Marc Stein: Terry most likely out.

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Dude, I can’t keep track of who all the posters are in here and every detail of what they say... all I know is it’s a pretty clear divide between those who buy everything Neil is selling and those who see there is no way Dame/CJ will ever be a legit contender. And since Neil says he won’t ever entertain trading CJ... I assume Neil supporters refuse to trade CJ as well, or else why defend Neil?

But you quoted me. It would start by focusing your post to be based on the quote you are referencing....

You know what assuming starts with right?
 
I know i love it when one of my employees comes back at me with a different idea that may improve things.

Yep, I had a boss that was very positive and interested in what his management team had to offer and even if he didn't agree he had a way of showing appreciation for the ideas put forth. When his son took over he was very close minded and thought he had all the answers. I always said we were a successful business despite him, lol.
 
Ball movement alone does not equate to more assists.

Better shooters making more shots off of ball movement is what increases assists.

So whats needed more? More ball movement or better shooters?

assists are a stat that is often misused and misunderstood as it isn't a single player stat even though it is listed as one. I see it more as a team stat. I make a very basic pass to a shooter and he makes it, I get an assist. I can make a spectacular pass to a shooter and he misses and I get nothing.
 
Is Stotts open to hiring guys who may question what he is doing? Is he even interested in guys who might teach fundamentals? I haven't heard anything that makes me think he is.

Who says he doesn't now? From listening and observing Stotts he comes across like a guy that values input and very open minded and one that listens to his coaches and players. I haven;t seen anything to suggest otherwise.
 
assists are a stat that is often misused and misunderstood as it isn't a single player stat even though it is listed as one. I see it more as a team stat. I make a very basic pass to a shooter and he makes it, I get an assist. I can make a spectacular pass to a shooter and he misses and I get nothing.
Yeah what's more telling is that we had the most dribbles per touch.
 
We went from 2 seasons ago with basically the same team being a bottom defense team to a top defensive team...we're not a team of 36 year old vets...passing needs to improve...during our win streak passing did improve...then guys got tired and hero balled more in the playoffs....great players will adapt, watch film and fill in the gaps in their games

lol.
 
I read it from a legit source but apparently they were wrong and were 4th.

https://stats.nba.com/teams/touches/?sort=AVG_DRIB_PER_TOUCH&dir=1

Still though.

We're also bottom 5 in paint touches.

I'll even help you out. You were on post season. Regular season we did have the highest average dribble per touch, but what does it really mean as there is only one dribble less by the top team. Do you really think that's a significant stat? I love stats but they also have to be put in perspective to mean much. How long does one dribble really take? a half second? a second? Can't really add up to much.
 
I'll even help you out. You were on post season. Regular season we did have the highest average dribble per touch, but what does it really mean as there is only one dribble less by the top team. Do you really think that's a significant stat? I love stats but they also have to be put in perspective to mean much. How long does one dribble really take? a half second? a second? Can't really add up to much.
Hm... Why did it default to post-season? Haha.

Uh, that's a huge difference. That's an extra 3 to 4 dribbles per possession. I don't know how to explain the magnitude of it...

What matters more is what's being done with those dribbles. A team that takes 3 dribbles per touch, but those 3 dribbles are usually from a player attacking the rim, it's going to be much better than a team that takes 3 dribbles per touch, where 6 dribbles come in isolation, then passes to somebody who passes again without taking a dribble, and then that guy takes 6 meaningless dribbles in isolation.

Both are 3 dribbles per touch, but the first is much more productive in trying to get good shots at the rim and collapsing the defense in order to create kickouts or open basket cuts for other players.

For us, our dribbles are mostly in isolation, with CJ, Dame, Shabazz, Turner, and even Aminu sitting there trying to break down their defender with a series of 5-6 dribbles.
 
I'll even help you out. You were on post season. Regular season we did have the highest average dribble per touch, but what does it really mean as there is only one dribble less by the top team. Do you really think that's a significant stat? I love stats but they also have to be put in perspective to mean much. How long does one dribble really take? a half second? a second? Can't really add up to much.

