Politics Cable news is driving this country towards war

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Natebishop3 said:
I'm not interested in getting into arguments with you guys about who is what and what the motivations are of every Trump voter. Or even most Trump voters.
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That's cool...you'll notice I didn't direct it at you through quote or mention.

What this entire thread is about is how our country is being pitted against one another and the media is exacerbating that problem. Some of the posts in this thread seem to confirm that theory.
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"The media" isn't a single entity. There's news reporting and there's editorializing/opinion. The opinion shows obviously produce a narrative slanted through their own world view. What would you prefer to see from opinion shows?

As for what this thread seems to confirm, I'd say it's that the nation has become (roughly) two sides pitted against each other. So maybe "the media" is accurately portraying reality, rather than creating something.
 
Orion Bailey said:
you do understand there are many republicans and conservatives who do not support trump dont you?
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Please re-read my post. I said "Trump supporters." Asking me about non-Trump supporters implies that you did not, in fact, read before replying.
 
Orion Bailey said:
Lol.
read the thread. By you bringing up trump supporters implies you know not what the ops question and direction of conversation is...

So turn your implications on your self there sir.
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From the original post in this thread: "CNN is all about racism. Republicans are racists. Trump supporters are racist."

I put the relevant portion in bold, so you wouldn't miss it. "Trump supporters" specifically were a part of this thread. Again, you should work on reading more carefully before trying to call other people out. If I meant all Republicans, I would have said Republicans.
 
Minstrel said:
That's cool...you'll notice I didn't direct it at you through quote or mention.



"The media" isn't a single entity. There's news reporting and there's editorializing/opinion. The opinion shows obviously produce a narrative slanted through their own world view. What would you prefer to see from opinion shows?

As for what this thread seems to confirm, I'd say it's that the nation has become (roughly) two sides pitted against each other. So maybe "the media" is accurately portraying reality, rather than creating something.
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These "journalists" need to be held accountable when the words they spread cause to loss of life. I would argue that some of these people, like Tucker Carlson, are just as responsible as Trump for spurring people to violence.
 
Natebishop3 said:
These "journalists" need to be held accountable when the words they spread cause to loss of life. I would argue that some of these people, like Tucker Carlson, are just as responsible as Trump for spurring people to violence.
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If you're talking about media members calling for violence, or spreading conspiracy theories that lead to violence, then I agree with you. I do believe in journalistic ethics, even for opinion shows. Where I wasn't really sure there was an issue was with opinion shows saying the other side is "bad" in a political/societal sense. How do we express political opinions without talking about the faults we see in what the people we disagree with are doing?
 
Orion Bailey said:
lol. You are aware of context are you not?
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Just admit that you made a mistake and thought I said "all Republicans." You'll be a better person for it! All of this desperate attempt to avoid admitting that error just sounds silly.
 
Orion Bailey said:
tyere is no mistake. The point is not about trump supporters. YOU brought that up erroneously.
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The point was how the media is pitting people against each other, and the original poster mentioned both Republicans and Trump supporters. You don't get to decide what "the point" is and decide other people's points are whatever you want them to be, just so that you can have something to bitch about. Sorry!
 
Orion Bailey said:
anyhow back to one of the points. When are dems going to learn to separate conservatives from trump supporters and acknowledge there is a difference?
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Democrats already do that. Like my original post in this thread separated Trump supporters from conservatives. You just didn't notice that, because you wanted to bitch about how Democrats lump all conservatives in with Trump supporters even though they obviously don't.

I hope you feel your question was suitably answered.
 
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Orion Bailey said:
Part of our problem is the left will not seem to admit this. Like you just wouldn't do.
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Yeah, I just wouldn't because I chose my terms correctly. I said "Trump supporters" because I meant "Trump supporters." You decided I meant all conservatives or all Republicans because that's your issue.

I could say most disagreeable responses to the op is just bitching too if i want to play that game.
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Maybe you could. Plenty of people bitch on this forum.
 
Minstrel said:
Yeah, I just wouldn't because I chose my terms correctly. I said "Trump supporters" because I meant "Trump supporters." You decided I meant all conservatives or all Republicans because that's your issue.



Maybe you could. Plenty of people bitch on this forum.
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Here's the real question - are all people who voted for Trump considered "Trump supporters?"
 
Orion Bailey said:
ill keep pointing out things that don't make sense. You call it bitching because you know you tried to turn the convo into trump supporters.

listen im debating but if you disagree with me then you are bitching...

wow man.


We shall agree to disagree.

anyhow back to one of the points. When are dems going to learn to separate conservatives from trump supporters and acknowledge there is a difference?
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Seems to me that the burden of proof lies with the non Trump supporting conservatives to prove that they are not aligned with Trump. The Dems are only calling how they see it, based on the existing evidence, NOT nuance. After 4 years of “fuck your feelings” by the Trump administration and it’s supporters, it is extremely difficult the recognize any real differences between Trump supporters and run of the mill conservatives. Trump himself deliberately used them to exploit and expand the divide. Perhaps Trump himself coopted “conservatives” and held them hostage. Regardless, they went along willingly. Or perhaps they also got drowned out by all the noise and chaos of MAGA world??? The end result was the same. It’s far more on the conservatives to show they are willing to cooperate and move forward than it is on the Dems.....but until they make a sincere show of separating themselves from the clown circus, they are....and always will be.....guilty by association. They just spent the past 4 years obstructing, ignoring and/or dismissing ANY kind of partisanship. McConnell made that clear every f**king time he opened his mouth......
 
