its snarky???? Its a meltdown?


then here is your quote you say i had a bunch of snark prior to....






what posts did i miss? Please enlighten me??

 

[Orion Bailey]

People who care about people dont make false claims and then go silent when evidence shows to the contrary....


What a buncha bs.....

im soo fucking gullible....

 

[calvin natt]

People who care about people dont make false claims and then go silent when evidence shows to the contrary....


What a buncha bs.....

im soo fucking gullible....

Maybe I only skimmed through all those pages, but I don't get it...it feels like every single person is anti-the Portland fuckers who try to burn or damage anything? Where is the argument, is it just whether or not its the equivalent of the DC event? There are some differences, some similarities, everyone involved is an idiot, arrest all of them. What are we even talking about, whats worse? I think on scale/magnitude the DC event is clearly, factually, far worse. The actual activity - destruction, vandalism, violence, same. But the Portland one didnt cause deaths or brain damage or anything like that, no? But sure. Fuck them all. I want them all behind bars. I thought we had established this awhile ago.

 

[RR7]

Maybe I only skimmed through all those pages, but I don't get it...it feels like every single person is anti-the Portland fuckers who try to burn or damage anything? Where is the argument, is it just whether or not its the equivalent of the DC event? There are some differences, some similarities, everyone involved is an idiot, arrest all of them. What are we even talking about, whats worse? I think on scale/magnitude the DC event is clearly, factually, far worse. The actual activity - destruction, vandalism, violence, same. But the Portland one didnt cause deaths or brain damage or anything like that, no? But sure. Fuck them all. I want them all behind bars. I thought we had established this awhile ago.

During the protests last summer, the worst elements of it all were the city blocks around the courthouse downtown. Every once in a while, something would pop up elsewhere, but for the majority, it was those blocks.

National media picked up on warzone Portland, and many in here, as well as many on social media, etc. scoffed at national news painting a different picture of what was actually happening. And so it was often repeated that it was just a few blocks, etc. Some like HCP went as far as posting pictures of his neghborhood to display this.

All the while, there was discussion of police brutality. To some in here, it came across that many of the posters here were more vocally concerned about the graffitti happening downtown, and had a more visceral reaction to seeing buildings being damaged and vandalized than they did about police brutality. Because of that being pointed out, a few would feel the need for the next year or so to find instances of it NOT being down there, and post a link, along with a sarcastic , "just a few blocks, huh" sort of post.

So you could say some were "dismissive" of what happened last summer, but I think the majority of it was in perspective to what was being protested, and a lot were dismissive about the damage to buildings in the sense that, they have insurance, that brings back a storefront, not a life.

January 6th happened, so of course it had to be compared because...I dunno.

And here we are a year later, and because a few cared more about black lives than storefronts, and that was twisted about slightly, we have to have a weekly call out of holding people accountable, etc., without ever actually having a specific hey, you said this, and now this, why do you specifically feel this way. Instead, when every anyone responds that they hate what happened here, it's Oh, not YOU, but others!. And the others just seems like a long, roundabout way of him wanting to carry on a feud with HCP for who knows the fuck why, to be honest, since he probably more than most stated how it was downtown, and surrounding areas were ok.

 

[Chris Craig]

Maybe I only skimmed through all those pages, but I don't get it...it feels like every single person is anti-the Portland fuckers who try to burn or damage anything? Where is the argument, is it just whether or not its the equivalent of the DC event? There are some differences, some similarities, everyone involved is an idiot, arrest all of them. What are we even talking about, whats worse? I think on scale/magnitude the DC event is clearly, factually, far worse. The actual activity - destruction, vandalism, violence, same. But the Portland one didnt cause deaths or brain damage or anything like that, no? But sure. Fuck them all. I want them all behind bars. I thought we had established this awhile ago.

I believe the argument is when both events happened some did not come out against the Portland protestors that got violent but did against those on the 6th that stormed the Capitol.

That those on the 6th were quick to be called terrorists but the violent protestors this summer were not.

