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B-Roy said:
How? I don't see how Hinrich is more of a creator than Blake.
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The numbers for his career do show him to have a higher assist% than Blake - so he is a tiny bit better, I suspect.
 
andalusian said:
The numbers for his career do show him to have a higher assist% than Blake - so he is a tiny bit better, I suspect.
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Ok.....but a "tiny bit better" won't solve the problem of not getting the ball into Oden.
 
Getting Hinrich wouldn't be a thrilling move (like getting Rubio, Rondo or even Sessions), but I think it would be a very strong basketball move. Hinrich is a lot like Blake on offense (though a bit superior as a distributor): a conservative point guard who can hit open shots from the perimeter.

But his defense is very good. He would be a large upgrade on that end, and that was Portland's greatest need, good defense at the point. I think Portland would actually be slightly more efficient on offense (and they were already among the best in the league in offensive efficiency) but their defense would take a major step forward.

So if Pritchard ends up landing Hinrich (without giving up Roy, Aldridge, Oden, Batum, Bayless or Rudy), I'll be quite happy. In fact, if he can acquire Hinrich for essentially salary relief and acquire a good backup power forward in the draft, I think the Blazers will be a much better team next season.
 
Blazed Mania 52 said:
So, with my first post on this forum I have to say one thing in regard to the thread title. That is, if the blazers do anything come draft night, I really hope we do not pull the trigger on a Hinrich deal. I mean if we are going to go out and trade good young prospects for a a 3-pointer shooting veteran with playmaking capabilities and help Roy in clutch situations then the last thing we can do is this guy who has a FAT contract and declining numbers over the past two years. I dont know but, it kinda smells like a Channing Frye situation. His numbers went down with the few yeas he played with knicks starting with a surprisingly good rookie season but ever since, he joined the blazers he has been playing like Joe Kleine with charisma and its not simply not getting the job done.

So I say, HEY lets get someone who almost dealt Kobe the second loss in the finals in a row, see, use draft night as a salary cap cleaning marathon and then wait until free aget season and get Hedo. Because he with, Lewis, and Howard almost won it, and since they have some money issues in regards to cap it may be the perfect oppurtunity to lure him here and pair him, with Roy, Aldridge, Webster,Fernendez,Pryzbilla, maybe Outlaw,perhaps Bayless and of course a hopefully improving year for Oden. I dont know but I think thats the best way to go but we'll just see what KP genius has in store.
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welcome to the forums, hopefully you keep posting. I disagree with you though, I always thought Frye was a reach when the Knicks took him, and that was after 4 years in college. For me, his only interesting season was his rookie year. Hinrich, on the other hand, has accomplished much more in his NBA career until injury and the #1 draft pick came in at his position.

Getting Hedo would probably require releasing Blake and Outlaw to create enough cap space, leaving the Blazers without a real PG. If you don't get him, you're shit out of luck. Besides, given what Batum has already done, getting a new PG is a higher priority.
 
Chicago has an interest in Casspi.

Maybe todays move is apart of the Kirk trade where we send Casspi to Chicago and they take the player KP wants at #16?
 
B-Roy said:
Ok.....but a "tiny bit better" won't solve the problem of not getting the ball into Oden.
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Of course it would. Having better perimeter defense will allow Oden to stay on the court longer... :devilwink:

I am just kidding. The biggest problem this team has, imho, is perimeter defense. Getting the ball to Oden will come with time with him improving and the team getting better doing it and trusting him. But - this is not the biggest problem of this team - so I would rather solve the problem of thirst before choosing the color of the cup, if you know what I mean...
 
andalusian said:
Of course it would. Having better perimeter defense will allow Oden to stay on the court longer... :devilwink:

I am just kidding. The biggest problem this team has, imho, is perimeter defense. Getting the ball to Oden will come with time with him improving and the team getting better doing it and trusting him. But - this is not the biggest problem of this team - so I would rather solve the problem of thirst before choosing the color of the cup, if you know what I mean...
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How does Hinrich solve the perimeter defense problem? Back to square one...
 
PapaG said:
How does Hinrich solve the perimeter defense problem? Back to square one...
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If you insist playing checkers when everyone else plays chess - it's not a surprise when you are stuck at square one... :drumroll:

I gave you the advances statistics that show that Hinrich is a much better perimeter defender. You choose to ignore it. Fine with me.
 
andalusian said:
If you insist playing checkers when everyone else plays chess - it's not a surprise when you are stuck at square one... :drumroll:

I gave you the advances statistics that show that Hinrich is a much better perimeter defender. You choose to ignore it. Fine with me.
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Actually you gave me statistics from one series, and then other Hinrich supporters claimed that he didn't even guard Rondo or Allen. Or maybe he did? I can't tell from your camp. My take is it seems like he may not be the answer if he can't even be trusted to guard Rajon Rondo. As for the "chess for checkers" line, I haven't seen anything that looks like chess in this thread, just some stats mixed in with opinion.
 
