Official Around The NBA Thread.....July

[theprunetang]

I agree that Kawhi won't stay. The Spurs made out like bandits. They are now another superteam (if you include coaching).

They are not a super team, Coach Popavich's god like coaching skills aside. This will help them stay relevant though. But, given that Leonard wanted out and killed any leverage the Spurs might have had, they got a pretty damned good player back. Wasn't expecting that.

 

[Sarni]

Nah. DeRozan does nothing for them. He's not even remotely a replacement for Kawhi, and they didn't really add anything else this summer. They're done.

DeRozan is almost 29. He averaged 23 ppg last season on 45.6% from the field and 31% from three. He's not a defensive player. He can't shoot the three. He's a free throw guy. He's James Harden ultra light. He's a fringe All-Star. They're trading out a top 5 player for a one trick pony that won't get them any closer to a championship.

I think they'll move him somewhere else.

Nah he’s as good a player as you are going to get for a disgruntled star with one year left who is willing to sign for LA only next year. Remember that almost everyone gets better after they move to San Antonio, I expect DeRozan to get better too as he has something to prove after this move.

They got 47 wins last year without Kawhi. Add DeRozan to that team plus a great young talent Lonnie Walker and it’s a 50+ win team surely.

 

[theprunetang]

Glad we weren't the ones giving up a player like CJ/DeRozan for an injured, surly, soon to be free agent that doesn't want to play in his new city.

 

[Natebishop3]

Nah he’s as good a player as you are going to get for a disgruntled star with one year left who is willing to sign for LA only next year. Remember that almost everyone gets better after they move to San Antonio, I expect DeRozan to get better too as he has something to prove after this move.

They got 47 wins last year without Kawhi. Add DeRozan to that team plus a great young talent Lonnie Walker and it’s a 50+ win team surely.

They shouldn't be trying to get comparable or somewhat comparable star for him. They should be trying to get young stars. That team is desperately in need of a rebuild. Aldridge is 33 and DeRozan will be 29. Neither of those players is a top 10 talent. To me, CJ is a bit of an unknown commodity. We have no idea what he could do if he was the focal point of an offense. He might average 25-30 ppg. We simply don't know. We pretty much know what LMA and DeRozan will do. If I had to choose between CJ and DeRozan, I'd take CJ.

But if I was the GM of SAS, I'd be really trying to get Boston or Philly to make me a deal.

 

[theprunetang]

Toronto is about to go full rebuild after this season.

 

[jlprk]

It couldn't have gone better. The Spurs got a star, which is a lot better than I expected.

And it's at their position of need. They get a SG/SF to replace Kawhi and Tony Parker. But a looming problem...

Aldridge won't like sharing the ball with another Brandon Roy.

 

[theprunetang]

It couldn't have gone better. The Spurs got a star, which is a lot better than I expected.

And it's at their position of need. They get a SG/SF to replace Kawhi and Tony Parker. But a looming problem...

The Spurs definitely made out better than I would have expected. I still wouldn't put them above next year's Blazers. A tie, if anything.

 

[Natebishop3]

The Spurs definitely made out better than I would have expected. I still wouldn't put them above next year's Blazers. A tie, if anything.

I really don't think so at all. DeRozan is a bandaid, and really not a very good one. It's good for us though. They're going to need a full rebuild in a couple years.

 

[theprunetang]

I really don't think so at all. DeRozan is a bandaid, and really not a very good one. It's good for us though. They're going to need a full rebuild in a couple years.

True. If I was a gm I would have wanted a bunch of future firsts and such. But, after the process finally worked for Philadelphia, no one is wanting to give up firsts. I think a bandaid is ok for San Antonio. They aren't ready to tear it down yet. And they finished with a decent record last year with NO Leonard. I think this next run with DeRozan and LMA will be their last run for a while.

 

[Natebishop3]

True. If I was a gm I would have wanted a bunch of future firsts and such. But, after the process finally worked for Philadelphia, no one is wanting to give up firsts. I think a bandaid is ok for San Antonio. They aren't ready to tear it down yet. And they finished with a decent record last year with NO Leonard. I think this next run with DeRozan and LMA will be their last run for a while.

If I was them, I'd blow it up and rely on their awesome scouting department to find them some gems. That would be my move. Get some picks and young players and rebuild. I'd move LMA as well. Just start over. It's the best time to do it because of Golden State and LA and Houston.

