Trade Josh Hart traded to the Knicks

[SharpesTriumph]

So what am I missing here? Why does this thread continue to linger. Josh wanted to leave and was GOING to leave, so they traded him. Why are people still posting about some random player who didn’t want to even be here?

Shows how exciting Hart was to root for that he could have such a lasting impact on Blazer fans not even playing a single season here.

CJ had 9 years here and nobody is posting about how much he is missed.

Some of us follow the rest of the NBA a lot as well, and Hart is awesome to watch on the Knicks. How long did we hear about Bowie over Jordan or Dale Davis over Jermaine? Yeah it was awhile. When all the Blazers got for Hart is a 21 win teams 6th best rookie in a very old Kristen Murry - behind an undrafted guy and late second rounders, along with cap space used to give out much worse contracts - yeah makes sense there is regret and second guessing.

 

[THE HCP]

Shows how exciting Hart was to root for that he could have such a lasting impact on Blazer fans not even playing a single season here.

CJ had 9 years here and nobody is posting about how much he is missed.

Some of us follow the rest of the NBA a lot as well, and Hart is awesome to watch on the Knicks. How long did we hear about Bowie over Jordan or Dale Davis over Jermaine? Yeah it was awhile. When all the Blazers got for Hart is a 21 win teams 6th best rookie in a very old Kristen Murry - behind an undrafted guy and late second rounders, along with cap space used to give out much worse contracts - yeah makes sense there is regret and second guessing.

Brother, I watch the entire league from summer league to summer league and STILL don’t understand why people care this much? This dude HATED portland and couldn’t leave fast enough. Let it go.

 

[Natebishop3]

So what am I missing here? Why does this thread continue to linger. Josh wanted to leave and was GOING to leave, so they traded him. Why are people still posting about some random player who didn’t want to even be here?

Because those fans refuse to acknowledge that he was going to leave.

 

[Duckhook]

Brother, I watch the entire league from summer league to summer league and STILL don’t understand why people care this much? This dude HATED portland and couldn’t leave fast enough. Let it go.

I can count my favorite Blazers on one hand. Josh is my #6 only because of his short tenure with us. Regardless of him not wanting to be here, he gave 110% every night in a Blazer uni, and he's been a difference maker for the Knicks in his dream scenario. I'm happy for him even though his time in P-town was short. He earns every cent when he's on the court. I'm watching the Knicks series just for him and OG. Those 2 are off the charts on the hustle meter. It's fun to see a piece of the Blazers actually make a difference in his new home... unlike other former Blazers.

 

[THE HCP]

I can count my favorite Blazers on one hand. Josh is my #6 only because of his short tenure with us. Regardless of him not wanting to be here, he gave 110% every night in a Blazer uni, and he's been a difference maker for the Knicks in his dream scenario. I'm happy for him even though his time in P-town was short. He earns every cent when he's on the court. I'm watching the Knicks series just for him and OG. Those 2 are off the charts on the hustle meter. It's fun to see a piece of the Blazers actually make a difference in his new home... unlike other former Blazers.

He’s not a piece of the Blazers though. Couldn’t stand it here, TRUST ME! Bring this shit to the KNICKS forum.

 

[Phatguysrule]

Shows how exciting Hart was to root for that he could have such a lasting impact on Blazer fans not even playing a single season here.

CJ had 9 years here and nobody is posting about how much he is missed.

Some of us follow the rest of the NBA a lot as well, and Hart is awesome to watch on the Knicks. How long did we hear about Bowie over Jordan or Dale Davis over Jermaine? Yeah it was awhile. When all the Blazers got for Hart is a 21 win teams 6th best rookie in a very old Kristen Murry - behind an undrafted guy and late second rounders, along with cap space used to give out much worse contracts - yeah makes sense there is regret and second guessing.

Nobody was going to give us more than we got and we helped him get where he wanted to go. He very clearly didn't want to be here.

Well done Cronin.

 

[STOMP]

Thibodeau is trying to kill Hart playing him all game with no breaks

In the Knicks 8 postseason games thus far, Josh has played all but 15 minutes. That includes an overtime game vs the 6ers where he played all 53 minutes.