 

[Chris Craig]

People who care about people dont make false claims and then go silent when evidence shows to the contrary....


What a buncha bs.....

im soo fucking gullible....

What false claims? What evidence? Who refuses to admit to being wrong? And to what do they refuse to admit to being wrong about?

 

[Chris Craig]

lol. No its not. Some who broke the building never new an officer was murdered. But they should be punished harsher?

see its this type of generalizing that is frustrating. By that rule, all protestors who help instigated an attempt on the police hq should be charged the same as the worst of them who tired toightvthe building on firecwith people inside.

See you want it both ways and im not gonna allow that. It isnt fair or equal.

Which is the whole point of the protests!!!

Equal treatment for individuals committing the same crimes.
Except of course when it works against me, then fuck it. Ill dismiss some of the crimes....

But, it's not the same crime. Both the violent protestors this summer and those who attacked the Capitol are both guilty. The both committed criminal acts.

But, think about it. If you go to court for shattering windows of a bank/store or looting, vs for breaking into a Capitol building to hunt down the VP and senators/house members with the intent to kill...which is a judge going to see as worse and prnaluze heavier?

Setting fire to the police station. Closer to the severity of what happened in DC, according to the law, but trying overthrow the government is still considered worse.

I see the equivalency you are trying to make. Anarchists in Portland broke into the police station by smashing its windows, vandalized it and lit on fire. They have tried to break into the courthouse next door. The lit a pile of stuff on fire. They are government buildings.

The Capitol is a government building. The rioters on January 6th were incited by the President, broke in. Killed cops doing it. Hunted for the VP (got within feet of him and would have killed him had they known his location) senators, and members of the house (would have killed them too. Well the Dems and the Republicans who voted to certify the election. Though government officials like Sen. Ron Johnson felt safe). They set up a gallow.

Both of these are terrible, but you can't tell me one isn't obviously worse than the other.

 

[riverman]

hey mods....I've seen a lot tamer threads than this get locked because they were at a logjam.....LOCK THIS THREAD.....move on..there's no topic here anymore if there ever was one to begin with.

 

[Orion Bailey]

In short...

Exactly. Thank you.
This will be my last post.


You nailed it on the head.
See i totally get it. I, in no way feel someone who broke a storefront window in portland should be held to the same standard as someone who broke into the Capital and attempted a coup.

There are levels to this. There are levels to everything.
But for the last year or two, some of the same people railing on me now will not use that same rationale towards anything they don't care for.

Like cops.

There aRe levels to cops. This, “all cops are bad” is pure bullshit. There is no doubt a serious issue with law enforcement from the foundation on up. But not all cops are bad.

how does this officer explain to his child all cops aRe bad?????


Like conservatives and republicans.
They arent all bad and “part of the problem”.

there is definitely an issue with a sect of more radical fringe “with racist tendencies” republicans who happen to share the same limited government ideals that i and other conservatives may have. Doesn't mean i give them an ounce of support or condone thier bigotry. But yet it was insinuated as much last year several times to several people making any type of opposing stance to the sweeping judgements others had here.

There are levels to everything. And when i brought this up regarding cops and conservatives last year, i was basically treated as a borderline nazi. A racist supporter.

its such a huge fucking double standard that some posters here have no clue they have it. And its been at the root of my continual standoffish( nonsense, lol) posts towards some people, Because i saw them last year tossing generalized, blanket statements out left and right... when it benefits thier stance.

So when i use that same style used last year, now, it doesnt fly, And told who cares what anyone said last year??? Fuck that. Own up.


Its straight up hypocritical, lame, weak, and everything else.


this has nothing to do with hcp as another poster eluded(i truly have no ill will for him or anyone here), even though this is one of those posters who im describing above.

This has everything to do with some posters who try to call me out on the very thing they themselves were doing last summer.

And yet im the one who is irrational and unable to have a conversation.

How do you have a conversation with people who backpedal and flipflop like that?

So hell yeah ive become abrasive to some people who like to play those bullshit games and stand proud with such double standards.

