2023 NBA Draft

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BankTeller said:
With Dame, everyone said "he's playing against a bunch of DII guys". With Sharpe, it was "he's playing against a bunch of high schoolers".

At some point, you just have to assess a prospect's talent and attributes, not competition. I'm also assuming that when you say "inefficient numbers", you're talking about purely his 3pt shooting and free throw shooting because he shot 56% from the field.

Here are the reasons why Amen is ranked so highly:
height 6'5.75 (combine)
weight 214lbs (combine)
wingspan 7'0 (combine)
vertical 44" (reported)
Ability to make plays for others (like actually become be your starting PG, not just a guy who can bring the ball up the court and make the right pass)
Athleticism to play lockdown defense

I think you're going to be surprised with Amen if we draft him.
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By the way that’s height without shoe so he got the size and athleticism to guard 1-3
 
BankTeller said:
With Dame, everyone said "he's playing against a bunch of DII guys". With Sharpe, it was "he's playing against a bunch of high schoolers".

At some point, you just have to assess a prospect's talent and attributes, not competition. I'm also assuming that when you say "inefficient numbers", you're talking about purely his 3pt shooting and free throw shooting because he shot 56% from the field.

Here are the reasons why Amen is ranked so highly:
height 6'5.75 (combine)
weight 214lbs (combine)
wingspan 7'0 (combine)
vertical 44" (reported)
Ability to make plays for others (like actually become be your starting PG, not just a guy who can bring the ball up the court and make the right pass)
Athleticism to play lockdown defense

I think you're going to be surprised with Amen if we draft him.
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Exactly.

I don't know if kids are just getting more talented or have better training programs but you don't have 40" verticals as a lottery pick.....and not do well. At the least, you're Andrew Wiggins or Harrison Barnes....but if you can pass, defend, handle the ball, rebound, make plays, attack the rim, and provide high IQ leadereship? You're drafting a floor general who inspires the team with their presence. The fact that the twins have 40" verticals and 7' wingspans? That's incredible. And it's different than other prospects because guys like Exum, OJ Mayo, Nick Young, or Gerald Green just didn't have other skills to fall back on. Therefore, their games fell apart due to them being incredibly one dimensional.

Ignore competition for a second and use your brain and eyes here and measure the milliseconds and millimeters of space-time that you see in this footage and apply that to the spacing and speed of the NBA.

Watch the passes, the body control while in motion, where Amen positions himself both on and off ball.



I doubt he'll ever have great shooting numbers but I've felt he is a Giannis-lite or Grant Hill-lite....a Ben Simmons/Iguodala hybrid. That his brother is a 33% 3pt shooter means he has the same genetic potential to be passable from the outside, as well.


TBpup said:
Zach Edey with a 7' 10.5" wingspan!!
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Zach Edey is a unicorn, as well (so many of them in this draft!). Highest PER in modern NCAA history (since they started recording PER)...not once but TWICE in a row. At the least, he's a bigger and better Enes Kanter. Imo, due to his height and wingspan, you should take him with the hope that he may help slow Wemby down in limited spurts (a "Wemby Stopper", so to speak). he has good IQ, elite footwork, good size, and his efficiency is some of the best in college history.

At best, it's possible he becomes the Jokic in this draft where he is a quality big man taken in the second round. If Jokic is in that Sabonis (rather, what a healthy Sabonis probably would've become) tier, for example, we can say Edey's absolutely perfect ceiling would be like Yao/Ewing tier.


Personally, I'm not opposed to getting Maxey by trading Dame to the Sixers, drafting Amen, drafting Edey, and using Simons to acquire the Magic's #6 pick (Magic needing a 20ppg guard who can shoot and helping them get to the playoffs considering they were .500 for the latter portion of their season). Use the #6 on Walker - another unicorn. Use #23 on Lively (or James Nnaji, another project big man who looks like he could be a Clint Capella/Nic Claxton type player if developed).

Maxey - Sharpe - Amen - Walker - Lively /// Keon - Little - Jabari - Edey

That's a talented young core, honestly.
 
MrDraftGuy said:
Exactly.

I don't know if kids are just getting more talented or have better training programs but you don't have 40" verticals as a lottery pick.....and not do well. At the least, you're Andrew Wiggins or Harrison Barnes....but if you can pass, defend, handle the ball, rebound, make plays, attack the rim, and provide high IQ leadereship? You're drafting a floor general who inspires the team with their presence. The fact that the twins have 40" verticals and 7' wingspans? That's incredible. And it's different than other prospects because guys like Exum, OJ Mayo, Nick Young, or Gerald Green just didn't have other skills to fall back on. Therefore, their games fell apart due to them being incredibly one dimensional.

