Wizards show interest; Olshey to stay with Trailblazers

[hoopsjock]

Yup. That's about even

9th pick is like the 15th pick in a mormal draft. Wall's contract is cancer.

I had the idea to include a 2020 unprotected 1st instead. For shits and giggles if the Blazers had the #4 pick who would you take?

 

[BonesJones]

I had the idea to include a 2020 unprotected 1st instead. For shits and giggles if the Blazers had the #4 pick who would you take?

Toss-up between DeAndre Hunter, Jarrett Culver, and Cameron Reddish.

All 3 can play SF.

Hunter is the best defender and has offensive potential.
Culver is a good defender, with good ball handling ability and the ability to score on all 3 levels as well as make plays for others.
Reddish is the best shooter and has the most potential and Portland would be a perfect place to help him reach it.

 

[THE HCP]

Have you ever thought about becoming a GM? You know the salary cap inside n out, are an excellent talent evaluator, and to top it all off are a true student of the game.

Ohh but wait, nobody would want to work with you, so it'd be impossible to get anything done. Nevermind, forget I mentioned it.

This is spot on FAMS

 

[BonesJones]

This is spot on FAMS

I think he meant to tag you. I hear the TV truck gets pretty musty.

 

[BigGameDamian]

 

[BigGameDamian]

 

[borim69]

OK--We all know that Olshey royally screwed the pooch July 2016. It was plainly evident within less than a year. He wasn't fired during the 16-17 season, though he probably deserved to be. If he were going to be impacted by his 2016 failures, it would have happened already.

When we're evaluating this extension, I think we have to look essentially at everything he's done since then. So here's my question: have his recovery efforts over the past 2 years earned him more time?

• Trading Plumlee and a 2nd for Nurkic and a 1st
• Trading up for Collins and drafting Swanigan
• Trading Crabbe for Nicholson
• Trading Vonleh for nothing
• Drafting Simons
• Trading 2 future 2nds Trent
• Re-signing Nurk for 48M/4y
• Trading Swanigan for Skal
• Trading Stauskas/Baldwin/2 2nds for Hood

Now I'm not counting free agent signings that aren't carrying forward (Curry/Kanter), since they have no impact on the team's future. But looking at the past almost 3 years in totality, Olshey has turned Plumlee/Vonleh/Crabbe/4 1sts/5 2nds into Nurkic/Collins/Skal/Simons, and a WCF appearance.

Guess I have to agree with you. I did the work, and I'm still less than impressed.

Yes and all the free agents that were beating on the door to come to Portland at that time. I honestly think that Aldridge when he walked without giving notice, players actually looked at that and said "man I do not want be there" and we actually became a dead zone. Now that the"Island for misfit toys" has made it to the WCF the door will be open for us once again. I get the unlove for NO but looking at everything he had 2 really bad deals. Turners contract would have been bad even if he had stayed the same caliber of player as he was when we picked him up but he got worse each year which made his contract even more horrible. Leonard was a gamble he looked like he was getting better when he got injured in his contract year. Who knows he might be able to do something better now that we went to the WCF and people might want to play in Portland now. I was all for the axing of Stotts and NO after the "Pelican Brief" series and they should have honestly, but with the acquisition of Kanter , Hood, and Curry I think they more then made up for it.

 

[HailBlazers]

Ok?

My point is that there's a lot more to a good GM than people understand/give Neil credit for.

 

[Orion Bailey]

My point is that there's a lot more to a good GM than people understand/give Neil credit for.

Id like to add that all gms have something not work at some point, or, what here would be considered a bad move. No gm is perfect

 

[wizenheimer]

I for one don't get the problem some folks have with Neil and Woj being really good friends..they ..have a long history..so what?

nothing is wrong with it as long as people keep in mind that Olshey is spinning like crazy in some of his leaks to Woj. Woj can report accurately what Olshey leaks to him but that doesn't mean that what's leaked isn't bullshit

 

[wizenheimer]

• Trading Crabbe for Nicholson - Good. Bailing the team out of Crabbe's horrible, Paul Allen instigated, contract, & delaying Lux Tax.

