For those of you who value analytics, Anfernee Simons is having one of the worst seasons of all time

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Labinot41 said:
Me too, always thought Seth was underrated. Simons has the green light to shot whenever he has the ball because he's an Olshey guy, meanwhile Seth was shooting something like 44% from 3 but had to beg to get some shots
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Stotts has always given the green light to any player that has a quality look.
 
KSF-ERIC said:
Seth was an Olshey guy. He signed him!
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Unfortunately he signed him to a one year contract while the club was in a difficult financial situation (that Olshey put them in) that made it impossible to re-sign Curry.
 
One of Anfernee's worst problems is, I think, his attitude. He seems to get down on himself very easily. This is good in moderation (otherwise you're JR Smith or Dion Waiters) but I think he tightens up. Maybe the problem is thinking he's going to get yanked. People forget but he was pretty terrible at the start of that one game against the Kings (that artificially raised our hopes), but the fact that there was literally nobody on the bench to take his place allowed him to settle in for the comeback. I'd honestly like it if Dame and CJ sat out one of the scrimmages.

It's a shame the NBA doesn't have a "loan" system (beyond the G-League, which would be seen as an insult) like they have in European Football. (For example, two key players on Leeds United were on loan from Man City and Brighton, respectively. They got to play and prove their worth when there just wouldn't've been the minutes for them (at least, for Harrison and Man City.))

Of course, the problem could just be that he's never going to get the hang of this whole "team sport" thing. But if only we could showcase him so that he could have a couple more games like that Sacramento game so that some dumb team thinks he's got star potential.
 
UKRAINEFAN said:
Unfortunately he signed him to a one year contract while the club was in a difficult financial situation (that Olshey put them in) that made it impossible to re-sign Curry.
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and if Dallas didn't put themselves in a financial situation they would have originally retained him.
 
Rastapopoulos said:
Seth Curry was our best +/- guy for most of last season. It always bemused me that he didn't get more minutes.
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Did you watch post season Curry? He wasn't very effective. I would have liked to keep him, but we knew going in it wasn't possible and it's nothing but water under the bridge now.
 
I find it very difficult to understand what people see in Simons. He is potentially what? Another high volume shooter? At best, CJ with less D? AT BEST. Is that even a good thing?

What's worse is Simons doesn't even seem to get it. He's just in their squandering leads and missing shots instead of finding where he fits.

Gary on the other hand...
 
Propagandist said:
I find it very difficult to understand what people see in Simons. He is potentially what? Another high volume shooter? At best, CJ with less D? AT BEST. Is that even a good thing?

What's worse is Simons doesn't even seem to get it. He's just in their squandering leads and missing shots instead of finding where he fits.

Gary on the other hand...
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An at best McCollum would be a huge bargain at the position in the draft he was taken at.
 
CupWizier said:
An at best McCollum would be a huge bargain at the position in the draft he was taken at.
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True. I'm mostly responding to the hype, I suppose.

Speaking of huge bargain at their draft position: Gary mfing Trent Jr!!! I think Gary being so good seems to have negatively impacted Simons. Dude is a revelation!
 
Propagandist said:
True. I'm mostly responding to the hype, I suppose.

Speaking of huge bargain at their draft position: Gary mfing Trent Jr!!! I think Gary being so good seems to have negatively impacted Simons. Dude is a revelation!
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Reminds me alot of patty mills. Not Ptown patty, but SA patty.
Def. A steal and a keeper. Let him run the second unit!
 
Propagandist said:
True. I'm mostly responding to the hype, I suppose.

Speaking of huge bargain at their draft position: Gary mfing Trent Jr!!! I think Gary being so good seems to have negatively impacted Simons. Dude is a revelation!
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Trent has definitely stepped up his game and has earned rotation minutes. Simons is still young and has the potential to still improve a lot. Here is an interesting comparison between Simons at 20 and Seth Curry at 25.

https://www.basketball-reference.co...player_id2=curryse01&idx=bbr__players&y2=2016
 
UKRAINEFAN said:
Well, they got Porzingis and Doncic out of their maneuvering and still got Curry back; so I think they really did OK.
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they have done fine but that had nothing to do with what I posted either.
 
Propagandist said:
I find it very difficult to understand what people see in Simons. He is potentially what? Another high volume shooter? At best, CJ with less D? AT BEST. Is that even a good thing?