Posters who i believe to be very intelligent otherwise and used to have mad respect for. But over the last year or two this bs double standard has grown to be unbearable. And when one now finds the head mod accusing me of things, but when asked to point it out, wont do it and goes silent, ive reached my limit. Shits not gonna make a turn for the better around here. Never gonna be like it used to be when i first got here. I see that now.

But hey, even the best of fighters have to retire eventually, right?
Lol.

 

[Hoopguru]

I agree that the severity is different.
But the taking over of many blocks in Seattle armed and even killing someone is a crime in the highest. Not to mentioned all people who lived in the zone be terrorized and business's being looted.
Any kind of riot/take insurgency without regards to others is bad shit and should not be tolerated. Just to shout burn it down is one heel of a threat. If this bs isnt nipped in the bud quick it will just metastasize.
Peace and Love, Flowers and Beads with a little Moby Grape.

 

[riverman]

one level to this shit is that cops abusing power are not these good cops....nor should they get to hide behind these good cops.....I know the local sheriff well...he's a great guy....my cousin has been sheriff of my hometown in Iowa for many decades....he doesn't carry a gun on his belt...never needed too....you will be hard pressed to find an Irish american like me without a cop in the family and a fireman......it's a tradition. None of this excuses abusing power.....if a protester in DC beat a cop with a fire extinguisher turns out to be a dentist...I don't start hating dentists....perspective....I know of nobody who condones police violence or racial profiling just to support the cops nor anyone who hates all cops.....false equivalency....and for those who might not know...HCP was a military policeman...blanket statements are bs and this is a court of public opinion...not a court of law. There has long been an abuse of power with the police systems in our country...well documented..good cops will clean their own house instead of cover up for bad cops. The old system was, cops don't snitch on cops no matter what...maybe they should from time to time.

 

[Minstrel]

how does this officer explain to his child all cops aRe bad?????

This is the problem you're having on the forum. You keep boiling down nuanced arguments to stupid strawman extremes. Like the above--no one has said every cop is bad. What people have said is A. police forces in general are being utilized in extremely bad ways (military equipment, escalation policies, little representation from the communities they police, etc) and B. all cops do share a responsibility not to enable the bad (i.e. abusive and/or murderous) cops by closing ranks and "protecting the badge" from any accountability.

Those are the types of arguments people have been making and, whether you agree or disagree, there are thoughtful arguments to be made around those issues. Instead, you decide in your head that "the liberals are arguing all cops are bad which is CRAZY rofl wtf do you guys hear yourselves?" and then act aggrieved when people try to explain to you that you aren't correctly understanding people's positions and then spend months informing the forum that there's a group of bullshitters who won't admit to "what they said" and post a bunch of quotes that you still don't understand and, when explained again, you just say "no way theyre just trying to cover their asses they mean what I assumed they mean"

 

[SlyPokerDog]

 

[SlyPokerDog]

In an astonishing twist to fallout from a false allegation of hit-and-run against City Commissioner Jo Ann Hardesty, the Portland Police Association announced March 16 that president Brian Hunzeker had resigned after a "serious, isolated mistake related to the Police Bureau's investigation into the alleged hit-and-run by Commissioner Hardesty."

The union said it learned of Hunzeker's "mistake" in the last 24 hours, though it did not specify what the mistake was. Questions still loom about who leaked police information to right-wing media March 4 alleging that Hardesty was involved in a hit-and-run.

PPA spokeswoman Angela Orr declined to provide further explanation: "At this point we have no further information to share other than what is stated in the attached press release," Orr told WW.


"Brian's mistake was not driven by malice," the press release said. "But it was a serious mistake. He has held himself to account by resigning his position as PPA president effective immediately. The PPA's executive board has accepted his resignation."

Mayor Ted Wheeler issued a statement Tuesday afternoon in which he said the resignation "raises significant questions that remain unanswered." He called on Hunzeker to immediately provide an explanation.

