Game Thread NBA PLAY-IN - PELICANS @ CLIPPERS - APRIL 15, 2022 - FRIDAY - 7:00 PM (PDT) TNT

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This is a deep draft with several SF/PF/C prospects that would be available with our draft pick. I can't imagine Cronin trading it away for a guy like Grant.
I can't imagine a guy who has been in NBA front offices for 13 years and been an assistant GM for the last 4-7 giving up CJ, Norm, RoCo and Larry for Hart, Winslow, Johnson, second round picks and a first that could so easily not convey but Cronin sure did that shit... sorry I forgot to mention all of the millions in cap savings that he is planning to just repurpose to guys that were already on the fucking roster.
 
Yeah, they protected it top 4. They didn't own it 15-30. So they put one contingency on the pick. 1 isn't a lot of contingencies .
You're stance of how shitty he is is noted. He should have been able to land us siakim, and Anthony edwards for 3 of our starters. What a shit bag.
There might be a small gap between me thinking that he should have gotten a late lotto/mid first that would convey in this years draft plus a solid role player for CJ and saying that he should have been able to land a proven all star and one of the best up and coming talents in the game for three of the four quality guys we gave up.
 
Paul George waves bye bye to the Blazers pick. He got his revenge from that Dame shot

No he didn't. You tried at a joke, but like your confusion with tank and trade, you failed again.
 
There might be a small gap between me thinking that he should have gotten a late lotto/mid first that would convey in this years draft plus a solid role player for CJ and saying that he should have been able to land a proven all star and one of the best up and coming talents in the game for three of the four quality guys we gave up.
And all signs looked like we were going to get a late lotto. And then the Lakers melted apart.

As for the Clippers trade, there wasn't 1sts to be had in all reality. I guess that doesn't stop us from crying that he should have gotten one for them somehow.
 
We need to let it play out and see what happens. If the Blazers are noticeably better next season, why should Cronin be fired? Because you don't like how he did it?
Of course, if the Blazers are worse next season, yes, he should be fired.
I don't think the Blazers are going to be worse next season than the team that couldn't win a road game until they played Houston.
In your scenario aren't we better because Ant popped and Dame is now healthy? What does that have to do with not getting enough value back for CJ, Norm, RoCo and Larry? No, I do not give this guy more chances to give more teams gifts. He is the interim GM and I don't think Vulcan would keep someone interim into next season so it would mean signing him to a contract that would be for more than just next season. There is no letting this play out and then whatever because there will be more damage that Cronin can do this off season. Let's just get a clean break from the Olshey era and see what someone who has no connection to Olshey's plans would do.

Like I've said, I can see us giving Cronin the GM job if we hire a President of Basketball Operations who is the actual decision maker and will prevent us from getting fleeced again.
 
And all signs looked like we were going to get a late lotto. And then the Lakers melted apart.

As for the Clippers trade, there wasn't 1sts to be had in all reality. I guess that doesn't stop us from crying that he should have gotten one for them somehow.
You're acting as if the only three teams in the NBA are us, the Pelicans and the Clippers... I think it's been made pretty clear that for Joe and CJ the Pelicans were the only option because of some bullshit loyalty but really there was no reason to take these deals. One was just pure shit and the other is still and was at the time very precarious. At the trade deadline the Lakers were already melting, they were four games under .500 and had just lost to us. If Cronin couldn't foresee that CJ would make the Pelicans a threat to make the playoffs that's even more damning, isn't it?
 
OK I am trying to spin this so I am not too pissed tonight. If the Clips lose then at least that means:

A: The Clips miss the playoffs after all the moves and money they spent. I can enjoy that.

B: I read an article on the Pistons and they clearly are trying to make a "splash" in free agency. They will have somewhere around $25 million in cap space available this summer. If the goal is to really make a splash, wouldn't dumping Grant's 20 million be even more appealing than the actual pick? So maybe they make the trade even if it means taking a future #1 pick?
You're probably right about B. but A. has some serious problems. The Clippers will get Kawhi back next season and had a chance for PG to get used to playing with Norm and RoCo who they will most likely retain for far less money than they're currently paying him. So we're not exactly going to get the last laugh on a team that will be a stronger contender next season because of the gift we gave them.
 
