Merged: Hinrich to PDX Discussed?

[Stepping Razor]

Re: Hinrich to PDX Discussed?

The Bulls are $1M under the LT threshold and have said for years they'd never go over it. If they ship out Hinrich at $9M-$9.5M, taking Boozer back at $12M doesn't make any sense.

If they take back Boozer and give up Kirk + Thomas, they'd have about $4M-$5M in breathing room to do a little dealing. However, their guard rotation minus Kirk would be Rose and Salmons and nobody else. And they're all of a sudden really heavy in the front court with Deng+Boozer+Noah+Miller and the two draft picks.

There was a small rumor of interest by the Bulls in Iverson. He could probably be had for that $4M-$5M and the Bulls could reasonably give him a lot of PT that he might not get elsewhere. I don't see AI as Paxson's kind of guy though - the opposite, in fact.

The alternative is to keep Hinrich and do nothing. After the season, they have Jerome James ($6M), Tim Thomas ($6.5M), and Brad Miller ($12M+) coming off the books for $25M more room. If they renounce Tyrus Thomas ($6.5M) instead of giving him a QO, that's even more space. They get to give Thomas another year to prove himself or the option of losing him (as in your proposed deal) while having the cap space to sign Boozer and LeBron in 2010 (or pick 2 max UFAs).

What do you think their strategy would be?

Interesting, thanks. If I was them, I probably wouldn't do this, then, unless I somehow had already lined up a one-year deal for Iverson or something along those lines. Or, I guess, unless I *really* liked Carlos Boozer.

SR

 

[Nikolokolus]

Re: Hinrich to PDX Discussed?

My guess is that if KP really wants Hinrich the Blazers had better be prepared to include Rudy in the talks -- even with some wacky 3 or 4 way deal the Bulls are going to need a guard coming back to them.

Would I do it? Yeah probably, but then again I don't esteem Rudy nearly as highly as most people around here and I think he's a short term guy in Portland.

 

[Masbee]

Re: Hinrich to PDX Discussed?

The Bulls are $1M under the LT threshold and have said for years they'd never go over it. If they ship out Hinrich at $9M-$9.5M, taking Boozer back at $12M doesn't make any sense.

If they take back Boozer and give up Kirk + Thomas, they'd have about $4M-$5M in breathing room to do a little dealing. However, their guard rotation minus Kirk would be Rose and Salmons and nobody else. And they're all of a sudden really heavy in the front court with Deng+Boozer+Noah+Miller and the two draft picks.

There was a small rumor of interest by the Bulls in Iverson. He could probably be had for that $4M-$5M and the Bulls could reasonably give him a lot of PT that he might not get elsewhere. I don't see AI as Paxson's kind of guy though - the opposite, in fact.

The alternative is to keep Hinrich and do nothing. After the season, they have Jerome James ($6M), Tim Thomas ($6.5M), and Brad Miller ($12M+) coming off the books for $25M more room. If they renounce Tyrus Thomas ($6.5M) instead of giving him a QO, that's even more space. They get to give Thomas another year to prove himself or the option of losing him (as in your proposed deal) while having the cap space to sign Boozer and LeBron in 2010 (or pick 2 max UFAs).

What do you think their strategy would be?

Probably to sit on their ass and watch all the top players pass them by. Same as they have been doing for years.

If they want to get after it, they need to take some chances.

This amazing fascination that Chicago has for stockpiling a platoon's worth of average players is kinda funny.

I don't understand your point about 2010 cap space.

If they send out matching salaries in the deal for Boozer, wouldn't they have more or less similar cap room doing the deal?

It is not like they are sending out one of their ending contracts in the deal.

 

[Natebishop3]

Re: Hinrich to PDX Discussed?

My guess is that if KP really wants Hinrich the Blazers had better be prepared to include Rudy in the talks -- even with some wacky 3 or 4 way deal the Bulls are going to need a guard coming back to them.

Would I do it? Yeah probably, but then again I don't esteem Rudy nearly as highly as most people around here and I think he's a short term guy in Portland.

That's why I think a Outlaw/Blake deal is much more realistic for Chicago. They get a backup point guard making backup point guard money and another scorer to replace Ben Gordon, both of whom will be free agents next summer. Makes much more sense than us taking the cap hit for Utah and trading it to the Bulls for Hinrich.

I'm really hoping we can just sign Odom and trade for Hinrich. I would feel really good about this offseason if we accomplished those two things. Forget Lee.

 

[Masbee]

Re: Hinrich to PDX Discussed?

My guess is that if KP really wants Hinrich the Blazers had better be prepared to include Rudy in the talks -- even with some wacky 3 or 4 way deal the Bulls are going to need a guard coming back to them.

Would I do it? Yeah probably, but then again I don't esteem Rudy nearly as highly as most people around here and I think he's a short term guy in Portland.