Wins are a stat. Can we put that in perspective?
 
I'll even help you out. You were on post season. Regular season we did have the highest average dribble per touch, but what does it really mean as there is only one dribble less by the top team. Do you really think that's a significant stat? I love stats but they also have to be put in perspective to mean much. How long does one dribble really take? a half second? a second? Can't really add up to much.

Hm... Why did it default to post-season? Haha.

Uh, that's a huge difference. That's an extra 3 to 4 dribbles per possession. I don't know how to explain the magnitude of it...

What matters more is what's being done with those dribbles. A team that takes 3 dribbles per touch, but those 3 dribbles are usually from a player attacking the rim, it's going to be much better than a team that takes 3 dribbles per touch, where 6 dribbles come in isolation, then passes to somebody who passes again without taking a dribble, and then that guy takes 6 meaningless dribbles in isolation.

Both are 3 dribbles per touch, but the first is much more productive in trying to get good shots at the rim and collapsing the defense in order to create kickouts or open basket cuts for other players.

For us, our dribbles are mostly in isolation, with CJ, Dame, Shabazz, Turner, and even Aminu sitting there trying to break down their defender with a series of 5-6 dribbles.

There you go. Now you guys are talking!!! :)

Add some bnm in the middle of this and most of the rest of the forum should walk away smarter!
 
Dude, I can’t keep track of who all the posters are in here and every detail of what they say... all I know is it’s a pretty clear divide between those who buy everything Neil is selling and those who see there is no way Dame/CJ will ever be a legit contender. And since Neil says he won’t ever entertain trading CJ... I assume Neil supporters refuse to trade CJ as well, or else why defend Neil?
Olshey should say he won't trade CJ. That isn't the problem. I don't believe a word guy says anyway but you don't actively shop CJ. You ask about players you want and see what the price is.
 
Tonight is a great example of a team with a flawed roster. Most are. You can't honestly tell me the Jazz have a better roster than the Blazers. They don't. Quinn Snyder is a guy who is overachieving. Terry Stotts? Not so much. That's underachieving. Our roster is much better.
 
Tonight is a great example of a team with a flawed roster. Most are. You can't honestly tell me the Jazz have a better roster than the Blazers. They don't. Quinn Snyder is a guy who is overachieving. Terry Stotts? Not so much. That's underachieving. Our roster is much better.
What?! You are delusional. Jazz win a playoff series and Blazers couldn’t win a playoff game. Jazz are one of the most balance team in the league... true PG with size that plays defense in Rubio... go to scorer and historic rookie in Mitchell, defensive player of year in Gobert, 3 n d player with size in Ingles... Favors... great bench... and they play as a team
 
What?! You are delusional. Jazz win a playoff series and Blazers couldn’t win a playoff game. Jazz are one of the most balance team in the league... true PG with size that plays defense in Rubio... go to scorer and historic rookie in Mitchell, defensive player of year in Gobert, 3 n d player with size in Ingles... Favors... great bench... and they play as a team

The Jazz are a superior team because of coaching. Not because of talent. The Blazers have much more talent. The Jazz are playing with spare parts. The Jazz have one scorer and that's Mitchell. The rest are guys who can't get their own shots. But because they play as a team, they are a far superior team. That's on coaching.
 
The Jazz are a superior team because of coaching. Not because of talent. The Blazers have much more talent. The Jazz are playing with spare parts. The Jazz have one scorer and that's Mitchell. The rest are guys who can't get their own shots. But because they play as a team, they are a far superior team. That's on coaching.

Their whole starting lineup would start for at least half the teams in the league. I don't think you can say that about ours.
 
At the start of the 2017-18 season, I tried searching for a new team and watched the Jazz for a couple of games. They clearly had less talent than the Blazers. But their coach was much smarter. It drew me back to the Blazers. The Blazers are more entertaining to watch, like an uncoached show-off high school all-star team.
 
