Trade Would you trade CJ... The Super Duper Trade Thread!

[blue9]

So does that mean we can expect Harkless to one day have a pretty good jumper? He didn't when he came out and he still doesn't.
But I admit, regardless of whether or not Simmons does get one....he is going to be good. Fuck I can see that I am changing my mind, but I don't want to admit the Lakers will be getting a young star.

Hopefully! People said Harkless had a decent 3P% early in his career. He's definitely got much better form than Aminu.

 

[Natebishop3]

In an era where IND will never come out of the East? Might be better for them to plan for the future, rather than futilely hoping they'll beat LBJ one of these years.

But George is only 26.. he just turned 26..... Why can't he be part of the future? He's a top 10 talent in the NBA. George is arguably the ceiling for Irving.

 

[42N8Bounce]

My questions is, what are the percentages of such trades paying off vs becoming busts?

Looking at the drafts between 1990 and 2010, the #2 pick has resulted in an all-star 42.9% of the time, and a starter 81.0% (started over half the games they played). That means 19.0% of the drafts, the #2 pick did not even result in a starter quality player.

Some past #2 picks:
2010: Evan Turner ("starter". Has barely started over half his games.)
2009: Hasheem Thabeet (not a starter)
2008: Michael Beasley (not a starter)
2007: Kevin Durant (All-Star)
2006: LaMarcus Aldridge (All-Star)
2005: Marvin Williams (Starter)
2004: Emeka Okafor (Starter)
2003: Darko Milicic (not a starter)
2002: Jay Williams (starter)
2001: Tyson Chandler (All-Star)
2000: Stromile Swift (not a starter)

CJ is already playing at an all-star level in my opinion (although not yet an all-star). On top of that, he's a quality teammate. I'm sticking with CJ.

 

[blue9]

But George is only 26.. he just turned 26..... Why can't he be part of the future? He's a top 10 talent in the NBA. George is arguably the ceiling for Irving.

And unless LBJ decides to come out West he'll be at least 29 before he as a shot at getting his team to the Finals. And by then BOS may be the dominant team - or even PHI!

 

[SlyPokerDog]

In Laker world CJ doesn't move the needle. Laker fans always believe that a Westbrook, Harden, Durant, Lebron, type player will just suddenly show up and want to play for the Lakers. Now they have a magical dreamy #2 pick. That could be the next Kobe or Lebron. Would you trade Lebron for CJ?

Would you trade the mystery box for a boat? No, because the mystery box be anything, including a boat.

Doesn't matter what we want, Lakers ain't makin' that trade.

 

[DreamKillah]

Not unless they didn't answer the phone

At that point you are guaranteed Simmons or Ingram, and while I really like CJ, and think he is a damn good player, those two have a chance to be special, and if you are a team like Portland, who doesn't attract a lot of "special" FA's, then you have to swing for the fences. IMHO, worst case scenario is you get a player that will be as good as CJ is right now in a year. It may not pay off in year 1, but I think overall it would be best for the franchise

Belatedly I agree . . . You'd probably have to get Dame to agree, and I don't see that happening -- those two are like brothers . . .

 

[BigGameDamian]

How many 2 guards have held down reddick and Thompson in this league it is two guys I wouldn't evaluate my 2 guard if he can play defense. Does he need to get better yes.

Defending guards in the NBA.

 

[speeds]

Why do people say DeRozen is a chucker? Honest question. The guy has a true shooting percentage of .550. CJ's is worse than that at .544. DeRozen takes about 5.5 less shots per game than CJ does. DeRozen gets to the line way more. Has a higher PER and a better defensive rating to boot.

I don't get the hate

DeRozan had a bit of a bounce-back year for sure. Look at his other years. Or just ask @speeds what the fans up there think of the player (or even what the team itself thinks reportedly).

He's had a few good seasons but in the playoffs he's been a bit shit.

