Would someone explain to me why Oden was so ineffective tonight?

[KingSpeed]

Fear of fouling?

Bad coaching?

Out of shape?

Offseason surgery?

Youth?

I will give him this- in the 2nd half, they gave him the ball, he backed Dampier in and put up an easy hook over him. So I suppose we could go to him a bit more than we do. But still, he's so invisible out there, for the most part. I'm not even talking about stats. Joel only had 2 more rebounds than Greg but he was sooo much more active than Greg. And he's playing with a bad wrist.

Get ready for the Durant vs Oden comparisons that the media are gonna be doling out over the next 48 hours.

 

[hasoos]

I don't know how often I have to say this. Oden needs the ball to be effective, and they just are not giving it to him. He got the ball in the second half, made a small difference, and then Nate put in Joel, which wasn't all bad Portland made another run, but they made several in the half. It just seemed after a bit that Nate was trying to out coach Carslisle, and after every timeout, he had a different lineup in. Some of those lineups didn't include either of the bigs.


The bigs are the Blazers strength. If they don't use them, we lose. That is all there is to it.

 

[The Professional Fan]

I don't know how often I have to say this. Oden needs the ball to be effective, and they just are not giving it to him. He got the ball in the second half, made a small difference, and then Nate put in Joel, which wasn't all bad Portland made another run, but they made several in the half. It just seemed after a bit that Nate was trying to out coach Carslisle, and after every timeout, he had a different lineup in. Some of those lineups didn't include either of the bigs.


The bigs are the Blazers strength. If they don't use them, we lose. That is all there is to it.

Yep. Thread over.

 

[Nikolokolus]

You make it way too complicated.

He's just a rookie, he's making rookie mistakes ... and more importantly Joel has been playing like the rock of Gibraltar on defense.

 

[oldmangrouch]

(shakes head)

Everytime I think the kid is starting to "get it", he regresses. At some point, the excuses have to stop.

 

[handiman]

Nate sticks to very rigid rotation patterns, usually changed only by foul troubles, and that puts Oden in match-up problems frequently against perimeter bigs, or has him sitting on the bench when there's a match-up he could be taking advantage of inside.

 

[craigehlo]

I don't know how often I have to say this. Oden needs the ball to be effective, and they just are not giving it to him.

Nuff said.

Our guards can't get him the rock when he's open. They need to deliver the ball to him in spots where he can be effective.

 

[The Professional Fan]

(shakes head)

Everytime I think the kid is starting to "get it", he regresses. At some point, the excuses have to stop.

I will admit that Greg is insecure in his game. There is no doubt about that. But he just needs time to get his confidence back, that is all. Really. That is all. We all need to be more patient with him. Trust me.....

 

[illmatic99]

Nuff said.

Our guards can't get him the rock when he's open. They need to deliver the ball to him in spots where he can be effective.

For that reason alone, I want Andre Miller or Kirk Hinrich on the team. As of right now, Batum and Rudy are our best post-entry passers, and even they're hesitant to make the pass sometimes. Either get a better guard who can feed Oden, or run more pick and rolls for him. There is absolutely no excuse for Nate to stifle GO's offensive game because of the inability of our guards.

 

[oldmangrouch]

I will admit that Greg is insecure in his game. There is no doubt about that. But he just needs time to get his confidence back, that is all. Really. That is all. We all need to be more patient with him. Trust me.....

Exactly. The mental side of his game is the problem.

Great players have more than great talent.....they have intensity, confidence, and killer instinct. Too many nights, Oden is 0-for-3.

 

[KingSpeed]

Yes, we could probably get him the ball more often. But can't he be effective without the ball? I thought we got him for rebounding and defense? Someone who could have a huge impact on the court WITHOUT having plays run for him. We already have LMA and Roy as our top two options. Oden was supposed to be that rock in the middle. But he hasn't been. He's practically given up on defense because he doesn't want to get into foul trouble. He misses a lot of rebounds. He's just lost out there a lot of the time.

 

[hasoos]

Nuff said.

Our guards can't get him the rock when he's open. They need to deliver the ball to him in spots where he can be effective.

Man I don't know how many times I scream at the guards to throw the ball to Oden or Aldridge when they are open, and its like they look right at them, and then throw the ball somewhere else. It absolutely blows my mind. If they had played with Shaq, he would have beat their asses by now.