I call Horseshit.

Rudy is worth Hinrich straight up.

"Add" Rudy.

I don't think so.

 

[hasoos]

Re: Hinrich to PDX Discussed?

Talk talk talk. Nothing is going to happen. Just like the trade deadline, just like before and during the draft. If any deals were going to have been made, they would have been made. I don't think teams will be too much in the mood to be considering trades until they have evaluated the teams when the season starts.

 

[Masbee]

Re: Hinrich to PDX Discussed?

That's why I think a Outlaw/Blake deal is much more realistic for Chicago. They get a backup point guard making backup point guard money and another scorer to replace Ben Gordon, both of whom will be free agents next summer. Makes much more sense than us taking the cap hit for Utah and trading it to the Bulls for Hinrich.

I'm really hoping we can just sign Odom and trade for Hinrich. I would feel really good about this offseason if we accomplished those two things. Forget Lee.

"Realistic".

20 - 10.

Post offense.

Which part of Blake and Outlaw provides any of that.

Any of it.

Guys like Boozer don't come in mass quantities. Either Chicago wants it or they don't. If they want it, THEY are the ones that have to pay. Not Portland. Not Utah. Chicago gets - by far - the best player in the deal.

 

[Natebishop3]

Re: Hinrich to PDX Discussed?

Talk talk talk. Nothing is going to happen. Just like the trade deadline, just like before and during the draft. If any deals were going to have been made, they would have been made. I don't think teams will be too much in the mood to be considering trades until they have evaluated the teams when the season starts.

Actually, it's the opposite.... we're doing all this talking, but nothing can actually be done until the 8th(?) or was it the 9th... anyway.... we're in the moratorium right now, so all we CAN do is talk.

 

[Natebishop3]

Re: Hinrich to PDX Discussed?

"Realistic".

20 - 10.

Post offense.

Which part of Blake and Outlaw provides any of that.

Any of it.

Guys like Boozer don't come in mass quantities. Either Chicago wants it or they don't. If they want it, THEY are the ones that have to pay. Not Portland. Not Utah. Chicago gets - by far - the best player in the deal.

I meant realistic between the Bulls and the Blazers. We do that deal and we still have a logjam at point guard and small forward. Blake/Outlaw for Hinrich meets the needs of both teams, therefor I believe it's a more realistic trade. If they truly want Boozer then I guess the Blazers need to decide if the trade is realistic for them.

 

[hasoos]

Re: Hinrich to PDX Discussed?

Actually, it's the opposite.... we're doing all this talking, but nothing can actually be done until the 8th(?) or was it the 9th... anyway.... we're in the moratorium right now, so all we CAN do is talk.

I do and I don't when I think about it. In one regard, Portland is still offering the same stuff they have offered over the last year because no personnel has changed. So our offers are still the same old offers. But there are a few teams that are going to have to shave salary in order to keep players, or just for the sake of shaving salary. So I can see that angle as making them motivated. The thing is, I don't see any of those guys having anything were "shopping for" now. So that being said, maybe Portland gets involved in a 3 way being the relief valve for somebody. But as for Portland going after the "Gerald Wallace's" of the league, they are really still only offering the same deal they offered last year, so that hasn't changed.

 

[Minstrel]

Re: Hinrich to PDX Discussed?

I wonder if Charlotte would be interested in Boozer. It seems like Boozer would be a nice fit along Okafor. The two together would give Charlotte excellent rebounding, Boozer would give them inside offense that they lack and Okafor makes up for Boozer's defensive deficiencies to some extent.

Getting Wallace out of Charlotte would be pretty nice.

 

[Denny Crane]

Re: Hinrich to PDX Discussed?

Probably to sit on their ass and watch all the top players pass them by. Same as they have been doing for years.

If they want to get after it, they need to take some chances.

This amazing fascination that Chicago has for stockpiling a platoon's worth of average players is kinda funny.

I don't understand your point about 2010 cap space.

If they send out matching salaries in the deal for Boozer, wouldn't they have more or less similar cap room doing the deal?

It is not like they are sending out one of their ending contracts in the deal.

Thomas is an ending contract if they renounce him after the season. As #4 pick, his salary is basically $6.5M coming off the books.

I suppose if they let Boozer walk, they'd have the cap space to sign almost 3 max UFAs. I'm assuming they'd deal for him if he agrees to an extension.

It'd be ironic if Paxson could figure out a way to screw over Boozer to make up for Boozer screwing over Paxson's brother (and ex-Blazer I add) John Paxson when he was GM of Cleveland.

 

[Natebishop3]

Re: Hinrich to PDX Discussed?

I wonder if Charlotte would be interested in Boozer. It seems like Boozer would be a nice fit along Okafor. The two together would give Charlotte excellent rebounding, Boozer would give them inside offense that they lack and Okafor makes up for Boozer's defensive deficiencies to some extent.

