Do we make the same mistake twice?

[downunderwonder]

Now we all know Thorn botched the VC signing, he was only bidding against himself and WAY overpaid vince. I like vince, as much as he annoys and frustrates me at times his is the go-to scorer we have always needed...His effort can be lax at times though and he does not get to the line anywhere near as often as he should. Those facts alone should have persuaded Thorn to cut at least 1 Mill per year off of his contract. At least.

Anyhoo, assuming Kidd will be a resticted free agent (which I have no clue if he will be) do we let him test the waters and simply match whatever offer comes his way? Pure and simple yes Kidd is an amazing player, he is actually one of my 5 favourites of all time (the others being Barkley, Kevin Johnson, Dennis Rodman and Sprewell) but he is entering the part of his career where even the greats started to slow down. John Stockton is probably the only pg of note who kept up reasonable production into his late 30's.

It would be doomsday if he left but is overpaying him really the way to avoid this from happening? I mean what he is asking is not a pretty penny and makes me doubt his sincerity when it comes to winning a ring. If he really wanted a championship, why is he so intent on totally screwing the salary cap? Knowing full well the difficulty of signing a quality player with next to nothing to pay them with.

Seeing as a area 51 extension will be due during this period he is seeking, do we risk losing our future for the sake of continuing our status as "also ran"? The LeBron dream is simply that and given the chance of sending Kidd away and recieving a nice package in return, is that too enticing a possibility to totally discount? Discuss.

 

[NOMAM]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (downunderwonder @ Jan 19 2008, 02:36 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Now we all know Thorn botched the VC signing, he was only bidding against himself and WAY overpaid vince. I like vince, as much as he annoys and frustrates me at times his is the go-to scorer we have always needed...His effort can be lax at times though and he does not get to the line anywhere near as often as he should. Those facts alone should have persuaded Thorn to cut at least 1 Mill per year off of his contract. At least.</div>

No, Carter wasn't overpaid (or WAY overpaid in your words) in the off season compared to other swingmen in the league. He's making 13 million this season. That's 800k more than Jefferson.

Tracy McGrady - 19 million
Paul Pierce - 16.3 million
Ray Allen - 16 million
Rashard Lewis - 15.6 million
Michael Redd - 14.5 million
Joe Johnson - 13.5 million

 

[downunderwonder]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NOMAM @ Jan 19 2008, 03:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (downunderwonder @ Jan 19 2008, 02:36 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Now we all know Thorn botched the VC signing, he was only bidding against himself and WAY overpaid vince. I like vince, as much as he annoys and frustrates me at times his is the go-to scorer we have always needed...His effort can be lax at times though and he does not get to the line anywhere near as often as he should. Those facts alone should have persuaded Thorn to cut at least 1 Mill per year off of his contract. At least.</div>

No, Carter wasn't overpaid (or WAY overpaid in your words) in the off season compared to other swingmen in the league. He's making 13 million this season. That's 800k more than Jefferson.

Tracy McGrady - 19 million
Paul Pierce - 16.3 million
Ray Allen - 16 million
Rashard Lewis - 15.6 million
Michael Redd - 14.5 million
Joe Johnson - 13.5 million
</div>

Not overpaid in the context of the league, overpaid in the context of the old supply vs demand theory. As there was no real demand for his services, we didnt have to pay him 13 mill this season. If the Magic were willing to pay Rashard 15.6, why didnt they offer that to Vince? No other team had the resources available to offer anywhere near that amount. Im just saying they could have got him for cheaper if they had of played a little hardball...

*Edit* Yes I realise it was a S&T for Lewis mmkay

 

[Black Republican]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NOMAM @ Jan 19 2008, 03:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (downunderwonder @ Jan 19 2008, 02:36 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Now we all know Thorn botched the VC signing, he was only bidding against himself and WAY overpaid vince. I like vince, as much as he annoys and frustrates me at times his is the go-to scorer we have always needed...His effort can be lax at times though and he does not get to the line anywhere near as often as he should. Those facts alone should have persuaded Thorn to cut at least 1 Mill per year off of his contract. At least.</div>

No, Carter wasn't overpaid (or WAY overpaid in your words) in the off season compared to other swingmen in the league. He's making 13 million this season. That's 800k more than Jefferson.

