OFFICIAL AROUND THE NBA: APRIL 2023

[Pinwheel1]

First go back and read the comment again. Seems like you missed this part.

I can name 3 moves that would have made this team not just a little but a bunch better. I know you can as well.

Tanking for the 7th pick is never the right move. Not even 1 time out of 10. Now if that 90% chance that we don't get the #1 pick happens they will have wasted another year. You guys all seem to forget 4 teams have better odds at 6 of the top 7 picks.

Fact is you simply don't know what would have happened if they improved the roster at the trade deadline and made the playoffs. You simply don't know.

I agree they could have most definitely made the playoffs this year if they really wanted to. Like you said they could have offered more to get players at the deadline that would have allowed that. But I was ok taking the chance after the all-star break to tank one last time. But this city can't afford to tank as the Lakers did for 5 years because we don't attract star free agents to help the process like they do. This is also why I lean toward the don't trade Dame camp. Retool around him. It will take a little luck though, but I like our odds better at 5 than I do at 12-18

 

[cdub503]

First go back and read the comment again. Seems like you missed this part.

I can name 3 moves that would have made this team not just a little but a bunch better. I know you can as well.

Tanking for the 7th pick is never the right move. Not even 1 time out of 10. Now if that 90% chance that we don't get the #1 pick happens they will have wasted another year. You guys all seem to forget 4 teams have better odds at 6 of the top 7 picks.

Fact is you simply don't know what would have happened if they improved the roster at the trade deadline and made the playoffs. You simply don't know.

what moves you making? Were you on the line with Cronin where he was getting those playoff making moves? You simply don’t know what was or wasn’t offered. Or at what price….. pretty sure most of this board wouldn’t want to pull more Olshey moves and kick this can further down the road by offering picks that we really shouldn’t be giving up if it’s truly not moving the needle.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

I can name 3 moves that would have made this team not just a little but a bunch better. I know you can as well.

I don't know that I can, but you have certainly piqued my curiosity.

 

[blazerkor]

it's a curious case, but did he fall off a cliff or did he just become obsolete?...or something else? Look at his career marks vs marks this season:

PER: career 13.1...this season 14.2
TS%: career .556...this season .584
eFG%: career .524...this season .563
RebRate: career 10.5%...this season 11.9%
AssistRate: career 7.6%...this season 10.2%
Turn.Rate: career 12.7%...this season 11.5%
winshares/48: career .086...this season .117
DBPM: career +1.3...this season +2.1
BPM: career +0.5...this season +1.7

in just about every metric that isn't tied to minutes he was better this season than his career marks. So he was producing at levels better than his norms but still had 25-30 DNP-CD's. And he's actually younger than Dame.

The fact is that even with Kawhi and PG13 out that team is very deep. In the regular season he averaged over 15 minutes per game when he played so the guy was in and out of the rotation. The rotation tightens up in the playoffs so he didn't see any minutes.

 

[Natebishop3]

I don't know that I can, but you have certainly piqued my curiosity.

And unless those moves were for a bona fide star, we would have been just good enough to get our asses stomped in the first round.

 

[Natebishop3]

it's a curious case, but did he fall off a cliff or did he just become obsolete?...or something else? Look at his career marks vs marks this season:

PER: career 13.1...this season 14.2
TS%: career .556...this season .584
eFG%: career .524...this season .563
RebRate: career 10.5%...this season 11.9%
AssistRate: career 7.6%...this season 10.2%
Turn.Rate: career 12.7%...this season 11.5%
winshares/48: career .086...this season .117
DBPM: career +1.3...this season +2.1
BPM: career +0.5...this season +1.7

in just about every metric that isn't tied to minutes he was better this season than his career marks. So he was producing at levels better than his norms but still had 25-30 DNP-CD's. And he's actually younger than Dame.

Maybe he was only playing in garbage time? I honestly didn't watch the Clippers at all this year.