 

[The Professional Fan]

Exactly. The mental side of his game is the problem.

Great players have more than great talent.....they have intensity, confidence, and killer instinct. Too many nights, Oden is 0-for-3.

Well, I understand that, and I agree. I have to ask though, and I wonder this from time to time:

Would Greg have been as insecure or tentative if the surgery never happened? In other words, he came off a great season at Ohio St, a season in which he was extremely agile, explosive, confident, and historically a winner. When I watched Oden as a Freshman at Ohio St, I saw a COMPLETELY different player. I'm assuming you've seen this footage as well. Or, perhaps you saw it real time, like I did. The Oden we have today is not the same Oden Ohio St had, yet he's what - 2 years older? I have absolutely no reason to believe that the Ohio St Oden will not eventually emerge, and likely emerge next season.

Greg has always relied on his natural born ability. That ability was taken from him due to surgery, and then he was placed in the most demanding basketball league in the world. His insecurity is completely understandable. And I have no doubt that he will come out of it.

 

[PapaG]

Reading some of the posts in this thread, and it's almost like Oden was not supposed to be a rebounding and defensive monster first and foremost. Now the offense needs to run through him in order for him to be effective? Why the hell have LMA and Brandon Roy if that is the case. Get some lockdown defenders, some perimeter shooters, and just feed the ball to Oden on every play! Championships galore!

The excuses need to stop. The guy disappears at times. Why? I've posted repeatedly that he could at least be active on the boards. He is a physical freak.

 

[PapaG]

Well, I understand that, and I agree. I have to ask though, and I wonder this from time to time:

Would Greg have been as insecure or tentative if the surgery never happened? In other words, he came off a great season at Ohio St, a season in which he was extremely agile, explosive, confident, and historically a winner. When I watched Oden as a Freshman at Ohio St, I saw a COMPLETELY different player. I'm assuming you've seen this footage as well. Or, perhaps you saw it real time, like I did. The Oden we have today is not the same Oden Ohio St had, yet he's what - 2 years older? I have absolutely no reason to believe that the Ohio St Oden will not eventually emerge, and likely emerge next season.

Greg has always relied on his natural born ability. That ability was taken from him due to surgery, and then he was placed in the most demanding basketball league in the world. His insecurity is completely understandable. And I have no doubt that he will come out of it.

I'm not sure he ever faced a comparable opponent physically in college. Now, players like Hilton Armstrong are blocking his shot. The guy needs to get some fire in his gut and trust his gifts.

 

[hasoos]

Reading some of the posts in this thread, and it's almost like Oden was not supposed to be a rebounding and defensive monster first and foremost. Now the offense needs to run through him in order for him to be effective? Why the hell have LMA and Brandon Roy if that is the case. Get some lockdown defenders, some perimeter shooters, and just feed the ball to Oden on every play! Championships galore!

The excuses need to stop. The guy disappears at times. Why? I've posted repeatedly that he could at least be active on the boards. He is a physical freak.

It depends on which side of the ball you are talking. Is it not true that bigs have a much better chance for a rebound if they are closer to the rim when the shot goes off? Inside shots provide that.

On the other side, I agree, you just have to box out and bring it. Unfortunately for Portland tonight, Dallas shoots a lot of 3's. Missed 3's lead to long rebounds, often where your bigs are not at.

 

[Jayps15]

Yes, we could probably get him the ball more often. But can't he be effective without the ball? I thought we got him for rebounding and defense? Someone who could have a huge impact on the court WITHOUT having plays run for him. We already have LMA and Roy as our top two options. Oden was supposed to be that rock in the middle. But he hasn't been. He's practically given up on defense because he doesn't want to get into foul trouble. He misses a lot of rebounds. He's just lost out there a lot of the time.

Greg Oden makes an impact without plays being run for him, he's got a 55% FG percentage with only 47% of his baskets being assisted on.

Other good centers:
Yao: FG: 54% Assisted: 57%
Dwight: FG:56% Assisted: 54%
Bynum: FG:55% Assisted: 63%
O'Neal: FG: 59% Assisted: 52%

He creates a higher percentage of his own offensive opportunities than any of those top centers, and of all of these guys Oden is second to only Dwight Howard in drawing fouls.

