Merged: 2pm KP and Larry Miller Press Conference

[maxiep]

Looking over all of the comments at Blazersedge.com on this story I stumbled across a bit from Norsktroll and somebody else that I can't quite remember, but they were both pretty certain that Mark Warkentien is the man driving this smear campaign and that A-Woj is 'his boy' (their words, not mine) ... in that context (if it's true) then Wojnawrowski's long running feud with KP and Warkentien having ties to guys like Jaynes, Vance, etc. from his time under Bob Whittsitt starts to make a lot more sense.

Hell, Jason Quick almost calls out Warkentien by name here:
http://blog.oregonlive.com/behindblazersbeat/2010/03/blazers_insider_vulcan_logic_h.html



Ultimately I think KP has made some mistakes, but there seems to be some serious Machiavellian shit going on right now behind the scenes. I think it's highly likely that Warkentien covets the Blazers job and probably feels like he has an inside track back into the organization if KP is forced out, especially since the Nuggets seem to have balked at giving him an extension.

There is a member of the Nuggets coaching staff with whom I'm friendly. That person refers to Warkentien as a "prick".

 

[KingSpeed]

Re: 2pm KP and Larry Miller Press Conference

You know, I want to wait on LMA to prove himself as well.

He hasn't really done as much this season.

But during the playoffs last year, he was 19/7.5 playing against a very tough and physical Rockets team.

He proved himself as the second option then.

I'm going to wait until the playoffs this year before I make a final judgment.

LMA is a solid second option and when Roy was out, he led us in scoring. People take him for granted. All Star? No. Solid second option for us? Yes.

 

[oldmangrouch]

Looking over all of the comments at Blazersedge.com on this story I stumbled across a bit from Norsktroll and somebody else that I can't quite remember, but they were both pretty certain that Mark Warkentien is the man driving this smear campaign and that A-Woj is 'his boy' (their words, not mine) ... in that context (if it's true) then Wojnawrowski's long running feud with KP and Warkentien having ties to guys like Jaynes, Vance, etc. from his time under Bob Whittsitt starts to make a lot more sense.

Hell, Jason Quick almost calls out Warkentien by name here:
http://blog.oregonlive.com/behindblazersbeat/2010/03/blazers_insider_vulcan_logic_h.html



Ultimately I think KP has made some mistakes, but there seems to be some serious Machiavellian shit going on right now behind the scenes. I think it's highly likely that Warkentien covets the Blazers job and probably feels like he has an inside track back into the organization if KP is forced out, especially since the Nuggets seem to have balked at giving him an extension.

Up to a point, I can understand Warkentien's bitterness. By all accounts, he was a valuable employee for the Blazers, but he just couldn't stomach working for John Nash. If he had hung in for another year, or if the Blazers had gotten off their duffs and fired Nash a year earlier, Warkentien would likely be the Blazer GM right now.

Instead, his former subordinate just falls into the job, and becomes a hero to the fans. The problem is, he is directing his wrath at KP, not the people who screwed him over.

 

[maxiep]

Jesus, what the fuck is wrong with the people at Vulcan? I've dealt with their RE group and they're idiots. It seems the folks on the sports side are no better. Whether or not all the shit said about Pritchard is true (and I don't believe it is), this is a clusterfuck of the first order. The timing, the lack of control over the message, the words coming from management and the awkward "press conference", everything.

Way to prepare a team for the playoffs, gang. Great fucking job.

 

[maxiep]

Up to a point, I can understand Warkentien's bitterness. By all accounts, he was a valuable employee for the Blazers, but he just couldn't stomach working for John Nash. If he had hung in for another year, or if the Blazers had gotten off their duffs and fired Nash a year earlier, Warkentien would likely be the Blazer GM right now.

Instead, his former subordinate just falls into the job, and becomes a hero to the fans. The problem is, he is directing his wrath at KP, not the people who screwed him over.

And Wark is the anti-Pritchard. Like Trader Bob, he's no chemistry major. Working for the Thuggets by most accounts isn't much fun. As for the players he covets, I've rooted for enough d-bags wearing the Scarlet & Black. Just say no to Whitsitt, Jr.

 

[Cake]

Re: 2pm KP and Larry Miller Press Conference

Under the current collective bargaining agreement, sure.

What if there's a $50m hard cap implemented, with grandfathered salaries but phased in over five years?