If you want to come up with an idea for trading CJ, it needs to be for a substantially good player. Not a role player like Nerlens Noel.

Cousins has been thrown around, but I don't think he fits the culture we're trying to maintain here...and look at his FG%.

One guy I would think about is Jonas Valanciunas. He could hold down the for at center for years to come. 24 years old, from Lithuania, good size and athletisim for a big man. Good rebounder, shot blocker, interior defender, shoots 57% from the field, 77% from the FT line, averaged 18/13 per 36 minutes last year. Jonas and #9 for CJ?

Biyombo is a free agent. Keep CJ and sign him.

 

[Boob-No-More]

He's had a few good seasons but in the playoffs he's been a bit shit.

This. He has Hardenitis in the post season. Like Harden he faces better defenders and better refs in the playoffs and his game suffers. Plus, he wants a max deal starting at $25 million.

Biyombo is a free agent. Keep CJ and sign him.

If he's cheap enough, I'd sign him as a back-up small ball center, but he won't be cheap enough. He's too undersized to be a full time starting center and does not have the shooting touch to play PF under Terry Stotts (or anyone, really). With the cap going way up, Biyombo will be overpaid by someone.

BNM

 

[PCmor7]

No.

 

[Sarni]

Definitely not for Noel, I don't like Noel's offense even if his defence is very good. Okafor has a higher ceiling IMO for future, he'll find it easier to improve the D than Noel will to develop consistent scoring threat. And I wouldn't even do this for Okafor, CJ for me is a player we need to be building around. Try moving other pieces for Okafor if it's possible at all but avoid using CJ in a possible trade.

 

[PHXBlazer1]

We're not trading CJ.

 

[ripcityboy]

 

[WillG]

Looks at proposed trade:

 

[Orion Bailey]

What if that pick could be flipped for a superstar?

For example - Anthony Davis.

If we offered up Simmons (assuming he's still there), Plumlee, and Vonleh for Davis, would the Pelicans accept?

Davis has health concerns, but he's a top 5 player in the league. The Pelicans probably wouldn't deal him for CJ, but they might be willing to do it for someone like Simmons.

I've said that the only way I think it benefits us is if the pick is used in trade. NOT as a roster spot.

If we get rid of CJ, we MUST get equal or more value back. Yes it may take CJ+?, but I don't want to trade him for two or three role players, or a young potential prospect from the draft. Must be a proven all star or we wont be improving the team.

 

[Mediocre Man]

Looking at the drafts between 1990 and 2010, the #2 pick has resulted in an all-star 42.9% of the time, and a starter 81.0% (started over half the games they played). That means 19.0% of the drafts, the #2 pick did not even result in a starter quality player.

Some past #2 picks:
2010: Evan Turner ("starter". Has barely started over half his games.)
2009: Hasheem Thabeet (not a starter)
2008: Michael Beasley (not a starter)
2007: Kevin Durant (All-Star)
2006: LaMarcus Aldridge (All-Star)
2005: Marvin Williams (Starter)
2004: Emeka Okafor (Starter)
2003: Darko Milicic (not a starter)
2002: Jay Williams (starter)
2001: Tyson Chandler (All-Star)
2000: Stromile Swift (not a starter)

CJ is already playing at an all-star level in my opinion (although not yet an all-star). On top of that, he's a quality teammate. I'm sticking with CJ.

View attachment 9121

These are always a bit unfair. Bad teams are constantly in the lottery, but when good teams get their due to trades or injuries, those picks are different. For example, Portland probably would have drafted Dame #2 over Michael Kidd Gilchrist. In this particular draft, both Simmons and Ingram are thought to be really outstanding prospects. Instead of looking at who the 2nd pick was in certain drafts, look at who the 2nd and 3rd best players were. That is more likely who a good GM like Neil Olshey would draft.

 

[BigGameDamian]

No.

Because you think CJ is untouchable?

 

[GriLtCheeZ]

Because you think CJ is untouchable?