That 2025 Bucks pick will be better than 11 imo and we won’t trade it for Grant. Looks like we gave up Norm, RoCo, and CJ for Cap Space flexibility…Ouch.
 
In your scenario aren't we better because Ant popped and Dame is now healthy? What does that have to do with not getting enough value back for CJ, Norm, RoCo and Larry? No, I do not give this guy more chances to give more teams gifts. He is the interim GM and I don't think Vulcan would keep someone interim into next season so it would mean signing him to a contract that would be for more than just next season. There is no letting this play out and then whatever because there will be more damage that Cronin can do this off season. Let's just get a clean break from the Olshey era and see what someone who has no connection to Olshey's plans would do.

Like I've said, I can see us giving Cronin the GM job if we hire a President of Basketball Operations who is the actual decision maker and will prevent us from getting fleeced again.
Don’t discount Chauncey’s role in personnel moves. Remember before he pursued coaching, he actually wanted to be a GM. He was rumored to be the front runner for the Cavs GM position but ultimately declined because of LeBron’s noncommittal stance on returning to the Cavs. I could see Chauncey targeting guys like Hart and Winslow that fit his style more. It could be Chauncey acting as de facto GM and Cronin being the cap/numbers guy.
 
That 2025 Bucks pick will be better than 11 imo and we won’t trade it for Grant. Looks like we gave up Norm, RoCo, and CJ for Cap Space flexibility…Ouch.
I admittedly don’t know details around the Bucks 25’ pick but why do people think it will be a good pick considering it’s the Bucks and Giannis and all. Are they going to nosedive the next two years?
 
With the Paul George news I now fully expect NO to win, keep their own pick, and then get the #1 pick via the Lakers.
 
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We're going to find out just how good Norm and RoCo are tonight.
Yeah, I haven't given up on our chances of the Pels pick conveying to us, I'm just even more convinced due to this proving just how needlessly reckless Joe's moves were that he should not be our head decision maker going forward. The guy made shitty deals in which he allowed our situation cap situation when we still have one of the richest ownership groups in the league to dictate other team's abilities to take advantage of us and get far more value from us than they gave back. That's not the kind of GM we should want running our franchise.

There will always be something that another team can try to hold over your head and a good negotiator won't allow that to affect their ability to get a fair and stable return. If this can happen because we were freeing up cap space why won't it happen for whatever reason in the future that we're at the bargaining table? Joe put himself in a position of weakness and a few actual GMs who need to be sharks, smelled blood in the water and took advantage, giving us shit that they didn't want or in the case of what we're watching today a very volatile asset for solid pieces with known value.
 
If it takes 2 L.A. super-teams crapping the bed, and Pop (the HOF coach) not dragging his team into the playoffs, AND Zion M.I.A. for the year AND the Pelicans make the playoffs to have the Blazers miss out on a projected #11 pick for a delayed MIL pick … well, then, the basketball gods are loopy as hell. Just not buying it. Clippers win.
 
You're acting as if the only three teams in the NBA are us, the Pelicans and the Clippers... I think it's been made pretty clear that for Joe and CJ the Pelicans were the only option because of some bullshit loyalty but really there was no reason to take these deals. One was just pure shit and the other is still and was at the time very precarious. At the trade deadline the Lakers were already melting, they were four games under .500 and had just lost to us. If Cronin couldn't foresee that CJ would make the Pelicans a threat to make the playoffs that's even more damning, isn't it?
Who out there was likely to give a 1st for Powell and RoCo?
It's easy to make demands for a better return and bitch about fleecing without looking team by team and what could even remotely possibly be realistic scenarios. It's then easy to fallback on the I don't know what offers are out there excuse, while bitching that this wasn't the best offer for them.
 