No teams COULD take on a $10m or $13m contract, even if they wanted to.

Will the CBA be that restrictive? Probably not. But the Blazers, by extending the players without accounting for the likelihood that there will be a significant change, are setting themselves up to have been painted into a serious corner. And... for what?

Ed O.

Well...because if they assumed the worst, that there will be some ridiculously restrictive salary cap, then they wouldn't have any talent at all.

 

[illmatic99]

What's most disturbing in all this is how Larry Miller tried as hard as he could to NOT back KP.

 

[maxiep]

What's most disturbing in all this is how Larry Miller tried as hard as he could to NOT back KP.

Exactly. What did KP do to him? Did he tell him that he didn't like 70s retread soul bands for opening night?

 

[illmatic99]

For every WarkenWoj dish on KP, you have another anonymous source vouching for him: http://www.beyondthebeat.net/20100323452/2010-articles/march/source-stop-qhatingq-on-pritchard.html

“All Kevin has done since joining Portland is help re-make them from a laughing stock in the league to a team other front offices emulate. If you don’t care for the way he goes about his business, that’s your problem. That’s not his. That doesn’t make it alright to beat the guy when he’s obviously going through a difficult time.”

While Pritchard gained support, there remains growing concern that his departure from the Blazers simply doesn’t bode well for Portland.

“It would be a massive mistake to let him walk,” the source continued.

“We are talking about setting the franchise back a couple years here. Really. Plenty of teams around the league will be paying close attention to see what happens this summer in Portland with their front office. He won’t be out of a job long. So why not retain him?

More @ link.

 

[blue32]

why is KP on the chopping block? I am so confused. I thought the presser was about TP, not KP?

And why is there this speculation about moving the team to seattle?

can someone help a dude out ?

gracias.

 

[UKRAINEFAN]

This reminds me a little bit of a situation with the Cleveland Indians a few years back. Their manger Charlie Manuel got some information the GM wasn't happy with his work. So he went to the gm and asked if he was gonna be fired. And the GM said "No, but we are going to interview candidates (including Manuel) at the end of the season". And so Manuel quit because he didn't want to work for someone who didn't have confidence in him. Of course he went on to manage the Phillies to two world series appearances. I almost wish Pritchard would do that because I really think he has been done wrong.

Here's some opinion from Dave at Blazer's Edge and I agree:

The most head-slapping, incredulity-evoking example came from Larry Miller when he said:

"I'm as surprised as you guys are that all this stuff came out of [the Penn firing]."

Let me offer a simple quote in response: What?!?

* You whack a guy publicly and dramatically
* You know his agent is a rabble-rouser
* You know his agent is your GM's agent
* You know your team has had turmoil internally that is both festering and heretofore unknown to the public (and thus bombshell material)
* You spent years in an adversarial and invasive relationship with the media

Yet you're surprised that anyone's bothering to ask about the huge fireworks display all of this is creating? If you dress up in green and crimson, walk into a circular ring in Mexico, and start waving a cape it probably shouldn't surprise you that some kind of cattle charge ensues. How could you not talk about all of this before you fired Tom Penn?

In order to be surprised by all of this you have to be woefully unaware of your environment: media, fans, even your own organization. And see, this is the part that makes the hairs on the back of my neck stand up. The Blazers are no stranger to being disconnected from their environment. It already brought the franchise and this city to the brink of divorce once. It certainly brought this franchise and the media to blows. We all assumed that we had a fresh start once the Jailblazer era was over. But the roots of that era didn't rest with the players or their actions. The deepest roots rested within the organization itself...precisely the kind of disconnect that this chain of events hearkens to. This has nothing to do with the fitness of Penn or Pritchard or anyone else. It has to do with a franchise where relationships that progress normally in other places--for good or ill--become this here. It has to do with this happening in multiple eras, across multiple executives, in multiple situations. It has to do with a franchise that cannot get out of its own way enough to let its followers love it.

http://www.blazersedge.com/

 

[RR7]

Loved the article by Quick this morning, knocking both Woj and Wark. Fuck them both. And Fuck Vulcan if they listen to the two of them.

 

[STOMP]

Well, if that's the case, I certainly don't mind having U-25 players like Roy and Aldridge locked up. Even with that, from what I've read, the owners are pushing to have all current contracts voided in the new CBA. That should make this summer VERY interesting considering the FA class, eh?

So, what's your point?