PapaG said:
Actually you gave me statistics from one series, and then other Hinrich supporters claimed that he didn't even guard Rondo or Allen. Or maybe he did? I can't tell from your camp. My take is it seems like he may not be the answer if he can't even be trusted to guard Rajon Rondo. As for the "chess for checkers" line, I haven't seen anything that looks like chess in this thread, just some stats mixed in with opinion.
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No problem. I will give you their career stats. For the career - (both of these guys played 6 years), Blake's Defensive Win Score is 4.7, the Captain's career Defensive Win Score is 18.5 - making him 3 times more valuable, defensively than Blake.

Is this good now?
 
andalusian said:
No problem. I will give you their career stats. For the career - (both of these guys played 6 years), Blake's Defensive Win Score is 4.7, the Captain's career Defensive Win Score is 18.5 - making him 3 times more valuable, defensively than Blake.

Is this good now?
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Not really since Blake played on crappy team, while Hinrich has gone from starting PG to combo guard off of the bench for a team that has regressed.
 
PapaG said:
Not really since Blake played on crappy team, while Hinrich has gone from starting PG to combo guard off of the bench for a team that has regressed.
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So what you are saying is that they should not have made him a combo guard and not brought him off the bench - and they would not have regressed? Let's capitalize on their mistake, then. :cheers:

This is just for fun - I think he is a big defensive upgrade on Blake, you do not. Understood.
 
andalusian said:
So what you are saying is that they should not have made him a combo guard and not brought him off the bench - and they would not have regressed? Let's capitalize on their mistake, then. :cheers:

This is just for fun - I think he is a big defensive upgrade on Blake, you do not. Understood.
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Yeah, I wouldn't be upset at Hinrich being a Blazer. At worst he'd be a wash defensively, although I will point out Blake didn't have a shoulder to help him move his hips on defense in these playoffs. I just don't think it is fair to Blake to scapegoat him, as many (not you) did in this thread.

:cheers:
 
lol - When I first saw this thread, I thought maybe Hinrich was coming out of the closet or something! :ohno:

First, blaming Blake for the playoff disappointment is silly - Yao owned both our centers more than Blake was having trouble with a speedy opposing guard.

Assuming it's Hinrich for Blake and Outlaw, I guess it won't hurt much. But, I'm not sure if it will help much.

Hinrich does play better defense than Blake, but his also gets into foul trouble a lot and, to me, is behind Blake in passing and perimeter shooting. But, not by much.

I just don't think this will be a "major" upgrade and would prefer to look elsewhere.
 
southnc said:
lol - When I first saw this thread, I thought maybe Hinrich was coming out of the closet or something! :ohno:

First, blaming Blake for the playoff disappointment is silly - Yao owned both our centers more than Blake was having trouble with a speedy opposing guard.

Hinrich does play better defense than Blake, but his also gets into foul trouble a lot and, to me, is behind Blake in passing and perimeter shooting. But, not by much.

I just don't think this will be a "major" upgrade and would prefer to look elsewhere.
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Yao, 16/11 per game in our playoff series, from a consistent All-Star 20/10 center. He's never averaged lower than that in the playoffs (and not since his rookie season in general).

Contrast with, Aaron Brooks, rookie, who averaged 15ppg on 45% shooting (45% from 3 as well) in the playoffs. He averaged 10ppg during the year on 40% shooting, 36.6% from 3.

So our centers were "owned" by a guy held to 4ppg less than his average, while Blake was "having trouble" with a guard who upped his production 50% and his shooting by 5 to 10%? I respectfully disagree.
 
BrianFromWA said:
Yao, 16/11 per game in our playoff series, from a consistent All-Star 20/10 center. He's never averaged lower than that in the playoffs (and not since his rookie season in general).

Contrast with, Aaron Brooks, rookie, who averaged 15ppg on 45% shooting (45% from 3 as well) in the playoffs. He averaged 10ppg during the year on 40% shooting, 36.6% from 3.

So our centers were "owned" by a guy held to 4ppg less than his average, while Blake was "having trouble" with a guard who upped his production 50% and his shooting by 5 to 10%? I respectfully disagree.
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Well, if we're going by production increase, LMA was also abused by Scola, wasn't he? Hell, Scola shot 57% for the series.
 