Ignore competition for a second and use your brain and eyes here and measure the milliseconds and millimeters of space-time that you see in this footage and apply that to the spacing and speed of the NBA.

Watch the passes, the body control while in motion, where Amen positions himself both on and off ball.



I doubt he'll ever have great shooting numbers but I've felt he is a Giannis-lite or Grant Hill-lite....a Ben Simmons/Iguodala hybrid. That his brother is a 33% 3pt shooter means he has the same genetic potential to be passable from the outside, as well.




Zach Edey is a unicorn, as well (so many of them in this draft!). Highest PER in modern NCAA history (since they started recording PER)...not once but TWICE in a row. At the least, he's a bigger and better Enes Kanter. Imo, due to his height and wingspan, you should take him with the hope that he may help slow Wemby down in limited spurts (a "Wemby Stopper", so to speak). he has good IQ, elite footwork, good size, and his efficiency is some of the best in college history.

At best, it's possible he becomes the Jokic in this draft where he is a quality big man taken in the second round. If Jokic is in that Sabonis (rather, what a healthy Sabonis probably would've become) tier, for example, we can say Edey's absolutely perfect ceiling would be like Yao/Ewing tier.


Personally, I'm not opposed to getting Maxey by trading Dame to the Sixers, drafting Amen, drafting Edey, and using Simons to acquire the Magic's #6 pick (Magic needing a 20ppg guard who can shoot and helping them get to the playoffs considering they were .500 for the latter portion of their season). Use the #6 on Walker - another unicorn. Use #23 on Lively (or James Nnaji, another project big man who looks like he could be a Clint Capella/Nic Claxton type player if developed).

Maxey - Sharpe - Amen - Walker - Lively /// Keon - Little - Jabari - Edey

That's a talented young core, honestly.
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I can get down with this.
 
Two guys that D69 identified last year are really moving up.

Hendricks is up to #4 in some scouts projections and Leonard Miller is said by some to go as high as #10. 6'9" and 6'10" with good wingspans. Hendricks is incredibly versatile defensively and Miller can play D while being very versatile offensively. Those are the types of players (along with B Miller) that this roster desperately needs.
 
3. Portland Trail Blazers - Amen Thompson, G, Overtime Elite City Reapers
Twins Amen and Ausar Thompson feel like the biggest wildcards of the 2023 NBA Draft after they bypassed more traditional routes for the upstart Overtime Elite league — but passing on them in the top-five might be even riskier than taking them. We’ll give Amen the slight edge over his brother because of his playmaking potential as a lead guard. At 6’7 with a 7-foot wingspan, Thompson has the size of a wing and the skill of a guard, and will be one of the five most athletic players in the league next season. He has incredible speed in the open floor and a blazing first step to draw two defenders to the ball, and at times he’ll have some truly creative passing flashes. Thompson is also a remarkable leaper around the basket, but he still needs to improve as a finisher when he’s not dunking it. His intersection of size, speed, leaping, passing, and defensive versatility gives him sky-high upside, but he’s a rough outside shooter who will essentially be starting from scratch with his three-point shot. He’d be a gamble at No. 3, but he has more upside than any player left on the board
 
Fez Forthright said:
3. Portland Trail Blazers - Amen Thompson, G, Overtime Elite City Reapers
Twins Amen and Ausar Thompson feel like the biggest wildcards of the 2023 NBA Draft after they bypassed more traditional routes for the upstart Overtime Elite league — but passing on them in the top-five might be even riskier than taking them. We’ll give Amen the slight edge over his brother because of his playmaking potential as a lead guard. At 6’7 with a 7-foot wingspan, Thompson has the size of a wing and the skill of a guard, and will be one of the five most athletic players in the league next season. He has incredible speed in the open floor and a blazing first step to draw two defenders to the ball, and at times he’ll have some truly creative passing flashes. Thompson is also a remarkable leaper around the basket, but he still needs to improve as a finisher when he’s not dunking it. His intersection of size, speed, leaping, passing, and defensive versatility gives him sky-high upside, but he’s a rough outside shooter who will essentially be starting from scratch with his three-point shot. He’d be a gamble at No. 3, but he has more upside than any player left on the board
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This is what I've been saying. Scoot or Amen imo. The size and athleticism seem next level for Amen. I think we need an Amen post.
 
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Day 2 into draft study.

Cam Whitmore remains my favorite if we decide to make a pick. Trading down to 4-6 might be an option depending on how much teams buy into the Thompson twins hype.
 
BankTeller said:
With Dame, everyone said "he's playing against a bunch of DII guys". With Sharpe, it was "he's playing against a bunch of high schoolers".