I admittedly don’t know details around the Bucks 25’ pick but why do people think it will be a good pick considering it’s the Bucks and Giannis and all. Are they going to nosedive the next two years?
Jrue and Kris will be 34 and 33 and I think many teams in the East will have passed them by then imo.
 
With the Paul George news I now fully expect NO to win, keep their own pick, and then get the #1 pick via the Lakers.
Their pick goes to Charlotte and I'm not counting the Clippers out of this game by any means but this does highlight just how shitty of a negotiator Joe is and the fact that he has a limited imagination that makes it very hard to trust his decision making.
 
You're acting as if the only three teams in the NBA are us, the Pelicans and the Clippers... I think it's been made pretty clear that for Joe and CJ the Pelicans were the only option because of some bullshit loyalty but really there was no reason to take these deals. One was just pure shit and the other is still and was at the time very precarious. At the trade deadline the Lakers were already melting, they were four games under .500 and had just lost to us. If Cronin couldn't foresee that CJ would make the Pelicans a threat to make the playoffs that's even more damning, isn't it?
The options for CJ at the deadline had been reported as Gallinari+filler+pick from Atlanta, Powell+Kleber/(maybe Hardaway?)+distant first from Dallas and the New Orleans deal. I can absolutely guarantee that this board would have been going bezerk if we had kept CJ past the deadline, and the same posters blasting Cronin now would be blasting him if he had turned down all offers and hadn't made a move.

Cronin likely took a gamble that the pick would convey this year (and as of the time of this post, of course, it still might). If it doesn't convey, is it not still a gamble worth taking at the time? The Milwaukee future pick may not be as shiny of an asset, but it still is an asset that can be utilized. Hell, that pick might be used to acquire Grant anyway (so really there would be no major difference on our end).

We can argue that Cronin should have negotiated for better terms after this season, but what if NOP simply says no. New Orleans was certainly interested in CJ, but I've never gotten the impression that they HAD to have him. NOP could have easily said, "meh, if you like those other deals better, we're fine." I'd still prefer Hart, the Milwaukee pick, and additional cap flexibility (along with the seconds, etc.) to the other offers.
 
Jrue and Kris will be 34 and 33 and I think many teams in the East will have passed them by then.
I don't know, Giannis will be 29 when the season starts and should be even better than he is right now. Your confidence that they won't be able to move a piece here or there to make sure they keep a solid team around them is presumptuous. I just don't see that pick being close to the lotto, also it's three years from now so it's just an uncertainty and that's the reason why future firsts are worth so much less than current firsts.
 
The options for CJ at the deadline had been reported as Gallinari+filler+pick from Atlanta, Powell+Kleber/(maybe Hardaway?)+distant first from Dallas and the New Orleans deal. I can absolutely guarantee that this board would have been going bezerk if we had kept CJ past the deadline, and the same posters blasting Cronin now would be blasting him if he had turned down all offers and hadn't made a move.

Cronin likely took a gamble that the pick would convey this year (and as of the time of this post, of course, it still might). If it doesn't convey, is it not still a gamble worth taking at the time? The Milwaukee future pick may not be as shiny of an asset, but it still is an asset that can be utilized. Hell, that pick might be used to acquire Grant anyway (so really there would be no major difference on our end).

We can argue that Cronin should have negotiated for better terms after this season, but what if NOP simply says no. New Orleans was certainly interested in CJ, but I've never gotten the impression that they HAD to have him. NOP could have easily said, "meh, if you like those other deals better, we're fine." I'd still prefer Hart, the Milwaukee pick, and additional cap flexibility (along with the seconds, etc.) to the other offers.

Where was the pressing need to dump CJ this season? You make it seem like there was some mandate to tank and get him off the roster asap. Is it unfathomable to imagine CJ would have recovered at least some trade value if he had the ball in his hands in Portland w/o as he has now?
 
