Blazers interested in Aaron Gordon

[illmatic99]

This is all silly. Players should be considering everything in where they want to go--where they can maximize their game, where they can win, where they can get the best business/branding opportunities, where they'd enjoy living, where they want to raise a family, etc. Acting as though they should ignore everything about their lives and business except "shut up and play better" is extremely boomer thinking. And boomers only seem to think that about athletes--anyone else, they'd recognize that maximizing your business opportunities is smart.

got no problem with guys wanting to build their brand. i have more of an issue with them thinking they need to be in large markets to build them.

 

[Minstrel]

got no problem with guys wanting to build their brand. i have more of an issue with them thinking they need to be in large markets to build them.

Realistically, large markets have always been better for endorsements. When it comes to national brands for superstars, market probably doesn't matter a lot. Kevin Durant or Michael Jordan will be huge nationally no matter where they play. But Gordon isn't a superstar--endorsing local car dealership and supermarket chains and such are much more lucrative in New York than in Sacramento.

 

[Chris Craig]

There are other trades out there that could help the Blazers but Olshey will be so focused on landing Gordon, he will miss out on them.

 

[julius]

This is all silly. Players should be considering everything in where they want to go--where they can maximize their game, where they can win, where they can get the best business/branding opportunities, where they'd enjoy living, where they want to raise a family, etc. Acting as though they should ignore everything about their lives and business except "shut up and play better" is extremely boomer thinking. And boomers only seem to think that about athletes--anyone else, they'd recognize that maximizing your business opportunities is smart.

No one is saying he shouldn't capitalize where he can, but that using market size as the crutch for why he can't "brand" himself is an outdated excuse. And no one saying "shut up and play better". If anything they're/we're saying his GAME is why he's not branded well, and it's his own doing.

For fucks sake, Portland is one of the smaller markets for the NBA and Damian has "branded" himself among the best in the entire league and no one complains about it or says "shut up and play Dame!"

But Dame proved you don't need a big market anymore to "brand" yourself.

Stop with the condescending horse shit.

 

[julius]

Realistically, large markets have always been better for endorsements. When it comes to national brands for superstars, market probably doesn't matter a lot. Kevin Durant or Michael Jordan will be huge nationally no matter where they play. But Gordon isn't a superstar--endorsing local car dealership and supermarket chains and such are much more lucrative in New York than in Sacramento.

Being a better player would garner him more opportunities.

The "endorsements" argument made sense when the league was paying players peanuts (compared to todays game) but Gordon signed a 4 year 75 million dollar contract. In a state with a 0% income tax.

I doubt he's going to make that up by moving to California or New York (with their income tax rates).

 

[illmatic99]

There are other trades out there that could help the Blazers but Olshey will be so focused on landing Gordon, he will miss out on them.

Chris Haynes literally just reported that talks about Gordon with the Blazers have cooled.

 

[Minstrel]

No one is saying he shouldn't capitalize where he can, but that using market size as the crutch for why he can't "brand" himself is an outdated excuse. And no one saying "shut up and play better". If anything they're/we're saying his GAME is why he's not branded well, and it's his own doing.

How is that "his own doing?" Unless you're claiming he's not trying his best, he's as talented as he is--he can't change his own talent to be Stephen Curry or Damian Lillard. That's not "his own doing" that's out of his control. And he never said anything about how he can't brand himself because he's not in a big market, that's just a position you put on him because you're weirdly angry with him. All he said was he preferred the superior branding opportunities (for his level of talent) in a bigger market. What's wrong about that actual position?

But Dame proved you don't need a big market anymore to "brand" yourself.

All you have to do is be as talented as Dame. Gordon not being as talented as Dame is his own doing.

Stop with the condescending horse shit.

I don't agree I was being condescending. I do think people are being irrational about this, probably due to the latent sense of "Portland is being dumped on again."

 

[julius]

Chris Haynes literally just reported that talks about Gordon with the Blazers have cooled.

