Miami Heat Dame Trade Ideas and Rumors (4 Viewers)

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SharpesTriumph said:
Miami needs OKC to accept the 2026 pick unprotected instead of the current protected 2025, then it can happen. It's been reported by national media.
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why are people excited about the contortions necessary for Portland to get a 1st next season that would likely be in the 25-30 range?

I get that people want to squeeze every drop of blood possible from Miami, I'm in favor of it too, but it seems to be a lot of focus on a minor asset. It's a molehill and there are mountains to climb

and there's no reason for OKC to cooperate by giving up draft leverage, without getting something in return.
 
wizenheimer said:
why are people excited about the contortions necessary for Portland to get a 1st next season that would likely be in the 25-30 range?

I get that people want to squeeze every drop of blood possible from Miami, I'm in favor of it too, but it seems to be a lot of focus on a minor asset. It's a molehill and there are mountains to climb

and there's no reason for OKC to cooperate by giving up draft leverage, without getting something in return.
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I would much much much rather have a 2026 pick.
 
Natebishop3 said:
I'm completely stumped as to why Herro seems to have a market...... but Simons did not.

Did we actually try to trade Simons?
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I haven't seen a lot of people around here who thinks Herro has much value.
 
Natebishop3 said:
I'm completely stumped as to why Herro seems to have a market...... but Simons did not.

Did we actually try to trade Simons?
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Simons is going to be the best shooter on the team next season. I have my doubts Cronin did much of anything to trade Ant. If he did, the GM knew he would get laughed at and hung up on.

"hi there Philadelphia, how about Simons/Nurkic and 3 protected 2nd rounders for Embiid??"

.... "LOLOLOL click"
 
Samuel said:
If Herro had value, Ant would have value, and Joe would have made a trade.
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this is a completely different equation. Brooklyn is looking at getting Herro, possibly while dumping Simmons. And all it may cost them is a couple of future 1st's.

meanwhile Ant was welded to #3 and being offered for Bridges, Siakam, and Zion. Portland likely wouldn't have any better luck attaching Herro to #3 than they did Ant
 
I like Simons better than Herro. Ant can score in more ways, play some point, and is cheaper.
Neither is known for their D
 
Natebishop3 said:
Not really. Not for the extra money. They're both shooters and Simons is arguably the better shooter.

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I noticed you didn't highlight the two defensive metrics.

Herro is a much better rebounder; a 9% rebound rate is actually pretty good for a SG. He's a little better passer. Herro was measured 2.25" taller at the combine. He's a year younger. And he's big enough to have some wing versatility...Ant has none

I'd much rather have Herro than Ant. But the reality is I'd rather not have either. They both have some of the same flaws

Pinwheel1 said:
I like Simons better than Herro. Ant can score in more ways, play some point, and is cheaper.
Neither is known for their D
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I'm curious, what are the ways that Ant can score that Herro can't?
 
wizenheimer said:
I noticed you didn't highlight the two defensive metrics.

Herro is a much better rebounder; a 9% rebound rate is actually pretty good for a SG. He's a little better passer. Herro was measured 2.25" taller at the combine. He's a year younger. And he's big enough to have some wing versatility...Ant has none

I'd much rather have Herro than Ant. But the reality is I'd rather not have either. They both have some of the same flaws
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I didn't highlight them because he plays on a really good defensive team. You put that dude on our team and he's a garbage defender, just like Simons.

I also really couldn't care less about rebounding. They're both shooters. That's why teams want them. They shoot the ball. Simons is a better shooter. He can also play the point guard position (not as well as Scoot.) I don't think Herro can do that.
 
Samuel said:
If Herro had value, Ant would have value, and Joe would have made a trade.
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I don't think that follows. Ant has value on the Blazers, and Herro has value on the Blazers. But Ant AND Herro on the team makes one of them less valuable to the Blazers.

I'm sure that some team would have given the Blazers SOMETHING for Simons, but since he is presumably valued by the organization their asking price was probably too rich for other teams.

Of course, I'm making some leaps in addition to the underlying logic, but I find it hard to believe that neither Ant nor Herro have any value to any teams in the NBA other than the ones they are currently on.
 
Natebishop3 said:
I didn't highlight them because he plays on a really good defensive team. You put that dude on our team and he's a garbage defender, just like Simons.

