Matisse Thybulle Signs Full-MLE Offer with Mavericks / Blazers match

[JDC]

I thought the 1 yr was referring to the rule about not trading to Dallas. But the veto... Wasnt sure. We dealt Allen Crabbe to BK after a similar deadline a few seasons ago.

The phrasing of the tweet does make it unclear but yes, RFA's that have their offer sheet matched have veto power on a trade for one year.

 

[BrianFromWA]

I thought the 1 yr was referring to the rule about not trading to Dallas. But the veto... Wasnt sure. We dealt Allen Crabbe to BK after a similar deadline a few seasons ago.

from the CBA FAQ #42

If a team matches an offer sheet and retains its free agent, then for one year they cannot trade him without his consent, and during that year cannot trade him at all to the team that signed him to the offer sheet. They also can't trade the player in a sign-and-trade transaction (see question number 92). A restricted free agent's resulting contract (whether with the new team or the contract is matched by the player's prior team) cannot be amended in any manner for one year.

 

[maxiep]

If he wants to be here this is a no brainer. Good locker room guy. Great defender

If you listen to him, he sounds like he gets Portland, even though he's from Issaquah. Very Channing Frye-like. I see him being a fan favorite.

 

[maxiep]

Thybulle, Rupert and Simmons will get stops

http://www.quickmeme.com/img/ab/ab8c229496701a3c93896c03d0a251dc00d0428b5e74c8f1da2d40985648dca6.jpg

 

[maxiep]

Why does it have to be Simmons or let's have Sharpe play maybe slightly out of position is that the only way you can defend wanting that bum Ben Simmons -- really that just shows you have no argument to make and you want to be lazy about it.

This is what you want in Ben Simmons this is is stat line for this past year

GP - MPG - FG% - 3PT% - FT% - Orb - DRB - TRB - AST - STL - BLK - TOV - PPG
42 - 26.29 - 0.566 - 0.000 - 0.439 - 0.95 - 5.31 - 6.26 - 6.10 - 1.29 - 0.57 - 2.31 - 6.93

You want this on the Blazers and to boot you get his contract for TWO more seasons at 37.8 and 40.3 million per season this is really what you want for this team. Now I have heard maybe it would be worth it if the Nets throw in 2 or 3 of there 1st's over the next few seasons and sure maybe ( doubt it ) that would make it worth it to a degree . However the Nets think they can start to make noise / contend again in the next two or 3 seasons that they might be willing to THROW AWAY first round picks to get this ass clown off there team. If the Blazers really hope to maybe turn it around how does this help the Blazers when another team basically told ya he is worthless so how does this help turn the Blazers around unless this owner does not really care about winning and just wants to tread water until she has to sell the team.

I think you nailed it in your second paragraph. We take Simmons NOT for what he can do on the court, but rather for the following reasons:
1. We can absorb his ridiculous contract.
2. Our window won't open during that time.
3. The Nets would PAY us with draft picks to be free of him and his deal
4. There's a small chance he may come back and actually play at a reasonable level. However, the expectation is zero. You don't really even care if he ever suits up for us.

 

[THE HCP]

Update the thread title!

Why when you can just start ANOTHER thread on the same topic.

 

[KingSpeed]

I think you nailed it in your second paragraph. We take Simmons NOT for what he can do on the court, but rather for the following reasons:
1. We can absorb his ridiculous contract.
2. Our window won't open during that time.
3. The Nets would PAY us with draft picks to be free of him and his deal
4. There's a small chance he may come back and actually play at a reasonable level. However, the expectation is zero. You don't really even care if he ever suits up for us.

I’d say there’s a rather good chance he plays at a reasonable level if the organization is stable and wants him there. He had a nice stretch of basketball last season when Nets won 18 of 20 games. He has had some mental health and back issues but he’s still very young and an All NBA-level talent. And on our team, he wouldn’t be relied upon to be one of our top 2 options. I’m all in on Simmons becoming a Blazer. I do not consider him to be a negative.

 

[Strenuus]

Don't match. This dude is barely a rotation player on a good team... giving him over $10m a year seems a dramatic overpay given the contracts that have been handed out this summer in free agency.

Yikes. That's a bad take lol

 

[PCmor7]

Thybulle, Rupert and Simmons will get stops

One of my little joys while the Blazers rebuild is playing the Heat twice a season and trying to see Dame shake Thybulle. Then Thybulle comes up and Dame's trying to get space from Caleb Martin. Then both those guys are out and he gets a break for a couple minutes by only having to deal with Rupert. Then the Heat run a screen for Dame and suddenly he's being guarded by Ben Simmons.

