Miami Heat Dame Trade Ideas and Rumors

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Natebishop3 said:
OG is going to be declining at 29?
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Yeah thats normally when players start to decline. Of course there are exceptions like CP3/Steph/Lebron. But theres others like Blake Griffin. An athletic wing that has had major injury concerns like OG might decline even sooner.
 
SharpesTriumph said:
Yeah thats normally when players start to decline. An athletic wing that has had major injury concerns like OG might be sooner.
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I thought the prevailing thought that 29 was peak prime. If 29 is declining than Dame is ancient at 33.
 
Natebishop3 said:
I thought the prevailing thought that 29 was peak prime. If 29 is declining than Dame is ancient at 33.
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Per a Dartmout study its about 27

Taking a look at a larger sample, data also show that most elite NBA players peak around 27-28. The average age of an All-Star player and an MVP is 26.5 and 27.9, respectively. Another analysis examining All-NBA players shows that the average age is 27.7.
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https://sites.dartmouth.edu/sportsanalytics/2021/11/10/peak-age-in-sports/
 
SharpesTriumph said:
Well he'll be 26 on Monday. So thats 7 years younger than Lillard, and 7 years older than Scoot.

Blazers are at least 2-3 years away if not longer. So OG will be declining, likely on a near max type of overpaid contract if he's not hurt again once Scoot/Sharpe are ready to win. Hell he might just leave in free agency to the Spurs or something in 11 months.

I don't think the Blazers need to get an OG level "starter" by giving up multiple unprotected picks. Even one of those picks are worth way more.

OG made sense if the Blazers were trying to win immediately next season with Lillard. Now it doesn't make any sense to give up great assets for him when the Blazers need to rebuild and possibly tank a few more seasons. OG will just get in the way of that.
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Scoot is ready to win now.
He's making passes that teammates need to convert to points now, not in 3 seasons.
If the Blazers get a top-half-of-NBA small forward, why tank?
 
blazerfan11 said:
Scoot is ready to win now.
He's making passes that teammates need to convert to points now, not in 3 seasons.
If the Blazers get a top-half-of-NBA small forward, why tank?
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I'm fine with the Blazers trying to win, and yeah I'm a huge Scoot fan. But I wouldn't give up unprotected picks for non star injury prone forwards. If the Blazers end up exceeding expectations and can try to make the playoffs then great go for it. I'd suspect they are ultimately closer to the tanking side of competing next season until we see otherwise. Scoot won't be able to do everything, and I question a lot of the Blazers frontcourt.
 
Natebishop3 said:
I thought the prevailing thought that 29 was peak prime. If 29 is declining than Dame is ancient at 33.
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Big reason why I thought the contend with Dame idea was always a huge longshot. Only players to lead a team to a title that were older than Dame were MJ/Wilt/Kareem/LBJ. Even with that said I'd have probably traded #3 for Brown or Bridges - but that was it, and that was more something I wanted to do with my heart than the thought it maximized the Blazers chance to best build a title winning team.

Fans always hold on to the ideal of big NBA star names well after their decline.
 
SharpesTriumph said:
I'm fine with the Blazers trying to win, and yeah I'm a huge Scoot fan. But I wouldn't give up unprotected picks for non star injury prone forwards. If the Blazers end up exceeding expectations and can try to make the playoffs then great go for it. I'd suspect they are ultimately closer to the tanking side of competing next season until we see otherwise. Scoot won't be able to do everything, and I question a lot of the Blazers frontcourt.
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Sure, we'd have to see the cost of getting a non-rookie-contract small forward before there's something to compare.
I'm saying in general, if the Blazers can get a solid small forward when Lillard is traded, I'd want to do that as a priority.
I'm against further intentional tanking.
 
RonBrewer said:
I’m on the minority but I still think Ben Simmons can carve out a role. Not sure where it will be
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We need to keep our salary low so we can take bad contracts in exchange for assets like picks. OKC did it right with 35 picks in the next 7 years. 15 of them being 1st rounders.

I would take draft picks to take Ben Simmons. I agree that he could turn his career around. He only has 2 years left anyways. In one year he'll be an asset.
 