I also really couldn't care less about rebounding. They're both shooters. That's why teams want them. They shoot the ball. Simons is a better shooter. He can also play the point guard position (not as well as Scoot.) I don't think Herro can do that.
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Ant sure hasn't displayed any consistent PG skills in 5 seasons. Herro had a higher assist rate this season, and has a career assist rate advantage over Ant, 18.3% vs 16.1%; higher assists/100-possessions as well. I'd say they are about equal in PG skills, although, IIRC, Herro played some PG at Kentucky and has played some in Miami

I think you're way too dismissive of rebounding. Considering Portland's rebounding issues, I'd much rather have a SG with Herro's 9% rebounding rate, than one with Ant's 4.3% rate, which by the way ranked 189th out of 190 at BBREF qualified player ranking. Two more rebounds a game can make a difference

and I'm pretty sure that the only reason this 3 way trade has legs is because Brooklyn is interested in Herro. If they were getting Ant and Herro was coming to Portland I think they'd bow out of the deal right away

but as I said, I'd much prefer it if Portland had neither player
 
Pinwheel1 said:
I thought the Heat front office was supposed to be pretty good talent evaluators. Here is one pre-draft evaluation: https://nbadraftroom.com/nikola-jovic/
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I’m impressed. After doing a mini dive, I’m coming around on a package from Miami. Not well versed on what picks could top this off but Jovic, Martin, Jaquez and Herro is a very intriguing hall. Jovic and Martin would fit incredibly well with our elite guards and Herro would be a great asset to move for a young athletic 5. Im excited for this rebuild. We can build this right starting from the ground up and we’re already ahead of the game. Scoot and Shay growing together is going to be SPECIAL.
 
I like Ant's chemistry with this group and have no desire to have the return on Dame be a guy whose value is a 5% rebounding improvement to the guy we already have. I want to keep Ant, see what he brings in a new system, and trade Hero for a player who actually improves the team now. While not popular, if it could bring us Simmons, I do that all day. I believe a new scene on the opposite coast with a bunch of young energetic talent is exactly what he needs. He needs to get back to having fun. I also really want Jovic
 
bemac said:
I like Ant's chemistry with this group and have no desire to have the return on Dame be a guy whose value is a 5% rebounding improvement to the guy we already have. I want to keep Ant, see what he brings in a new system, and trade Hero for a player who actually improves the team now. While not popular, if it could bring us Simmons, I do that all day. I believe a new scene on the opposite coast with a bunch of young energetic talent is exactly what he needs. He needs to get back to having fun. I also really want Jovic
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what chemistry with what group? Going to be a very different team next year
 
wizenheimer said:
Ant sure hasn't displayed any consistent PG skills in 5 seasons. Herro had a higher assist rate this season, and has a career assist rate advantage over Ant, 18.3% vs 16.1%; higher assists/100-possessions as well. I'd say they are about equal in PG skills, although, IIRC, Herro played some PG at Kentucky and has played some in Miami

I think you're way too dismissive of rebounding. Considering Portland's rebounding issues, I'd much rather have a SG with Herro's 9% rebounding rate, than one with Ant's 4.3% rate, which by the way ranked 189th out of 190 at BBREF qualified player ranking. Two more rebounds a game can make a difference

and I'm pretty sure that the only reason this 3 way trade has legs is because Brooklyn is interested in Herro. If they were getting Ant and Herro was coming to Portland I think they'd bow out of the deal right away

but as I said, I'd much prefer it if Portland had neither player
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I would be interested in comparing those assist numbers to what Simons had in 2021-2022 while Dame was out. He had a 22.2 AST% that season and then it dropped to 18.6 when Dame came back.
 
Natebishop3 said:
I would be interested in comparing those assist numbers to what Simons had in 2021-2022 while Dame was out. He had a 22.2 AST% that season and then it dropped to 18.6 when Dame came back.
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Dame did run the offense, but Ant was a secondary 'facilitator'...that's when the offense sputtered a lot by the way

Dame averaged 7.3 assists; Hart averaged 3.9 for 51 games. Those two and their 12.2 assists were the primary 'competition' for Ant's playmaking when he generated 4.1 assists

but Herro was competing with Butler at 5.2, Lowry at 5.1, Adebayo at 3.2, and Oladipo at 3.5. Herro averaged 4.2, I am not persuaded that Ant was more obstructed by Dame than Herro was by Butler, Lowry, and Adebayo

by the way, I just saw you say in another post here that Ant wasn't a PG, he was a lead guard. While I'm a little unclear on what that means, it does seem to mean you agree with me that Ant ain't a PG
 
wizenheimer said:
Dame did run the offense, but Ant was a secondary 'facilitator'...that's when the offense sputtered a lot by the way