Hell even Pryzbilla is assisted on 62% of his FGs.

And he's just fine rebounding the ball as well.

 

[The Professional Fan]

I'm not sure he ever faced a comparable opponent physically in college. Now, players like Hilton Armstrong are blocking his shot. The guy needs to get some fire in his gut and trust his gifts.

Nah....he was so fast off the floor in college, so fast getting down the floor, and he jumped so fucking high. He was a bigger, faster Amare. That's why he was a once in a decade prospect. And he'll get back there. I really have no doubt. It just takes a little patience on our part. Thank God he came to Portland. Had this kid gone to NY or LA, my god.....

 

[Rodolfo]

Hasn't this been talked about a million times in a million different threads? He's a rookie. He's coming off major surgery. He will get better. everyone relax. fin.

 

[The Professional Fan]

Hasn't this been talked about a million times in a million different threads? He's a rookie. He's coming off major surgery. He will get better. everyone relax. fin.

Word.

 

[PapaG]

It depends on which side of the ball you are talking. Is it not true that bigs have a much better chance for a rebound if they are closer to the rim when the shot goes off? Inside shots provide that.

On the other side, I agree, you just have to box out and bring it. Unfortunately for Portland tonight, Dallas shoots a lot of 3's. Missed 3's lead to long rebounds, often where your bigs are not at.

Dallas shot 14 3s tonight; the Blazers shot 13. JJ Barea ended up with one less rebound than Greg Oden.

 

[C_note]

It's apparent Oden is a rotation-player at best. We should trade him now, and at least salvage some of the value he still has. I'd settle for a late-lottery pick.

 

[PapaG]

Hasn't this been talked about a million times in a million different threads? He's a rookie. He's coming off major surgery. He will get better. everyone relax. fin.

Yeah, I've said he needs to be given time and that he isn't completely healthy. I've been flamed for posting it.

 

[PapaG]

It's apparent Oden is a rotation-player at best. We should trade him now, and at least salvage some of the value he still has. I'd settle for a late-lottery pick.

I assume this is sarcasm, but my literal side would agree since the guy seems to disappear on some nights. You can't measure intangibles.

 

[Natebishop3]

It's apparent Oden is a rotation-player at best. We should trade him now, and at least salvage some of the value he still has. I'd settle for a late-lottery pick.

Is this a serious post? I can't tell....

 

[craigehlo]

On defense, I can see the argument that he's hitting the rookie wall. Slack should be cut there.

On offense, it's all on the coaching staff and team to get him involved. He's getting deep, he just needs the rock. If he were on the Suns, he would be averaging at least 15ppg.

 

[Natebishop3]

Trading Oden at this point would be just plain stupid.

 

[PapaG]

I'm sick of this mentality. Unless we have the best player in the NBA, no one on the team should be untouchable. If we could get Howard for Oden, would it be stupid too?

No, it would be a steal at this point and would make the Blazers a title contender for years to come.

Find your fire, Greg.

 

[Natebishop3]

I'm sick of this mentality. Unless we have the best player in the NBA, no one on the team should be untouchable. If we could get Howard for Oden, would it be stupid too?

Do you REALLY think we're going to get someone like Dwight Howard for Oden? No. We're going to get a collection of young talent, or an older All-Star. I doubt we'd get a Bosh, Wade, or even a Devin Harris. Oden is an unproven commodity at this point, and it behooves us to hold onto him and keep developing him. In terms of potential, Oden is through the roof. Very few players have come along like him, and very few will come along after... we need to cultivate this. Trading would be impatient and foolhardy.

 

[PapaG]

Do you REALLY think we're going to get someone like Dwight Howard for Oden? No. We're going to get a collection of young talent, or an older All-Star. I doubt we'd get a Bosh, Wade, or even a Devin Harris. Oden is an unproven commodity at this point, and it behooves us to hold onto him and keep developing him. In terms of potential, Oden is through the roof. Very few players have come along like him, and very few will come along after... we need to cultivate this. Trading would be impatient and foolhardy.

A straight from HS player who can't shoot FTs for a "once-in-a-generation center"? Seems like a steal for Orlando.