Considering the state of the economy, the expiring CBA and where things project, Portland absolutely paid full price/top dollar for the honor of extending Roy and LA. Management's actions were as if they had zero leverage when in fact they had quite a bit. If they'd allowed them to play out another year and become RFA's they could have matched any offer that they might have received from another club... and any offer from another club would have been less then what they got + the two players wouldn't have the extra security. All management really risked by doing so was catching flack from a bunch of Blazer fans for a year.

That they overpaid was pretty obvious to many of us here... Ed was hardly alone in noting this at the time those deals were signed. What made me especially uncomfortable was that this would leave less dollars available under the lux tax line for resigning Greg, Batum, Bayless, Rudy, etc... I didn't feel that BR & LA's talents were so great that they could drag just anyone to championships. I can recall Ed saying similar things when Zach and Theo were extended against a tide of cheers from the board... I was with him then too

Hanging one's hopes that current deals are going to be voided is pie in the sky nonsense.

STOMP

 

[mook]

Jesus, what the fuck is wrong with the people at Vulcan? I've dealt with their RE group and they're idiots. It seems the folks on the sports side are no better. Whether or not all the shit said about Pritchard is true (and I don't believe it is), this is a clusterfuck of the first order. The timing, the lack of control over the message, the words coming from management and the awkward "press conference", everything.

Way to prepare a team for the playoffs, gang. Great fucking job.

Well said.

It's insane that this kind of distraction is coming up now, just when the team is fighting for playoff position. I mean jesus, there are 10 other months of the year they could be doing this shit...

Every player on the Blazers' team owes their employment in Portland directly to a Pritchard decision. I want our team to be thinking about the next game and the playoffs, not whether their boss is getting fired. This kind of crap shouldn't impact on-court play, but why the hell is management even risking it?

Man, if Pritchard is indeed dumped, I want to see the guy who fires him come up with a better replacement. Because I look around the NBA and I don't see a lot of better prospects out there.

 

[OSUBlazerfan]

Although I dont always agree with KP....

The guy NEEDS to stay. What the hell is wrong with these people making decisions

Near the end of what had been a long Monday for Kevin Pritchard, the suddenly embattled Trail Blazers general manager found solace in a note passed on to him from his church pastor:

Conflict is inevitable.

Misery is a choice.

Choose peace.

"I'm choosing peace," Pritchard said softly late Monday night. "It's going to be all right. It's going to be all right."

 

[BGrantFan]

Re: 2pm KP and Larry Miller Press Conference

LMA is a solid second option and when Roy was out, he led us in scoring. People take him for granted. All Star? No. Solid second option for us? Yes.

Aldridge averaged 20/10 on >50% shooting when Roy was out. If anything, Andre Miller needs to shoot less and get Aldridge the ball more often. It's hard for me to bitch about Aldridge when his PG is taking more shots than he gets in many games.

 

[OSUBlazerfan]

Re: 2pm KP and Larry Miller Press Conference

Aldridge averaged 20/10 on >50% shooting when Roy was out. If anything, Andre Miller needs to shoot less and get Aldridge the ball more often. It's hard for me to bitch about Aldridge when his PG is taking more shots than he gets in many games.

Thats an Aldridge (maybe nate) problem not a Miller problem

 

[BGrantFan]

Hanging one's hopes that current deals are going to be voided is pie in the sky nonsense.

STOMP

I never "hanged my hopes" that the current deals would be voided. I merely pointed out that the latest that I've read says that the owners will want current deals to be voided after the CBA expires.

So ... you basically wasted your time writing that nonsense to me. I don't think the Blazers overpaid for Roy. You do. Oh well.

 

[BGrantFan]

Re: 2pm KP and Larry Miller Press Conference

Thats an Aldridge (maybe nate) problem not a Miller problem

How is not get enough touches Aldridge's fault?

 

[OSUBlazerfan]

Re: 2pm KP and Larry Miller Press Conference

How is not get enough touches Aldridge's fault?

Because he disapears in the 4th quarter, and he is a choker. He gets plenty of touches in the first quarter. why? because he is assertive in the 1st, and makes shots in the first.

He gets lost as the game goes on and his rep as a choker is well deserved

 

[BGrantFan]

Re: 2pm KP and Larry Miller Press Conference

Because he disapears in the 4th quarter, and he is a choker. He gets plenty of touches in the first quarter. why? because he is assertive in the 1st, and makes shots in the first.