Dame averaged 7.3 assists; Hart averaged 3.9 for 51 games. Those two and their 12.2 assists were the primary 'competition' for Ant's playmaking when he generated 4.1 assists

but Herro was competing with Butler at 5.2, Lowry at 5.1, Adebayo at 3.2, and Oladipo at 3.5. Herro averaged 4.2, I am not persuaded that Ant was more obstructed by Dame than Herro was by Butler, Lowry, and Adebayo
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In games where Simons started at point guard and Dame was nowhere to be found, he played much different. I can’t explain it. He was just better.
 
wizenheimer said:
what chemistry with what group? Going to be a very different team next year
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Exactly, and I believe one that fits him better. This is going to be fun free-wheeling basketball. We shall see.
 
Natebishop3 said:
In games where Simons started at point guard and Dame was nowhere to be found, he played much different. I can’t explain it. He was just better.
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same thing was said for years about CJ....didn't mean anything. That's why the Pels were trying to jump up and draft a PG
 
Natebishop3 said:
Not here..... no.

But I was listening to the Locked on Nets podcast just gushing about the idea of adding Herro to their team.
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That's odd... I'm not seeing it much elsewhere, but I guess if I looked a little harder I might see it. Mostly what I see on social media or on the boards is that he's ok.

I hope the Nets front office thinks he's amazing and will back up the truck for him, so we can get more in return.
 
Idog1976 said:
I've coveted Jovic since last years draft. I currently am coveting Noah Clowney & Dariq Whitehead. It sure would be awesome get all three and a bunch of picks to boot!
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I guess I’m starting to come around to Jovic too. I like that he plays without the ball and he can handle and facilitate a little bit. His ft% was sky high, bodes well for his shooting.

I’m on board. I get the Wagner vibes from him, only less confidence in his defense being as good. I’d want Clowney as a guy who could maybe become Claxton-like one day. That at least fills out two interesting prospects for the bench. Add in the unprotected 24/28/30 1sts + unprotected 27/29 swaps from Miami, and the best of the 27 1sts from Brooklyn, and that’s a solid haul.
 
Natebishop3 said:
Not really. Not for the extra money. They're both shooters and Simons is arguably the better shooter.

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Convenient that you dont highlight any of the more defensive or wholistic stats...

Ant is a slightly better shooter. Herro at least attempts to play defense & thus is a better player (as evidenced by the stats you posted of WS/48, BPM, & VORP)
 
wizenheimer said:
same thing was said for years about CJ....didn't mean anything. That's why the Pels were trying to jump up and draft a PG
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Yeah but we don’t want/need him to be a point guard full time. And I think Scoot can play off the ball better than Dame if they play together.
 
CJ_is_Gone said:
Convenient that you dont highlight any of the more defensive or wholistic stats...

Ant is a slightly better shooter. Herro at least attempts to play defense & thus is a better player (as evidenced by the stats you posted of WS/48, BPM, & VORP)
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Are you wize’s alternate account????
 
CJ_is_Gone said:
Convenient that you dont highlight any of the more defensive or wholistic stats...

Ant is a slightly better shooter. Herro at least attempts to play defense & thus is a better player (as evidenced by the stats you posted of WS/48, BPM, & VORP)
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I’ll say it again. His defensive stats are gonna look better because he was on a really good defensive team. Put him on our dumpster fire defense and his stats would look like trash too.
 
Idog1976 said:
I've coveted Jovic since last years draft. I currently am coveting Noah Clowney & Dariq Whitehead. It sure would be awesome get all three and a bunch of picks to boot!
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people might need to slow their role a little bit

Think about it...what if Cronin/Schmitz are geniuses at player evaluation. That would mean in 2026, Sharpe, Jovic, and Rupert would all be due for new contracts. And the following summer, Scoot, Murray, Clowney, and Whitehead would all be due for their extensions

a team just can't have that many players graduating from rookie scale to 2nd contracts in two years. Now obviously, some will fail. But it's still better to have 2 or 3 in a two year period than 7
 
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wizenheimer said:
people might need to slow their role a little bit

Think about it...what if Cronin/Schmitz are geniuses at player evaluation. That would mean in 2026, Sharpe, Jovic, and Rupert would all be due for new contracts. And the following summer, Scoot, Murray, Clowney, and Whitehead would all be due for their extensions

a team just can't have that many players graduating from rookie scale to 2nd contracts in two years. Now obviously, some will fail. But it's still better to have 2 or 3 in a two year period than 7
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No. Someone would need to be flipped. We won’t have enough minutes to develop all those dudes anyway.
 
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