What's worse is Simons doesn't even seem to get it. He's just in their squandering leads and missing shots instead of finding where he fits.

Gary on the other hand...
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Supposedly he has all the shooting range of Dame and CJ, plus otherworldly athleticism beyond them.

What he doesn't have is the 4 years of seasoning at the college level that really helped develop the starters ahead of him.
 
PtldPlatypus said:
Supposedly he has all the shooting range of Dame and CJ, plus otherworldly athleticism beyond them.

What he doesn't have is the 4 years of seasoning at the college level that really helped develop the starters ahead of him.
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I've heard these things, notably from Olshey, and I still don't get it. I started the season VERY high on Simons. I bought into the hype a little. But he has been awful awful. Like come into the game with a lead and leave with a deficit 90% of the time awful. How, in Dame's prime, is this worth it? It's perplexing.

And while many have wondered if two diminutive guards can carry a team, what about three?!? I'm just saying if best case scenario is a CJ comp, half the fans don't even want CJ on this team! @CupWizier posted a side-by-side with Seth above and I'm thinking: wow, Seth would be great to have again, NOT that they are similar by any means. Seth is a boon and a team player; Anfernee is just playing crunch.
 
CupWizier said:
Trent has definitely stepped up his game and has earned rotation minutes. Simons is still young and has the potential to still improve a lot. Here is an interesting comparison between Simons at 20 and Seth Curry at 25.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.fcgi?request=1&sum=0&player_id1_hint=Anfernee Simons&player_id1_select=Anfernee Simons&player_id1=simonan01&idx=bbr__players&y1=2020&player_id2_hint=Seth Curry&player_id2_select=Seth Curry&player_id2=curryse01&idx=bbr__players&y2=2016
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Why are you comparing these two? They are nowhere near the same level of production.
 
Propagandist said:
I've heard these things, notably from Olshey, and I still don't get it. I started the season VERY high on Simons. I bought into the hype a little. But he has been awful awful. Like come into the game with a lead and leave with a deficit 90% of the time awful. How, in Dame's prime, is this worth it? It's perplexing.

And while many have wondered if two diminutive guards can carry a team, what about three?!? I'm just saying if best case scenario is a CJ comp, half the fans don't even want CJ on this team! @CupWizier posted a side-by-side with Seth above and I'm thinking: wow, Seth would be great to have again, NOT that they are similar by any means. Seth is a boon and a team player; Anfernee is just playing crunch.
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My point for posting the comparison was merely to show a player that floundered around in the league for several years and was 25 years old before he was given a minor role and has since found his confidence to become a quality player. Some of you guys want to blame Olshey for over hyping him. Do you not remember that last game against Sac 2 years ago when Simons had that huge game? This forum was going bonkers for Simons and I remember some even hyping him as an all star in a couple years and a possible hall of famer. I am in complete agreement that the kid has struggled big this year, but he is only 20 and on a rookie contract and only in his second year out of high school and people are already writing him off. Patience is what should be in order at this stage. He might not make it, but then again, it might just click for him and he can become a solid contributor. Olshey's job is to hype the team. It's fans jobs to watch and evaluate for themself.
 
tester551 said:
Why are you comparing these two? They are nowhere near the same level of production.
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You do realize that the seasons I compared were Curry's 3rd season at 25 years old from a big program like Duke and Simons only 20 and in his second year out of high school. Is Simons at Curry's level now? Absolutely not but there is a 5 year difference in age and a ton of big game experience advantage for Curry. Time will tell if Simons can reach or even exceed that level.
 
CupWizier said:
My point for posting the comparison was merely to show a player that floundered around in the league for several years and was 25 years old before he was given a minor role and has since found his confidence to become a quality player. Some of you guys want to blame Olshey for over hyping him. Do you not remember that last game against Sac 2 years ago when Simons had that huge game? This forum was going bonkers for Simons and I remember some even hyping him as an all star in a couple years and a possible hall of famer. I am in complete agreement that the kid has struggled big this year, but he is only 20 and on a rookie contract and only in his second year out of high school and people are already writing him off. Patience is what should be in order at this stage. He might not make it, but then again, it might just click for him and he can become a solid contributor. Olshey's job is to hype the team. It's fans jobs to watch and evaluate for themself.
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No, I understand. I'm just saying Seth has been a knock down shooter since day one. And still is. Seth is a smart player. Simons is not, at all and who knows what will happen, but losing games isn't worth finding out.