AmirIcon said:
We need to keep our salary low so we can take bad contracts in exchange for assets like picks. OKC did it right with 35 picks in the next 7 years. 15 of them being 1st rounders.

I would take draft picks to take Ben Simmons. I agree that he could turn his career around. He only has 2 years left anyways. In one year he'll be an asset.
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May just take a city that loves him.
 
wizenheimer said:
I don't think the problem is OG. He simply doesn't want Ant traded, even for an obvious upgrade
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Yeah I like Ant more than most but I'd trade him for OG. The issue is giving up unprotected picks and Portland not being likely to win anything of significance now with OG. It makes no sense to go that direction if we're rebuilding. Better to hoard picks and not really try our hardest to win. Although if we end up winning more than expected thats great, it just shouldn't be the main goal right now. Winning now should've been the urgent goal if we were building around Dame, not when building around a 19/20 year old backcourt.
 
SharpesTriumph said:
Yeah I like Ant more than most but I'd trade him for OG. The issue is giving up unprotected picks and Portland not being likely to win anything of significance now with OG. It makes no sense to go that direction if we're rebuilding. Better to hoard picks and not really try our hardest to win. Although if we end up winning more than expected thats great, it just shouldn't be the main goal right now. That would've been a type of goal if we were building around Dame.
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That's why I'm thinking about sending the two Miami picks with Ant so it's not our picks.
 
Natebishop3 said:
That's why I'm thinking about sending the two Miami picks with Ant so it's not our picks.
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So if I sell my car for $20k I can spend it all on strippers and blow because its the dealerships money?

I'll have to let my wife know... it wasn't any of our money, it was the dealerships. I wonder what she'll say.
 
SharpesTriumph said:
So if I sell my car for $20k I can spend it all on strippers and blow because its the dealerships money?

I'll have to let my wife know... it wasn't any of our money, it was the dealerships. I wonder what she'll say.
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Who's picks do you think are more valuable? Ours right now or Miamis in 7 years?
 
SharpesTriumph said:
So if I sell my car for $20k I can spend it all on strippers and blow because its the dealerships money?

I'll have to let my wife know... it wasn't any of our money, it was the dealerships. I wonder what she'll say.
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No, I get it.

If we trade our picks then there's no reward for tanking. But if for some bizarre reason Toronto would be willing to trade us OG for Ant and any ole two first rounders, it'd be kinda cool to trade picks we kinda don't think are gonna be any good.
 
Natebishop3 said:
Who's picks do you think are more valuable? Ours right now or Miamis in 7 years?
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I think ours are more valuable, so yeah the trade would be even dumber if you put Portland picks unprotected in the trade instead of Miami. Those are picks you give up for Giannis or a star, maybe Jaylen Brown or Bridges - but certainly not for OG.

But that doesn't mean trading Miami picks makes it a good trade. Miami's picks unprotected in 2028 and 2030 have a ton of value that far out. That franchise has no assets but Bam and few picks to build for those distant years, they could be at the bottom of the NBA. This is how the Celtics got Tatum and Brown without having to tank.

Plus you want to give up Ant? OG is an injury plagued role player that will never be a star and very well might walk for nothing in 11 months. If he doesn't walk he will be on a massive overpaid contract near the max that makes him have very little value. Blazers have no use for his ability to win games next season. That would be a horrible trade.
 
ebott said:
No, I get it.

If we trade our picks then there's no reward for tanking. But if for some bizarre reason Toronto would be willing to trade us OG for Ant and any ole two first rounders, it'd be kinda cool to trade picks we kinda don't think are gonna be any good.
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Why won't the picks be any good?

OKC, the Spurs, Utah, and Denver have a ton of good players or great trade assets that they could be dominant in 5 years. What does Miami have, especially if acquiring Dame? The only thing they have is Bam. They already owe a pick to OKC and would owe 2-3 to us if we do the Dame trade. That won't allow them to build the young talent on their roster in future seasons. They were a playin team this year - its very possible they are in the lottery for some of those future years. That franchise might be a mess at that time.