 

[SharpesTriumph]

I'd say the decision to not try and win now was made a year ago last offseason - not at the deadline. The Blazers had no big man depth, a super injury prone center with only a 3rd string level backup in Eubanks. They had no size at backup PF or C spots. Undersized wings in Winslow and GP2, again whom were super injury prone. They had a bunch of projects throughout the roster such as Keon/Greg Brown/Jabari instead of veterans who could contribute winning minutes. They were hard capped so didn't have means to acquire a star in trades. They somehow got even smaller with more guards after Cronin said the main issue with the prior season was being undersized.

The Blazers built a roster to not go all out for wins last summer either consciously or subconsciously. That they made the decision in February to fully commit to the tank was the right move at that time; but only because the prior moves forced the team into a non winning position.

 

[Fairly-Hard]

No complaints about Sharpe. IMHO he was the very best choice for a pick in that slot. Fact remains he is still 2 years away from truly being a factor. Seems like you have all forgot Dame ain't playing that anymore. When they get the 7th pick again they can hopefully find someone who wants that pick for someone who can help this team win.

 

[Natebishop3]

This story definitely makes me not want KAT lol

 

[Predator]

Yeah this year the Playoffs are just solidifying my thoughts on tanking. I really don't ever want to read another poster tell me "Why make the Play in and just get swept in the playoffs?".
Great moments and great plays happen in the Playoffs. One of the greatest series ending shots happened in front of my eyes and twice it's been done by one of my favorite players in Portland.

If the trade deadline comes around and you have the means to make a run and get into the playoffs by all means get there. Anything less is just losing.

Lol, not all playoff teams are created equal.

We are much closer to the Timberwolves than we are to the Heat, whom were in the finals recently and conference finals last year.

It’s not even a debate whether the playoffs are entertaining, of course they are, but *if* the goal is competing for championships it’s undoubtedly more beneficial for us NOT to make the playoffs.

Some on here say the goal isn’t championships, the goal is “fun” and “entertaining”. If that’s the case, of course squeaking into the playoffs and winning a game or even a series achieves that goal.

 

[Fairly-Hard]

. pretty sure most of this board wouldn’t want to pull more Olshey moves and kick this can further down the road by offering picks that we really shouldn’t be giving up if it’s truly not moving the needle.

Ha. So now you gonna move a pick anyway? Are they keeping the #7 pick? Heck are they even keeping the #2 pick.

This conversation has been had ad nauseam.

Make the playoffs and play to win. Put together the best team you can and work hard. They didn't even tank well. How do you find yourself throwing away games and still have 4 teams with better odds to get the #1 pick than you do?

Pathetic this board is actually watching the Heat get by the Bucks because of a "Lillard like" performance under the right circumstances which presented themselves with a back injury to Giannis making him miss 2 games then try to tell themselves "It's all for the best" because they got a 10% chance to get a player that might become a great player.

I'm never going to buy that. Ever. Make the playoffs and see what happens. You never get a chance to see true greatness if you aren't even at the show.

 

[Fairly-Hard]

We are much closer to the Timberwolves than we are to the Heat, whom were in the finals recently and conference finals last year.

They certainly were way worse than the T-Wolves the way the season ended yes.
Go read the statement again and get back to us.

 

[Predator]

First go back and read the comment again. Seems like you missed this part.

I can name 3 moves that would have made this team not just a little but a bunch better. I know you can as well.

Tanking for the 7th pick is never the right move. Not even 1 time out of 10. Now if that 90% chance that we don't get the #1 pick happens they will have wasted another year. You guys all seem to forget 4 teams have better odds at 6 of the top 7 picks.

Fact is you simply don't know what would have happened if they improved the roster at the trade deadline and made the playoffs. You simply don't know.

What 3 moves make this team a LOT better?

We don’t even have the assets to make 3 “good” moves.

And based on what Cronin said, it sounded like we didn’t have the assets at the time to make ONE good move which is why they pivoted into gathering more assets.

We don’t have depth.

We don’t have size.

Our defense sucks.

Our coach probably sucks (although hard to say for sure because our roster sucks).

And a good portion of our “experience” is injury prone.

And our experience isn’t “championship level”.

None of this is relatable to the Warriors, Lakers, or Heat.

 

[Predator]

They certainly were way worse than the T-Wolves the way the season ended yes.
Go read the statement again and get back to us.

