Politics White Nationalist Rally turns to violence and terrorism

[riverman]

You were able to find and post it. Thus not wiped off the face of the earth.

I can show you many paintings of Hitler and Robert E Lee as well as photos of the holocaust....the camera captured many crimes against humanity

 

[Denny Crane]

Oh, well, if photos count, then removing the statues should be no problem. You'll still have the Google images, so not wiped off the face of the Earth.

So having them stay wouldn't have the desired effect, either. Your arguments are silly. Seriously silly.

 

[riverman]

Your arguments are silly. Seriously silly.

translation....you have no answer for your sadness at the loss of Confederate icons in public parks...

 

[Minstrel]

So having them stay wouldn't have the desired effect, either.

The desired effect is not to officially glorify slave culture on public land.

I'm fine with there being a record that they existed, whether in museums or on the Internet. We don't want to erase history, do we?

 

[Denny Crane]

The desired effect is not to officially glorify slave culture on public land.

I'm fine with there being a record that they existed, whether in museums or on the Internet. We don't want to erase history, do we?

It is history that they erected the statues in those parks and named them.

So yeah, you do want to erase history. You also want to do it in places you don't even live near or visit.

 

[Minstrel]

It is history that they erected the statues in those parks and named them.

Preserve the former locations of the statues and the former names of the parks online too. No worries, buddy. I'd hate to erase any history.

 

[riverman]

I just don't think they should be taken down

fair enough.....they didn't bother me either but they bother people that are connected closely to that chapter in history as did colored only restrooms in the south....I'm sure lot's of whites weren't bothered by segregated public facilities either. Respect the dignity of those whose ancestors suffered in the region would be a good place to start.

 

[SlyPokerDog]

Denny's fired up because today because he found out Costco doesn't sell Lee jeans.

 

[Denny Crane]

translation....you have no answer for your sadness at the loss of Confederate icons in public parks...

I have no sadness at the loss of Confederate icons in public parks. Like I just wrote, it's a complex issue. The right answer is probably that some should be removed and some should remain. On a case by case basis.

 

[Denny Crane]

they didn't bother me either

See how that works?

 

[Denny Crane]

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/08/18/...e-statues-artists-preservationists-trump.html

Trump Aside, Artists and Preservationists Debate the Rush to Topple Statues

In state after state this week, artists, museum curators, and historic preservationists found themselves grappling with lightning-fast upheaval in a cultural realm — American monuments — where they usually have input and change typically unfolds with care. Many said that even though they fiercely oppose President Trump and his defense of Confederate statues, they saw the removal of the monuments as precipitous and argued that the widening effort to eliminate them could have troubling implications for artistic expression.

“I am loath to erase history,” Mr. Bunch said. “For me it’s less about whether they come down or not, and more about what the debate is stimulating.”

(Bunch is the director of the Smithsonian's National Museum of African American History and Culture)

So far that debate has been almost entirely a reaction to Mr. Trump and his views on race, with little discussion about the Confederate monuments and sculptures as works of art or historical artifacts of any cultural value.

 

[Denny Crane]

Facts. Pesky little things.

http://www.unionleader.com/column/D...o-blame-for-Charlottesville-violence-08182017

Deroy Murdock: Both sides were to blame for Charlottesville violence

ABC-TV affiliate WRIC reported that police nabbed eight people tied to this melee. While some clearly were white-power extremists, others were anything but. These include Troy Dunigan, 21, of Tennessee. “He was arrested Saturday for throwing objects at ‘Nazi protesters,’ according to court documents.” Beth Foster, director of the Mercy Junction Justice and Peace Center, told NBC-TV’s Chattanooga affiliate WRBC that she knows Dunigan. “He is an anarchist and is part of an Antifa action to confront white supremacy, and that’s why he was in Charlottesville.”

CBS-TV station WTVR reported that, “Officials said Robert K. Litzenberger of Charlottesville was charged with misdemeanor assault and battery after a state trooper witnessed Litzenberger spit on Jason Kessler,” who organized the white-nationalist rally.

Facts barely matter when it comes to slamming President Trump. There is nothing Trump can say or do to please his fire-breathing foes, other than to head-first off the George Washington Bridge. (Washington owned slaves. So, tear it down!)

 

[riverman]

See how that works?

Yeah....when I see it bothering my fellow americans, I try to understand why and respect their views....rather than argue that Confederate soldiers are some sort of heroes that should be immortalized. A Civil War museum would solve the problem just like the holocaust museum exists so folks won't forget but public parks are not where we view statues of German officers who practiced genocide.

 

[riverman]

Facts barely matter when it comes to slamming President Trump

facts barely matter to President Trump.....see how that works?