Tracy McGrady - 19 million
Paul Pierce - 16.3 million
Ray Allen - 16 million
Rashard Lewis - 15.6 million
Michael Redd - 14.5 million
Joe Johnson - 13.5 million
</div>
Amen

 

[NOMAM]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (downunderwonder @ Jan 19 2008, 03:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NOMAM @ Jan 19 2008, 03:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (downunderwonder @ Jan 19 2008, 02:36 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Now we all know Thorn botched the VC signing, he was only bidding against himself and WAY overpaid vince. I like vince, as much as he annoys and frustrates me at times his is the go-to scorer we have always needed...His effort can be lax at times though and he does not get to the line anywhere near as often as he should. Those facts alone should have persuaded Thorn to cut at least 1 Mill per year off of his contract. At least.</div>

No, Carter wasn't overpaid (or WAY overpaid in your words) in the off season compared to other swingmen in the league. He's making 13 million this season. That's 800k more than Jefferson.

Tracy McGrady - 19 million
Paul Pierce - 16.3 million
Ray Allen - 16 million
Rashard Lewis - 15.6 million
Michael Redd - 14.5 million
Joe Johnson - 13.5 million
</div>

Not overpaid in the context of the league, overpaid in the context of the old supply vs demand theory. As there was no real demand for his services, we didnt have to pay him 13 mill this season. If the Magic were willing to pay Rashard 15.6, why didnt they offer that to Vince? No other team had the resources available to offer anywhere near that amount. Im just saying they could have got him for cheaper if they had of played a little hardball...
</div>

Well, Carter's side and Nets management always seemed to be in talks and interested in getting a deal done with each other, so it was not like Nets managment low balled Vince and then Vince's side started looking around the league for other suitors. They both seemed interested in getting a reasonable deal done that both sides were happy with. And I think the Nets got a better deal with Vince than the Magic got with Lewis. But if the Magic GM thinks that Lewis's contract topping out at 23.8 million is better than Carter's, which tops out at 17.3 million, than I'll just assume he's crazy.

 

[downunderwonder]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NOMAM @ Jan 19 2008, 03:33 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>Well, Carter's side and Nets management always seemed to be in talks and interested in getting a deal done with each other, so it was not like Nets managment low balled Vince and then Vince's side started looking around the league for other suitors. They both seemed interested in getting a reasonable deal done that both sides were happy with. And I think the Nets got a better deal with Vince than the Magic got with Lewis. But if the Magic GM thinks that Lewis's contract topping out at 23.8 million is better than Carter's, which tops out at 17.3 million, than I'll just assume he's crazy.</div>

co-sign on that.

Anyhow the issue isnt the past, its the future. You seem to have a similar logic to myself, whats your thoughts on the current Kidd Situation?

 

[NOMAM]

It's tough to say what to do at this point. Is this the Nets team that gets off to slow starts like the last few years before they eventually start to make their way up the standings. Or will they continue to be inconsistent and sucky and *gasp* miss the playoffs or get bounced in the first round. It's troubling that they always get off to these kind of starts to the season. If they start rolling then do they make a move to improve the bench and front court at the deadline and would that be enough to put them over the top? Resigning Kidd will depend on where they are as a team and if they feel they are close to getting back to the finals a shot at a championship. Who knows where the Nets will end up after this season.

 

[Universe]

I don't think we could ever overpay Kidd. Well we could be his game will always be the same.

 

[Jizzy]

we could have lowballed vc into taking like 8 mil a year because no team offered anything. thorn is a retard

 

[Lavalamp]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Universe @ Jan 19 2008, 06:44 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>I don't think we could ever overpay Kidd. Well we could be his game will always be the same.</div>

I think Kidd wishes you were GM right now. lol

 

[NOMAM]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jizzy @ Jan 19 2008, 07:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>we could have lowballed vc into taking like 8 mil a year because no team offered anything. thorn is a retard</div>

Vince and his agent wouldn't accept such a low ball offer like that and Thorn would have been a retard if he offered it and expected it to be accepted. Vince would have either kept his player option which would have paid him like 15 million (?) this season or looked around more actively for other teams.

 

[downunderwonder]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (NOMAM @ Jan 19 2008, 07:52 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Jizzy @ Jan 19 2008, 07:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div><div class='quotemain'>we could have lowballed vc into taking like 8 mil a year because no team offered anything. thorn is a retard</div>

Vince and his agent wouldn't accept such a low ball offer like that and Thorn would have been a retard if he offered it and expected it to be accepted. Vince would have either kept his player option which would have paid him like 15 million (?) this season or looked around more actively for other teams.
</div>

Well given he had already made his decision to opt out and other than Orlando, Charlotte was the only locale where he would have got the money he was seeking... Most other teams were lacking the free agent signing money knowing full well that outside of VC, it was one of the worst free agent crops in recent memory....