Official Around The NBA Thread.....July

[lawai'a]

Jimmy says he's "Fed up"

http://www.startribune.com/amid-off...owns-sidesteps-instead-of-squashes/488552851/
more fuel for the "jimmy has got to go" rumors, at least maybe one of them.

 

[PtldPlatypus]

His contract is actually pretty good for the team. It's a fixed salary not a percentage of the salary cap like say Dame's. So if the cap goes up next year CJ's pay stays the same.

First I've heard of Dame's (or any NBA player's) salary being variable like an ARM. I'm quite certain they don't work that way. The max salary cap percentages define the first year of a max deal, but after that point, the raises are limited to a fixed percentage of the first-year salary. The cap jumping will not affect Dame's salary at all until it's time for him to get an extension or a new deal.

 

[Driew]

First I've heard of Dame's (or any NBA player's) salary being variable like an ARM. I'm quite certain they don't work that way. The max salary cap percentages define the first year of a max deal, but after that point, the raises are limited to a fixed percentage of the first-year salary. The cap jumping will not affect Dame's salary at all until it's time for him to get an extension or a new deal.

I'm trying to find the article that said that--maybe it was just a tweet. I read it a couple of weeks ago but I can't find it now. So you could be right haha

 

[hoopsjock]

First I've heard of Dame's (or any NBA player's) salary being variable like an ARM. I'm quite certain they don't work that way. The max salary cap percentages define the first year of a max deal, but after that point, the raises are limited to a fixed percentage of the first-year salary. The cap jumping will not affect Dame's salary at all until it's time for him to get an extension or a new deal.

I've been saying for years that one way to make it fairer for all teams is to have max salaries count the percentage of the cap. That way you wouldn't have situations where Dame makes like $26 million and Kawhi only makes like $18 million because he signed his deal 3 years earlier or whatever (just guessing on the numbers without looking it up). All teams should have the their max player(s) cost the same.

 

[BonesJones]

I've been saying for years that one way to make it fairer for all teams is to have max salaries count the percentage of the cap. That way you wouldn't have situations where Dame makes like $26 million and Kawhi only makes like $18 million because he signed his deal 3 years earlier or whatever (just guessing on the numbers without looking it up). All teams should have the their max player(s) cost the same.

A constant 25%/30%/35% (depending on tenure) would make a lot of sense.

 

[e_blazer]

I'm trying to find the article that said that--maybe it was just a tweet. I read it a couple of weeks ago but I can't find it now. So you could be right haha

I think this is the article you’re looking for, but I don’t think it says exactly what you thought it did:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bl...collum-extension-max-contract-nba-free-agency

 

[Driew]

I think this is the article you’re looking for, but I don’t think it says exactly what you thought it did:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bl...collum-extension-max-contract-nba-free-agency

Nah that wasn't it--it was posted just a few weeks ago (I'm almost certain it was a tweet) because it was regarding the cap going up a little and how CJ gave the Blazers a break by signing a contract that wasn't a percentage of the cap. Oh well that's the downside of tweets is that it's hard to find again later haha

 

[Driew]

I've been saying for years that one way to make it fairer for all teams is to have max salaries count the percentage of the cap. That way you wouldn't have situations where Dame makes like $26 million and Kawhi only makes like $18 million because he signed his deal 3 years earlier or whatever (just guessing on the numbers without looking it up). All teams should have the their max player(s) cost the same.

But this article does say Dame has a percentage of the salary cap....maybe because of the Rose rule or something he gets that privilege?

https://www.nbcsports.com/northwest...will-damian-lillard-trigger-derrick-rose-rule

 

[Sarni]

Why is there virtually no interest in Okafor?

I get that he plays no defence but that’s about the attitude, surely one of 30 teams must at least have the slightest hope they would be able to work with him on that and address the issue. His offense was already very good in his rookie year and it was top notch in college. After his year 1 he had enough value that we were talking about CJ for him or Boston’s #3 pick. Now nobody wants to give him league minimum?

I’d not mind him here but we cannot find an open roster spot I guess.