 

[theprunetang]

If I was them, I'd blow it up and rely on their awesome scouting department to find them some gems. That would be my move. Get some picks and young players and rebuild. I'd move LMA as well. Just start over. It's the best time to do it because of Golden State and LA and Houston.

Not disagreeing. But, I think I proud franchise like them, that has been a legitimate contender for years, deserves to give themselves one last chance, no matter how unlikely.

 

[Natebishop3]

Not disagreeing. But, I think I proud franchise like them, that has been a legitimate contender for years, deserves to give themselves one last chance, no matter how unlikely.

I think they have been doing that, and once Duncan retired and it was obvious that they weren't going to keep it going they should have started over. The whole reason why they won a title in the first place was because they had an elite player in Duncan and they kept putting complimentary players around him. Kawhi could have been that guy, but that's over now. Aldridge isn't that guy anymore and DeRozan certainly isn't either. It's time to blow it up.

 

[theprunetang]

I think they have been doing that, and once Duncan retired and it was obvious that they weren't going to keep it going they should have started over. The whole reason why they won a title in the first place was because they had an elite player in Duncan and they kept putting complimentary players around him. Kawhi could have been that guy, but that's over now. Aldridge isn't that guy anymore and DeRozan certainly isn't either. It's time to blow it up.

As a pragmatist, I agree. But you can't fault the Spurs for trying to win a couple of times before they are through

 

[Natebishop3]

As a pragmatist, I agree. But you can't fault the Spurs for trying to win a couple of times before they are through

LMA's value, and actually DeRozan's value, will continue to degrade every season.

I have no idea what offers they were getting for Kawhi. I don't know if Boston offered any of their young guys. Maybe DeRozan is actually the best offer they got, and he would have more value than an unknown Kawhi. If that's the case, maybe they're looking to flip DeRozan for something better? Even if they do acquire DeRozan, I would trade him and LMA for young talent and assets. This is the most those two players will be worth, and their value will only get worse.

 

[Cippy91]

 

[theprunetang]

It's happening!

 

[Sarni]

So now that it's confirmed I can give my thoughts.

I think it's a good trade for both teams, not so great for both players but marginally better for Leonard than it is for DeRozan.

San Antonio's perspective: They get a very good player back, a pretty decent young talent and an additional pick which will probably not amount to much considering that Toronto are easily a top 3 team in the East. I think with Popovich being almost 70 and their best player being on the wrong side of 30 they are trying to make their last run at competing. It's actually not that far fetched, they won 47 games last year without Kawhi and they were the only team that actually looked like beating the Warriors in a game in 2016-17 playoffs before Kawhi went out. Players get better after they join Toronto and they tend to get much more mileage out of their talent than any other team so DeRozan has proper value to them. Poeltl and pick are good sweteners.

Toronto's perspective: Danny Green is just a salary filler so let's leave him for now. It's a very good move for them, they went into this Summer knowing they weren't good enough to compete last year and needed big changes to get the blood flowing again. I thought they would find it very difficult to trade Lowry and DeRozan and get value back but they managed to get a potential top 5 player back. If all works out well, they will have a healthy Leonard for a year and could potentially compete for the finals more than they could have with DeRozan simply because he's a much better player. He could IMO resign anywhere he went, I don't buy that he's only going to LA and would not consider any other team - as proven with George who stayed in one of the least attractive destinations in the NBA after a very disappointing season because he embraced the culture. If it doesn't work out they will have cleared $30million a year and given themselves a chance to reboot albeit without any additional young assets. I think it would have been very tough to get a young player or a high pick back for DeRozan though, considering you need match salaries and all.

Players perspective: It's really harsh on DeRozan who has given everything to Toronto and has stayed there in 2016 offseason despite being able to get a max from virtually 20 out of 30 teams in the league. He will probably enjoy San Antonio because of great coaching and culture but he will feel down about it for sure. It's not a dream move for Kawhi but at least he gets out of San Antonio and goes to a team that might challenge for the Finals. Also, he might actually like it there I think.

 

[handiman]

You know what this means, right? Kawhi is done. That's the only explanation for a top player to head east! The net effect is one more all-star headed west.

 

[Charcoal Filtered]

Love this for Toronto. They are going all in for next year. They have an aging roster and it is now or never for them. Lots of expiring contracts to work with next offseason.

For San Antonio, they get two additional years of Derozan at 27M. Not sure I would want to be the one paying that. Pop could find a way to use him efficiently though. Guessing they have worked together before thru USA basketball. Have not seen enough of Poetl to have an opinion.