I hate biased takes like that. I've seen Olshey apologists try and blame Paul Allen for 2016 over and over. I think it's off base

it's off base because the same people who will twist themselves in logical knots blaming PA for the bad moves will untwist in a hurry to give Olshey credit for all the good moves...

and the thing is, if PA was micromanaging the Blazers into those bad moves he was still there micromanaging the good moves as well. So if PA was responsible for Crabbe's extension, he was responsible for the Nicholson trade and the Plumlee trade for Nurkic

I'd also say that if you just paid attention to Olshey's love affair with Meyers you'd know Olshey was front and center involved in 2016

 

[e_blazer]

I hate biased takes like that. I've seen Olshey apologists try and blame Paul Allen for 2016 over and over. I think it's off base

it's off base because the same people who will twist themselves in logical knots blaming PA for the bad moves will untwist in a hurry to give Olshey credit for all the good moves...

and the thing is, if PA was micromanaging the Blazers into those bad moves he was still there micromanaging the good moves as well. So if PA was responsible for Crabbe's extension, he was responsible for the Nicholson trade and the Plumlee trade for Nurkic

I'd also say that if you just paid attention to Olshey's love affair with Meyers you'd know Olshey was front and center involved in 2016

It's called an "opinion", wizenheimer. Sorry if it upped your blood pressure a few points, but I'm allowed one just like you are. That's what keeps this place from becoming an echo chamber where all we allow are folks who agree with our own biases. BTW, you have plenty of biases of your own and you haven't been particularly bashful in expressing them.

I probably shouldn't have used the word "instigated" since I don't know for a fact that Paul Allen actually pushed to match on Crabbe. He certainly signed off on it or NO would have been given his walking papers when it turned out so badly and the team had to eat Nicholson's contract in order to get out of Crabbe's.

In retrospect, I think that 2016 was a result of the Blazers (Olshey included) getting a bit happy with themselves after the unexpected playoff success the previous season and thinking that they were closer than they were to competing. Most things I read about the move indicated that there was a consensus that the Lillard, CJ, Crabbe backcourt rotation was a good one and that Crabbe might be due to make a major leap building off of the previous season. They spent $19M, plus ultimately another $2.7M of Nicholson's contract stretched over 7 years, to find out that there really wasn't much "up" left for Crabbe. Like I said, I think we have to assume that PA was okay with that cost since NO didn't get the axe. For those who hate Olshey, it's always going to be one of the biggest blotches on his resume. I always wonder the flipside, however. If the Blazers don't match and Crabbe had taken a major step forward with the Nets, how would the Olshey haters have reacted to that? I suspect we all know the answer to that, but it's a lot easier to use 20-20 hindsight and claim that Olshey should have known that Crabbe wouldn't have panned out.

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

I hate biased takes like that. I've seen Olshey apologists try and blame Paul Allen for 2016 over and over. I think it's off base

it's off base because the same people who will twist themselves in logical knots blaming PA for the bad moves will untwist in a hurry to give Olshey credit for all the good moves...

and the thing is, if PA was micromanaging the Blazers into those bad moves he was still there micromanaging the good moves as well. So if PA was responsible for Crabbe's extension, he was responsible for the Nicholson trade and the Plumlee trade for Nurkic

I'd also say that if you just paid attention to Olshey's love affair with Meyers you'd know Olshey was front and center involved in 2016

This post kind of reeks of a lot of assumptions. Im not saying the post you replied to didnt assume things as well.
However you say, “if” PA was heavily involved in signing Crabbe, “then” he had too be involved with other trades. How do you know that? Its very possible he was involved heavily in one thing and backed off and wasnt involved in another, or as involved at least.
It breaks the logical process to say well if one event took place because of one factor then all other events took place because of that same process.

 

[wizenheimer]

This post kind of reeks of a lot of assumptions. Im not saying the post you replied to didnt assume things as well.
However you say, “if” PA was heavily involved in signing Crabbe, “then” he had too be involved with other trades. How do you know that? Its very possible he was involved heavily in one thing and backed off and wasnt involved in another, or as involved at least.
It breaks the logical process to say well if one event took place because of one factor then all other events took place because of that same process.

maybe I botched my post a little: If Paul Allen was micro-managing enough to over-rule Olshey on matching the Crabbe offer sheet, and that's for sure what some Olshey supporters have been saying, then why would it be PA was only involved in one bad decision. That's what "breaks the logical process". If he was calling one move, it's certain he'd be calling other moves, and it's just about certain they would have not only been just the bad moves

do you think it was PA that told Olshey to go out and make a big offer to Turner? Whose idea was Turner in the first place? Who saw Turner as the prize in 1016. And who went hard after Chandler Parsons. Or Roy Hibber; or Greg Monroe. Was it Paul Allen who in 2015 tried to extend Meyers for a rumored 15M/year, or was it the GM who said "if Meyers believed in himself half as much as I believe in him he'd be an all-star" Nope, that was all Olshey and I'd really like somebody to present evidence there was any team, other than Portland, willing to pay Meyers 10M/year after the crappy year he had in 15-16.

yes, obviously PA signed off on 2016, but the GM was the architect of that house of cards