PapaG said:
Actually you gave me statistics from one series, and then other Hinrich supporters claimed that he didn't even guard Rondo or Allen. Or maybe he did? I can't tell from your camp. My take is it seems like he may not be the answer if he can't even be trusted to guard Rajon Rondo. As for the "chess for checkers" line, I haven't seen anything that looks like chess in this thread, just some stats mixed in with opinion.
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He couldn't guard Rajon Rondo because Rose and Ben Gordon were. I'd rather have them guard Rondo also, if it meant the alternative was them guarding Allen.

You're the one that insisted that Blake played better in the Playoffs. That's the reason why those stats were given.
 
Crimson the Cat said:
He couldn't guard Rajon Rondo because Rose and Ben Gordon were. I'd rather have them guard Rondo also, if it meant the alternative was them guarding Allen.
You're the one that insisted that Blake played better in the Playoffs. That's the reason why those stats were given.
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You'd rather put your "best perimeter defender" on Ray Allen, who still kicked ass, over Rajon Rondo, who averaged a triple-double FOR THE SERIES?
 
Minstrel said:
Getting Hinrich wouldn't be a thrilling move (like getting Rubio, Rondo or even Sessions), but I think it would be a very strong basketball move. Hinrich is a lot like Blake on offense (though a bit superior as a distributor): a conservative point guard who can hit open shots from the perimeter.
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i think hinrich is a better player than sessions. he's good defensively and is a solid pg who can shoot. i wouldn't really call hinrich similar to blake. he's better at everything except for spot up shooting where blake probably has a small edge. hinrich is much better defensively, distributes better, and draws more fouls.

i'll be please if the blazers come out of the draft with this ten man rotation

pg - hinrich/bayless
sg - roy/rudy
sf - batum/webster
pf - aldridge/blair
c - oden/pryzbilla
 
PapaG said:
Not really since Blake played on crappy team, while Hinrich has gone from starting PG to combo guard off of the bench for a team that has regressed.
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So now your argument is that Blake's teams have been crappier than Hinrich's teams, so comparing career stats is unfair. Ok. You live in your world and I'll live in mine. The cool thing is that in my world Hinrich's a defensive stud muffin. I'm thinking that if they do trade for him, my world's closer to Pritchard's world than your's. I'm cool with that.
 
Crimson the Cat said:
So now your argument is that Blake's teams have been crappier than Hinrich's teams, so comparing career stats is unfair. Ok. You live in your world and I'll live in mine. The cool thing is that in my world Hinrich's a defensive stud muffin. I'm thinking that if they do trade for him, my world's closer to Pritchard's world than your's. I'm cool with that.
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I don't see it, at least in terms of stopping a Rondo or Brooks. Oh well, let's see what happens. If they don't trade for Hinrich, I guess my world is closer to to Pritchard's than yours.
 
rocketeer said:
i think hinrich is a better player than sessions.
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Sessions is younger and posts a better PER. While he was a reserve (as Hinrich has been lately), he started the final 40% of the season or so and continued to play very well with some big games.

It's close right now since Hinrich is better defensively, but considering age and Sessions' likelihood of improving from his near 18 PER, I think Sessions has a decent chance to be a star while Hinrich is a solid role-player and isn't likely to be anything more the rest of his career.

i wouldn't really call hinrich similar to blake. he's better at everything except for spot up shooting where blake probably has a small edge.
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I think they play similar styles. Both are conservative point guards who have solid but unspectacular distributing abilities, distribute more from the wing than by slashing and shoot from the perimeter.

I agree that Hinrich is slightly better at most things, except defense where he's much better.

pg - hinrich/bayless
sg - roy/rudy
sf - batum/webster
pf - aldridge/blair
c - oden/pryzbilla
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Yeah, that is exactly my "realistic and great" off-season. Fixes the team's two main holes quite perfectly: defense at point guard and the void at backup power forward.
 
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PapaG said:
Well, if we're going by production increase, LMA was also abused by Scola, wasn't he? Hell, Scola shot 57% for the series.
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If you want to say that Scola abused LMA, and was a factor in us losing the series, I find it a lot easier to agree with than the "Centers got owned, Blake just had a little trouble" story.
 
BrianFromWA said:
If you want to say that Scola abused LMA, and was a factor in us losing the series, I find it a lot easier to agree with than the "Centers got owned, Blake just had a little trouble" story.
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That wasn't my post. Although, looking back, it could be argued that Game One lost the series for Portland when the centers did get abused.
 
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