He gets lost as the game goes on and his rep as a choker is well deserved

When did he get a rep as a choker? I must have missed that day.

 

[Trader Ed]

Re: 2pm KP and Larry Miller Press Conference

Considering Aldridge's stagnation this season, I agree with your second statement. Even at the time, I thought it might be a slight overpay, but worth it to lock in certainty. Now I think it was a significant overpay.

I don't think the team overpaid for Roy. I think he's legitimately a max-level player and any of the cap room teams that lost out on James or Wade would have been willing to max out Roy this summer.

Unfortunately we have been caught up in this mess before and seemingly have not learned our lesson. Randolph, Miles, Roy, Aldridge

Players who deserve big contracts and teh treat of them getting big money elsewhere ahs led us to over pay for their services to make them happy and stay. It has ended up handcuffing us in the coming years.

PA is to blame too... no contract gets done unless he signs off on it. Its his money and his team. He is too much a hands on owner to not be in the loop. He is also a fan and love his Blazers, and is very passionate about them. He wants his players he enjoys. Miles was a big example of that. Darius was getting better and got a huge raise at the right time, mostly due to PA liking him so much. Zach was all about timing in the FA market.

Roy shoud be a max player, LMA maybe 90-95% of it IMHO.

The new CBA will hamper many teams if it comes close to any of its desires by the owners. The owners need to have some leverage IMHO. The players should not always be willing to take the money when its good, and not give it u when its bad. Aka Mr Deeks movie when he is dealing with his star QB.

Simple business... you want a raise when its good? Are you willing to take a pay cut when its bad? Noooo you just want the raise...

 

[Crimson the Cat]

Just finished my morning cup of coffee. It's time for what will be my daily shout out to the suits up north.

Fuck you Paul Allen and the Vulcans. You've found yet another bright way to fuck up this team. Bravo, bravo.

 

[Pinwheel1]

Well said.

It's insane that this kind of distraction is coming up now, just when the team is fighting for playoff position. I mean jesus, there are 10 other months of the year they could be doing this shit...

Every player on the Blazers' team owes their employment in Portland directly to a Pritchard decision. I want our team to be thinking about the next game and the playoffs, not whether their boss is getting fired. This kind of crap shouldn't impact on-court play, but why the hell is management even risking it?

Man, if Pritchard is indeed dumped, I want to see the guy who fires him come up with a better replacement. Because I look around the NBA and I don't see a lot of better prospects out there.

Playing devil's advocate.......If Penn was actively searching for another job with another franchise while the Blazers were in the stretch run of the season, then he deserved to be canned immediately. (IF THIS WAS THE CASE) Again the Agent made this about KP, not the Blazers. Sure they should have handled it better, but if the guy deserved to fired now, you don't wait. And even though we want to know why he was fired, it is the right thing to do to not to tell the world. For respect to Penn (And for lawsuite purposes)

 

[BGrantFan]

Playing devil's advocate.......If Penn was actively searching for another job with another franchise while the Blazers were in the stretch run of the season, then he deserved to be canned immediately. (IF THIS WAS THE CASE) Again the Agent made this about KP, not the Blazers. Sure they should have handled it better, but if the guy deserved to fired now, you don't wait. And even though we want to know why he was fired, it is the right thing to do to not to tell the world. For respect to Penn (And for lawsuite purposes)

Do you think this tension started the minute Penn was fired? I don't. I think Pritchard has been getting more and more frustrated as the season has progressed. His agent finally went public with the situation, and Pritchard not firing him means that Pritchard supports what his agent said.

Pritchard won't be coming back. I just don't see how it is possible at this point.

 

[Crimson the Cat]

Playing devil's advocate.......If Penn was actively searching for another job with another franchise while the Blazers were in the stretch run of the season, then he deserved to be canned immediately. (IF THIS WAS THE CASE) Again the Agent made this about KP, not the Blazers. Sure they should have handled it better, but if the guy deserved to fired now, you don't wait. And even though we want to know why he was fired, it is the right thing to do to not to tell the world. For respect to Penn (And for lawsuite purposes)

But is it really that sinister, what Penn supposedly did? I can't say I wouldn't be keeping an open ear for other advancement/money-making opportunities as well. Business is business. As long as he was doing his job and not revealing any damaging team secrets, I'm not certain management handled this correctly. And then, to allow it to escalate to this point, is beyond fucked up.