 

[illmatic99]

Spurs just leap frogged us in the standings as well.

 

[Wizard Mentor]

Re: Derozan, Kawhi
Is SA the warmest city in the NBA?
Is Toronto the coldest?
Is SA sending a message to NBA players? Screw with us and we'll send you to the effing North Pole. We don't care whether it hurts us or not, Don't Mess with Texas!

 

[UKRAINEFAN]

What do people think about what Magic Johnson said on the telecast last night? He said that after watching all the playoffs, that he felt that defense and toughness were more important than shooting and so that is the direction he is going. I guess my first thought is that toughness and shooting are what's important. Do we have any good shooters who are also "tough"?

 

[Wizard Mentor]

Spurs just leap frogged us in the standings as well.

Naw. After watching Derozan play defense and still having to cater to Lamarcus will have Pops asking TO BE traded by the trade deadline.

 

[illmatic99]

What do people think about what Magic Johnson said on the telecast last night? He said that after watching all the playoffs, that he felt that defense and toughness were more important than shooting and so that is the direction he is going. I guess my first thought is that toughness and shooting are what's important. Do we have any good shooters who are also "tough"?

Magic sounded like a moron. GS is loaded with shooters. Boston is loaded with shooters. Houston built their whole team on shooting, not penetration -- they have only 2 players who could create, while the rest of the team depended on spacing and rolling. His whole premise was wrong.

He can't build shit. The only reason Lebron went there was to be in LA, and Magic fell ass backwards into landing him; and immediately proceeded to screw up their build. It will be hilarious watching them crash and burn this season while Lebron spends more time making movies during the playoffs.

 

[UKRAINEFAN]

Magic sounded like a moron. GS is loaded with shooters. Boston is loaded with shooters. Houston built their whole team on shooting, not penetration -- they have only 2 players who could create, while the rest of the team depended on spacing and rolling. His whole premise was wrong.

He can't build shit. The only reason Lebron went there was to be in LA, and Magic fell ass backwards into landing him; and immediately proceeded to screw up their build. It will be hilarious watching them crash and burn this season while Lebron spends more time making movies during the playoffs.

I hope you're right; it will be interesting to see how that team gels (or doesn't).

 

[Wizard Mentor]

Magic sounded like a moron. GS is loaded with shooters. Boston is loaded with shooters. Houston built their whole team on shooting, not penetration -- they have only 2 players who could create, while the rest of the team depended on spacing and rolling. His whole premise was wrong.

He can't build shit. The only reason Lebron went there was to be in LA, and Magic fell ass backwards into landing him; and immediately proceeded to screw up their build. It will be hilarious watching them crash and burn this season while Lebron spends more time making movies during the playoffs.

Don't underestimate the power of the dark side. LBJ's supporting cast in Cleveland was extremely weak, and he got them to the finals (yes, in the east).

 

[Wizard Mentor]

Re: Derozan, Kawhi
Is SA the warmest city in the NBA?
Is Toronto the coldest?
Is SA sending a message to NBA players? Screw with us and we'll send you to the effing North Pole. We don't care whether it hurts us or not, Don't Mess with Texas!

Reminds me of a movie....

His personality flaws
Give me adequate cause
To send him packing on a one-way trip
So his prospects take a terminal dip
His assets frozen, the venue chosen
Is the ends of the earth, whoopee!
So long,
Iago: Good bye, see ya!
Jafar: Ex-Prince Ali!

 

[Wizard Mentor]

Raptors Told DeMar DeRozan At Summer League He Wouldn't Be Traded
JUL 18, 2018 9:19 AM

The Toronto Raptors met with DeMar DeRozan in Las Vegas during Summer League and told him he would not be traded.

DeRozan, however, was traded on Wednesday in Toronto's deal with the San Antonio Spurs for Kawhi Leonard.

In a story posted on his Instagram page on Wednesday morning, DeRozan wrote, "Be told one thing & the outcome another. Can't trust em. Ain't no loyalty in this game. Sell you out quick for a little bit of nothing... Soon you'll understand... Don't disturb..."

Neither DeRozan or Leonard are expressing enthusiasm for the trade.

 

[Eastoff]

So is there any chance we can trade CJ for Butler?

 

[noknobs]

Not sure why players would be upset about DeRozan being traded and saying there's no loyalty. Talk about hypocritical. Players are allowed to show no loyalty but teams aren't?