 

[wizenheimer]

I think you nailed it in your second paragraph. We take Simmons NOT for what he can do on the court, but rather for the following reasons:
1. We can absorb his ridiculous contract.
2. Our window won't open during that time.
3. The Nets would PAY us with draft picks to be free of him and his deal
4. There's a small chance he may come back and actually play at a reasonable level. However, the expectation is zero. You don't really even care if he ever suits up for us.

I think the minimum salary rules in the new CBA have made it much more acceptable for teams to absorb bad salary like Simmons. Teams have to have a payroll of at least 90% of the cap when the season starts. There's no advantage to carrying more than 10% of the cap in the form of cap-space into the season

 

[BrianFromWA]

I think the minimum salary rules in the new CBA have made it much more acceptable for teams to absorb bad salary like Simmons. Teams have to have a payroll of at least 90% of the cap when the season starts. There's no advantage to carrying more than 10% of the cap in the form of cap-space into the season

But no one aside from SAS are really close or in danger of that. However, hard capping at the apron is no joke, and having a 40M albatross when the difference between the min and the apron is 50M is going to be interesting to solve.

 

[PCmor7]

Bam!

We got Bam?

#FreeBam!

 

[PCmor7]

Why is this only one thread? I feel like Cronin must have lied in matching the offer. In fact, I'm sure he did.

 

[wizenheimer]

But no one aside from SAS are really close or in danger of that. However, hard capping at the apron is no joke, and having a 40M albatross when the difference between the min and the apron is 50M is going to be interesting to solve.

it's a balancing act for sure. soft cap - hard cap - hard floor

what I see, in the glimpse of the rules I've seen, is there is no penalty for dropping below the floor after the season starts. But I may not have seen the full set of rules. Of course, Blazers don't have to worry about the floor. It looks like the Blazers are only 2M below the tax line right now. They have 62M in salary allocated to Dame & Nurkic. So, depending on the circumstances of a Dame trade, they might dip below the tax line by quite a bit

a big problem I see is that Nurkic has negative value. I'm thinking he'll dilute the value the Blazers can get for Dame

 

[maxiep]

I’d say there’s a rather good chance he plays at a reasonable level if the organization is stable and wants him there. He had a nice stretch of basketball last season when Nets won 18 of 20 games. He has had some mental health and back issues but he’s still very young and an All NBA-level talent. And on our team, he wouldn’t be relied upon to be one of our top 2 options. I’m all in on Simmons becoming a Blazer. I do not consider him to be a negative.

I'm saying the Nets perception is that he's a negative. And that means they pay us extra to be rid of him.

I have the same optimistic hope, but others that know more than me seem to be of the mind he'll never play in the NBA again.

 

[Sloth]

I don't like us matching this at all tbh and I will just leave it at that.

 

[KeepOnRollin]

I don't like us matching this at all tbh and I will just leave it at that.

Actually, we would love you to expand on why.

 

[Sloth]

Actually, we would love you to expand on why.

He sucks ass and I would rather we would have spent the money on someone else. Thanks.

 

[KeepOnRollin]

He sucks ass and I would rather we would have spent the money on someone else. Thanks.

I can get the last part (although do you have a name in mind on who you would rather have - that is available of course) but how do you quantify the first part?

 

[Sloth]

I can get the last part (although do you have a name in mind on who you would rather have - that is available of course) but how do you quantify the first part?

I just don't think skill set(If you want to call it that) works great with the guys we have on the team right now. Fair enough if other peope like him and of course I will cheer him on, just my opinion.

Another guy to sign for similar money maybe? I would have taken a stab at PJ Washington.

 

[Mediocre Man]

I just don't think skill set(If you want to call it that) works great with the guys we have on the team right now. Fair enough if other peope like him and of course I will cheer him on, just my opinion.

Another guy to sign for similar money maybe? I would have taken a stab at PJ Washington.

Washington would be awesome, but why would he join a team with no shot at all of making the playoffs?

 

[BonesJones]

Still like those undersized lineups

When the goal is to develop and not win the next couple years, you start Scoot, Ant, and Sharpe together. It's not ideal long-term but the Blazers should see if Ant can up his production and his trade value before they try to cash in.

 

[Ed O]

He sucks ass and I would rather we would have spent the money on someone else. Thanks.