STOMP

 

[Sheldon Shape]

Nobody was going to give us more than we got and we helped him get where he wanted to go. He very clearly didn't want to be here.

Well done Cronin.

Getting Kris Murray for Josh Hart should not be congratulated. A lawn chair could have gotten the same deal.

 

[MickZagger]

In the Knicks 8 postseason games thus far, Josh has played all but 15 minutes. That includes an overtime game vs the 6ers where he played all 53 minutes.

STOMP

He wore down Derrick Rose with that kind of stuff too

 

[Whyachi]

Getting Kris Murray for Josh Hart should not be congratulated. A lawn chair could have gotten the same deal.

it's GM gone wild 3 dimensional adaptive tanking.

By Portland trading key hustle man Josh Hart for Knicks scrubs, in the middle of a mediocre 28-30 season.. it made the Blazers worse. The losses piled up big time, and Portland's 2023 ping pong ball took a significant bounce. Blazers drafted #3, Scoot Henderson.

(* losing on purpose and lying about the rebuild pissed off extremely expensive team captain Lillard. Dame's winning contributions were no longer wanted. His trade request also meant no luxury tax for Jody. Woohoo! Our owner is rich!)

Cronin can fake injuries and bench his key players if he has no All-Stars on his roster. So Jrue Holiday couldn't be part of Joe's master plan either.

The 2023 Knicks became instantly better once they acquired Hart. The NYK pick climbed the ladder, leaving Portland with a not very good FRP pick.

Soo, enter the backup plan. Bench Jerami Grant the final 20+ games, and give maximum playing time to the Knicks FRP rookie Kris Murray. It was almost beneficial that Murray had been struggling to shoot all season. Billups tank master strategy had Murray parked out in deep territory every game. Kris was told he's playing AMAZING, and to keep launching as many threes as possible. The Blazer losses piled up rapidly. Portland went 4-19 with sharpshooting forward Jerami Grant on the *wink wink injured list.

Final results of the Josh Hart trade? Tune in this Sunday, it's Blazers Ping Pong Day!

 

[Phatguysrule]

Getting Kris Murray for Josh Hart should not be congratulated. A lawn chair could have gotten the same deal.

I didn't realize that's all we got for Josh Hart. You know, the player we were going to lose for no return at all.

 

[SheedSoNasty]

This makes me wonder how much people will be disappointed when we trade other productive players for FRP and then complain when said pick that already has a low chance of being a legit player flames out.

 

[STOMP]

He wore down Derrick Rose with that kind of stuff too

In his first 4 years in the league Rose averaged between 35-37 MPG before injuries set in. For comparison, MJ average 38 MPG for his entire career. Rose blew out his knees (Ligament & Miniscus tears) which can happen on any one play especially for guys who are super explosive.

STOMP

 

[wizenheimer]

I didn't realize that's all we got for Josh Hart. You know, the player we were going to lose for no return at all.

I don't think it was a certainty Hart was going to opt out early and walk. It was pretty damn likely though; at least is was pretty likely if Hart wanted to stay married

but the trade had more moving parts than just Hart and the Knicks draft pick. Portland got back the 23rd pick and Thybulle as well as taking a flyer on Reddish

however, the Blazers didn't just give up Hart. They also gave up TWO 2nd round picks: the more favorable of Portland's or New Orleans' 2027 2nd's; and, Portland's 2029 2nd round pick

when you're rolling the dice on future events, it's almost always a win-some/lose-some gamble (which is why a successful tank takes time). I don't think you can pencil in Murray in the loss column quite yet. His rookie season was such that it might be leaning loss compared to the generic value of a 23rd pick. At the same time, while Murray has definite flaws in his game, one of them is not BBIQ. That BBIQ might mean he'll become a solid player; not starting-level solid probably, but lower rotation solid....maybe

Thybulle has some value. Obviously, not anywhere close to the value of Hart. But he can be an effective role player on a good roster. He's kind of wasted on Portland considering the team trajectory; and if he isn't traded between now and the trade deadline I'd say he's even more likely to opt out and walk next summer than Hart was last summer

anyway, I don't think Cronin should get much positive credit for that trade. He sent out the best player, by far, but devalued the gain of a first round pick by the loss of those 2nd's. That doesn't look like good GM-ing to me