Are you honestly referencing that Sacramento game as proof of something? Haha. EVERYONE looked good in that game. But yes, I was excited too. That was fun. But again, so what if it means another high volume, inefficient player?

My point is this: fuck Simons. Let's ride with Gary. Gary doesn't make us worse. If age is such a valuable thing, hey Gary is only a few months older than Anfernee. Simons is a terrible player and his terribleness has become a HUGE distraction.

I don't nitpick Olshey anymore, but I disagree about the hype stuff. He needs to zip it, or talk about the guys that are actually good.
 
Rastapopoulos said:
One of Anfernee's worst problems is, I think, his attitude. He seems to get down on himself very easily. This is good in moderation (otherwise you're JR Smith or Dion Waiters) but I think he tightens up. Maybe the problem is thinking he's going to get yanked. People forget but he was pretty terrible at the start of that one game against the Kings (that artificially raised our hopes), but the fact that there was literally nobody on the bench to take his place allowed him to settle in for the comeback. I'd honestly like it if Dame and CJ sat out one of the scrimmages.

It's a shame the NBA doesn't have a "loan" system (beyond the G-League, which would be seen as an insult) like they have in European Football. (For example, two key players on Leeds United were on loan from Man City and Brighton, respectively. They got to play and prove their worth when there just wouldn't've been the minutes for them (at least, for Harrison and Man City.))

Of course, the problem could just be that he's never going to get the hang of this whole "team sport" thing. But if only we could showcase him so that he could have a couple more games like that Sacramento game so that some dumb team thinks he's got star potential.
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it's such a hard comparison between Euro soccer and American basketball as players are sold in soccer where as a player needs to be traded in the NBA and then the NBA has a salary cap and luxury tax penalties where as Soccer has a fair play rule (based on a teams income, meaning the rich get richer and the poor grab the scraps). The big power teams come raiding the smaller teams for their players all the time which keeps creating the disparity.

I do agree with you on the confidence thing though as to be successful, you have to have the right amount of confidence and humility and Simons might be over thinking to much. I'm an old fart and a baseball player and a perfect example is Chuck Knoblach who was an all star second baseman and out of the blue, he couldn't throw the ball accurately to first base anymore. It became such a mental thing for him as in order to be successful one needs to have the tools, but also need to healthy mentally. Let's hope he gets it.
 
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Propagandist said:
No, I understand. I'm just saying Seth has been a knock down shooter since day one. And still is. Seth is a smart player. Simons is not, at all and who knows what will happen, but losing games isn't worth finding out.

Are you honestly referencing that Sacramento game as proof of something? Haha. EVERYONE looked good in that game. But yes, I was excited too. That was fun. But again, so what if it means another high volume, inefficient player?

My point is this: fuck Simons. Let's ride with Gary. Gary doesn't make us worse. If age is such a valuable thing, hey Gary is only a few months older than Anfernee. Simons is a terrible player and his terribleness has become a HUGE distraction.

I don't nitpick Olshey anymore, but I disagree about the hype stuff. He needs to zip it, or talk about the guys that are actually good.
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Before the shutdown, Trent had clearly moved ahead of Simons in the rotation so not sure why you think that's an issue. Simons has a 4 year contract (if options are picked up) at a very low cost. No harm in allowing the time to see what he can become. It's up to Simons to put the work in and to make himself at minimum a rotational NBA player. For comparison Trents minutes were 29 and 26 minutes in the last 2 months before the shutdown and Simons was 19 and 15 minutes per game so Stotts has already favored Trent over Simmons and no reason not to expect that to remain.
 
CupWizier said:
So you don't think he is out performing his 2 mil a year salary? Hard to find a vet with his experience and production for 2 mil a year.

I'd say he has proven to be a bargain signing.
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Never said anything about his salary not being worthwhile, just think its hard to call him decent compared to the rest of the NBA.
 
Seth was a huge part of our success. Played great defense. Lights out shooter. Now we have weak ass Simons smh
 
BonesJones said:
An inefficient guy who doesnt pass much and plays little defense? Meh.
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He commands a double team. Defends well in isolation. Above average three point shooter. And one of the most clutch players ever, as we saw when he hit the game winner against Toronto. So yeah, he’s at LEAST decent.
 
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