At some point, you just have to assess a prospect's talent and attributes, not competition. I'm also assuming that when you say "inefficient numbers", you're talking about purely his 3pt shooting and free throw shooting because he shot 56% from the field.

Here are the reasons why Amen is ranked so highly:
height 6'5.75 (combine)
weight 214lbs (combine)
wingspan 7'0 (combine)
vertical 44" (reported)
Ability to make plays for others (like actually become be your starting PG, not just a guy who can bring the ball up the court and make the right pass)
Athleticism to play lockdown defense

I think you're going to be surprised with Amen if we draft him.
Click to expand...
D2 appears to be a higher level of competition than the 16-18 yr olds in the OTE league. Thompson is 2-4 yrs older than many of his peers. Shaedon had a really solid body of work at EYBL and AAU against the best players in his class, while also reclassifying upward as an 18 yr old. Shaedon is 4 months younger than Thompson is now.
 
illmatic99 said:
Day 2 into draft study.

Cam Whitmore remains my favorite if we decide to make a pick. Trading down to 4-6 might be an option depending on how much teams buy into the Thompson twins hype.
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Powerful guy with an explosive game. His weaknesses can be improved. Needs ball handling and could improve his shot.
I agree this is a great pick but it might not be the timeline they want? This guy might be 2-3 years out?
 
Fairly-Hard said:
Powerful guy with an explosive game. His weaknesses can be improved. Needs ball handling and could improve his shot.
I agree this is a great pick but it might not be the timeline they want? This guy might be 2-3 years out?
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Ya he's not ready yet and will take time, but he looks like a modern day Shawn Marion. He's nearly two years younger than either Miller or the Thompson twins and has the Villanova pedigree. His explosiveness is going to translate especially with increased spacing in the NBA.

4 + 20+ future first for 3? We can then use 20 + 23 + Ant + Nurk to get Dame his vet help. Send the future first to Chi to open up the rest of our picks if needed.

A Sharpe/Whitmore future wing duo is super enticing to me.
 
illmatic99 said:
Ya he's not ready yet and will take time, but he looks like a modern day Shawn Marion. He's nearly two years younger than either Miller or the Thompson twins and has the Villanova pedigree. His explosiveness is going to translate especially with increased spacing in the NBA.

4 + 20+ future first for 3? We can then use 20 + 23 + Ant + Nurk to get Dame his vet help. Send the future first to Chi to open up the rest of our picks if needed.

A Sharpe/Whitmore future wing duo is super enticing to me.
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Drafting Whitmore at #4 is an overdraft imo, you could probably get him at #6 seeing as how there is a lot of chatter about Walker being the guy for DET at #5.

Interesting that we are polar opposites on the twins and Whitmore. To me, Whitmore looks like he has a ways to go regarding his tunnel vision. That is a lot harder to fix than a jumpshot imo. He also seems more slow footed and lacks burst, so I don't know how to project what he will become defensively. He looks like a shorter Obi Toppin.
 
Between Miller and Lively at the back half of the 1st round, who you like better?
 
BankTeller said:
Between Miller and Lively at the back half of the 1st round, who you like better?
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There are a couple of Millers in this draft... Are you referring to Leonard Miller?
If so, Leonard. I have him as a top 10 player from this draft. Getting him at 23 would be a steal.
 
BankTeller said:
Drafting Whitmore at #4 is an overdraft imo, you could probably get him at #6 seeing as how there is a lot of chatter about Walker being the guy for DET at #5.

Interesting that we are polar opposites on the twins and Whitmore. To me, Whitmore looks like he has a ways to go regarding his tunnel vision. That is a lot harder to fix than a jumpshot imo. He also seems more slow footed and lacks burst, so I don't know how to project what he will become defensively. He looks like a shorter Obi Toppin.
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For college freshmen who make a decent amount of 3s and dunks as freshmen:

https://barttorvik.com/playerstat.p...5&yvalue=Fr&year=all&start=-11101&end=all0501

Jabari Parker, Taylor Hendricks, Anthony Bennett, Cam Whitmore, Omari Spellman

Those guys have an AST% below 9 and some all time BAD A/TO ratio relative to their positions as college freshmen.

Whitmore could fix his issues. It's certainly possible but it will require a fundamental restructuring of how he plays. And I don't know if that will work. For example, Exum never played point guard and had poor playmaking. The Jazz tried to make him into a point guard but since he could only test his skills against NBA caliber defenses, it did not work out (plus, it likely takes a certain kind of brain/mentality to think like a point guard).

Due to his natural skills, I do think Whitmore can be impactful like Andrew Wiggins. But he has severe tunnel vision, on top of that.