I'll add to your post with the reasons I think matching is a mistake:

• He's not a very good player. He is terrible offensively and while he had a "hot streak" of 38% from 3's with part of a season in Portland, he's clearly a huge negative offensively. He had fallen out of the rotation with the 76ers for a reason.
• He's not needed by this team given our goals. We don't need to add a defensive stopper in order to develop our guys and try to win (while losing due to inexperience).
• He's not needed by this team given our roster. Our most important three players moving forward are all guards, and having Thybulle play at guard takes minutes away from Sharpe and/or Simons... playing him at small forward takes minutes away from Murray and Rupert. Adding guards has been easy for this team as we saw with Mayes. Adding wings has been easy as we saw with Knox, Thybulle, and Reddish.
• He might hamstring future moves. We might be limited in moves me can make by paying him so much, due to ownership's unwillingness to spend too much on a lottery team and/or NBA cap/tax considerations.
• He's getting paid too much. He was basically traded by the Sixers for Jalen McDaniels when he came to the Blazers, and the Sixers let McDaniels walk... he signed for two years and $9m with the Raptors.
• He won't have much, if any, trade value. We got him on the cheap and now he's more expensive in terms of his contract. Other similar players signed for less. He has no-trade power for a year. Why would any other team be interested in adding him, other than Dallas who is going all-in this summer?

It's not my money and it's not as dramatic an overpay as Jerami Grant was, but it is not a smart move by the Blazers to match.

 

[BrianFromWA]

Washington would be awesome, but why would he join a team with no shot at all of making the playoffs?

More likely, why on earth wouldn't CHA match the offer? Unless it's SAS, they're likely getting a steal at the MLE, which I don't know that Washington would sign. He's at a sweet spot of "only" having to give up about 4M if he signs his 8M QO vs. the NTMLE, but with the unrestricted free agent rights next summer. Sure, if SAS offered 4/80 or so he probably signs, and now the decision is CHA's, but I don't think there's any world where the MLE gets him to sign and/or not get immediately matched.

S&T for Ant, though... Ant's 24,107,143 cap hit means they can sign and trade PJ for $19,205,714 starting salary, or 4yr/82.8M, straight up. Reduces our cap number by 4.9M and balances the roster a bit.

 

[Mediocre Man]

When the goal is to develop and not win the next couple years, you start Scoot, Ant, and Sharpe together. It's not ideal long-term but the Blazers should see if Ant can up his production and his trade value before they try to cash in.

I guess I’d rather have Sharpe at his natural position than playing out of position

 

[BonesJones]

I guess I’d rather have Sharpe at his natural position than playing out of position

I would too, but that would require limiting Ant or Scoot, and that doesn't make sense to me. Let Ant start and play his way into having better trade value and then trade him at the deadline. Sharpe can still get some SG minutes:
Scoot (34) / Simons (12)
Simons (24) / Sharpe (24)
Sharpe (12) / Thybulle (24) / Rupert (12)

Would've rather just given Rupert more minutes and see if Nas can take a step if he can get healthy (very unlikely but why not).

 

[BLAZINGGIANTS]

I would too, but that would require limiting Ant or Scoot, and that doesn't make sense to me. Let Ant start and play his way into having better trade value and then trade him at the deadline. Sharpe can still get some SG minutes:
Scoot (34) / Simons (12) - Who gets the other two minutes?
Simons (24) / Sharpe (24)
Sharpe (12) / Thybulle (24) / Rupert (12)

Would've rather just given Rupert more minutes and see if Nas can take a step if he can get healthy (very unlikely but why not).

 

[BonesJones]

My B. You can add those 2 anywhere you want to.

 

[Mediocre Man]

I would too, but that would require limiting Ant or Scoot, and that doesn't make sense to me. Let Ant start and play his way into having better trade value and then trade him at the deadline. Sharpe can still get some SG minutes:
Scoot (34) / Simons (12)
Simons (24) / Sharpe (24)
Sharpe (12) / Thybulle (24) / Rupert (12)

Would've rather just given Rupert more minutes and see if Nas can take a step if he can get healthy (very unlikely but why not).

That makes sense, but why would his value go up? He’s had two years of good offensive basketball.

 

[STOMP]

That makes sense, but why would his value go up? He’s had two years of good offensive basketball.

Like most scorers, I think he's better playing on the ball then off. With Dame gone, he'll have the opportunity to be the lead much more often. We shall see, but especially if the plan is to profile him for a trade I'd start him at PG with Sharpe at SG. If the plan is to have these 3 guards be the future, I see him as the best option coming off the bench as the 6th man.

STOMP