 

[Denny Crane]

Yeah....when I see it bothering my fellow americans, I try to understand why and respect their views....rather than argue that Confederate soldiers are some sort of heroes that should be immortalized. A Civil War museum would solve the problem just like the holocaust museum exists so folks won't forget but public parks are not where we view statues of German officers who practiced genocide.

Does it bother you when a few hundred or even 10,000 anarchists are bothered enough to go protest and commit violent acts? Even when there are none of those awful hate groups marching at the same time?

 

[Denny Crane]

facts barely matter to President Trump.....see how that works?

Hows that Russia Conspiracy Theory working out for you?

 

[riverman]

when a few hundred or even 10,000 anarchists are bothered enough to go protest and commit violent acts?

where are these hundreds and tens of thousands of anarchists that are commiting violent acts? fake fucking news much?

 

[Denny Crane]

facts barely matter to President Trump.....see how that works?

Trump isn't accomplishing anything.

 

[riverman]

Hows that Russia Conspiracy Theory working out for you?

I'm not involved in a Russian conspiracy but it's not working out very well for Trump's administration......and that doesn't work out well for anyone last time I checked......

 

[Denny Crane]

where are these hundreds and tens of thousands of anarchists that are commiting violent acts? fake fucking news much?

Oregon Live is fake news?

http://www.oregonlive.com/opinion/index.ssf/2017/05/is_portland_done_with_punk_fas.html

Portland must be done with punk fascists: Opinion

The May Day rally on Monday was only an hour into its march through downtown before Portland police shut it down, citing vandalism and threats from so-called anarchists. And within 20 minutes, anarchists started a fire at the intersection of Southwest 4th Avenue and Southwest Morrison Street. Piled-up green and blue plastic news boxes and white commercial signs ignited quickly, erupting into orange flames and sending up a thick plume of black smoke.

Before nightfall, a few storefront and office windows were broken, restaurant tables and chairs were dragged into the street, projectiles were thrown at police, and flash bang grenades were launched by police in riot gear. Twenty-five arrests were made.

...

If this sounds familiar, not to mention stupid and costly, you're right. Last November, masked and bat-wielding anarchists joined an otherwise peaceful march by 4,000 against the election of Donald Trump and in one short hour trashed storefronts in the Pearl District. For an uncertain 20 televised minutes, as unseen police mobilized a response, the anarchists showed Portland they really could hold the city by its throat.

 

[riverman]

Trump isn't accomplishing anything.

Trump is dragging us backwards and I sincerely protest his direction.......you and I view success very, very differently though.

 

[riverman]

anarchists started a fire

hundreds and tens of thousands of violent acts is not quite some douche starting a fire......if 10000 people started destroying Portland we'd see the Nat'l Guard on the streets.

 

[riverman]

Oregon Live is fake news?

I have no idea.....don't subscribe to that news feed and only have read links posted here from there....

 

[SlyPokerDog]

Oregon Live is fake news?

No, editorials are not fake news. Only you have made that claim in the past.

 

[MarAzul]

Those who forget history are doomed to repeat it.

Someone famous said that.
Its true.

I'm willing to bet a majority of American citizens do not know much about our history.

That said, I disagree with Santayana's sentiment that those who forget history are condemned to repeat it. Humans are condemned to repeat history, regardless. The same themes keep recurring, history tends to go in cycles (modified for the era). Because until our essential natures change, humans remain humans regardless of the time period with the same concerns and aggressions. In my opinion, though, while history cycles, continued social progress (as I'd define it) serves to reduce the amplitude on those cycles, causing less extreme swings towards violence and hatred. So, in that sense, even if individuals don't have a good memory of their high school history, memory of history tends to get baked into the development of society.

Pure baloney. Tearing down is regression in the name of progression. They both look the same, change. Actually I really have no feel for the statues raised in the Eastern US, but I would leave it to the residents of that area to decide their worth. What the hell a loud mouth from Oregon is weighing in about is a different matter. Progressive's are like that, mind everyone's business and support any change. Pay no mind to unintended consequences, move on down the progressive agenda. It is never complete, there is more to destroy.

 

[Minstrel]

Progressive's are like that, mind everyone's business and support any change.

Not any change, just the ones that make sense.

Also, I'm not advocating for the statues to be destroyed. Just not displayed on public land.

 

[MarAzul]

Just not displayed on public land.

Not your fucking call. If you had any sense, you would not need to be tutored.

 

[Minstrel]

Not your fucking call.

When did I say it was my call? It's up to the local mayors and governors.

 

[MarAzul]

It's up to the local mayors and governors.

Hopefully they follow the will of their people. Not like the democrats in Durham that let the destruction happen and then sort it out later.
That will piss people off.

 

[Minstrel]

Hopefully there follow the will of their people.

The will of the people elects politicians--once there, they should do what they believe is right. If the people disagree with their actions, the recourse is to vote them out. If we did everything by polling, we wouldn't need elected representatives.