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

maybe I botched my post a little: If Paul Allen was micro-managing enough to over-rule Olshey on matching the Crabbe offer sheet, and that's for sure what some Olshey supporters have been saying, then why would it be PA was only involved in one bad decision. That's what "breaks the logical process". If he was calling one move, it's certain he'd be calling other moves, and it's just about certain they would have not only been just the bad moves

do you think it was PA that told Olshey to go out and make a big offer to Turner? Whose idea was Turner in the first place? Who saw Turner as the prize in 1016. And who went hard after Chandler Parsons. Or Roy Hibber; or Greg Monroe. Was it Paul Allen who in 2015 tried to extend Meyers for a rumored 15M/year, or was it the GM who said "if Meyers believed in himself half as much as I believe in him he'd be an all-star" Nope, that was all Olshey and I'd really like somebody to present evidence there was any team, other than Portland, willing to pay Meyers 10M/year after the crappy year he had in 15-16.

yes, obviously PA signed off in 2016, but the GM was the architect of that house of cards

I would say the team they built was on both of them. The good the bad and the ugly. Generally, things roll both ways. When someone on my team at work screw up, I have to take responsibility for that to my boss. He has to take responsibility for that to investors. So when NO did stupid things at least some of the responsibility falls on his boss. Now I have no idea how much "micromanagement" PA did towards the end of his life, but I know he had a reputation as a "somewhat" hands-on owner. I don't know if it was all NO giving PA bad advice, or PA saying I want this guy. I do know that PA hired NO to build a team, and therefore PA isn't absolved if the GM was doing something he didn't like well bosses fire employee's for screwing up, it never appeared like NO's job was really in danger. So to that extent, I believe that NO was doing things that PA in the very least signed off on.

Also no one saw ET as the prize in 2016, I believe they were going after Chandler freaking Parsons and was that the year they tried to get Whiteside(?) sorry I'm drawing a blank on that, but ET was definitely not "option a", I think when it looked like they may "strike out" they kind of over-reacted and overpaid wanting to make sure they "did something" with that money. Now, I think we all know that summer of 2016 was a pretty epicly bad off-season for the Blazers, whether it was "All on NO, or All on PA", I dunno your guess is as good as mine.

 

[hoopsjock]

maybe I botched my post a little: If Paul Allen was micro-managing enough to over-rule Olshey on matching the Crabbe offer sheet, and that's for sure what some Olshey supporters have been saying, then why would it be PA was only involved in one bad decision. That's what "breaks the logical process". If he was calling one move, it's certain he'd be calling other moves, and it's just about certain they would have not only been just the bad moves

do you think it was PA that told Olshey to go out and make a big offer to Turner? Whose idea was Turner in the first place? Who saw Turner as the prize in 1016. And who went hard after Chandler Parsons. Or Roy Hibber; or Greg Monroe. Was it Paul Allen who in 2015 tried to extend Meyers for a rumored 15M/year, or was it the GM who said "if Meyers believed in himself half as much as I believe in him he'd be an all-star" Nope, that was all Olshey and I'd really like somebody to present evidence there was any team, other than Portland, willing to pay Meyers 10M/year after the crappy year he had in 15-16.

yes, obviously PA signed off on 2016, but the GM was the architect of that house of cards

It is possible that Allen changed his mind and I think it's pretty simple...

2015-16 we advance to the 2nd round and actually play the Warriors tough. If not for Curry OT heroics in game 4 we could've possibly tied the series 2-2.

Summer of 2016 Paul Allen is all in on the Blazers and going as far over the cap as Olshey wants to and demands we keep the team together while also using our cap space to add to the core.

2016-17 the team struggles and is not looking likely to make the playoffs completely failing to build of the success of the previous season. The Nurk trade momentarily saves the season but he gets hurt and we get swept by the Warriors in a series that isn't even close outside of game 3 where Nurk tried to play on one leg.

Summer of 2017 Allen doesn't like paying the tax for a team that barely makes the playoffs and demands Olshey to get under the tax.

 

[illmatic99]

Oh for fucks sake. You go away for 3 days and this happens? I just now saw this extension. Massive news.

 

[TorturedBlazerFan]

Oh for fucks sake. You go away for 3 days and this happens? I just now saw this extension. Massive news.

Hope you had a good vacation!

 

[illmatic99]

Hope you had a good vacation!

Too short.

But 5 years! Jody is going all in. Guess we need to set aside the fears of her selling the team will all these extensions and new contracts. This is a good sign that the spending won't stop. Now we need to actually put this $ to good use and land us a serious star. At least our management isn't a complete failure like in LA.

Good ownership is the first key to winning in the league. We have that.