In contrast, Jarace Walker has some good assist rates relative to his size and he has displayed incredible defensive numbers and skills. His vertical and wingspan is quite high, according to the NBA Combine numbers, at 38" and 7'2" (which is quite impressive for a forward of his size).

In 10 years, do not be surprised if Jarace Walker is like the Paul George of the draft except with DPOY talent. At the least, I think he's Aaron Gordon with DPOY talent. Mid-ceiling is Julius Randle with better passing and DPOY talent

Personally, I truly think it is worth drafting Scoot or Amen at #3 and acquiring the #6 with Simons (Magic really want a young guard who can shoot, not forwards) to draft Walker. Acquire Leonard Miller with the #23. If you trade Dame, you can get Claxton or Ayton. Draft Edey in the second round.

Scoot/Amen-Sharpe-Walker-Miller-Ayton/Claxton ----- Keon, Little, Jabari, Edey.

Imo, that Portland team would have talent levels similar to the 2007-2010 Thunder when they had their Big 3 and Ibaka.
 
MrDraftGuy said:
Personally, I truly think it is worth drafting Scoot or Amen at #3 and acquiring the #6 with Simons (Magic really want a young guard who can shoot, not forwards) to draft Walker. Acquire Leonard Miller with the #23. If you trade Dame, you can get Claxton or Ayton. Draft Edey in the second round.
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Don't disagree with the premise.

But Orlando will not give #6 up for Simons. #11 is the best/most realistic possibility.

Leonard Miller will not be there at #23 (like I was hoping for). He'll go mid-lotto.
 
Boise Blazer said:
The more I watch Taylor Hendricks the more I wonder why he isnt higher in some mocks drafts. If we had dropped to 6 or lower I would have loved that pick.
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If we had dropped back to 7 instead of moving up, I would be singing his praises at the top of my lungs.
 
Boise Blazer said:
The more I watch Taylor Hendricks the more I wonder why he isnt higher in some mocks drafts. If we had dropped to 6 or lower I would have loved that pick.
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There's always an All-Star or borderline All-Star found in latter portion of the lottery (the 8-14 range).

Hendricks is possibly that guy.

However, he is lacking in a handle and thus, his shot creation is limited. Often times, he feels some contact while backing down and tries to dribble around to the side - over dribbling and leaving him vulnerable - rather than pivoting and attacking. If he learned to control his body as he attacked the rim, he could focus on utilizing a first step and finding his way to the rim by contorting his body and using his length to score the ball.

Also needs to pass some more.

Some people feel he could be a Siakam 2.0 if he improves his weaknesses. If he pans out, it's likely going to be a few years from now
 
MrDraftGuy said:
There's always an All-Star or borderline All-Star found in latter portion of the lottery (the 8-14 range).

Hendricks is possibly that guy.

However, he is lacking in a handle and thus, his shot creation is limited. Often times, he feels some contact while backing down and tries to dribble around to the side - over dribbling and leaving him vulnerable - rather than pivoting and attacking. If he learned to control his body as he attacked the rim, he could focus on utilizing a first step and finding his way to the rim by contorting his body and using his length to score the ball.

Also needs to pass some more.

Some people feel he could be a Siakam 2.0 if he improves his weaknesses. If he pans out, it's likely going to be a few years from now
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Even before panning out, I think he could become Jaden McDaniels 2.0 relatively soon.
 
Would anyone be interested in Rayan Rupert at #23? Looks like the guys who were in that range earlier in the year like Leonard Miller and Dereck Lively will likely be selected higher than that. Still doing a deep dive on Rupert but physically, he could be a high upside play. Won't be 19 until the end of this month.

Combine measurements:
6'6 w/o shoes (6'7-6'7.5 in shoes)
8'10 standing reach
7'2 wingspan
193lbs

Unlike the twins, he IS very thin, so he will need to put on a considerable amount of weight. However, he projects to be a very good defender and that is the strongest aspect of his game currently. Jumpshot is a work in progress but should become a good 3-D wing. I would say his catch-and-shoot is respectable at this point.
 
BankTeller said:
Would anyone be interested in Rayan Rupert at #23? Looks like the guys who were in that range earlier in the year like Leonard Miller and Dereck Lively will likely be selected higher than that. Still doing a deep dive on Rupert but physically, he could be a high upside play. Won't be 19 until the end of this month.

Combine measurements:
6'6 w/o shoes (6'7-6'7.5 in shoes)
8'10 standing reach
7'2 wingspan
193lbs

Unlike the twins, he IS very thin, so he will need to put on a considerable amount of weight. However, he projects to be a very good defender and that is the strongest aspect of his game currently. Jumpshot is a work in progress but should become a good 3-D wing. I would say his catch-and-shoot is respectable at this point.
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Yes. And I think he should be getting more playing time.
 
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