I would guess it was as much Portland thinking "when you've come to your senses (about Gordons value/trade requirements) then we are willing to talk again. but until then, good luck getting what you want" as it is anything.

 

[Minstrel]

Being a better player would garner him more opportunities.

Again, unless you think he's just being lazy about his game, you can't just make yourself more talented. "Being a better player" would garner him more opportunities, but no amount of work on his game is turning him into a superstar.

 

[illmatic99]

CJ has a 100 mil empire and multiple businesses outside of basketball including a BRAND name wine. He's managed just fine being a second/third tier star in Portland.

 

[julius]

How is that "his own doing?" Unless you're claiming he's not trying his best, he's as talented as he is--he can't change his own talent to be Stephen Curry or Damien Lillard. That's not "his own doing" that's out of his control. And he never said anything about how he can't brand himself because he's not in a big market, that's just a position you put on him because you're weirdly angry with him. All he said was he preferred the superior branding opportunities (for his level of talent) in a bigger market. What's wrong about that actual position?

Not sure where I'm "weirdly angry with him".

I think the issue is that the preferred "superior branding opportunities" won't amount to much unless he's a player that fans care about. Why do you think you never hear commercials with Julius Randle in them? He's in arguably the biggest market in the league, but he's not a marketable player.

All you have to do is be as talented as Dame. Gordon not being as talented as Dame is his own doing.

Doesn't have to be "as talented" as Dame, but it shows that if you are marketable in 2021, it doesn't matter where you are playing anymore.

This isn't 1993.

I don't agree I was being condescending. I do think people are being irrational about this, probably due to the latent sense of "Portland is being dumped on again."

the "boomer" thing, and you're totally coming off as though you're a better brand of fan because you support the players (implying those of us who are taking a different stance on this don't support players making as much money as they can humanly make, given the shortness of their careers).

 

[julius]

CJ has a 100 mil empire and multiple businesses outside of basketball including a BRAND name wine. He's managed just fine being a second/third tier star in Portland.

Yep. It's doable if you're willing to put in the work.

NOT saying Orlando is the ideal market, but for fucks sake, we're talking about Portland. It's not like Portland is a huge market by comparison or in a state that is a hot bed for social activities/etc.

He's a small fish in a medium sized market thinking if he moves to a bigger market, he'll be a bigger fish.

If he comes to Portland, I want him to succeed (actually, I'd like to him to succeed any place).

 

[Chris Craig]

Chris Haynes literally just reported that talks about Gordon with the Blazers have cooled.

Neil can't get Orlando to give him a pick

 

[Minstrel]

I think the issue is that the preferred "superior branding opportunities" won't amount to much unless he's a player that fans care about. Why do you think you never hear commercials with Julius Randle in them? He's in arguably the biggest market in the league, but he's not a marketable player.

Are you in his local market? Do you know what endorsements he does or doesn't have? Again, I said that "national brand" is probably not market-dependent, but having a national brand depends on being a superstar by and large.

Doesn't have to be "as talented" as Dame, but it shows that if you are marketable in 2021, it doesn't matter where you are playing anymore.

It shows that for a player as talented as Lillard when it comes to national branding. In that past, I've seen data that shows that larger markets yield far more lucrative local endorsements. In fact, Lillard himself might well be making more money if he had been playing in LA or New York. Saying he's doing well for himself doesn't in any way tell us whether he'd be doing better elsewhere.

the "boomer" thing, and you're totally coming off as though you're a better brand of fan because you support the players (implying those of us who are taking a different stance on this don't support players making as much money as they can humanly make, given the shortness of their careers).

That's your projection. I said nothing about being a "better brand of fan" and that thought never crossed my mind. I do think people are getting unduly upset with Gordon for no reason--it's perfectly reasonable for him to care about those things. But we have sentiments in this thread about "fuck him" and "if this is who he is, we're better off without him" and insinuations that he cares more about branding than working on his game. Sounds exactly like past comments about "mercenaries" for players who cared about the money they made.