Nah, I’m good.

It’s clear you think we are the same level as the Lakers, Heat, and Warriors… all who have championship level experience, better defense by exponential levels, mobile centers, and 2 of those teams have arguably top 5 coaches in the league.

Fairly hard to process how we are on that level, but to each their own.

 

[Natebishop3]

Ha. So now you gonna move a pick anyway? Are they keeping the #7 pick? Heck are they even keeping the #2 pick.

This conversation has been had ad nauseam.

Make the playoffs and play to win. Put together the best team you can and work hard. They didn't even tank well. How do you find yourself throwing away games and still have 4 teams with better odds to get the #1 pick than you do?

Pathetic this board is actually watching the Heat get by the Bucks because of a "Lillard like" performance under the right circumstances which presented themselves with a back injury to Giannis making him miss 2 games then try to tell themselves "It's all for the best" because they got a 10% chance to get a player that might become a great player.

I'm never going to buy that. Ever. Make the playoffs and see what happens. You never get a chance to see true greatness if you aren't even at the show.

It's so pointless to argue about this right now.

We don't know where our pick is going to be. We don't know which players are going to be available for trade. Sure, there are rumors, but the playoffs are still in full swing. Once the lottery happens and we know what our pick is, I think we can start assessing value and gauging what trades might be possible. But there are just so many unknowns at this moment.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

They didn't even tank well. How do you find yourself throwing away games and still have 4 teams with better odds to get the #1 pick than you do?

Can't get behind this claim. Once they clearly chose to tank, they had easily the worst record in the league, and the only teams with "better odds" finished with fewer wins than the Blazers already had when they chose to tank--ie, they tanked as well as was mathematically possible.

 

[Strenuus]

Can't get behind this claim. Once they clearly chose to tank, they had easily the worst record in the league, and the only teams with "better odds" finished with fewer wins than the Blazers already had when they chose to tank--ie, they tanked as well as was mathematically possible.

Yep. 2 teams secured the worst records weeks before our tank.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

Yep. 2 teams secured the worst records weeks before our tank.

Yeah--maybe if the Blazers started tanking February 1st and lost every game for the final 2.5 months, they might have been able to secure the 4th spot. 'Course we also wouldn't have gotten Dame's 71-point game, but still...

 

[Strenuus]

Yeah--maybe if the Blazers started tanking February 1st and lost every game for the final 2.5 months, they might have been able to secure the 4th spot. 'Course we also wouldn't have gotten Dame's 71-point game, but still...

Exactly. Can't say they suck at tanking when we didn't tank until 25-30 games.

 

[Fairly-Hard]

It's so pointless to argue about this right now.

We don't know where our pick is going to be. We don't know which players are going to be available for trade. Sure, there are rumors, but the playoffs are still in full swing. Once the lottery happens and we know what our pick is, I think we can start assessing value and gauging what trades might be possible. But there are just so many unknowns at this moment.

It is pointless. All i said was

Yeah this year the Playoffs are just solidifying my thoughts on tanking. I really don't ever want to read another poster tell me "Why make the Play in and just get swept in the playoffs?".

That simply doesn't seem like a good argument any longer.

The team could have made better moves and they did not have to tank.
1st they could have kept Hart. Yes we all know he wanted to go to New York. We also all know he was a free agent. The point is if the team kept him and did well he might have reconsidered? We just don't know i guess. I know If Dame does what Dame seems to do in big games with a guy like Hart next to him it can be very special.
2nd they could have added depth at the center position especially after getting rid of Payton.
3rd. We all know the buyout market had players available for more depth. There was no need to keep players that we all know are never going to amount to anything. Keon comes to mind. We had other roster spots available.
There was no reason to Hard Cap the team the way they did and everyone here knows it.

That is and will always be my stance on this. Even more so after watching multiple teams get lucky due to injuries to other teams best players.
Giannis
PG13
Leonard
Fox
Middleton was just coming back from injury
Zion was still out for the play in
Jordan Poole with his ankle
Dejounte Murray
Julius Randle
Enbiid is nursing a bad knee.

There are more but i just can't think of them and don't want to go and look it all up.