Getting Wallace out of Charlotte would be pretty nice.

I would be much more supportive of THAT deal, but someone would still have to go to Utah to make that work. If Boozer makes around 12 million, and we only have 8-9 million in cap space, then we still have to make up the three million.

I would LOVE to see a Boozer for Wallace deal, and then trade Blake and Outlaw for Hinrich.

 

[Denny Crane]

Re: Hinrich to PDX Discussed?

I would be much more supportive of THAT deal, but someone would still have to go to Utah to make that work. If Boozer makes around 12 million, and we only have 8-9 million in cap space, then we still have to make up the three million.

I would LOVE to see a Boozer for Wallace deal, and then trade Blake and Outlaw for Hinrich.

Why do we want Blake and Outlaw when you guys basically admit Hinrich is the better guy. It's a downgrade for us and we have no need for Outlaw.

 

[Minstrel]

Re: Hinrich to PDX Discussed?

I would be much more supportive of THAT deal, but someone would still have to go to Utah to make that work. If Boozer makes around 12 million, and we only have 8-9 million in cap space, then we still have to make up the three million.

$3 million in cash and a second-round pick (the pick thrown in because I don't think you can do a straight-cash deal, but I may well be wrong on that)?

Can you use cap space to make up the difference between the max $3 million cash considerations and a $12 million contract?

 

[Draco]

Re: Hinrich to PDX Discussed?

Why do we want Blake and Outlaw when you guys basically admit Hinrich is the better guy. It's a downgrade for us and we have no need for Outlaw.

Chicago doesn't want anything to do with it, Blazer fans do.

 

[Mediocre Man]

Re: Hinrich to PDX Discussed?

Why do we want Blake and Outlaw when you guys basically admit Hinrich is the better guy. It's a downgrade for us and we have no need for Outlaw.

Expiring contract would be the only reaso I can think of?

 

[maxiep]

Re: Hinrich to PDX Discussed?

The Bulls are $1M under the LT threshold and have said for years they'd never go over it. If they ship out Hinrich at $9M-$9.5M, taking Boozer back at $12M doesn't make any sense.

If they take back Boozer and give up Kirk + Thomas, they'd have about $4M-$5M in breathing room to do a little dealing. However, their guard rotation minus Kirk would be Rose and Salmons and nobody else. And they're all of a sudden really heavy in the front court with Deng+Boozer+Noah+Miller and the two draft picks.

There was a small rumor of interest by the Bulls in Iverson. He could probably be had for that $4M-$5M and the Bulls could reasonably give him a lot of PT that he might not get elsewhere. I don't see AI as Paxson's kind of guy though - the opposite, in fact.

The alternative is to keep Hinrich and do nothing. After the season, they have Jerome James ($6M), Tim Thomas ($6.5M), and Brad Miller ($12M+) coming off the books for $25M more room. If they renounce Tyrus Thomas ($6.5M) instead of giving him a QO, that's even more space. They get to give Thomas another year to prove himself or the option of losing him (as in your proposed deal) while having the cap space to sign Boozer and LeBron in 2010 (or pick 2 max UFAs).

What do you think their strategy would be?

I think we'd be sending Chicago Steve Blake.

 

[maxiep]

Re: Hinrich to PDX Discussed?

And for the record for Bulls' fans, Boozer + Blake > Hinrich + Thomas. Both from a salary and talent perspective.

 

[Natebishop3]

Re: Hinrich to PDX Discussed?

Why do we want Blake and Outlaw when you guys basically admit Hinrich is the better guy. It's a downgrade for us and we have no need for Outlaw.

Because Steve Blake is a backup point guard making backup point guard money. Kirk Hinrich is a starting point guard making starting point guard money... playing backup. Of course Hinrich is an upgrade.

 

[GoBlazersGo]

Re: Hinrich to PDX Discussed?

I wonder if Charlotte would be interested in Boozer. It seems like Boozer would be a nice fit along Okafor. The two together would give Charlotte excellent rebounding, Boozer would give them inside offense that they lack and Okafor makes up for Boozer's defensive deficiencies to some extent.

Getting Wallace out of Charlotte would be pretty nice.

I was thinking along the same lines:

- Blake and Outlaw for Hinrich
- Cap-space, filler, and/or picks for Gerald Wallace (in a three-way deal with Utah and Charlotte).

It consolidates the roster a bit, addresses all three of our most immediate weaknesses (starting PG, starting SF, and back-up PF) and leaves us with an absolutely deadly nine-man rotation. Now somebody just needs to work on making the stars align in order to get Utah and Charlotte to play along.

Hinrich / Bayless
Roy / Fernandez
Oden / Przybilla
Wallace / Batum
Aldridge / (Wallace)

 

[Furball]

Re: Hinrich to PDX Discussed?