 

[julius]

Again, unless you think he's just being lazy about his game, you can't just make yourself more talented. "Being a better player" would garner him more opportunities, but no amount of work on his game is turning him into a superstar.

I'm not sure your making as strong a point as you think you are. If he's not making himself any better throughout his career, that's why he's not marketable. And it's not like he has to be superstar to be marketable (it does help though)

 

[Ripcity4life77]

I am not totally sold on a big like Gordon or Aldridge cause of Melo -- cause unless the deal involves Melo makes ZERO sense to trade for a 4 . If i am the Blazers i look for a SF who can play D and 3 and maybe either slide into SG or PF in certain spots but this team needs D . Then you get that piece then go try and find a 4/5 from buyout market or something to shore up the front court.

 

[Minstrel]

I'm not sure your making as strong a point as you think you are.

I'm pointing out that "being a better player" (the kind that garners national brands) isn't within his control, as you keep implying.

 

[Sheldon Shape]

I think Trent and John Collins are more even in terms of value than Trent and Gordon. I'd be okay with giving Trent for Collins but less so for Gordon.

 

[wizenheimer]

I'd wonder if the "bigger market" and "branding" stuff came from Gordon or his agent

 

[Chris Craig]

Gordon doesn't really have a choice though. He will get traded where Orlando decides to trade him.

 

[James lamphear]

Gordon doesn't really have a choice though. He will get traded where Orlando decides to trade him.

That's about it due he still under contract.

 

[glazeduck]

He's not a superstar for the same reason why Nurk, Khris Middleton, Andrew Wiggins and others are not superstars. They're not good enough. It's also why Ingram, Trent and Murray aren't superstars. And it has zero to do with the size of the city they play in and the size of that city and its relation to branding opportunities.

Superstars are superstars because they're great players.

That's fine, and I agree with everything you said. But you called him "the runner up in the dunk contest", when, again, he is more than that. I don't give a rat's ass about the larger market comment because we'll never NOT be fighting an uphill battle there, but I don't blame the guy for wanting to be known as more than just "dunk bro".

 

[Hoopguru]

HHype reports ghat talks between Gordon & zers have cooled.
Thats fine by me.

 

[TBpup]

HHype reports ghat talks between Gordon & zers have cooled.
Thats fine by me.

Similar to what I heard from a couple of sauces. The price is too high and it seems like it was a bit complicated from what they indicated...and some of the other parties weren't exactly helping.

 

[Hoopguru]

Similar to what I heard from a couple of sauces. The price is too high and it seems like it was a bit complicated from what they indicated...and some of the other parties weren't exactly helping.

I dont think he brings that much more than RoCo.

 

[UKRAINEFAN]

I am not totally sold on a big like Gordon or Aldridge cause of Melo -- cause unless the deal involves Melo makes ZERO sense to trade for a 4 . If i am the Blazers i look for a SF who can play D and 3 and maybe either slide into SG or PF in certain spots but this team needs D . Then you get that piece then go try and find a 4/5 from buyout market or something to shore up the front court.

I think Aldridge is only effective as a 5 at this point.

 

[julius]

That's fine, and I agree with everything you said. But you called him "the runner up in the dunk contest", when, again, he is more than that. I don't give a rat's ass about the larger market comment because we'll never NOT be fighting an uphill battle there, but I don't blame the guy for wanting to be known as more than just "dunk bro".

Um, where did I call him the runner up?

 

[julius]

I'm pointing out that "being a better player" (the kind that garners national brands) isn't within his control, as you keep implying.

And going to a bigger market won't necessarily get him a better "brand" recongition either

 

[LayneStaley]

Fuck Gordon, go get Collins.

 

[UKRAINEFAN]

Similar to what I heard from a couple of sauces. The price is too high and it seems like it was a bit complicated from what they indicated...and some of the other parties weren't exactly helping.

OK, then, let's go for Larry Nance!