"Mr. Hunzeker has given no reason for his resignation except that he made a serious mistake about an ongoing criminal investigation," Wheeler said. "As the police commissioner, I demand to know what that mistake was. I have called for an internal investigation to clarify the circumstances. While I appreciate Mr. Hunzeker's self-described act of accountability, I demand he give a full and transparent accounting of what he did and what his motivations were to Commissioner Hardesty and the public. I call on him to do so immediately."


PPA said in a statement that former president Daryl Turner, whose term ended in November, will return to the union as an executive director "to help our union rebuild trust within our membership, with City Hall and the Police Bureau, and with the community."

The PPA apologized to Hardesty in the statement and said it would be contacting her personally.

In a statement issued Tuesday evening, Hardesty said she was in a City Council budget work session when news of the resignation broke, and that she currently knows as much information as the public does.

"I do know that Mayor Wheeler and I agreed that the scope of the impending outside investigation into the Portland Police Bureau will not only get to the bottom of this specific politically motivated leak," Hardesty said, "but will also look into potential political and racial bias, as well as potential ties to white supremacists within the Portland Police Bureau."

Hunzeker's career as PPA president was short-lived: He replaced Turner on Nov. 1, 2020—less than five months ago. During his brief tenure, he opposed Hardesty's police oversight board measure (which voters passed overwhelmingly in November), calling the measure "terrible public policy."

On March 6, Hunzeker posted on the PPA's Facebook page that it is "unconscionable" for Wheeler to have ordered an investigation into the leaking of police records that incorrectly implicated Hardesty.


He then went on to slam Hardesty in the post.

"We didn't see this sort of 'high priority' call for an investigation by the Mayor or any other elected official last summer when Commissioner Hardesty falsely accused police of setting fires to our own buildings," Hunzeker wrote. "Sadly, this kind of bombastic rhetoric isn't even surprising anymore."

The Police Bureau issued a statement Tuesday acknowledging Hunzeker's resignation as union president: "Officer Hunzeker remains an employee of the Portland Police Bureau, and will receive an assignment within the bureau to be determined."

https://www.wweek.com/news/2021/03/...-related-to-hardesty-hit-and-run-allegations/

 

[Orion Bailey]

Who cares about the 800000 doing their jobs the right way. This is about the ones who don’t. Cops who don’t kill people don’t deserve praise. So go ahead and say “yeah but there are good ones”. Throw a party. Who cares. Gee I am ever so grateful we have many cops who don’t murder! Yippeeeee

I completely agree, the vast majority of police officers are not bad people and truly care about the citizens they are charged to protect.

But here is a big problem, some of the officers like the ones who killed the man in Minnesota have had multiple complaints for violence filed against them. All of the complaints were filed by citizens, none by fellow officers. Police are very reluctant to police themselves.

There have been studies done with retired officers asking them about the crimes and/or questionable actions they witnessed by other officers and it's over 80% of those retired officers that admitted they saw stuff during their careers and didn't say anything.

That's the problem.

The police feel there is a thin blue line and at the same time they operate behind a blue wall of silence.

Is an officer still considered good if they witness another officer doing wrong and stay silent about it?

That's difficult to answer.

I care that they do their job without murdering. I don’t believe in participation trophies. I don’t throw parties for people who just don’t kill people.

People need to understand the anger the black and brown community have. Peaceful protests don’t do SHIT! Look at kapernick, he protested police brutality peacefully and got his career and reputation ruined.

you can only peacefully protest for so long while nothing happens/improves

the police don’t give a fuck about a peaceful protest

has been any serious change in any PD that was because of a peaceful protest?

what positive changes did Kaepernick’s peaceful protest bring?