I don't think CJ is an Untouchable I think he's a Kshatryia, you know a Warrior, King or a blazer.

 

[BBert]

Why would we trade CJ, a lottery pick who has proven his worth in actual NBA games, who is one-half of what is universally referred to as the second best back court in the NBA, and who is on the heals of 3 years of NBA experience and his second year of solid of playoff experience, for a lottery pick who has not proven himself or even played in the NBA?

We wouldn't.

You don't break up the "second best back court" in the NBA. You find other ways to improve your team.

 

[cardova08]

For a slice of hot pizza? Supreme, extra cheese. Maybe even stuffed crust. Mmmm...

 

[Mediocre Man]

The cheese and bacon stuffed crust at pizza hut is way better than CJ can ever be in the NBA

 

[Jon]

Pizza Hut SUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCKS

 

[PtldPlatypus]

Why would we trade CJ, a lottery pick who has proven his worth in actual NBA games, who is one-half of what is universally referred to as the second best back court in the NBA, and who is on the heals of 3 years of NBA experience and his second year of solid of playoff experience, for a lottery pick who has not proven himself or even played in the NBA?

We wouldn't.

You don't break up the "second best back court" in the NBA. You find other ways to improve your team.

How many backcourts were better than Curry/Ellis in 2011? Those two combined for 42.7 ppg on 34.3 fga, both shooting over 45%. Breaking up that backcourt seemed to be a decent choice.

 

[Jon]

In theory, but maybe if Stotts wasn't our coach.

Also, there's this...

how the fuck do you get $30,000 of damages to carpets? the way this place was "damaged", it seems as though, to me anyways, he moved out and then someone broke in and had a party. either that or the landlords screwed with the house when he moved out. something just seems fishy to me about the charges and stuff. how to the landlords know it's Gatorade stains?

 

[Pinwheel1]

How many backcourts were better than Curry/Ellis in 2011? Those two combined for 42.7 ppg on 34.3 fga, both shooting over 45%. Breaking up that backcourt seemed to be a decent choice.

They did not like playing together though. CJ and Dame do. As much as I value Ellis, he does not always seem to fit in with his teammates on the court.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

They did not like playing together though. CJ and Dame do. As much as I value Ellis, he does not always seem to fit in with his teammates on the court.

But is the issue whether or not the players like playing together, or whether or not their games complement each other in such a way that is conducive to winning a championship?

 

[Jon]

...because i sure as shit wouldn't. y'all should stop with the CJ trade stuff. the dude is a great asset to the team. why screw that up?

 

[KeepOnRollin]

Actually, the reason the Warriors traded Ellis was two fold.

1. He was a ball stopper according to their scouts. The flow of the offense was affected. And they wanted him to give Curry more shots in the backcourt (which he resisted).
2. They had just drafted a very big SG by the name of Klay Thompson a few months before the deal and they were ready to turn the position over to him.

Of course defense also contributed to it (as it does to our two guys) but I don't see CJ being a ball-stopper that doesn't get Lillard involved and I don't see where Crabbe is ready to be our Klay Thompson.

So it is easy to throw out Curry and Ellis as the same situation as Dame and CJ but it just isn't when you look at it logically.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

...because i sure as shit wouldn't. y'all should stop with the CJ trade stuff. the dude is a great asset to the team. why screw that up?

The dude IS a great asset to the team, no doubt. But that doesn't mean that there's no way to improve the franchise's championship prospects by dealing him.

And even if you're not in favor of trading him, discussion of the concept provides valuable insight into the fanbase's views of him as an individual player as well as he and Dame as a unit.

This forum exists for the purpose of facilitating conversation. Why would you want to quash that?

 

[BlazerCaravan]

I'm done trading Jermaine for Dale Davis over and over again. I don't care if I'm called irrational for overvaluing our talent; I AM IRRATIONAL. BIG FUCKING DEAL. I like CJ and want him with us for as long as possible.