 

[Pinwheel1]

Do you think this tension started the minute Penn was fired? I don't. I think Pritchard has been getting more and more frustrated as the season has progressed. His agent finally went public with the situation, and Pritchard not firing him means that Pritchard supports what his agent said.

Pritchard won't be coming back. I just don't see how it is possible at this point.

No I don't but that is not the point. People are wondering "why now". And the answer is tied to what Penn was fired for. KP's issues should not be public right now. But it was.... due to his agent. Not the Blazers. The Blazer may or may not be at fault for KP's unhappiness, but the timing is the agents fault. (IF and only IF Penn was fired for just cause)

 

[BGrantFan]

No I don't but that is not the point. People are wondering "why now". And the answer is tied to what Penn was fired for. KP's issues should not be public right now. But it was.... due to his agent. Not the Blazers. The Blazer may or may not be at fault for KP's unhappiness, but the timing is the agents fault. (IF and only IF Penn was fired for just cause)

As I've previously posted, though, if Pritchard didn't like his agent pulling him into it, he would have distanced himself from the agent and the agent's comments. Since he has not, I can only assume that Penn's firing was some sort of Vulcan message to Pritchard, and that Pritchard and his agent know it, so they played the only card they had; Pritchard's popularity in the Blazer fanbase vs. a Vulcan organization that has already ruined the franchise once.

I have literally no trust for Vulcan Inc., so I have to admit that my opinion is going to be pro-Pritchard in its origin. From there, the available information seems to say that Pritchard is not long for Portland, and that we'll have a new GM by the draft.

 

[mook]

Playing devil's advocate.......If Penn was actively searching for another job with another franchise while the Blazers were in the stretch run of the season, then he deserved to be canned immediately. (IF THIS WAS THE CASE) Again the Agent made this about KP, not the Blazers. Sure they should have handled it better, but if the guy deserved to fired now, you don't wait. And even though we want to know why he was fired, it is the right thing to do to not to tell the world. For respect to Penn (And for lawsuite purposes)

If I were running the show and what you described happened, I'd "transition Penn to a new opportunity in the organization" being vice president of negotiating soda contracts with the Rose Garden or some other bullshit job. Fire him after the season is over.

When they tried to whack the Don, did Michael run out and immediately escalate a gang war when the Corleones were at their weakest? Or did he negotiate a truce, let people let their guard down, and then eliminate all of his enemies in one fell swoop at the time of his choosing?

You don't make moves that might undermine the GM's authority and distract the team in the middle of a playoff push. You put on your business face, let the players take the headlines (as they should), and wait for a week after the season's over to make your transition.

Even if you have to absolutely fire Penn (I can't see it, but I'll play along) you immediately come out fully endorsing Pritchard. Even if you plan on canning his ass in two months. That's just how it's done.

 

[The_Lillard_King]

If I were running the show and what you described happened, I'd "transition Penn to a new opportunity in the organization" being vice president of negotiating soda contracts with the Rose Garden or some other bullshit job. Fire him after the season is over.

When they tried to whack the Don, did Michael run out and immediately escalate a gang war when the Corleones were at their weakest? Or did he negotiate a truce, let people let their guard down, and then eliminate all of his enemies in one fell swoop at the time of his choosing?

You don't make moves that might undermine the GM's authority and distract the team in the middle of a playoff push. You put on your business face, let the players take the headlines (as they should), and wait for a week after the season's over to make your transition.

Even if you have to absolutely fire Penn (I can't see it, but I'll play along) you immediately come out fully endorsing Pritchard. Even if you plan on canning his ass in two months. That's just how it's done.

But if you are PA (one of the wealthest people in the US and fighting cancer), do you really have to play by corporate rules?

There are so many rumors out there . . . but if the rumor that Penn got into a yelling match with Miller and called PA a liar to his face is true, I would think PA is in a position to fire Penn and not have to explain himself to anyone.

In fact if I was the boss cutting the checks, and I was pissed at Penn, I would expect the GM to come and back me up with "I like Penn, he is a good friend, but this was an organizational decision and I support the organization"

I wonder if PA will come out and publically support KP . . . but I have had my run in with big egos and the more PA feels like he is forced to do this, the less likely he will do it.

This had nothing to do with KP. The agent makes a mess of the Penn firing by dragging in KP and now PA has to go in and clean up the agent's mess to make KP feel good?