Natebishop3 said:
Here's the real question - are all people who voted for Trump considered "Trump supporters?"
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They are when they choose to vote for him but many regret the choice and later become his detractors like say...Michael Cohen...if you double down and vote for him twice then you are definitely a Trump supporter...if you only choose to dump him after he's attacked the capitol with a mob of racists.....you're probably just trying to save your own neck or survive like McConnell is
 
Orion Bailey said:
T


hmm, so if this is the case. What proof would be acceptable for say me, a non trump supporting conservative, for you to beleive im not a racist or s trump supporter?

what proof would be satisfactory?

i can say what i say, but its rarely heard or acknowledged. I can vote, but then that isnt viewable by most.
So i ask. Short of screaming i hate trump every day(which im not gonna do because its silly, a waste of time and emotions), What will it take to provide adequate proof?
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To me, you just gave me enough proof by stating you are a non trump supporting conservative.
 
Natebishop3 said:
I would agree with you that there are definitely racist Trump supporters. But you're going to extrapolate personal experience out to say that a lot of the 70 million people who voted for Trump are racist? What percentage of the democrats are racist?
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Of course every republican isn't a racist, I don't think anybody here would claim they are......but if rounded up all said racists, I wonder who they voted for?
 
THE HCP said:
Of course every republican isn't a racist, I don't think anybody here would claim they are......but if rounded up all said racists, I wonder who they voted for?
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You guys aren't understanding the argument I'm making. I'm not here to debate whether republicans are racists or they aren't.

I'm saying that cable news is presenting this illusion that they are, while Fox is presenting the democrats as some kind of boogie man coming to destroy our country.
 
Natebishop3 said:
You guys aren't understanding the argument I'm making. I'm not here to debate whether republicans are racists or they aren't.

I'm saying that cable news is presenting this illusion that they are, while Fox is presenting the democrats as some kind of boogie man coming to destroy our country.
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Its my unverified opinion that one of those viewing audiences takes what they are watching as 100% factual to a fault more than the other.
 
Natebishop3 said:
You guys aren't understanding the argument I'm making. I'm not here to debate whether republicans are racists or they aren't.

I'm saying that cable news is presenting this illusion that they are, while Fox is presenting the democrats as some kind of boogie man coming to destroy our country.
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Are you talking about the daytime news or the evening "entertainment" shows?
 
Natebishop3 said:
Here's the real question - are all people who voted for Trump considered "Trump supporters?"
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At different points, yes. If you voted for Trump in 2016, you were a Trump supporter then. If you since changed your mind and voted for someone else in 2020, then you aren't now. If you voted Trump in 2020, then of course you're a Trump supporter now.
 
Orion Bailey said:
may i ask if it really matters? I mean if the station that airs both types are dividing the country, does it matter if its considered news or satire?
The results are the same for the intended.
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I think there is a difference in what the news networks show during the day vs the evening shows.
 
Orion Bailey said:
T


hmm, so if this is the case. What proof would be acceptable for say me, a non trump supporting conservative, for you to beleive im not a racist or s trump supporter?

what proof would be satisfactory?

i can say what i say, but its rarely heard or acknowledged. I can vote, but then that isnt viewable by most.
So i ask. Short of screaming i hate trump every day(which im not gonna do because its silly, a waste of time and emotions), What will it take to provide adequate proof?
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For me personally (not that I have EVER thought you had a racist bone in your body)? Because I know you, I’ve socialized with you, I’ve had discussions with you and I have seen how you interact with others. But........like it or don’t, at this time in history the Republican Party is far more of a magnet for racists than the Democratic Party. That’s not to say the Dems are devoid of racists, but what we saw on 1/6 was a Republican (NOT Democratic, despite malicious misdirection by the right) affiliated mob of people looking to retain their white privilege. The unfortunate reality for anti Trump (or ambivalent Trump) conservatives is that they have been painted with the Trump brush and it’s going to take time, effort and action to scrub it off. It’s kinda like 2016 when us Trump haters were branded “libtards” and “snowflakes” despite our loathing for Hillary Clinton. No one on the Right wanted to hear our side of things. The winners get to make up the labels. Haters are gonna hate, and to some left leaning folks a conservative is the same as a MAGAt. Doesn’t make it right or fair but it doesn’t change the reality. Trump created a shitload of damage and some people want blood (Again, a reverse negative of 2016). Good guys like you, HailBlazers and Johnnyboy are collateral damage. And I for one deeply regret that. Welcome to American politics.......
 
SlyPokerDog said:
I like regularly going to https://www.aljazeera.com/ for news. It gives an interesting perspective about the USA from outside of the USA.

Also Shepard Smith's show on CNBC is pretty "fair and balanced."
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I go to overseas news feeds to find out what the hell is going on in the world....news here is all about who Ben Affleck just puked on. We really have the worst international coverage in the American market...it's actually embarrassing
 
Minstrel said:
At different points, yes. If you voted for Trump in 2016, you were a Trump supporter then. If you since changed your mind and voted for someone else in 2020, then you aren't now. If you voted Trump in 2020, then of course you're a Trump supporter now.
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See I don't think that's necessarily true. Someone could vote Republican and not necessarily like Trump. I have seen Democrats do it plenty of times. Kitzhaber?
 
Natebishop3 said:
See I don't think that's necessarily true. Someone could vote Republican and not necessarily like Trump.
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When I say "supporter," I don't mean you love Trump. I mean that you're willing to support him, and all he stands for. Willing to, not necessarily thrilled to. Maybe you're doing it for an anti-abortion position. Maybe you're doing it because you really believed he's an economic whiz. That doesn't change that you're willing to support a racist, you just have your reasons for doing so.
 
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