Who out there was likely to give a 1st for Powell and RoCo?
It's easy to make demands for a better return and bitch about fleecing without looking team by team and what could even remotely possibly be realistic scenarios. It's then easy to fallback on the I don't know what offers are out there excuse, while bitching that this wasn't the best offer for them.
I mean, could have waited for Olshey to land another job. Haha
 
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Their pick goes to Charlotte and I'm not counting the Clippers out of this game by any means but this does highlight just how shitty of a negotiator Joe is and the fact that he has a limited imagination that makes it very hard to trust his decision making.
I thought NO gets the Lakers pick.
 
The options for CJ at the deadline had been reported as Gallinari+filler+pick from Atlanta, Powell+Kleber/(maybe Hardaway?)+distant first from Dallas and the New Orleans deal. I can absolutely guarantee that this board would have been going bezerk if we had kept CJ past the deadline, and the same posters blasting Cronin now would be blasting him if he had turned down all offers and hadn't made a move.

Cronin likely took a gamble that the pick would convey this year (and as of the time of this post, of course, it still might). If it doesn't convey, is it not still a gamble worth taking at the time? The Milwaukee future pick may not be as shiny of an asset, but it still is an asset that can be utilized. Hell, that pick might be used to acquire Grant anyway (so really there would be no major difference on our end).

We can argue that Cronin should have negotiated for better terms after this season, but what if NOP simply says no. New Orleans was certainly interested in CJ, but I've never gotten the impression that they HAD to have him. NOP could have easily said, "meh, if you like those other deals better, we're fine." I'd still prefer Hart, the Milwaukee pick, and additional cap flexibility (along with the seconds, etc.) to the other offers.
I don't trust the reporting that only three teams had interest in CJ. I do trust the reporting that the offers were pretty far below his actual value because of his contract but more so because Joe had just shown that he was willing to give away quality pieces. To think that a rookie GM's first move being pure shit didn't affect the offers he received for his second move wouldn't be very logical.

I'll say what I've said before. If the pick conveys and I still think there's a decent chance that it does, then the trade wasn't fucking awful but the Norm/RoCo trade was and that affected this trade. This trade not being awful in no way redeems Cronin from the first trade he made being awful. This is an interim GM and he's shown that he will let other GMs take advantage of him and possibly that he has no clue how to manage his ownership group for the betterment of the team.

I just don't know why we would keep him when we know this is 1 of 30 of these jobs in the world and not the least attractive one. The pool that we have to hire from is vast and we can do better than what Joe has shown he is.
 
Where was the pressing need to dump CJ this season? You make it seem like there was some mandate to tank and get him off the roster asap. Is it unfathomable to imagine CJ would have recovered at least some trade value if he had the ball in his hands in Portland w/o as he has now?
If we move him in the offseason, we'd have to take back over 26 million in contracts to kitchen his deal. Which shoots our next year's salary through the roof. And makes it more difficult to retain both ant and nurk AND make other moves to improve the team.
 
You're probably right about B. but A. has some serious problems. The Clippers will get Kawhi back next season and had a chance for PG to get used to playing with Norm and RoCo who they will most likely retain for far less money than they're currently paying him. So we're not exactly going to get the last laugh on a team that will be a stronger contender next season because of the gift we gave them.

I don't need to have the last laugh. But I live in LA and as we all know misery loves company. So at least I get some short-time enjoyment.

To be honest I could care less about RoCo. He was not coming back IMO so I don't care if he is on the Clippers next year. You say so yourself that he will get a pay cut in the summer. He is a replaceable talent. I personally like watching Winslow more just based on his ball-handling skills for his position, and his disposition.
 
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I thought NO gets the Lakers pick.
They do get the Lakers pick which it's just being dramatic to say is going to be #1, they just don't get to "keep their own pick" that goes to Charlotte if the Pelicans win tonight.
 
Funny that the first trade by Cronin will totally fuck up his second. a fucking 2025 milwaukie pick and Hart for CJ and Nance is a fucking steal. I wouldn't be shocked if the Sixers are kicking themselves right about now for not taking CJ. He is playing better than Harden ATM and they would have got back picks!
 

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