 

[kjironman1]

I don't think it was a certainty Hart was going to opt out early and walk. It was pretty damn likely though; at least is was pretty likely if Hart wanted to stay married

but the trade had more moving parts than just Hart and the Knicks draft pick. Portland got back the 23rd pick and Thybulle as well as taking a flyer on Reddish

however, the Blazers didn't just give up Hart. They also gave up TWO 2nd round picks: the more favorable of Portland's or New Orleans' 2027 2nd's; and, Portland's 2029 2nd round pick

when you're rolling the dice on future events, it's almost always a win-some/lose-some gamble (which is why a successful tank takes time). I don't think you can pencil in Murray in the loss column quite yet. His rookie season was such that it might be leaning loss compared to the generic value of a 23rd pick. At the same time, while Murray has definite flaws in his game, one of them is not BBIQ. That BBIQ might mean he'll become a solid player; not starting-level solid probably, but lower rotation solid....maybe

Thybulle has some value. Obviously, not anywhere close to the value of Hart. But he can be an effective role player on a good roster. He's kind of wasted on Portland considering the team trajectory; and if he isn't traded between now and the trade deadline I'd say he's even more likely to opt out and walk next summer than Hart was last summer

anyway, I don't think Cronin should get much positive credit for that trade. He sent out the best player, by far, but devalued the gain of a first round pick by the loss of those 2nd's. That doesn't look like goo GM-ing to me

From people I know who are in the “Know”. He was gone. Never was going to stay.

 

[Phatguysrule]

I don't think it was a certainty Hart was going to opt out early and walk. It was pretty damn likely though; at least is was pretty likely if Hart wanted to stay married

but the trade had more moving parts than just Hart and the Knicks draft pick. Portland got back the 23rd pick and Thybulle as well as taking a flyer on Reddish

however, the Blazers didn't just give up Hart. They also gave up TWO 2nd round picks: the more favorable of Portland's or New Orleans' 2027 2nd's; and, Portland's 2029 2nd round pick

when you're rolling the dice on future events, it's almost always a win-some/lose-some gamble (which is why a successful tank takes time). I don't think you can pencil in Murray in the loss column quite yet. His rookie season was such that it might be leaning loss compared to the generic value of a 23rd pick. At the same time, while Murray has definite flaws in his game, one of them is not BBIQ. That BBIQ might mean he'll become a solid player; not starting-level solid probably, but lower rotation solid....maybe

Thybulle has some value. Obviously, not anywhere close to the value of Hart. But he can be an effective role player on a good roster. He's kind of wasted on Portland considering the team trajectory; and if he isn't traded between now and the trade deadline I'd say he's even more likely to opt out and walk next summer than Hart was last summer

anyway, I don't think Cronin should get much positive credit for that trade. He sent out the best player, by far, but devalued the gain of a first round pick by the loss of those 2nd's. That doesn't look like goo GM-ing to me

And he sent Hart someplace he wanted to be.

I'm not a huge Cronin fan, but I'm not sure if there was a better deal out there for Cronin to make. We weren't going to be able to trade Hart for a taller Josh Hart.

 

[Phatguysrule]

From people I know who are in the “Know”. He was gone. Never was going to stay.

Everyone I've heard who has even a shred of legitimate contact with the team or Hart says the same thing.

Dude was 100% gone and he made that 100% clear to Cronin.

 

[kjironman1]

Everyone I've heard who has even a shred of legitimate contact with the team or Hart says the same thing.

Dude was 100% gone and he made that 100% clear to Cronin.

That’s exactly what I’ve heard but my contacts are very few and nowhere near what I would call Woj worthy.
Also what you just said seems to be the line that makes it cool was there was no hemming around or beating around the bush for money. He was upfront from the beginning.

 

[wizenheimer]

And he sent Hart someplace he wanted to be.