Their whole starting lineup would start for at least half the teams in the league. I don't think you can say that about ours.

Favors? No. Rubio? Not really. He's been losing in Minnesota since back in the days. Ingles today? Maybe. But the guy wasn't even drafted. Give credit to their coach for making a legit player out of him.

O'neal? Burks? These guys are cast-offs. The Blazers have much more raw talent but Snyder gets his players to play as a whole unit instead of individuals. Snyder > Stotts to the 10th degree.
 
Favors? No. Rubio? Not really. He's been losing in Minnesota since back in the days. Ingles today? Maybe. But the guy wasn't even drafted. Give credit to their coach for making a legit player out of him.

Doesn't matter what they did before. The league is very situational. Rubio, Favors, and Ingles would start for many teams today.

O'neal? Burks? These guys are cast-offs.

I said starters.
 
What?! You are delusional. Jazz win a playoff series and Blazers couldn’t win a playoff game. Jazz are one of the most balance team in the league... true PG with size that plays defense in Rubio... go to scorer and historic rookie in Mitchell, defensive player of year in Gobert, 3 n d player with size in Ingles... Favors... great bench... and they play as a team
Let's see how they do against Houston.
 
Doesn't matter what they did before. The league is very situational. Rubio, Favors, and Ingles would start for many teams today.

Of course you can be brave and say that today, but 6 months ago nobody would have thought twice about those guys or this team. We say it differently now because of their success as a team. This is obvious. We'd be talking about the Blazers starting 5 right now if they would have advanced as well. Doesn't take much courage to say this now.

I said starters.

You did. I said team as a whole. My points still stand. They are a far less talented team than the Blazers and most would even agree now. They are just better coached and it shows.
 
Favors? No. Rubio? Not really. He's been losing in Minnesota since back in the days. Ingles today? Maybe. But the guy wasn't even drafted. Give credit to their coach for making a legit player out of him.

O'neal? Burks? These guys are cast-offs. The Blazers have much more raw talent but Snyder gets his players to play as a whole unit instead of individuals. Snyder > Stotts to the 10th degree.
Stotts beat Snyder twice this year. The first time snapped Utah's longest win streak of the season. The second cost Utah home court advantage.
 
Stotts beat Snyder twice this year. The first time snapped Utah's longest win streak of the season. The second cost Utah home court advantage.
But who's in the 2nd round?
 
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Which they didn't need and got a much better matchup.

Oh, those two game sample sizes in the regular season that mean nothing. So beautiful.
Oh, the games meant something but the sample didn't. There's a time for stats and a time for other metrics. It all depends on the situation.

If you get hung up looking for stats to prove you right then you're probably going to miss the mark. Stats are for guiding you to the most likely outcome of a future event, providing they are of sufficient size.

Also, the more you know about the context of a stat the better.
 
I don’t see how it’s even an argument that Snyder has done better this season than Stotts. His two best offensive players left them in the offseason and were replaced by a player who has been a major disappointment for Minnesota for the past few years and couldn’t shoot and a 13th overall pick rookie. They were 19-28 at one point and nobody expected them to even get close to playoffs let alone finish 48-34 and go to the second round at the expense of OKC.

He has basically made them all much better than they were ever perceived. Players like O’Neale and Ingles weren’t even considered good enough for this league at an advanced age and Ingles has probably been a top 10 small forward this season if not better than that. Rubio has been one of the best playmakers around for the last 2-3 months and Mitchell has probably been a top 20 player this season which is huge. This is like what Stotts did in 2015-16, have them compete against all odds. He should comfortably win the coach of the year now.
 
Can he please be fired already? Either he gets fired this off season and we start looking for replacement coaches as soon as possible or he will get fired early next season and we have an interim all year. He does not coach well in the playoffs. Getting swept in the first round is unacceptable we would be better off missing the playoffs.
 

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