Big market teams like the Lakers, Bulls, Knicks have been stuck in the lottery for many years. Theres no certainty Miami is going to stay out of it every season for the next 7 years.
 
SharpesTriumph said:
I think ours are more valuable, so yeah the trade would be even dumber if you put Portland picks unprotected in the trade instead of Miami. Those are picks you give up for Giannis or a star, maybe Jaylen Brown or Bridges - but certainly not for OG.

But that doesn't mean trading Miami picks makes it a good trade. Miami's picks unprotected in 2028 and 2030 have a ton of value that far out. That franchise has no assets but Bam and few picks to build for those distant years, they could be at the bottom of the NBA. This is how the Celtics got Tatum and Brown without having to tank.

Plus you want to give up Ant? OG is an injury plagued role player that will never be a star and very well might walk for nothing in 11 months. If he doesn't walk he will be on a massive overpaid contract near the max that makes him have very little value. Blazers have no use for his ability to win games next season. That would be a horrible trade.
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I understand that as a Blazers fan, you may not know this, but....
there is a part of the game called "defense." Blazers are, and have been, last in the league in it, OG is a master of it.
So, yes, OG has some downsides, but defense is why Ant has miniscule trade value around the league, even though he himself is a master of offense.
 
Wizard Mentor said:
I understand that as a Blazers fan, you may not know this, but....
there is a part of the game called "defense." Blazers are, and have been, last in the league in it, OG is a master of it.
So, yes, OG has some downsides, but defense is why Ant has miniscule trade value around the league, even though he himself is a master of offense.
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Do you think the Blazers are going to contend next year or something? Why would we consider giving up unprotected picks for a one year rental of OG's defense. Yeah I'd give up Ant for OG. I wouldn't give up unprotected picks.

Avery Bradley was one of the best defensive guards in the NBA then washed at 27. Defense is one of the first skills that slips as players approach their late 20's.

Maybe in a few years when Sharpe/Scoot are closer to develop the Blazers can trade away picks for a win now elite two way player to contend. They aren't at that point. It would be stupid to trade away picks right now for that type of rental. If the Blazers want defense then just do more moves like acquiring Thybulle for 2nd rounders.

Blazers need to develop talent and acquire first round picks. They don't need to to try and cash in their best chips to immediately contend. They need to slowly build up their chip stack.
 
SharpesTriumph said:
Do you think the Blazers are going to contend next year or something? Why would we consider giving up unprotected picks for a one year rental of OG's defense. Yeah I'd give up Ant for OG. I wouldn't give up unprotected picks.

Avery Bradley was one of the best defensive guards in the NBA then washed at 27. Defense is one of the first skills that slips as players approach their late 20's.

Maybe in a few years when Sharpe/Scoot are closer to develop the Blazers can trade away picks for a win now elite two way player to contend. They aren't at that point. It would be stupid to trade away picks right now for that type of rental. If the Blazers want defense then just do more moves like acquiring Thybulle for 2nd rounders.

Blazers need to develop talent and acquire first round picks. They don't need to to try and cash in their best chips to immediately contend. They need to slowly build up their chip stack.
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I'm not saying what we should or should not do. What I am saying is that you completely ignored OG's good side when making some sort of argument about him.
 
Also the irony that we would acquire the type of forward that Dame wanted in a trade sending Dame out is nuts.

If the Blazers were going to trade Ant and picks for OG wouldn't you have wanted to do that to keep Dame in Portland? Why would you do that move when sending Dame to Miami and rebuilding? It just makes no sense.
 
Wizard Mentor said:
I'm not saying what we should or should not do. What I am saying is that you completely ignored OG's good side when making some sort of argument about him.
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OG is a great defender, probably right below Thybulle. If he was an iron man like Bridges I'd be much more interested in him - but his injuries scare me. Also his massive pending contract makes him have little value. I never said anything bad about his defense or ignored it so I'm not sure why your implying that. If the Blazers could just sign him without giving up unprotected picks I'd much rather have him than Grant/Nurk/Ant/etc.
 
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