I'm not a huge Cronin fan, but I'm not sure if there was a better deal out there for Cronin to make. We weren't going to be able to trade Hart for a taller Josh Hart.

as I said, Portland didn't trade Hart alone; they traded Hart + two 2nd's for Thybulle and a 23rd pick. I'm not willing to credit that trade as being the best Portland could have done

 

[RR7]

I think getting a 1st round pick is good value for an expiring role player you know is walking at the end of the season. That seems like it should be roughly the going value for a player of Hart's talent level. I think 2 2nds is an ok deal for someone of Thybulle's talent level, considering we got 3 2nds for a comparable player in GPII.
Overall I see that as an easy win for Cronin.

 

[Phatguysrule]

as I said, Portland didn't trade Hart alone; they traded Hart + two 2nd's for Thybulle and a 23rd pick. I'm not willing to credit that trade as being the best Portland could have done

Fair enough. I don't view 2nds as assets to get hung up about. They help get deals done and once in a blue moon they turn into a productive player. But we have a ton of 2nds.

As @RR7 says above, I was stoked to get a first out of Hart. I was super excited at getting 'Tiss out of a small portion of our glut of 2nd rounders.

 

[Phatguysrule]

That’s exactly what I’ve heard but my contacts are very few and nowhere near what I would call Woj worthy.
Also what you just said seems to be the line that makes it cool was there was no hemming around or beating around the bush for money. He was upfront from the beginning.

Agreed. And I don't have any contacts. But I read people who do. And the ones I trust and who have been reliable all tend to agree on all of this.

 

[RR7]

Fair enough. I don't view 2nds as assets to get hung up about. They help get deals done and once in a blue moon they turn into a productive player. But we have a ton of 2nds.

It's only worth getting hung up on if we're the ones sending them. If we were getting 2nds in a deal, they'd likely be pooh-poohed as meh whatever picks.

 

[Phatguysrule]

It's only worth getting hung up on if we're the ones sending them. If we were getting 2nds in a deal, they'd likely be pooh-poohed as meh whatever picks.

Lol. You're probably right.

I'm definitely not sold on Cronin. I just can't fault him for this one.

 

[Tince]

as I said, Portland didn't trade Hart alone; they traded Hart + two 2nd's for Thybulle and a 23rd pick. I'm not willing to credit that trade as being the best Portland could have done

I'd guess the majority of trades in the league fall under the category of "not being the best <insert team> could've done". Of course, we'll never know what other options were on the table, so it's impossible to say either way.

Looking back, I can't imagine there were many teams bidding against the Knicks in wanting Hart as a 2 month rental and/or lock him down for $100m long term.

 

[wizenheimer]

I'd guess the majority of trades in the league fall under the category of "not being the best <insert team> could've done". Of course, we'll never know what other options were on the table, so it's impossible to say either way.

Looking back, I can't imagine there were many teams bidding against the Knicks in wanting Hart as a 2 month rental and/or lock him down for $100m long term.

fine...I was just pushing back a little on the claim that the Knicks trade was the best Portland could have done.

 

[Phatguysrule]

fine...I was just pushing back a little on the claim that the Knicks trade was the best Portland could have done.

Not that I think Cronin knocked it out of the park, I just can't think of what more we could have "expected" in that situation.

 

[Samuel]

fine...I was just pushing back a little on the claim that the Knicks trade was the best Portland could have done.

Who would you have had them trade for?

 

[MickZagger]

In his first 4 years in the league Rose averaged between 35-37 MPG before injuries set in. For comparison, MJ average 38 MPG for his entire career. Rose blew out his knees (Ligament & Miniscus tears) which can happen on any one play especially for guys who are super explosive.

STOMP

Gotcha. I just remember some people echoing the sentiment that Thibs played him too many minutes. I guess I was wrong.

I think the wear down injuries with players these days has a lot to do with all the AAU play when they’re young/

 

[wizenheimer]

Who would you have had them trade for?

if I haven't been clear, my skepticism is based upon Portland trading Hart plus 2 picks for Thybulle + 1 pick. That doesn't look that great of a trade to me; but I'll grant there are some extenuating circumstances

I guess in the interest of 'completion' the trade ended up being CJ + Nance + two 2nds for Grant + Thybulle + Murray + one 2nd. I think that was a decent trade, generically. Kind of a waste for a roster and timeline like Portland's