 

[hoopsjock]

But this article does say Dame has a percentage of the salary cap....maybe because of the Rose rule or something he gets that privilege?

https://www.nbcsports.com/northwest...will-damian-lillard-trigger-derrick-rose-rule

@PtldPlatypus already said why:

The percentage is simply from the year the contract is signed, not a percentage each year of the cap. I'm saying it should be like the way you think it is but it isn't.

That is why stars like LeBron and KD are basically signing one year deals the last few off seasons. They can usually sign for more money the following summer, although this year with the cap only goung up a tiny amount I think LeBron actually lost money by not picking up his option with Cleveland.

 

[Driew]

I get that he plays no defence but that’s about the attitude, surely one of 30 teams must at least have the slightest hope they would be able to work with him on that and address the issue.

Word probably got around that no amount of coaching would get him to play defense.

 

[Driew]

@PtldPlatypus already said why:

The percentage is simply from the year the contract is signed, not a percentage each year of the cap. I'm saying it should be like the way you think it is but it isn't.

That is why stars like LeBron and KD are basically signing one year deals the last few off seasons. They can usually sign for more money the following summer, although this year with the cap only goung up a tiny amount I think LeBron actually lost money by not picking up his option with Cleveland.

ahhhh okay I see. Thanks for the clarification!

 

[UKRAINEFAN]

I have been reading Furious George this week and it occurred to me that it might be a good idea for Paul Allen to have George Karl and others with diverse viewpoints look at the Blazers and suggest what they might be doing wrong and what changes to make. Then I remembered vaguely that there were rumors that they were doing that, although no more information ever came out, did it? Then I started wondering if some of Olshey's ideas lately came from some recommendations from these unidentified people? Like: get more shooters, get Collins in the post more, utilize Turner better, let Ed Davis go......
BTW, some things a little surprising from the book: Karl emphasized defense more than offense. Terry Stotts was with Karl 15 years as an assistant and Karl considered him maybe his best friend (until Karl had to fire him in order to keep his own job). Stotts also played under Karl before coaching with him.

 

[Hoopguru]

I have been reading Furious George this week and it occurred to me that it might be a good idea for Paul Allen to have George Karl and others with diverse viewpoints look at the Blazers and suggest what they might be doing wrong and what changes to make. Then I remembered vaguely that there were rumors that they were doing that, although no more information ever came out, did it? Then I started wondering if some of Olshey's ideas lately came from some recommendations from these unidentified people? Like: get more shooters, get Collins in the post more, utilize Turner better, let Ed Davis go......
BTW, some things a little surprising from the book: Karl emphasized defense more than offense. Terry Stotts was with Karl 15 years as an assistant and Karl considered him maybe his best friend (until Karl had to fire him in order to keep his own job). Stotts also played under Karl before coaching with him.

I enjoyed the book. He really struggled with Melo because of his unwillingness to play D.
He and GP bumped heads but it was primarily because they were much alike. Always said what was on their mind. But both were hard workers and very competitive.
He and Boggie were like oil and water.

 

[illmatic99]

http://www.startribune.com/amid-off...owns-sidesteps-instead-of-squashes/488552851/
more fuel for the "jimmy has got to go" rumors, at least maybe one of them.

Where? I didn't read anything of the sort.

 

[kjironman1]

So not only do i not really understand why the Raptors went all in on Leonard the way they did? Now i really don't understand why the Hawks are facilitating the Rockets? Is the East just a bunch of Western Conference puppets?

 

[illmatic99]

So not only do i not really understand why the Raptors went all in on Leonard the way they did? Now i really don't understand why the Hawks are facilitating the Rockets? Is the East just a bunch of Western Conference puppets?

If Kawhi signs there past next year, that's a huge payoff for their gamble. What other medium do they have to land a top 5 player?

Hawks are looking out for themselves-- they got a pick from OKC and salary relief (when you consider the length of Schroder's deal). They don't care about the Rockets. It's the same thing we did when we paid off Varejao's contract to take on CLE's pick-- no one accused Neil of being a facilitating puppet for the Cavs.