 

[Natebishop3]

It is pointless. All i said was


That simply doesn't seem like a good argument any longer.

The team could have made better moves and they did not have to tank.
1st they could have kept Hart. Yes we all know he wanted to go to New York. We also all know he was a free agent. The point is if the team kept him and did well he might have reconsidered? We just don't know i guess. I know If Dame does what Dame seems to do in big games with a guy like Hart next to him it can be very special.
2nd they could have added depth at the center position especially after getting rid of Payton.
3rd. We all know the buyout market had players available for more depth. There was no need to keep players that we all know are never going to amount to anything. Keon comes to mind. We had other roster spots available.
There was no reason to Hard Cap the team the way they did and everyone here knows it.

That is and will always be my stance on this. Even more so after watching multiple teams get lucky due to injuries to other teams best players.
Giannis
PG13
Leonard
Fox
Middleton was just coming back from injury
Zion was still out for the play in
Jordan Poole with his ankle
Dejounte Murray
Julius Randle
Enbiid is nursing a bad knee.

There are more but i just can't think of them and don't want to go and look it all up.

All we have to go off of is last year, so I thought it was funny that you mentioned the 7th pick because that's exactly where we picked Sharpe.

You said "Tanking for the 7th pick is never the right move. Not even 1 time out of 10." It's still early, but I think Sharpe is going to prove you wrong.

I can't really argue with you about whether it was worth tanking this year because we don't know what our pick will be, but if we somehow win the #1 pick I shall return to refute your point

 

[andalusian]

All we have to go off of is last year, so I thought it was funny that you mentioned the 7th pick because that's exactly where we picked Sharpe.

You said "Tanking for the 7th pick is never the right move. Not even 1 time out of 10." It's still early, but I think Sharpe is going to prove you wrong.

I can't really argue with you about whether it was worth tanking this year because we don't know what our pick will be, but if we somehow win the #1 pick I shall return to refute your point

I believe Stephen Curry was drafted #7 as well.

 

[Cugel]

The NBA has to change the post season to give teams an incentive NOT to load manage. How about best season records choose who they want to play in the post-season, every round?

 

[KingSpeed]

agreed

and it's not like the Blazers didn't do everything Dame could to make the playoffs 8 straight years. And when they did, the result was always the same: once they faced a legitimate contender in a playoff series they got curb-stomped all 8 of those years. Portland's record in those close-out series was 1-4/1-4/1-4/0-4/0-4/0-4/1-4/2-4....that's 6-32; that's a .158 winning percentage which would equal a 13-69 record over an 82 game season. There was no real progress over the decade of olshey-ball.

New Orleans wasn’t a legitimate contender. Nor was Memphis. #2 Denver, however, was and the Blazers beat them in 7, the most impressive performance the team has had since beating the Utah Jazz in the 1992 WCF and I’d say the Denver series win was more impressive actually. It’s easy to say “but they lost when they lost!” Well, yeah, and they won when they won. OKC considered themselves contenders in 2019 too by the way. In the end, the only thing you’re saying is that we’ve gone 1-12 vs the Warriors, one of the greatest teams of all time. Makes sense to me.

 

[TBpup]

It is pointless. All i said was


That simply doesn't seem like a good argument any longer.

The team could have made better moves and they did not have to tank.
1st they could have kept Hart. Yes we all know he wanted to go to New York. We also all know he was a free agent. The point is if the team kept him and did well he might have reconsidered? We just don't know i guess. I know If Dame does what Dame seems to do in big games with a guy like Hart next to him it can be very special.
2nd they could have added depth at the center position especially after getting rid of Payton.
3rd. We all know the buyout market had players available for more depth. There was no need to keep players that we all know are never going to amount to anything. Keon comes to mind. We had other roster spots available.
There was no reason to Hard Cap the team the way they did and everyone here knows it.

That is and will always be my stance on this. Even more so after watching multiple teams get lucky due to injuries to other teams best players.
Giannis
PG13
Leonard
Fox
Middleton was just coming back from injury
Zion was still out for the play in
Jordan Poole with his ankle
Dejounte Murray
Julius Randle
Enbiid is nursing a bad knee.