There's no point arguing about whether rioting is "right" or not. On an individual basis, sure, people should take responsibility for their actions and consider whether rioting is a good action or not. But in terms of human dynamics, this is inevitable. Just as authoritarian regimes eventually lead to violent revolutions, this kind of corrupt policing, often protected by the government and justice system, is going to lead to uprisings. It's inevitable and unavoidable. Might as well debate the rightness or wrongness of the tides.

lol fuck 12

This is the problem you're having on the forum. You keep boiling down nuanced arguments to stupid strawman extremes. Like the above--no one has said every cop is bad. What people have said is A. police forces in general are being utilized in extremely bad ways (military equipment, escalation policies, little representation from the communities they police, etc) and B. all cops do share a responsibility not to enable the bad (i.e. abusive and/or murderous) cops by closing ranks and "protecting the badge" from any accountability.

Those are the types of arguments people have been making and, whether you agree or disagree, there are thoughtful arguments to be made around those issues. Instead, you decide in your head that "the liberals are arguing all cops are bad which is CRAZY rofl wtf do you guys hear yourselves?" and then act aggrieved when people try to explain to you that you aren't correctly understanding people's positions and then spend months informing the forum that there's a group of bullshitters who won't admit to "what they said" and post a bunch of quotes that you still don't understand and, when explained again, you just say "no way theyre just trying to cover their asses they mean what I assumed they mean"

oh yeah, what does fuck 12 mean again?

12 are all cops. Fuck 12 is all cops...


Keep arguing your semantics. You are wrong... again.
Even you @Minstrel said its inevitable. And condone the rioting....

i just got these posts ( some more relevant than others) in the first few pages of the floyd killing three. Im sure there are more if i wanted to waste more time but finding the fuck12 is enough evidence to prove that some indeed do think all cops see bad and said so in saying fuck 12.

Now lets see the spin evolve off of this one. and im the strawman... lol.
Ill accept your apology anytime. And will not hold a grudge.

 

[ehizzy3]

Fuck 12

 

[Lanny]

How am I a hypocrite? That quote is from the riots in DC. Yes, it was terrorism. I also called out the violent rioters in Portland.

I don't think he was talking about you, Chris.

 

[Lanny]

View attachment 37564
I'm retired and can waste time all day if I like......some of you guys are young....don't understand how time spent like this can possibly be productive on any level at all....stop living in the past and deal with today...my 2 cents.....vote...write your representatives.....take in a town hall meeting etc... Jan 6th and the BLM protests last summer are entirely different sets of circumstances.....arson and property damage, trespassing, etc are crimes...should be addressed as crimes....Jan 6th was an attempted political coup in our nations capitol in a building holding the vast majority of our representatives and the vice president....it is not on the same level as unrest in cities across the nation over racial profiling and police brutality....in DC cops were badly injured and killed by american flags. and fire extinguishers...let's have some perspective.....whataboutism is just a shit stirring stick

I am ancient and have no concept of time. It takes me half an hour to walk across the street provided they have cutouts at each corner of the intersection. If they don't have cutouts it can take me days.

 

[Lanny]

oh yeah, what does fuck 12 mean again?

12 are all cops. Fuck 12 is all cops...


Keep arguing your semantics. You are wrong... again.
Even you @Minstrel said its inevitable. And condone the rioting....

i just got these posts ( some more relevant than others) in the first few pages of the floyd killing three. Im sure there are more if i wanted to waste more time but finding the fuck12 is enough evidence to prove that some indeed do think all cops see bad and said so in saying fuck 12.

Now lets see the spin evolve off of this one. and im the strawman... lol.
Ill accept your apology anytime. And will not hold a grudge.

Orion,
I should and will keep out of this because I would only inflame things and I wish that all of you would do the same because you are ONLY inflaming things. Should any of you be making progress toward a meeting of the minds, such as Steve Allen displayed in his regular TV show "Meeting of Minds", I wouldn't be saying this. At this point you are all being counterproductive.
Hey, I just thought of something, if you would all get pissed at me for saying this then you could all have something in common and I will have served my purpose.

 

[Minstrel]

Even you @Minstrel said its inevitable. And condone the rioting....

Inevitable doesn't mean right or acceptable. I said that directly in the quote you tried to use. You either mix up word meanings or choose to ignore what people say in order to argue.