 

[Chris Craig]

Melo to Houston

 

[Wizard Mentor]

Kobe Bryant Quote says exactly what I think is wrong with the league:

"The NBA does better when the Lakers are at their highest potential,” Bryant said when the trade news broke.

edit:
#thisiswhytheleagueisandhasalwaysbeenrigged

 

[calvin natt]

Kobe Bryant Quote says exactly what I think is wrong with the league:


edit:
#thisiswhytheleagueisandhasalwaysbeenrigged

nah. not buying. league has been doing great the past few years with the Lakers being crap. I think when people say this they just mean iconic franchises being relevant is good for fans.

 

[Wizard Mentor]

nah. not buying. league has been doing great the past few years with the Lakers being crap. I think when people say this they just mean iconic franchises being relevant is good for fans.

Firstly, let me say, I'm OK with you not buying it.

The NYK have also sucked and the league is doing great. But, regardless of how well the league does, they spend a lot of time trying to figure out how to do better. One of the effects of this is that NYK, Chicago, LAL will always get the benefit of the doubt. Now that James has joined LAL, there will be a lot more benefit, and a lot less doubt.

This isn't just the ranting of a random jerk on the net - the results are quantifiable. In the last 38+ years, ZERO small market teams have won a championship that didn't have either LBJ or Tim Duncan. So, to the Portland, Utahs, Minnys, Denvers, and other small market teams of the world, you need a player that is at least top 3 in the history of the league at their position or you are toast.

 

[hoopsjock]

Why is there virtually no interest in Okafor?

I get that he plays no defence but that’s about the attitude, surely one of 30 teams must at least have the slightest hope they would be able to work with him on that and address the issue. His offense was already very good in his rookie year and it was top notch in college. After his year 1 he had enough value that we were talking about CJ for him or Boston’s #3 pick. Now nobody wants to give him league minimum?

I’d not mind him here but we cannot find an open roster spot I guess.

I'm guessing he thinks he's worth more than the minimum and isn't willing to accept that fate yet.

 

[lawai'a]

still having knee pain after surgery several years ago might also be a contributing factor.

I'm guessing he thinks he's worth more than the minimum and isn't willing to accept that fate yet.

 

[riverman]

So not only do i not really understand why the Raptors went all in on Leonard the way they did? Now i really don't understand why the Hawks are facilitating the Rockets? Is the East just a bunch of Western Conference puppets?

well the Nets are turning into the Blazers minor league franchise

 

[calvin natt]

Firstly, let me say, I'm OK with you not buying it.

The NYK have also sucked and the league is doing great. But, regardless of how well the league does, they spend a lot of time trying to figure out how to do better. One of the effects of this is that NYK, Chicago, LAL will always get the benefit of the doubt. Now that James has joined LAL, there will be a lot more benefit, and a lot less doubt.

This isn't just the ranting of a random jerk on the net - the results are quantifiable. In the last 38+ years, ZERO small market teams have won a championship that didn't have either LBJ or Tim Duncan. So, to the Portland, Utahs, Minnys, Denvers, and other small market teams of the world, you need a player that is at least top 3 in the history of the league at their position or you are toast.

But....those teams did have Duncan and Lebron, and they won titles. I know the NBA has a big/small market problem, I am just not saying its part of a conspiracy or "rigged" system. The bigger cities or cities with nice weather, etc., are draws because these guys are humans. There wasn't any rigged system that had Michael Jordan going to Chicago, or Bird to Boston. If there is any questionable pick among those championship winners its freaking Tim Duncan going to SA just because David Robinson got hurt and they lost a shit ton of games. And that helped San Antonio, not Boston, where he was close to landing.

 

[riverman]

Firstly, let me say, I'm OK with you not buying it.

The NYK have also sucked and the league is doing great. But, regardless of how well the league does, they spend a lot of time trying to figure out how to do better. One of the effects of this is that NYK, Chicago, LAL will always get the benefit of the doubt. Now that James has joined LAL, there will be a lot more benefit, and a lot less doubt.

This isn't just the ranting of a random jerk on the net - the results are quantifiable. In the last 38+ years, ZERO small market teams have won a championship that didn't have either LBJ or Tim Duncan. So, to the Portland, Utahs, Minnys, Denvers, and other small market teams of the world, you need a player that is at least top 3 in the history of the league at their position or you are toast.