I don't think Hinrich is going anywhere. I'm pretty sure with Ben Gordon leaving, Hinrich and Rose will be the starting backcourt. Also, I think Boozer is becoming Zack Randolph. This trade doesn't pass the smell test.

 

[BoomChakaLaka]

Re: Hinrich to PDX Discussed?

Talk talk talk. Nothing is going to happen. Just like the trade deadline, just like before and during the draft. If any deals were going to have been made, they would have been made. I don't think teams will be too much in the mood to be considering trades until they have evaluated the teams when the season starts.

If all of this Boozer talk has any legs - then Portland should one-up Utah and sign Millsap to an offer sheet tomorrow!

Put the screws to Utah! Let them have to match - they won't because they'll be paying (essentially) double for Millsap, by being way over the cap. They CAN'T match!

Then, see what Travis/Blake (or Travis/Bayless & Pendergraph) can bring by way of trade for a PG...or G.Wallace.


PS: If a play for Millsap were to work (meaning Utah doesn't match) then Utah get's Pritchslapped! If we've secured Millsap, I say make a huge play for G. Wallace. Travis can then go, but I'd keep Blake in this scenario - go ahead and give up Bayless, Picks, maybe even Webster.

This does leave us "on the hunt" for our PG of the future, I know....but come on, we won't have cap space for decades and we've just solidified one of the top front courts in history: Wallace/Batum - LMA/Millsap - Oden/Pryz.

With Roy, Rudy, Blake, Mills - that is tough.

And in time, we can move Pryz and Blake to get our PG (maybe even at the trade deadline, if necessary).

KP get it done

 

[mook]

Re: Hinrich to PDX Discussed?

Why fart around with Hinrich if we can somehow use Carlos Boozer as a bargaining chip with another team?

Seems to me the obvious trade is to parlay Boozer and, say, Rudy and/or Bayless into Devin Harris.

Gerald Wallace isn't a bad backup plan, but I'd rather consolidate my talent around PG. It's a harder position to acquire talent at, and we already have Batum at SF.

If I'm New Jersey, I think I'd rather have Boozer and Fernandez rather than just Harris. Wins more games, sells more tickets, and probably still keeps them in position for the big free agency next year.

 

[Draco]

Re: Hinrich to PDX Discussed?

Why fart around with Hinrich if we can somehow use Carlos Boozer as a bargaining chip with another team?

Seems to me the obvious trade is to parlay Boozer and, say, Rudy and/or Bayless into Devin Harris.

Gerald Wallace isn't a bad backup plan, but I'd rather consolidate my talent around PG. It's a harder position to acquire talent at, and we already have Batum at SF.

If I'm New Jersey, I think I'd rather have Boozer and Fernandez rather than just Harris. Wins more games, sells more tickets, and probably still keeps them in position for the big free agency next year.

Not a bad line of thinking.

1. Get Utah to trade Boozer for Travis. This uses all our cap space and gives them lux relief and the ability to retain Millsap
2. Trade Boozer, Rudy, Bayless for Harris, Battie, Najera, and Hayes

NJ gets cheap young talent in Rudy/Bayless. They save money this season since we'd be taking more salary back in the trade (but still within 25% trade limit.) They save small amount owed to Najera next season. Boozer is a quality talent that could be resigned if he's a good fit or if not allow them to enter free agency 2010 with a roster full of rookie contracts.

I'm not sure if this would be enough to actually get a deal done, but it is the only line of thinking to a reasonable Harris deal I've seen to date.

 

[SodaPopinski]

Portland/Utah/Chicago three-way trade being discussed?

Sorry if this has been posted in another thread, but I didn't see it anywhere.

95.5 The Game is reporting the Blazers, Jazz and Bulls are discussing a three-way deal. They didn't have all the specifics, but they knew it at least involved Carlos Boozer going to Chicago and Kirk Hinrich going to Portland. It is originating from a Salt Lake sports radio station, and they are trying to track down the details before 9 a.m.

This would likely scrap the Paul Millsap deal and would probably prompt us to sign Brandon Bass.

 

[B-Roy]

Re: Portland/Utah/Chicago three-way trade being discussed?

If this is true then the Jazz are getting PLAYED.

 

[Wheels]

Re: Portland/Utah/Chicago three-way trade being discussed?

what are we giving up?

 

[alex42083]

Re: Portland/Utah/Chicago three-way trade being discussed?

This could be the response to the Millsap offer sheet, or the Millsap offer was a result to Utah not wanting to get this deal done and they're revisiting it. In any case, if the Jazz want to unload Boozer for nothing, it looks like Portland will have to be involved.

 

[Wheels]

Re: Portland/Utah/Chicago three-way trade being discussed?

If this is true then the Jazz are getting PLAYED.

not if their goal is to keep Millsap. They cant find many takers to rent Boozer for a year.