There are more but i just can't think of them and don't want to go and look it all up.

We played the Warriors when Steph either couldn't go or was way under 100%. Played them without Durant. Both times, we got smoked. We need talent and a lot of it.

 

[Blazinaway]

All we have to go off of is last year, so I thought it was funny that you mentioned the 7th pick because that's exactly where we picked Sharpe.

You said "Tanking for the 7th pick is never the right move. Not even 1 time out of 10." It's still early, but I think Sharpe is going to prove you wrong.

I can't really argue with you about whether it was worth tanking this year because we don't know what our pick will be, but if we somehow win the #1 pick I shall return to refute your point

Hell, the season was going nowhere ad we simply weren't a good team and would have had NO chance in the play in or playoffs. So might as well get a good pick and a what, 4o plus percent chance at a top 4 pick, and 10% chance at the #1 - why the F not? maybe we just get lucky, either way we get a shot at another very good player or trade chip.

 

[KingSpeed]

You simply don't know. You have no idea. You make statements that absolutely have no basis for discussion. The only player they will keep if they draft him this year will be the #1 pick. After that it's a complete crap shoot and Dame has already said he doesn't want any more rookies.

No I don’t know but you don’t know either. I DO know we were 31-40 and needed to go 9-2 including a win over OKC to get the 10th seed. The chances of that happening were low and the 10th seed has never made the playoffs so there’s that too. The CHANCES of us reaching the 2nd round were extremely low. I’d rather have a 42% chance at a Top 4 pick. To most of us, that was more valuable than a playoff run we weren’t equipped for to win. It NEVER ends well for a team with a 31-40 record. Tanking was 100% the right decision even if we end up with only the #7 pick.

 

[KingSpeed]

No complaints about Sharpe. IMHO he was the very best choice for a pick in that slot. Fact remains he is still 2 years away from truly being a factor. Seems like you have all forgot Dame ain't playing that anymore. When they get the 7th pick again they can hopefully find someone who wants that pick for someone who can help this team win.

Keegan Murray started all year as a rookie and helped Kings not only make the playoffs but get the 3 seed.

 

[KingSpeed]

Ha. So now you gonna move a pick anyway? Are they keeping the #7 pick? Heck are they even keeping the #2 pick.

This conversation has been had ad nauseam.

Make the playoffs and play to win. Put together the best team you can and work hard. They didn't even tank well. How do you find yourself throwing away games and still have 4 teams with better odds to get the #1 pick than you do?

Pathetic this board is actually watching the Heat get by the Bucks because of a "Lillard like" performance under the right circumstances which presented themselves with a back injury to Giannis making him miss 2 games then try to tell themselves "It's all for the best" because they got a 10% chance to get a player that might become a great player.

I'm never going to buy that. Ever. Make the playoffs and see what happens. You never get a chance to see true greatness if you aren't even at the show.

When we chose to tank, it was no longer mathematically possible to crack the Top 4 in the lottery. We tanked at a very high level and got the very best odds we could get. Even if we tried to win, we very likely would’ve failed to make the play-in but ended up with 8th best odds instead of 5th. How is that desirable to you?

 

[wizenheimer]

New Orleans wasn’t a legitimate contender. Nor was Memphis. #2 Denver, however, was and the Blazers beat them in 7, the most impressive performance the team has had since beating the Utah Jazz in the 1992 WCF and I’d say the Denver series win was more impressive actually. It’s easy to say “but they lost when they lost!” Well, yeah, and they won when they won. OKC considered themselves contenders in 2019 too by the way. In the end, the only thing you’re saying is that we’ve gone 1-12 vs the Warriors, one of the greatest teams of all time. Makes sense to me.

are you really trying to argue it was because of the Warriors that Portland looked so pathetic bowing out of the playoffs 8 times?

all you have to do is go back to the last time they faced the Warriors in the playoffs in 2019. That Warriors was 4-0 against the Blazers and 10-8 against the other three teams they faced. They didn't even win the championship. Three other teams beat them 8 times. Portland couldn't do it once. That's failure and that was the best Blazer team in the Dame/CJ era