I'd put the Pistons in the conversation.....they used to be big market but Detroit was a ghost town when they won a championship last and they had NO superstars on that roster....you could buy a house in Detroit back then for a pack of chewing gum...Detroit was seriously a city in decline and nobody wanted to live there.

 

[Hoopguru]

Firstly, let me say, I'm OK with you not buying it.

The NYK have also sucked and the league is doing great. But, regardless of how well the league does, they spend a lot of time trying to figure out how to do better. One of the effects of this is that NYK, Chicago, LAL will always get the benefit of the doubt. Now that James has joined LAL, there will be a lot more benefit, and a lot less doubt.

This isn't just the ranting of a random jerk on the net - the results are quantifiable. In the last 38+ years, ZERO small market teams have won a championship that didn't have either LBJ or Tim Duncan. So, to the Portland, Utahs, Minnys, Denvers, and other small market teams of the world, you need a player that is at least top 3 in the history of the league at their position or you are toast.

The Warriors were door mats for years and Oakland wasn't looked at as really a large market team. The hit gold in the draft three times with players no one thought or would classify as franchise type players when drafted, even Curry. With the addition of a few solid vets (Bogut, Iggy, others) they have surprised any expectations the league or fans ever thought of, even before KD.
I agree that it helps a teams odds for sure, to have a few super stars, but most our grown organically.
Even many of the so called larger markets are struggling to win a championship.

 

[calvin natt]

The Warriors:
Garbage for decades
owner finally sold team (Chris Cohan, was a complete dick and didn't care)
Don Nelson I think was overrated as a coach but had a tremendous eye for talent - he liked guys like Mitch Richmond, Tim Hardaway, Letrell Sprewell, and....Steph Curry when nobody else thought those guys would be superstars.
Nelson encouraged them to play very loose and Steph to play without fear of being reprimanded.
Nelson left.
His old friend took over the GM duties but didn't want it permanently, Larry Riley.
Ainge called his old boss, Joe Lacob, and told him that he knew the perfect GM - Bob Myers, a local guy who knew Ainge from his agent days.
Lacob took a risk hired Bob as Asst GM, and Riley gave him a year to learn the ins and outs.
Bob spent a season watching Mark Jackson and knew he wasn't good enough. Pissed off half the fans and fired him.
The took a risk and traded Monta for Bogut - pissing off half their fan base that it wasn't Curry. Again, half.
Bob came in and nailed drafts. Green, Klay, with role players too like McCaw, J Bell, Looney
Signed free agents that weren't highly sought after - David West, S Livingston, Quinn Cook, and one that was, Iggy.

Just do all that and you too can win championships.
NOBODY wanted to play in Oakland. No one. They built it, won, and started to attract people.

 

[Wizard Mentor]

But....those teams did have Duncan and Lebron, and they won titles. I know the NBA has a big/small market problem, I am just not saying its part of a conspiracy or "rigged" system. The bigger cities or cities with nice weather, etc., are draws because these guys are humans. There wasn't any rigged system that had Michael Jordan going to Chicago, or Bird to Boston. If there is any questionable pick among those championship winners its freaking Tim Duncan going to SA just because David Robinson got hurt and they lost a shit ton of games. And that helped San Antonio, not Boston, where he was close to landing.

It's not rigged like a coin that always lands on heads, it's rigged like a coin that lands on heads 60% of the time. That's enough to kill small market teams, and it has. If you prefer a different term than "rigged", no problem. I liked the term "rigged" because it is intentional, as Magic Johnson points out.

 

[Wizard Mentor]

The Warriors were door mats for years and Oakland wasn't looked at as really a large market team. The hit gold in the draft three times with players no one thought or would classify as franchise type players when drafted, even Curry. With the addition of a few solid vets (Bogut, Iggy, others) they have surprised any expectations the league or fans ever thought of, even before KD.
I agree that it helps a teams odds for sure, to have a few super stars, but most our grown organically.
Even many of the so called larger markets are struggling to win a championship.

I'd agree that Kevin Durant signing a big shoe contract was a big boon for small market teams. Regardless SF/Oakland make a huge media market, regardless of whoever's perspective.